Endotoxin And Fat Consumption

[Westside PUFAs]

The gallbladder is not important. It's like the bladder, they are just storage bags. People have it removed often and after surgery, bile flows from the liver (where it is made) through the common bile duct and into the small intestine. The body can no longer store bile between meals. In most people, this has little or no effect on digestion. If it does, then take an ox bile supplement.

but I'll admit several months of haagen dazs every evening and I now have cellulite for the first time in my life. Not even overeating calories either!

I appreciate your honesty.

I eat quite a lot of fat as a breastfeeding Mom and wonder if it's causing some of my issues.

I think so.

lol you are so aggressive.. I was just asking what you think or how you think that it works(low fat diet). For example in case of gallbladder issues, gallstones due to estrogen.. So please relax. My post wasn't about vegans vs paleo, fat vs carbs or whatever.. I'm simply curious. How low fat can work for gallbladder-bile flow issues.. Because I have those issues. I would like to eat nothing but cheap starches and be healthy again. But I don't see how this can work. I have zero interest to be in some hardcore diet group. I'm 29 and everything what I want is to be healthy.. Like you said. I don't agree with everything what somebody says. But I'm willing to eat ANYTHING. From worms to nothing but grass or whatever for health. But it must make some sense.. So like I said. I'm simply curious how can work this low fat approach. Specifically for liver, gallbladder issues.

Your first sentence was “Westside Pufa I'm curious what you think about people like Dr.mcdougall who promotes NO FATS at all. Just starches, vegetables and maybe some fruits," so I told you what I think of him. I thought you already knew what works for you because of that bodybuilding pic you posted? Was that a long time ago?

 

[lindsay]

The gallbladder is not important. It's like the bladder, they are just storage bags. People have it removed often and after surgery, bile flows from the liver (where it is made) through the common bile duct and into the small intestine. The body can no longer store bile between meals. In most people, this has little or no effect on digestion. If it does, then take an ox bile supplement.

This is an incredibly untrue statement. Do you have a gallbladder? Have you had gallbladder disease or problems? It is debilitating and can cause stabbing pain. After having mine removed, I have continued suffering bad digestive problems since - would have issues with vomiting in the middle of the night if I ate fried foods (this was before I discovered RP and stopped eating PUFA), etc. Everyone I know who has had their gallbladder removed can no longer eat certain foods without having bad digestive upset.

If I could do it over again knowing what I know now, I would have kept my gallbladder in tact. Usually, it's an issue of serotonin & estrogen. Those won't go away after having the gallbladder removed. And in fact, many woman experience gallbladder problems after giving birth (when the hormones change and estrogen levels are higher).

 

[Westside PUFAs]

But if you don't take ox bile then my statement remains. I haven't seen you talk about it before and I thought you were doing well so if you do have major digestion problems now then I didn't know. You've had your gallbladder and your appendix removed?

 

[Peater Piper]

Eating lower fat should be easier without a gallbladder, no? I'm not sure even a moderate fat diet would work well without ox bile at each meal, too many undigested lipids.

 

[Birdie]

@Westside PUFAs could you address the gallbladder issue on low fat? I eat quite a lot of fat as a breastfeeding Mom and wonder if it's causing some of my issues. Peat always said to add butter to starch but many conflicting viewpoints on this. Plus he recommends ice cream for quite a lot of issues, but I'll admit several months of haagen dazs every evening and I now have cellulite for the first time in my life. Not even overeating calories either!

Boy oh boy, no Haagen Dazs for me. I tried that way back and.... a quick 10 pounds later.... But my husband makes it every day adding Greek yogurt, applesauce and fruit or maple syrup. When I start, it's endless and I end up sickish from too much. He can eat the same amount every night with no problem. However, every so often I buy those H-D vanilla ice cream bars with the chocolate coating. Something about the three of them and no more works. But if I got them often, the 3 wouldn't matter. Would eat 3 at once. Kinda helps that they are expensive.

Not that you asked me, but when Ray says to add butter to starches, maybe consider how much he means to add. As he says, people can get into a lot of trouble just trying to be sure to get ALL the right nutrients and losing sight of the amounts of food eaten. Just recently, I've been cutting back slightly. I get carried away with butter which is good but...

