Acetylcholinesterase info (nightshade sensitivity)

[InChristAlone]

Most people do not have any issues with the the solanine containing foods (nightshades). My body very gradually lost its ability to deal with solanine when I was in my 50's. I would be surprised if it turrns out that you can eat some solanine containing foods if you have an issue with solanine. The front cover of Norman Childers book advises people to "avoid these rigidly --" (see image).

My brother was a type 2 diabetic. He is a former marine and he attacked his problem by excercise and changing his diet. His diabetes went away but his but his neuropathy did not. A few months after he fully understood the conquences of every word on the front cover image of Childers book and ate accordingly, his so-called 'diabetic' neuropathy vanished.

That's amazing, neuropathy cured by avoiding nightshades!

 

[David PS]

That's amazing, neuropathy cured by avoiding nightshades!

I think he was misdiagnosed.

 

[Dolomite]

The only nightshade I eat now is white potato. I am going to quit eating them and see if the arthritis in my knees will go away.

I have the book by Childers and he mentions that he had to have surgery on his gut after consuming spicy V-8 for many years. My husband developed colitis several years ago and he was drinking V-8 and using large amounts of red pepper on his food. We thought the red pepper was contaminated with salmonella or something since he used it raw. But perhaps it is the solanine that caused the colitis.

 

[moa]

i cured my sensibility, severe gut cramps with IBS, with zinc and choline.

the most severe cramps i had were with undercooked potatoes, indeed.

30mg zinc bisgycinate for 2 months, 6 eggs per day for as long as you can (+some 50mg b5, not every day)

if you can't first eggs, try some molybdenum , worked for me.

I've detailed in my previous posts.

i think of your baseline acetylcholine is high normally, you are less prone to symptoms from ache inhibitors.

 

[VitoScaletta]

Wow gotta check out that book. This whole thread sparked so many ideas. I seem to have a huge problem with nightshades, especially potatoes. They seem to cause crazy serotonin or maybe rather high acetylcholine symptoms. Thanks.

So would you say eating cholinergic things like eggs will be possible again when you stopped nightshades for a while?

Have you replaced potatoes with anything? This thread is quite distressing as it turns out a lot of the foods I eat are nightshades.

 

[FitnessMike]

Very good post!

I am prone to acetylcholine excess, too. I can take something mildly pro-cholinergic for a few days but then I feel completely off — depressed AF, muscle weakness, sleep problems, perfuse sweating and very bad anhedonia.

I am still trying to figure out this thing. I think it is a supersensitivity that is caused by something else as many people don‘t seem to have problems with acetylcholine excess. I texted with @redsun extensively about this. Zinc excess seems to be a big trigger for acetylcholine hypersensitivity.

I think my zinc-induced copper deficiency, leading towards parasympathetic dominance is the major factor.

For me I do the following. First, avoid the things that strongly stimulate acetylcholine/parasympathetic NS. (excess choline, zinc, B1, B5, vitamin E, nicotine…)
Second, ensure you have the co-factors needed for norepinephrine synthesis / sympathetic NS. (bioavailable copper, vitamin C, B6)

I can confirm that zinc and vit e, besides obvious b vitamins are causing onset insomnia, quite sure that it has to do with acth.

So if I understood Dr Peats quotes right, peoples with hypo metabolism are more prone to suffer from acetylcholine negative effects.

Yesterday i ate potatoes twice and morning pulse as well as sleep was rubbish, unfortunate cuz i love them.

Anyway mate, any updates or more conclusions/experiences you can share with us?

 

[FitnessMike]

I am prone to acetylcholine excess, too. I can take something mildly pro-cholinergic for a few days but then I feel completely off — depressed AF, muscle weakness, sleep problems, perfuse sweating and very bad anhedonia.

I am still trying to figure out this thing. I think it is a supersensitivity that is caused by something else as many people don‘t seem to have problems with acetylcholine excess. I texted with @redsun extensively about this. Zinc excess seems to be a big trigger for acetylcholine hypersensitivity.

I think my zinc-induced copper deficiency, leading towards parasympathetic dominance is the major factor.

For me I do the following. First, avoid the things that strongly stimulate acetylcholine/parasympathetic NS. (excess choline, zinc, B1, B5, vitamin E, nicotine…)
Second, ensure you have the co-factors needed for norepinephrine synthesis / sympathetic NS. (bioavailable copper, vitamin C, B6)

Do we know whether cocoa powder copper is bioavailable?

