Rheumatoid Arthritis Managed With Fruit And Protein Diet

nbznj

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Oct 4, 2017
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287
what's incredible - at least, to me - about this thread is my genetic testing also showed very high risk factors for RA, like everything seems to be saying 2-6x increased risk for it. Combine that with the "hunter gatherer" low glucose metabolism.

Has Ray ever shown starch being potentially causal for RA? Is it common for RA patients to go on lower "carbs" diets - carbs meaning grains pretty much, in the mainstream language
 
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Ania

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what's incredible - at least, to me - about this thread is my genetic testing also showed very high risk factors for RA, like everything seems to be saying 2-6x increased risk for it. Combine that with the "hunter gatherer" low glucose metabolism.

Has Ray ever shown starch being potentially causal for RA? Is it common for RA patients to go on lower "carbs" diets - carbs meaning grains pretty much, in the mainstream language
I never heard him talk about strict direct starch -RA connection, but he talked much about endotoxin role in any chronic condition. And starch has much geater affinity to endotoxin than simple sugar. @haidut also found some information about an oldschool intestinal disinfectant which happened to treat RA. Unfortunately it is not available anymore.I think endotoxins are a huge factor in many chronic deseases. Seems to be true in my case.
 
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Ania

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I never heard him talk about strict direct starch -RA connection, but he talked much about endotoxin role in any chronic condition. And starch has much geater affinity to endotoxin than simple sugar. @haidut also found some information about an oldschool intestinal disinfectant which happened to treat RA. Unfortunately it is not available anymore.I think endotoxins are a huge factor in many chronic deseases. Seems to be true in my case.

Here is a link
Simple Intestinal Antiseptic As A Cure For Rheumatoid Arthritis (RA)
 

sevenzy

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Jun 12, 2019
Messages
37
what a great post. super interesting. i bet the multiple doses of antibootics killed your gut - and i wonder if you were taking the evil Cipro one. i join you on thinking that meat and sugar really work. i was able to add back in dairy after TONS colon cleansing / detox and ( hate to say it ) probiotics. you might want to try A2 dairy if you want to give it a go again, worked for me.

I'm considering trying megaspore probiotics to rebalance gut. What probiotics did you use?
 

Ms.Orchid

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I'm considering trying megaspore probiotics to rebalance gut. What probiotics did you use?

Just wanted to say that my naturopath had me take Megaspore probiotics for my wonky gut, and they worked like a charm--this is after trying any number of different probiotics over the years, which had absolutely no effect. I just finished one bottle (one pill a day)--within a week of starting, there was noticeable improvement, and it got better from there. I'm waiting to see how lasting the effects are...so far it's been 3 weeks since I finished the bottle, and things are still good.
 

sevenzy

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Just wanted to say that my naturopath had me take Megaspore probiotics for my wonky gut, and they worked like a charm--this is after trying any number of different probiotics over the years, which had absolutely no effect. I just finished one bottle (one pill a day)--within a week of starting, there was noticeable improvement, and it got better from there. I'm waiting to see how lasting the effects are...so far it's been 3 weeks since I finished the bottle, and things are still good.

Thank you for telling of your experiance with megaspore. Sounds really good. I think I will give it a try. Do you know the mechanics of megaspore? I heard that the probiotics go in an sit next bad bacteria and produce antiobiotics to kill them but its all targeted for bad bacteria.
 

Ms.Orchid

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@sevenzy I don't really know the mechanics of megaspore, other than to say there is definitely something different about it, making it far more effective. If it's the case that it produces antibiotics targeting the bad bacteria, that is pretty cool!
 

Centsmom

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May 31, 2016
Messages
85
Hi everybody on this forum,