 

[Parsifal]

But if you don't take ox bile then my statement remains. I haven't seen you talk about it before and I thought you were doing well so if you do have major digestion problems now then I didn't know. You've had your gallbladder and your appendix removed?

What is the role of the appendix in digestion?

 

[lindsay]

But if you don't take ox bile then my statement remains. I haven't seen you talk about it before and I thought you were doing well so if you do have major digestion problems now then I didn't know. You've had your gallbladder and your appendix removed?

I do take Ox Bile every day (thanks to the suggestion of Anon from the site formerly known as Peatarian). It's the only way I can digest certain proteins & foods well and keep things moving, bile wise. And yes - I had my appendix removed ten years ago at the age of 23 because my doctors prescribed me Zelnorm for too long in college and I got gallbladder disease. I dropped down to 95 lbs. very quickly because of having trouble eating everything. That drug thoroughly screwed up my digestion for years and put me on a negative serotonin/estrogen trajectory. I knew I would get appendicitis eventually, but have been very careful about eating starches for years because they always made things worse for me. If I had discovered RP sooner in life, it would have been better for me, but I'm happy that I ever discovered his work.

I AM doing much better - mentally especially - but digestion is my constant struggle because everything bothers my stomach if I cannot control everything I eat very carefully and take certain supplements. Trust me - if I could eat loads of starch everyday and tolerate it, I would LOVE that! I am glad it has been working for you! We are all different and require different diets based on our circumstances and histories.

But yes - regarding the gallbladder, it's a very important little thing that can cause hell if it goes awry or is gone. I'm not sure what is worse - dealing with gallbladder pains or not having that bile output, but I think a lot of gallbladder issues are related to endotoxin, serotonin & estrogen.

@YuraCZ - If you haven't tried Ox Bile for your gallbladder issues, I can definitely recommend it. I take it now before I eat most proteins (since many contain some fat).

 

[lindsay]

What is the role of the appendix in digestion?

I think the appendix is kind of like that useless organ that alerts someone of a serious infection. RP said somewhere that most serotonin is produced in/around the appendix. When there is too much endotoxin, I think the appendix gets severely infected and kind of protects the rest of the body from the infection - until it bursts, that is. My surgeon told me that, while medical books say nothing about it, he suspects people who get appendicitis have histories of digestive problems because he can tell by the condition of their lower intestines.

 

[YuraCZ]

Westside PUFA "
The gallbladder is not important. It's like the bladder, they are just storage bags. People have it removed often and after surgery, bile flows from the liver (where it is made) through the common bile duct and into the small intestine. The body can no longer store bile between meals. In most people, this has little or no effect on digestion. If it does, then take an ox bile supplement.
"
Are you serious? If this is really what you think. Then I have no more questions for you. It is ridiculous...

Btw I highly recommend watching videos of this funny and well spoken man.. Even somebody with zero knowledge on human body will gain from his brilliant explanations.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

Are you serious? If this is really what you think. Then I have no more questions for you. It is ridiculous...

I'm glad you have no more questions. Please don't ask me for my opinion again.

 

[YuraCZ]

Lindsay ox bile and or digestive enzymes are great for proper digestion. But it is not treating the cause just manage consequences. In your case since you don't have a gallbladder is ox bile with every fatty meal necessary. I need to fix the whole system. It's not just the gallbladder or just the thyroid etc.. It's a system of system like somebody says. :) Btw I'm surprised like nobody cares about lymphatic system here.. Like it doens't exist or what..

 

[Parsifal]

I think the appendix is kind of like that useless organ that alerts someone of a serious infection. RP said somewhere that most serotonin is produced in/around the appendix. When there is too much endotoxin, I think the appendix gets severely infected and kind of protects the rest of the body from the infection - until it bursts, that is. My surgeon told me that, while medical books say nothing about it, he suspects people who get appendicitis have histories of digestive problems because he can tell by the condition of their lower intestines.

Thant's interesting, thanks for sharing this. Some people say that it is a reservoir for "good bacterias" in case you have a dysbiosis, what do you think about it? I think that the people I know having difficulties with starch are the ones that don't have an appendix anymore (like me).

