Low Toxin Diet Grant Genereux's Theory Of Vitamin A Toxicity

tim333

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This is from Nutrition and Physical Degeneration by Weston A Price:

Another illustration of the wisdom of the native Indians of that far north country came to me through two prospectors whom we rescued and brought out with us just before the fall freeze-up. They had gone into the district, which at that time was still uncharted and unsurveyed, to prospect for precious metals and radium. They were both doctors of engineering and science, and had been sent with very elaborate equipment from one of the large national mining corporations. Owing to the inaccessibility of the region, they adopted a plan for reaching it quickly. They had flown across the two ranges of mountains from Alaska and when they arrived at the inside range, i.e., the Rocky Mountain Range, they found the altitude so high that their plane could not fly over the range, and, as a result, they were brought down on a little lake outside. The plane then returned but was unable to reach the outside world because of shortage of fuel. The pilot had to leave it on a waterway and trudge over the mountains to civilization. The two prospectors undertook to carry their equipment and provisions over the Rocky Mountain Range into the interior district where they were to prospect. They found the distance across the plateau to be about one hundred miles and the elevation ranging up to nine thousand feet. While they had provisions and equipment to stay two years they found it would take all of this time to carry their provisions and instruments across this plateau. They accordingly abandoned everything, and rather than remain in the country with very uncertain facilities and prospects for obtaining food and shelter, made a forced march to the Liard River with the hope that some expedition might be in that territory. One of the men told me the following tragic story. While they were crossing the high plateau he nearly went blind with so violent a pain in his eyes that he feared he would go insane. It was not snow blindness, for they were equipped with glasses. It was xeropthalmia, due to lack of vitamin A. One day he almost ran into a mother grizzly bear and her two cubs. Fortunately, they did not attack him but moved off. He sat down on a stone and wept in despair of ever seeing his family again. As he sat there holding his throbbing head, he heard a voice and looked up. It was an old Indian who had been tracking that grizzly bear. He recognized this prospector's plight and while neither could understand the language of the other, the Indian after making an examination of his eyes, took him by the hand and led him to a stream that was coursing its way down the mountain. Here as the prospector sat waiting the Indian built a trap of stones across the stream. He then went upstream and waded down splashing as he came and thus drove the trout into the trap. He threw the fish out on the bank and told the prospector to eat the flesh of the head and the tissues back of the eyes, including the eyes, with the result that in a few hours his pain had largely subsided. In one day his sight was rapidly returning, and in two days his eyes were nearly normal. He told me with profound emotion and gratitude that that Indian had certainly saved his life.

Now modern science knows that one of the richest sources of vitamin A in the entire animal body is that of the tissues back of the eyes including the retina of the eye.


My question is, if these native americans were always eating nose to tail like the WAPF claims they were, how did they know about vitamin A deficiency and how to cure it? Liver was known as a cure for xerophthalmia all through the ancient world, what does that tell us about how vitamin A rich their typical diet was?
 

Dr. B

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A range of different meats supplemented with some seafood, some legumes, some eggs and some gelatin in the form of stocks or jelly.

Many like to get really technical with mineral balance but a lot of it is faulty theorizing and shooting in the dark. It's pretty straight forward though that milk is a relatively new food from an evolutionary perspective (a large percentage of people from dairy consuming cultures don't even have lactase persistence in adulthood), that calcium competes with magnesium which is very important and that paleolithic man had incredible bone health and general health without dairy and with a high phosphorus diet. Vitamin D status and other factors are very important for calcium status. Our body has complex ways of improving absorption and conservation of calcium when it is scarce in the diet. My serum ferritin seems to remain lower than it used to, iron stores can easily be reduced through donating blood if necessary but I don't seem to have a need to do that anymore.
what about whey protein, colostrum, or goats/sheeps milk then ? arent they similar to human breast milk? are they beneficial to have, whey is easily digestible right
 

tim333

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what about whey protein, colostrum, or goats/sheeps milk then ? arent they similar to human breast milk? are they beneficial to have, whey is easily digestible right
Goat and sheep milk is nothing like human breast milk. Human breast milk is not even for adult humans, it's designed specifically for the nutritional needs of an infant.

Who wants to tuck into a meal of whey protein with friends? A lot of our nutrition comes from meat, why displace that with whey? Almost all healthy eating concepts are fraudulent and counterproductive.
 

zwez

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Goat and sheep milk is nothing like human breast milk. Human breast milk is not even for adult humans, it's designed specifically for the nutritional needs of an infant.

Who wants to tuck into a meal of whey protein with friends? A lot of our nutrition comes from meat, why displace that with whey? Almost all healthy eating concepts are fraudulent and counterproductive.
Ricotta cheese is a whey cheese that has been eaten since the Bronze Age. The more you talk the more you look like a fool.
 

Dr. B

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Goat and sheep milk is nothing like human breast milk. Human breast milk is not even for adult humans, it's designed specifically for the nutritional needs of an infant.