I've been lurking here for a long time. I've decided to write a post about my condition in case it might be useful for some in similar situation. I've suffered from excruciating joint pain since I was. 17 (I am 47 right now). For many years the attacks were occasional. My bloodwork for years didn't show anything wrong. According to the labs I was in perfect health. Several years ago I went paleo for over a year, and during that time I didn't experience a single incidence of joint pain. I thought paleo cured me ( although I started suffering from insomnia) One day I craved good old capuccino. I had 3 cups that day ( first time after more than a year). After 3 days I developed terrible inflammation in my joints. Then I connected the dots. I thought it was either coffee or milk. I waited several days until the inflamation subsided and made a provocation with fresh raw milk.. After 3 days it all started again. The pain was killing me. I landed in hospital for an injection since oral painkillers did noting. The injection didn't help neither. After some time I made another provocation, but this time with goat milk, but the situation repeated : inflamed, swallen joints. It would attack any joints in the whole body - big and small ones : feet, hands, arms, knees, jaw, even pubic bone. Finally I stopped all dairy and was fine for over a year. In the meantime I discovered Ray Peat and his work. I was reading his articles, searching forum, listening to all interviews. I was fascinated. I started implementing many things into my diet (except dairy of course). After some time I developed joint pain again. I was devastated. Since the inflamation stars after 3 days from consumption, it took me 3 months to discover it was carrot this time. I couldn't believe it. Carrot?!!! So I stopped it, and again everything returned to normal... for some time. After some time symptoms came bak. This time it was gelatin. The list of acceptable foods was becoming more and more restricted and the diet became very repetitive, especially if you take into account things unacceptable from Peat's perspective. After long time I discovered the pattern - anything that I ate more than once daily for a period of time was becoming an offending food for me. However, when I realized it, it was already too late. My RA (already officially diagnosed with bloodwork) became chronic. I suffered from constant debiliating pain. No matter how I manipulated my diet, nothing helped. As if I got intolerant to every single food on the earth. The only relief was after appendectomy, when I fasted for 3 days.
As soon as I started eating again, after 3 days symptoms reapeared. I didn't know what to do. I couldn't function. I was terribly depressed. I didn't want a life in constsnt pain. I was suicidal. Finally, i decided that from historical perspective the least offending foods for human beings are fruts and animal protein. So i started a diet made up strictly of all kinds of fruits and meat, fish and seafood. At the beginning nothing changed, but the diet was so friendly, easy and satisfying, that I carried on. I lost my hope for recovery. However, after 3,4 weeks I felt better. I started having days without pain. After about 6 weeks my joint pain subsided. I couldn't believe it. I started this diet in July last year. I am still fine. After some time I reintroduced egg without adverse effects. So now I basically eat fruits, meat, fish, seafood and eggs. I use beef tallow as my fat for preparing my meat or fish. I supplement with some eggshell calcium, K2-mk4 and occasional magnesium glicynate. From time to time I tried to reintroduce things like mushrooms, spinach or potatoes, but each time the symptoms came back. So now I stick to carnivore/frutarian diet. I am totally starch free. I am doing fine. I am grateful for having my life back. The added bonus is that last fall/winter seaon I didn cach any infection first time in my whole life. Noramally I had to go through 2 or 3 courses of antibotics during season. Another bonus is my liver health. Recently I had an ultrasound of my abdomen. The doctor asked what I was doing that I had such a liver.He said that it looked like it was never used at all. Like totally new one. He said he had never seen such liver in a person after 40.
If i had recognized the pattern earlier, I wouln't have gone in such trouble. It would be enough to diversify my diet and not to eat the same food too often. I have no idea if it is revesible. I do not care about it now. I am just happy that I have a painfree life again. I am not cured by any means, i just mange my condition without doctors and killing madications. I believe, there are many people just like me out there, who will not be lucky enough to discover the reason of their debiliating conditions. I think it may concern many of so called "autoimmune diseases. What helped me, doesn't have to help everybody. But it is so easy, safe and quite healthy, that I would give it a try if somebody told me about it in times, when I had no clue what was wrong with me.
I feel great, energetic and happy. I wanted to share my story. Maybe it might be helpful for someone.
Sorry for it be so long and chaotic. There are so many more details, but it would become a book rather than a post. Also, forgive me my English, I did my best. In case someone has questions, I'll be happy to answer.
Ania
K
No geletain ? Any problems not including geletain ?
 
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Ania

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Hi guys. Just a small update. I have been on my fruit and protein diet for 13 months now. I feel great, my weight is stabilized, I was able to come back to some light strength training. My mental and emotional condition is better then ever. I didn't catch a single infection through the whole year, which never happened before in my whole life. From comments of people around me, my face looks younger ( i personally do not notice any dramatic difference). My body tells me I am doing something right. The interesting part is that I am not bored with this kind of eating, although it may seem extremelly dull. Each meal is a sheer pleasure. My instinct work like a clock. I eat when I am hungry. Previously I never recognized real hunger. I felt hungry most of the time and even after a big meal I felt like eating a little more. I was constatntly thinking about food. Now I have 3 meals a day and never think about food between them. I have good energy, but not maniac. I sleep very well, sometimes I have to pee around 4 or 5 in the monrning, but i return to lseep instantly.I have so much more mental space for other activities. I am planning to do some extensive bloodwork in September, so I will let you know about the results.
 