 

[EIRE24]

I think your right Lisa. There is no denying the fact that my ancestry played a role in my development of celiac disease. I'm sure it wasn't the only factor but it was definitely a contributor. I even tried reintroducing wheat in the form of sourdough bread after a year of very strict 'peating' and seemed to do okay for awhile until I suddenly crashed myself completely so I know there is more to it for me than just metabolism and hormone balance.

Crashed yourself?

 

[lindsay]

Thant's interesting, thanks for sharing this. Some people say that it is a reservoir for "good bacterias" in case you have a dysbiosis, what do you think about it? I think that the people I know having difficulties with starch are the ones that don't have an appendix anymore (like me).

This is definitely a possibility. And it would make sense for sure. Though I'm not sure how this would relate to serotonin and the appendix. I had numerous incidences before my appendix was removed where I got endotoxemia - it was very random and usually involved eating boiled eggs. But one time, it happened when I ate cooked beets - go figure. I think most people who get appendicitis have a problem with digestion in the first place. I know people who said there digestion was bad before its removal and bad after, which was my experience. Except when I took antibiotics - then I felt great.

Did you have bad digestion before having your appendix removed? When my appendicitis broke out, I had been eating a lot of white rice and mashed potatoes. I think for people like us, eating good immune boosting foods (which may include probiotic foods), as well as using antibiotics when needed, is a good option. I just started some tetracycline antibiotics because this past week I didn't feel good and it's been a slow build up. And I got Cyproheptadine to see if this helps as well.

 

[Parsifal]

Did you have bad digestion before having your appendix removed? When my appendicitis broke out, I had been eating a lot of white rice and mashed potatoes. I think for people like us, eating good immune boosting foods (which may include probiotic foods), as well as using antibiotics when needed, is a good option. I just started some tetracycline antibiotics because this past week I didn't feel good and it's been a slow build up. And I got Cyproheptadine to see if this helps as well.

Well, I had GERD at birth (could not tolerate mother's milk) and during all my childhood, and autistic symptoms so I guess yes my digestion has always been an issue... And it is still crappy. Eating an all pectin-free fruit diet with some lean meat (no dairy) is what seems to work best for me (with some activated charcoal from time to time) but I'm too poor to be able to afford this on a regular basis (and this is annoying, I have to eat all day long) so I end up eating high amounts of sugar which doesn't go well with me. So I'm trying to eat a high starch no fat diet (mainly sticky rice because this is what I seem to tolerate for starches) since 3 days but I feel a bit poisoned for now lol. I intend to see if I end up adapting to it like what @Westside PUFAs said about what he saw in a clinic with people adaptating to starch (I will give it a try for 4 more days).

I am paranoid with antibiotics since having a very bad experience with it for a long time with lyme disease: Worse After Antibiotics: Precipitating Endotoxin Release?

 

[lindsay]

Well, I had GERD at birth (could not tolerate mother's milk) and during all my childhood, and autistic symptoms so I guess yes my digestion has always been an issue... And it is still crappy. Eating an all pectin-free fruit diet with some lean meat (no dairy) is what seems to work best for me (with some activated charcoal from time to time) but I'm too poor to be able to afford this on a regular basis (and this is annoying, I have to eat all day long) so I end up eating high amounts of sugar which doesn't go well with me. So I'm trying to eat a high starch no fat diet (mainly sticky rice because this is what I seem to tolerate for starches) since 3 days but I feel a bit poisoned for now lol. I intend to see if I end up adapting to it like what @Westside PUFAs said about what he saw in a clinic with people adaptating to starch (I will give it a try for 4 more days).

I am paranoid with antibiotics since having a very bad experience with it for a long time with lyme disease: Worse After Antibiotics: Precipitating Endotoxin Release?

I can totally sympathize. My digestion caused me to develop very bad eating disorders for years. I still tend to be a small eater because I don't want to upset the equilibrium. I think that's why I've shied away from eating tons of fruit and starchy carbs and tend to prefer high nutrient dense foods like cheese and eggs, oranges, etc.

