Pregnenolone - Notice Of Change In COA

[healthnatura]

I wanted to update you on a change in the purity concentration of our pregnenolone. Prices for 99.9% pure have tippled! This would make the prices I would have to pass on to you unsustainable. 20 grams of pregnenolone would be approaching $90 each. So I have made the decision to go with slightly lower 99.3% purity. It is still the same high quality product from the same source as we have been buying from for the last 15 years. Just a lower level of refinement. The only change is the source material residue level will now be 0.7% instead of 0.1% residue. I expect that you will see no change in how you feel as a result of the change. I have loaded up a current COA here.



For those that are curious, the residue consists mainly of waxy esters leftover from the enzymatic manufacturing process. The source material is wild yam from which diosgenin is extracted enzymes are then used to convert it to pregnenolone.

 

[answersfound]

great! thank you. i use your product now. i hope they don't make pregnenolone illegal or only available through prescription

 

[healthnatura]

Pregnenolone is here to stay for a very long time. The primary FDA rules are related to labeling and claims. That is why we label it the way that we do and include a COA like a lab chemical supply company would do.

 

[energyandstruct]

I have had negative effects from this pregnenolone. I'm not inclined to criticize your company reflexively, since i've also had negative effects from other pregnenolone on the market... but ray says that these effects are most likely due to estrogens/estrogenic impurities.

At first I found that highly improbable, but I did some digging and it seems like diosgenin or wild yam is the main impurity in your pregnenolone, according to your coa. If that's true, diosgenin could be estrogenic and explain the issues with your pregnenolone.

Ray said that pure pregnenolone should have no effects other than positive, e.g. if your hormones are normal, it won't get used at all. I had these effects with repeated doses

 

[Dhair]

I have had negative effects from this pregnenolone. I'm not inclined to criticize your company reflexively, since i've also had negative effects from other pregnenolone on the market... but ray says that these effects are most likely due to estrogens/estrogenic impurities.

At first I found that highly improbable, but I did some digging and it seems like diosgenin or wild yam is the main impurity in your pregnenolone, according to your coa. If that's true, diosgenin could be estrogenic and explain the issues with your pregnenolone.

Ray said that pure pregnenolone should have no effects other than positive, e.g. if your hormones are normal, it won't get used at all. I had these effects with repeated doses

Have you tried Idealabs pregnenolone to compare?

 

[energyandstruct]

Have you tried Idealabs pregnenolone to compare?

I haven't. I spent a bunch of money on health natura products and other supplements and idealabs products are expensive. I'm afraid i can't afford to keep experimenting with stuff that isn't working for me. The other brand i tried was life extension, in capsules

 

[Dhair]

I haven't. I spent a bunch of money on health natura products and other supplements and idealabs products are expensive. I'm afraid i can't afford to keep experimenting with stuff that isn't working for me. The other brand i tried was life extension, in capsules

I just posted in the stressnon thread that I took 500mg healthnatura pregnenolone and felt nothing, but stressnon was literally life changing for me. Topical might work better for you, and you will probably be able to get away with a much lower dose. You should check it out.

 

[energyandstruct]

I just posted in the stressnon thread that I took 500mg healthnatura pregnenolone and felt nothing, but stressnon was literally life changing for me. Topical might work better for you, and you will probably be able to get away with a much lower dose. You should check it out.

i wonder if the stressnon is better b/c of the vitamin E in it. is this haidut's product? i'm a little concerned about the sfa esters, esp. since he won't disclose the specific ones

 

[Dhair]

i wonder if the stressnon is better b/c of the vitamin E in it. is this haidut's product? i'm a little concerned about the sfa esters, esp. since he won't disclose the specific ones

I'm pretty sure Stessnon doesn't have vitamin E in it. The ingredients in my bottles just say SFA esters and ethanol. I wouldn't be too concerned about the SFA esters. I don't really see how they could be harmful, but I do agree that he should disclose what they are. You avoid so many problems with transdermal application of hormones/vitamins/drugs. Intestinal irritation throws everything off balance.
Haidut's pregnenolone has a very strong, drug-like effect on me. Sometimes it causes depersonalization, but that's the allopregnanolone . The most profound effects are the color saturation and potent antidepressant effects. I get thoughts and feelings that I haven't had since I was a child. 5a-DHP is supposed to circumvent a lot of issues people typically have with preg to get the allopreg effects, but it caused me to almost have a mental breakdown, with none of the beneficial effects that preg now gives me. Just be careful with anything and everything.

 

[Stilgar]

Would it be possible to offer both purities?

It would be helpful so that people could decide whether to part with more money for a higher purity.