JustAGuy

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Jul 21, 2018
Messages
141
Thank you Ania for sharing your experience here, this is very beneficial.

I thought I would just share my similar experience on this topic.
Personally, after years, I seem to also have come to the conclusion that Fruit + Beef is where it's at for me.
My wellbeing is greatly enhanced and also a painful knee joint seems to be getting better over time. Also a stiff/painful neck that I had for a long time vanishes. This has always been my go-to benchmark for inflammation, if I overtrained or ate offending foods I would always get this painful feeling in my neck.

In the past I had already concluded that fruit-only diet reduced my inflammation, though this lead to losing lots of muscle mass and a feeling of running on adrenaline 24/7.
It seems adding fatty beef adds stability to this system, allowing me to be more relaxed rather than hyperactive/in adrenaline mode.

Going beef-only didn't work for me either, I became sluggish and felt dehydrated 24/7. Excess protein (over 100g daily, tried even 300g per day) increased my feeling of inflammation.

Potatoes/starches do not work for me either, the least offending starch seems to be white-rice, but this even causes more problems than benefits for me. Maybe in the future I will try some sports starch such as vitargo, which absorbs extremely quickly into the system, since I am very active and have a lot of difficulty getting enough calories to support my activity.

@Ania the idea of rotating your foods seems interesting, I will try this since I have not done so before. Do you also have to do this rotation with fruits and meats? I was hoping you could give any more detail about how you apply this practically and how long you feel you need to have a "reset-period" for between eating two products.
 
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Ania

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Messages
206
Thank you Ania for sharing your experience here, this is very beneficial.

I thought I would just share my similar experience on this topic.
Personally, after years, I seem to also have come to the conclusion that Fruit + Beef is where it's at for me.
My wellbeing is greatly enhanced and also a painful knee joint seems to be getting better over time. Also a stiff/painful neck that I had for a long time vanishes. This has always been my go-to benchmark for inflammation, if I overtrained or ate offending foods I would always get this painful feeling in my neck.

In the past I had already concluded that fruit-only diet reduced my inflammation, though this lead to losing lots of muscle mass and a feeling of running on adrenaline 24/7.
It seems adding fatty beef adds stability to this system, allowing me to be more relaxed rather than hyperactive/in adrenaline mode.

Going beef-only didn't work for me either, I became sluggish and felt dehydrated 24/7. Excess protein (over 100g daily, tried even 300g per day) increased my feeling of inflammation.

Potatoes/starches do not work for me either, the least offending starch seems to be white-rice, but this even causes more problems than benefits for me. Maybe in the future I will try some sports starch such as vitargo, which absorbs extremely quickly into the system, since I am very active and have a lot of difficulty getting enough calories to support my activity.

@Ania the idea of rotating your foods seems interesting, I will try this since I have not done so before. Do you also have to do this rotation with fruits and meats? I was hoping you could give any more detail about how you apply this practically and how long you feel you need to have a "reset-period" for between eating two products.
Thanks for this. This is so interesting to hear other people's experience.This is such a rarity with this diet. I am glad you also see benefits. After 13 months I believe there is something unique in this approach. Probably drastic decrease of antinutrients. The only thing that worries me is iron from regular meat consumption. But I have no choice, at least for the time being.
With regards to rotating foods, I discovered that I cannot repeat any food twice daily, but I can have the same food the next day. This does not lead to intolerance in my case. So i could eat beef daily. Beef is my main meat, but i change for variety : so I eat beef, lamb, fish, scalops, shrimp, liver for nutrients, ocasionally other meats. I always have eggs for breakfast.
I had the same experience as you with both frutarian and carnivore. None was sustainable. It was a torture.
 

jet9

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Joined
Mar 5, 2018
Messages
607
I was following very similar diet for close to a year:

meat/seafood/eggs + fruits (apples, grapes, watermelon, dates, etc), 0 added sugar. The only difference i had 200g of lettuce in the evening.

I felt good on it, the only problem as times goes i start to feel too anxious/hard to focus on work, like too much adrenalin, which only starch can solve for some reason.