Have you tried listening to see what your body craves? I know that after I had appendicitis, I had hit my last straw. It was the third surgery I had had in 8 years and I was angry at my body. So I decided to just eat what I craved, during and after antibiotics - I was naturally led to hard cheeses, cream, coffee, eggs, and moderate amounts of sugar - usually in the form of cane sugar, OJ and oranges. And sushi - I ate sushi almost daily for a year. Still one of my favorite foods. That worked for me for quite some time, but I was also taking thyroid. Thyroid really seems to help me with my digestive problems and inflammation. Also, finding activities I enjoy helps a lot too.

Have you tried adding probiotic foods into your diet? I cured food poisoning once with Kefir and potato starch - I keep telling myself I should eat this all the time, but it's not a fun food to eat, LOL. The starch pulls the kefir bacteria all the way through the large intestine, since it is not digestible. If you don't tolerate dairy, you could try some sour cabbage or other pickled foods. I LOVE pickled things and crave them all the time.

Additionally, I had fairly good success with Iodine - I took high doses for about 4 or 5 months and experienced less inflammation and did not get sick once during the winter. I still take it from time to time, while taking thyroid. I crave fish a lot, which makes me wonder if I am slightly iodine deficient.

Anyhow, I hope you will find something that works for you!! One thing I think is important is not letting other people sway you to convince your body that it wants something when it doesn't. Listening to my cravings was such a fantastic thing. And it worked for me for some time. I've only taken antibiotics twice in like ten years and usually try to rely on other things. But I'm tired of feeling "meh" lately, so I thought I would give tetracycline a go and eat some probiotic foods and take Cypro. Starch I can tolerate in small doses, but I don't think my diet would ever work on high starch without eating probiotics with it. Which is a thought :) But I like my dairy fat and tasty foods. Plus, as someone who was protein deficient for along time, I can feel how eating some protein makes a big difference. I don't eat meat a lot, but seafoods and eggs and cheese are staples.

 

[Amazoniac]

Nutritional Keys for Intestinal Barrier Modulation
Gln: glutamine
Trp: tryptophan
TER: transepithelial electrical resistance, that measure paracellular ions flux (69).

"In multicellular organisms epithelial and endothelial cells form selective permeable interfaces between tissue compartments of different chemical compositions. Tight junctions which connect adjacent cells, control the passage of molecules across the barrier and, in addition, facilitate active transport processes. The cellular barriers are not static but can be deliberately modulated by exposure to specific external stimuli. In vitro models representing the essential absorption barriers of the body are nowadays available, thus allowing investigation of the parameters that control permeability as well as transport processes across those barriers."
"..non-invasive techniques are needed to quantify the barrier integrity continuously during the experiment. Such techniques are available and are mainly based on the measurement of the transendothelial or transepithelial electrical resistance (TEER) of barrier forming cells grown on porous membranes."

 

[EIRE24]

This is definitely a possibility. And it would make sense for sure. Though I'm not sure how this would relate to serotonin and the appendix. I had numerous incidences before my appendix was removed where I got endotoxemia - it was very random and usually involved eating boiled eggs. But one time, it happened when I ate cooked beets - go figure. I think most people who get appendicitis have a problem with digestion in the first place. I know people who said there digestion was bad before its removal and bad after, which was my experience. Except when I took antibiotics - then I felt great.

Did you have bad digestion before having your appendix removed? When my appendicitis broke out, I had been eating a lot of white rice and mashed potatoes. I think for people like us, eating good immune boosting foods (which may include probiotic foods), as well as using antibiotics when needed, is a good option. I just started some tetracycline antibiotics because this past week I didn't feel good and it's been a slow build up. And I got Cyproheptadine to see if this helps as well.

Let me know how the anti biotic goes for you. I may try it for my acne

 

[Peatish Ninja]

The gallbladder is not important. It's like the bladder, they are just storage bags. People have it removed often and after surgery, bile flows from the liver (where it is made) through the common bile duct and into the small intestine. The body can no longer store bile between meals. In most people, this has little or no effect on digestion. If it does, then take an ox bile supplement.

Wtf...

 

[YuraCZ]

Wtf...

I'm also really surprised. It is common statement from doctors. Who have no idea about biology and nutrition. But someone who supposed to know something about human body can't say something like that.. It's insane....