 

[moa]

I can confirm that zinc and vit e, besides obvious b vitamins are causing onset insomnia, quite sure that it has to do with acth.

So if I understood Dr Peats quotes right, peoples with hypo metabolism are more prone to suffer from acetylcholine negative effects.

Yesterday i ate potatoes twice and morning pulse as well as sleep was rubbish, unfortunate cuz i love them.

Anyway mate, any updates or more conclusions/experiences you can share with us?

yet acetylcholine is essential for deep sleep and dreams. during sleep, brain needs to paralyse the body muscles, excepting the eyes, in order to be able to sleep deeply and/or have dreams.

people with low acetylcholine don't have dreams and low B5 is associated with bad sleep and chronic migraine as a result of bad sleep.

I think depression symptoms are related to low dopamine, maybe because of low tolerance to adrenalin, because of low GABA.

I haven't found a way to raise dopamine naturally without raising anxiety and adrenalin. copper may help in the beginning but not long term.

coffee helps to raise tolerance to adrenalin but only long term, start with low and go up slowly (short term it causes anxiety, if taken too much).

i think magnesium is also needed also for sleep.

Usually zinc and B5 helps having good sleep and it's better to take before sleep.

i think, if you have anxiety, you won't fall asleep, that's why it's important to take some magnesium (topical or orally), theanin, fruit juice and maybe some taurine before sleep, (and romaine camomille?).

it's strange to have muscle weakness, because low acetylcholine is linked to muscle weakness usually.

 

[FitnessMike]

its really mad, iv had a lot of strong nettle tea yesterday evcening, and this morning my pulse is really messed up, very low, itsreally mad

Abstract​

Extracts of acetone-dried powders prepared from nettle leaves were shown to catalyse the synthesis of acetylcholine. The specific activity of the enzyme in these extracts is of the same order as that of extracts from mammalian sources, such as ox brain, and the effects of temperature and pH are similar to those reported for mammalian choline acetyltransferase. Synthesis is not restricted to the younger leaves but appears to be continuous up to senescence.

Choline acetyltransferase in the nettle Urtica dioica L

Extracts of acetone-dried powders prepared from nettle leaves were shown to catalyse the synthesis of acetylcholine. The specific activity of the enzyme in these extracts is of the same order as that of extracts from mammalian sources, such as ox brain, ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[youngsinatra]

its really mad, iv had a lot of strong nettle tea yesterday evcening, and this morning my pulse is really messed up, very low, itsreally mad

Abstract​

Extracts of acetone-dried powders prepared from nettle leaves were shown to catalyse the synthesis of acetylcholine. The specific activity of the enzyme in these extracts is of the same order as that of extracts from mammalian sources, such as ox brain, and the effects of temperature and pH are similar to those reported for mammalian choline acetyltransferase. Synthesis is not restricted to the younger leaves but appears to be continuous up to senescence.

Choline acetyltransferase in the nettle Urtica dioica L

Extracts of acetone-dried powders prepared from nettle leaves were shown to catalyse the synthesis of acetylcholine. The specific activity of the enzyme in these extracts is of the same order as that of extracts from mammalian sources, such as ox brain, ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Brother, I am also so sensitive. Just ate some non-organic blueberries yesterday evening and my acetylcholine got high as hell. (severe bradycardia - 45 bpm HR, saliva going crazy, sweaty, dizzy)

I suspect that many of the pesticides are also an issue in regards to acetylcholine, so maybe buying it organic or at least buy vegetables and fruits that you can peel.

But blueberries themselves increase acetylcholine I think.

 

[youngsinatra]

Thyroid, coffee and low-dose biotin are the only things that seems to help. And avoiding pro-cholinergic substances/foods (B vitamins usually bite me in the **** after a few days)

 

[ecstatichamster]

I have lost the ability to eat white potatoes without stomach problems. Just in the last few years. I think that maintaining potatoes in my diet consistently probably resulted in some adaptation that made it tolearable. Ironically when I heard Dr. Peat talk about not being able to tolerate potatoes, I began focusing on potatoes as a source of dietary problems for me.

I have great problems with peppers, tomatoes, eggplant, in any quantity, but can tolerate occasionally eating them or eating them in lower amounts. I always wondered why I wasn’t similarly intolerant of white potatoes.