So now i am testing having small portion of starch (400g of sweet potatoes) every 3 days. I can't tolerate grains, rice, or even white potatoes, but sweet potatoes are more or less ok. (purple skin white flash ones).
 

gately

Member
Joined
Mar 29, 2013
Messages
305
Hi guys. Just a small update. I have been on my fruit and protein diet for 13 months now. I feel great, my weight is stabilized, I was able to come back to some light strength training. My mental and emotional condition is better then ever. I didn't catch a single infection through the whole year, which never happened before in my whole life. From comments of people around me, my face looks younger ( i personally do not notice any dramatic difference). My body tells me I am doing something right. The interesting part is that I am not bored with this kind of eating, although it may seem extremelly dull. Each meal is a sheer pleasure. My instinct work like a clock. I eat when I am hungry. Previously I never recognized real hunger. I felt hungry most of the time and even after a big meal I felt like eating a little more. I was constatntly thinking about food. Now I have 3 meals a day and never think about food between them. I have good energy, but not maniac. I sleep very well, sometimes I have to pee around 4 or 5 in the monrning, but i return to lseep instantly.I have so much more mental space for other activities. I am planning to do some extensive bloodwork in September, so I will let you know about the results.

Ania,

How are you feeling on the diet? Could you describe exactly what you eat in a day, meaning what a breakfast / lunch / dinner typically looks like? Thank you.
 

jet9

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Joined
Mar 5, 2018
Messages
607
Ania,

How are you feeling on the diet? Could you describe exactly what you eat in a day, meaning what a breakfast / lunch / dinner typically looks like? Thank you.
would be interested in this too!
 

Peatogenic

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Sep 11, 2017
Messages
746
My diet is similar...only meat, fruit, and a couple starchy vegetables. No grains or dairy. Only meat and fruit would be even more expensive than my diet currently.
 

Hgreen56

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Joined
Apr 8, 2020
Messages
723
Hi everybody on this forum,

I've been lurking here for a long time. I've decided to write a post about my condition in case it might be useful for some in similar situation. I've suffered from excruciating joint pain since I was. 17 (I am 47 right now). For many years the attacks were occasional. My bloodwork for years didn't show anything wrong. According to the labs I was in perfect health. Several years ago I went paleo for over a year, and during that time I didn't experience a single incidence of joint pain. I thought paleo cured me ( although I started suffering from insomnia) One day I craved good old capuccino. I had 3 cups that day ( first time after more than a year). After 3 days I developed terrible inflammation in my joints. Then I connected the dots. I thought it was either coffee or milk. I waited several days until the inflamation subsided and made a provocation with fresh raw milk.. After 3 days it all started again. The pain was killing me. I landed in hospital for an injection since oral painkillers did noting. The injection didn't help neither. After some time I made another provocation, but this time with goat milk, but the situation repeated : inflamed, swallen joints. It would attack any joints in the whole body - big and small ones : feet, hands, arms, knees, jaw, even pubic bone. Finally I stopped all dairy and was fine for over a year. In the meantime I discovered Ray Peat and his work. I was reading his articles, searching forum, listening to all interviews. I was fascinated. I started implementing many things into my diet (except dairy of course). After some time I developed joint pain again. I was devastated. Since the inflamation stars after 3 days from consumption, it took me 3 months to discover it was carrot this time. I couldn't believe it. Carrot?!!! So I stopped it, and again everything returned to normal... for some time. After some time symptoms came bak. This time it was gelatin. The list of acceptable foods was becoming more and more restricted and the diet became very repetitive, especially if you take into account things unacceptable from Peat's perspective. After long time I discovered the pattern - anything that I ate more than once daily for a period of time was becoming an offending food for me. However, when I realized it, it was already too late. My RA (already officially diagnosed with bloodwork) became chronic. I suffered from constant debiliating pain. No matter how I manipulated my diet, nothing helped. As if I got intolerant to every single food on the earth. The only relief was after appendectomy, when I fasted for 3 days.
As soon as I started eating again, after 3 days symptoms reapeared. I didn't know what to do. I couldn't function. I was terribly depressed. I didn't want a life in constsnt pain. I was suicidal. Finally, i decided that from historical perspective the least offending foods for human beings are fruts and animal protein. So i started a diet made up strictly of all kinds of fruits and meat, fish and seafood. At the beginning nothing changed, but the diet was so friendly, easy and satisfying, that I carried on. I lost my hope for recovery. However, after 3,4 weeks I felt better. I started having days without pain. After about 6 weeks my joint pain subsided. I couldn't believe it. I started this diet in July last year. I am still fine. After some time I reintroduced egg without adverse effects. So now I basically eat fruits, meat, fish, seafood and eggs. I use beef tallow as my fat for preparing my meat or fish. I supplement with some eggshell calcium, K2-mk4 and occasional magnesium glicynate. From time to time I tried to reintroduce things like mushrooms, spinach or potatoes, but each time the symptoms came back. So now I stick to carnivore/frutarian diet. I am totally starch free. I am doing fine. I am grateful for having my life back. The added bonus is that last fall/winter seaon I didn cach any infection first time in my whole life. Noramally I had to go through 2 or 3 courses of antibotics during season. Another bonus is my liver health. Recently I had an ultrasound of my abdomen. The doctor asked what I was doing that I had such a liver.He said that it looked like it was never used at all. Like totally new one. He said he had never seen such liver in a person after 40.
If i had recognized the pattern earlier, I wouln't have gone in such trouble. It would be enough to diversify my diet and not to eat the same food too often. I have no idea if it is revesible. I do not care about it now. I am just happy that I have a painfree life again. I am not cured by any means, i just mange my condition without doctors and killing madications. I believe, there are many people just like me out there, who will not be lucky enough to discover the reason of their debiliating conditions. I think it may concern many of so called "autoimmune diseases. What helped me, doesn't have to help everybody. But it is so easy, safe and quite healthy, that I would give it a try if somebody told me about it in times, when I had no clue what was wrong with me.
I feel great, energetic and happy. I wanted to share my story. Maybe it might be helpful for someone.
Sorry for it be so long and chaotic. There are so many more details, but it would become a book rather than a post. Also, forgive me my English, I did my best. In case someone has questions, I'll be happy to answer.
Ania
K