Who wants to tuck into a meal of whey protein with friends? A lot of our nutrition comes from meat, why displace that with whey? Almost all healthy eating concepts are fraudulent and counterproductive.
but isnt it easily digestible, so should be excellent for adults too? i heard human breast milk is mostly whey, and the casein is A2. so wouldnt a colostrum be similar if its from an A2 cow or sheep, goat etc since those colostrums are mostly whey, with 20% casein about.
 

tim333

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Ricotta cheese is a whey cheese that has been eaten since the Bronze Age. The more you talk the more you look like a fool.
Anyone can read this thread and see the only person sounding foolish (and spiteful) is you. Sitting there with no helpful input of your own waiting to cherry pick and attack others with no constructive outcome.
 

tim333

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but isnt it easily digestible, so should be excellent for adults too? i heard human breast milk is mostly whey, and the casein is A2. so wouldnt a colostrum be similar if its from an A2 cow or sheep, goat etc since those colostrums are mostly whey, with 20% casein about.
Colostrum seems highly unappetizing to me and it is high in estrogen and other hormones. The digestibility of a food is just one aspect of its suitability for consumption. How is whey a better choice than meat?
 

Dr. B

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Colostrum seems highly unappetizing to me and it is high in estrogen and other hormones. The digestibility of a food is just one aspect of its suitability for consumption. How is whey a better choice than meat?
the protein quality, lack of iron, calcium to phosphate ratio, possibly lower in fat, more saturated fat proportion than meats
 

Eberhardt

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Great to know , thanks. Someone else on this huge thread, had low normal PTH on low VA diet. I wish Ray could explain that, but He has been very vague during our emails. He is stating low VD is my problem.

Grant hasn't provided any sources showing high levels of retinoic acid in casein and I've looked and haven't found any. The whole casein and retinoic acid thing has zero basis.

Casein has been used as glue, it's complex and difficult to digest if you're not a baby calf. Certain types of casein like BCM7 cause a range of disease. Every macro nutrient in dairy is bad for adult humans. Lactose and galactose (a cleavage product of lactose) are both bad for adult humans. Dairy fat is high in vitamin A. Dairy is way too high in calcium for adult humans. Dairy was known as poor man's meat in the middle ages. Some groups have lived on it and been healthy but that doesn't make it an optimal food for everyone. Dairy does contain iodine and in remote Swiss villages it would have been the only source of iodine in the diet. Some people claim to thrive on it, many don't. The paleo dieters are wrong about legumes and grains not being paleo but they are right about treating dairy with caution, it's a far newer food group than any other.
 

Apple

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Great to know , thanks. Someone else on this huge thread, had low normal PTH on low VA diet. I wish Ray could explain that, but He has been very vague during our emails. He is stating low VD is my problem.
looks like PTH level is closely related to insulin secretion and is impared in diabetics
Hence we need more glucose to lower PTH .
 
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Tarmander

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Tim, you need some MILK! I just watched your most recent YouTube video and your balding has accelerated 100-fold during this low vitamin A quest. By the end of this thing, you might be the new Jason Statham, if you hit the gym more frequently. ;)
I wanted to throw a couple comments in here from the last 30 pages or so. This comment above was interesting. I have noticed that since I went low vitamin A a few years ago, I have had a lot more hair loss then before that period. I attribute this to increased bone density and mass. My teeth also became much stronger and whiter over these years. I imagine my skull has also had mass added to it, and this could account for the hair loss. Although others will probably say lack of metabolism or something from low VA. I don't really care...the depression, chaos, and awful feeling I get from Vitamin A is a fine trade for some hair.

This would also explain some of Peat's issues. I think Vitamin A is bad for the teeth and the bones in general.

Also, on some of the comments about Grant. I interviewed him twice on the podcast and enjoyed talking with him both times. He seems very straightforward, but I will say some of his dates from his kidney disease and vitamin A diet don't exactly line up, and he actively is trying to take down vitamin A as a vitamin. Take that as you will, everyone has an agenda, even Peat, so be aware when you read them.

Personally I eat butter every day, probably 1/4 of a stick at least, and have no problem with it. I did the no vitamin A for like a year, loved the first 6-8 months and started to feel off from all the meat and rice in the last part. I still think this diet is one of the best experiments I ever did.
 

Blossom

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I still think this diet is one of the best experiments I ever did.
I feel the same. I really learned a lot about myself physically and what I can and cannot tolerate which I probably would have never completely figured out otherwise. I eat butter everyday too and it’s never been a problem.
 

Apple

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I feel the same. I really learned a lot about myself physically and what I can and cannot tolerate which I probably would have never completely figured out otherwise. I eat butter everyday too and it’s never been a problem.

Butter is an excellent source of vit A. :)

1 tbsp Vitamin A - 354.86 IU (11 % of RDI)
The Recommended Dietary Allowance for adults 19 years and older is 900 mcg RAE for men (equivalent to 3,000 IU) and 700 mcg RAE for women (equivalent to 2,333 IU).
 

Blossom

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Butter is an excellent source of vit A. :)

1 tbsp Vitamin A - 354.86 IU (11 % of RDI)
The Recommended Dietary Allowance for adults 19 years and older is 900 mcg RAE for men (equivalent to 3,000 IU) and 700 mcg RAE for women (equivalent to 2,333 IU).
Yes, I usually get 20-40% of my RDI.
 

Blossom

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How do you get calories in a low vitamin A, pufa and starch free diet?
It was quite difficult when I did it. I basically ate mainly red meat and honey for about 8 or 9 months.
 

Eberhardt

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EMF Mitigation - Flush Niacin - Big 5 Minerals

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