These days I would rather save up for longer to buy things I know will be 100% safe.

I have been burnt too many times with my own poor choices and being cheap rarely helped with supplements.

 

[energyandstruct]

Would it be possible to offer both purities?

It would be helpful so that people could decide whether to part with more money for a higher purity.

These days I would rather save up for longer to buy things I know will be 100% safe.

I have been burnt too many times with my own poor choices and being cheap rarely helped with supplements.

seconded

 

[energyandstruct]

also i feel like the impurities could be endotoxin rather than estrogen

 

[golder]

I have had negative effects from this pregnenolone. I'm not inclined to criticize your company reflexively, since i've also had negative effects from other pregnenolone on the market... but ray says that these effects are most likely due to estrogens/estrogenic impurities.

At first I found that highly improbable, but I did some digging and it seems like diosgenin or wild yam is the main impurity in your pregnenolone, according to your coa. If that's true, diosgenin could be estrogenic and explain the issues with your pregnenolone.

Ray said that pure pregnenolone should have no effects other than positive, e.g. if your hormones are normal, it won't get used at all. I had these effects with repeated doses

Diosgenin is now a new component of Haidut's 'Gonadin' product. Could you outline the estrogenic qualities to haidut please Debored13 and allow him a chance to come back

 

[healthnatura]

I have had negative effects from this pregnenolone. I'm not inclined to criticize your company reflexively, since i've also had negative effects from other pregnenolone on the market... but ray says that these effects are most likely due to estrogens/estrogenic impurities.

At first I found that highly improbable, but I did some digging and it seems like diosgenin or wild yam is the main impurity in your pregnenolone, according to your coa. If that's true, diosgenin could be estrogenic and explain the issues with your pregnenolone.

Ray said that pure pregnenolone should have no effects other than positive, e.g. if your hormones are normal, it won't get used at all. I had these effects with repeated doses

I have checked and there is no diosgenin in our pregnenolone powder. With that said, my clinical experience has been that no one supplement is the perfect for all people. In My 18 years of clinical practice I never found one that did, not even water.

I am not a Ray Peat clinician and my training and opinions differ from his. In other posts I've quite transparent about that. I hope that the explanation below will help you understand why I don't think pregnenolone is always positive for everyone. I would love to say yes pregnenolone is always good for you, buy our product, you will always feel good if you do. But I can't, doing so would be unethical as a supplement company and would violate FDA rules for the promotion of nutritional supplements. My views of pregnenolone, any supplements for that matter, is that there is no one size fits all.

Pregnenolone isn't for everyone. It is a base prohormone that the body uses to make other hormones from, DHEA, progesterone, estrogen and a number of neurotransmitters to name only a few. If there is a problem where the body is over/under producing a product for a reason other than a pregnenolone deficiency, pregnenolone may not be a corrective measure that works or may only work partially. Pre and Pro hormone supplements work when there is an underlying deficiency in that material. In those instances pregnenolone can be a life changer. Each step of hormone and neurotransmitter production are enzyme dependent and neuroendocrine signaling dependent. If there is a mutation of the enzyme, or a dysfunction/deficiency due to another factor pregnenolone may, or may not, be part of the bigger picture. Here are a few examples. Enzyme dysfunction can be a mineral deficiency, all enzymes have a metallic core. For example, iron is required for the first step of oxygen transportation a deficiency of iron leads to low oxygen levels and that will cascade through the entire metabolic process. Zero iron you are dead. Less than optimal and processes get prioritized based on critical needs. Minerals are only one example, vitamins, essential fats and pro vitamins are also involved. Inhibition due to outside toxicity is also a possibility. Heavy metals like mercury can block essential enzyme functions by either blocking the enzyme receptor site or inhibiting the enzyme formation due to displacement of the mineral core that controls the exact shape and function of the enzyme itself. These are only two examples of what heavy metals can do. Another inhibitory agent example are fluorines and halides. These are very large molecules that can block thyroid hormone receptor sites and also can play a role in the production of thyroid hormone by displacement of iodine and deformation of the enzyme needed to convert T4 into the active thyroid hormone T3 that actually binds to the cell receptor site to regulate the cellular metabolic rate. Metabolic rate controls temperature and temperature regulates the exact size of enzymes as well as their rate of formation. Enzymes are like keys, they are very specific. Too hot and they become large and can't function and systems begin to shut down by rate of priority with an endpoint of death by heatstroke. The inverse is also true, cold contracts the enzyme with an endpoint of death by hypothermia. Infections, biofilms, mycotoxins, endotoxins, and other biological toxins are also examples that can influence all the functions we have already talked about. All of these regulatory functions are prioritized by essential necessity to prevent death leading to all manner of symptoms inbetween and relate directly with the success or failure of any chosen therapy. Much of this touches on the topic of epigenetics, and the external factors that influence genetic expression and the proper function of those expressions. We are just beginning to understand this new way of looking at metabolic function and how we can use that understanding to be more targeted with effective interventions.