But it turns out, I am intolerant of white potatoes.

I think if you eat a challenging food, your body can adapt somewhat to the inflammatory trigger, and somewhat compeNate. But if you withdraw that food, your body stops compensating, and even a small amount can trigger symptoms that you didn’t experience when you were consistently eating that food in larger quantities.

It has always puzzled me how people in other cultures can eat foods that are inflammatory, but I think this is the reason. The adaptation to consistently eating inflammatory foods that quiets the body’s reaction to that food.

 

[youngsinatra]

I have lost the ability to eat white potatoes without stomach problems. Just in the last few years. I think that maintaining potatoes in my diet consistently probably resulted in some adaptation that made it tolearable. Ironically when I heard Dr. Peat talk about not being able to tolerate potatoes, I began focusing on potatoes as a source of dietary problems for me.

I have great problems with peppers, tomatoes, eggplant, in any quantity, but can tolerate occasionally eating them or eating them in lower amounts. I always wondered why I wasn’t similarly intolerant of white potatoes.

But it turns out, I am intolerant of white potatoes.

I think if you eat a challenging food, your body can adapt somewhat to the inflammatory trigger, and somewhat compeNate. But if you withdraw that food, your body stops compensating, and even a small amount can trigger symptoms that you didn’t experience when you were consistently eating that food in larger quantities.

It has always puzzled me how people in other cultures can eat foods that are inflammatory, but I think this is the reason. The adaptation to consistently eating inflammatory foods that quiets the body’s reaction to that food.

Same here. Can't do potatoes, tomatoes, bell peppers and so on. They give me horrible symptoms, especially depression and neuro-muscular issues.

 

[David PS]

I think if you eat a challenging food, your body can adapt somewhat to the inflammatory trigger, and somewhat compeNate. But if you withdraw that food, your body stops compensating, and even a small amount can trigger symptoms that you didn’t experience when you were consistently eating that food in larger quantities.

It has always puzzled me how people in other cultures can eat foods that are inflammatory, but I think this is the reason. The adaptation to consistently eating inflammatory foods that quiets the body’s reaction to that food.

I was eating nightshades everyday until I finally went cold turkey. I have concluded that for me it was an age related decline in my enzymes. My body gradually became unable to process nightshades. Even small amounts found in spice mixtures will trigger me. I have about a 4 day delay before symptoms appear.

Many people can slowly reintroduce milk into their diet. But for me this just not work with nightshades.

 

[Frankdee20]

There is notable mention of acetylcholinesterase inhibition from nightshades but some sources claim they block acetylcholine as well. Which is the exception then ?

 

[FitnessMike]

Same here. Can't do potatoes, tomatoes, bell peppers and so on. They give me horrible symptoms, especially depression and neuro-muscular issues.

have you noticed your resting pulse gets low when you have other high ACH symptoms?

 

[youngsinatra]

have you noticed your resting pulse gets low when you have other high ACH symptoms?

Absolutely.

 

[youngsinatra]

I don't know why pro-cholinergics do amazing things to my digestive tract for a few days (perfect bile flow, stomach acid, perfect stool consistency and color) but then just stop working and I just end up with the bad side effects of high acetylcholine. (blurry vision, bradycardia, dizziness, too much saliva and tears, muscle and facial twitching, depression, anhedonia..)

I am now investigating my stainless steel cookware as a source of metals that contribute to issues with acetylcholinesterase. (Nickel, chromium, zinc..)

Activation and inactivation of acetylcholinesterase by metal ions - PubMed

The kinetic consequences of acetylcholinesterase peripheral site occupation by metal ions were examined using three substrates; acetylthiocholine, p-nitrophenylacetate, and 7-(dimethylcarbamoyloxy)-N-methylquinolinium iodide. Two classes of metal ion effects were noted: activation by a group...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Highserotonin90]

@giovanitinatra Some symptoms that you describe as high acetylcholine are also symptoms of high cerebral histamine (and here we could connect with copper which degrades it at an intracellular level).

 

[youngsinatra]

@giovanitinatra Some symptoms that you describe as high acetylcholine are also symptoms of high cerebral histamine (and here we could connect with copper which degrades it at an intracellular level).

Copper only degrades histamine in the digestive tract, from food sources. (via DAO)
Methylation (SAMe) degrades intracellular histamine. (via HNMT)

hnmt intracellular histamine - Google Suche