i see that you are still active here so i have 2 questions for you.
I read that you have ditch't starch.
I wondering if you react on white rice, and so yes how? Do you got bloat or tired for example.
Also wondering if you react bad on cheap concentrate fruit juice's like applejuice.

also i read here that vitamina a toxity can increase these pains.
i read that you also avoid carrots now. You still eat other vitamin a sourches like liver?
if dont, and you also avoiding milk than i guess you intake is very (unhealthy levels) low?

greetz
 
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Ania

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206
i see that you are still active here so i have 2 questions for you.
I read that you have ditch't starch.
I wondering if you react on white rice, and so yes how? Do you got bloat or tired for example.
Also wondering if you react bad on cheap concentrate fruit juice's like applejuice.

also i read here that vitamina a toxity can increase these pains.
i read that you also avoid carrots now. You still eat other vitamin a sourches like liver?
if dont, and you also avoiding milk than i guess you intake is very (unhealthy levels) low?

greetz

In the past, when I ate most foods, I didnt notice any problems with digesting rice. Since I switched to the current diet I haven't tried even a single grain of rice. I do not drink store bought juices. I eat liver once a week. I hope my vit A status is ok, although I've never checked it.
 
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Ania

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Messages
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Ania,

How are you feeling on the diet? Could you describe exactly what you eat in a day, meaning what a breakfast / lunch / dinner typically looks like? Thank you.
Sorry to answer only now, I must have missed your question.
I am feeling perfectly ok. I was doing an extensive blood work in early spring and the doctor told me it was "too good"
However, my joint pain started to return and I was devastated. I couldn't figure out what it was this time. It took me couple of months of experimenting to discover that this time it was water! I didn't want to believe it. It seemed so rediculous. However, I made an experiment and switched to distilled water. All my joint pain is gone now. But what is more amazing - a rash which I had for over 30 years constantly and I had to take Zyrtec daily through all these years - resolved as well like magic. No dietary intervention ever helped with that. I am probably allergic to nickel.

Ok. What I eat in a day.
Breakfast is practically always the same (around 9 am)
4-5 ripe bananas, very well blended with 2-3 raw eggs and salt to taste.

The next meal( we do not have lunch in my country) around 3 pm
It is a piece of meat/fish/ seafood/ beef liver (200-250gr) and a chosen fruit (I usually do not mix them, because I can't eat the same food twice a day) at least 500 gr, but sometimes more. My favourites are mangoes, papayas, pineapples, kiwi gold, very sweet oranges, dark grapes, melons.

In the evening I eat fruits exclusively. A lot.

It is not a cheap diet, and not very convenient, especially when you're traveling, but I have no way back. At least for the time being.
I probably suffer from hypersensitivity type IV. Maybe in couple of years when my "memory cells" are exchanged, I will be able to reintroduce some foods. I've read about such cases.
 

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