I'm not trying to be critical of Ray Peat, but I have a different take on things, that's all. I hope that this helps you understand that there is too much complexity to simplify it down to a universal place where there is a single therapy that will always be beneficial. Even water can be toxic if taken in excess.

 

[healthnatura]

Would it be possible to offer both purities?

It would be helpful so that people could decide whether to part with more money for a higher purity.

These days I would rather save up for longer to buy things I know will be 100% safe.

I have been burnt too many times with my own poor choices and being cheap rarely helped with supplements.

We are required to report on our COA the minimum guaranteed purity as outlined by FDA rules for retail sizes of raw materials. Most all of our batches come back as 99.7 % pure. Guaranteed analysis of 99.9% pure runs in the hundreds of dollars per gram now. I doubt that the difference is worth paying $1,000 for 10 grams just to get 0.02% greater purity. If anyone wishes to make a special order, I can get it as a custom manufacture. Pricing may vary from what I have listed here.

 

[Pufas Shmoofas]

essential fats

Ray says essential fats are a myth

 

[healthnatura]

Ray says essential fats are a myth

This is one subject where I disagree. Again, I have different training and opinions than Ray Peat, which is common in the medical field. I will say this though. Context in the status of an individual's health is everything. For example, there are cases where the body is unable or significantly compromised to the point that fat absorption is critically low or low enough to produce symptoms specific to fats. Pancreatitis for example. We also know that there are fats that the body needs to function (a scientifically proven fact) but does not have the ability to produce, 99% of the time diet is sufficient to prevent the need for supplementation. I have seen cases where Krill oil saves lives from acute pain and neurological problems such as misdiagnosed parkinson's with which krill oil completely resolved the problem.

 

[TeaRex14]

Has anyone listened to the "It's Rainmaking Time" interview with Ray? I never got the impression Ray thinks EFAs are a total myth. In that interview he says he's still waiting for someone to "prove their essentialness". I think Ray is interested in the animal studies showing EFA deficiency increasing the metabolic rate, but if he thought 0 grams of PUFA were needed, I don't think he would be recommending foods like oysters, shrimp, and eggs. I do think there should be conscious effort to reduce PUFA, but achieving 0% unsaturation is quite literally impossible. And I remember Danny Roddy saying about 5 grams of PUFA, per 2,000 calories, is a good metabolic friendly range. The issue with things like krill oil is it's highly unstable, and it's unclear if it's usage is really producing anti-inflammatory effects, or just immune suppression effects that resemble anti inflammatory effects. A good way to test this would be trying krill oil, and then trying aspirin, and seeing which one works better. Aspirin is a legit anti-inflammatory.

 

[healthnatura]

Has anyone listened to the "It's Rainmaking Time" interview with Ray? I never got the impression Ray thinks EFAs are a total myth. In that interview he says he's still waiting for someone to "prove their essentialness". I think Ray is interested in the animal studies showing EFA deficiency increasing the metabolic rate, but if he thought 0 grams of PUFA were needed, I don't think he would be recommending foods like oysters, shrimp, and eggs. I do think there should be conscious effort to reduce PUFA, but achieving 0% unsaturation is quite literally impossible. And I remember Danny Roddy saying about 5 grams of PUFA, per 2,000 calories, is a good metabolic friendly range. The issue with things like krill oil is it's highly unstable, and it's unclear if it's usage is really producing anti-inflammatory effects, or just immune suppression effects that resemble anti inflammatory effects. A good way to test this would be trying krill oil, and then trying aspirin, and seeing which one works better. Aspirin is a legit anti-inflammatory.

All good points. There is a lot we don't know, but there have been a few epidemiological studies I've read over the years that suggest EFA's positively impact human health if they are deficient in the diet. Iodine for example. All fish oils can be unstable if not protected from oxidation. We use a Krill product that is rapidly processed and then oxygen purged with argon to protect it during storage.

 

[Pufas Shmoofas]

I never got the impression Ray thinks EFAs are a total myth. In that interview he says he's still waiting for someone to "prove their essentialness".

You have to pick one, as these are conflicting ideas. It's not a myth that these fats exist of course, but if Ray does not believe they are essential, he's saying he thinks the idea of "essential" fatty acids is untrue or a myth in other words.