1. **NEW Mini Body Light** MBL1 - Orange & Red Light Therapy Mini Body Light
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Cholesterol Powder
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Pau D'arco Bark
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Metabasoap - Handcrafted Soap
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  5. Cocoa Butter - Organic & Fair Trade Certified
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  6. Orange & Red Light Therapy Device - LGS1
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice
  7. Cascara Sagrada Powder From Farmalabor In Italy
    CLICK HERE!
    Dismiss Notice

Babies Experience Life As An LSD Trip, As A Result Of Their High Metabolism

Discussion in 'Scientific Studies' started by haidut, Jul 23, 2018.

  1. haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    14,231
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    Peat wrote a few times on the brain's innate need to dream and how anti-serotonin chemicals like LSD removes the barriers on consciousness imposed by an authoritarian culture. He said that the ability to dream in an awake state is an indication of high metabolic rate and that is a testament to serotonin's negative effect on metabolism - a serotonin antagonist like LSD intensifies greatly a biomarker (awake dreaming) of high metabolism. He has also spoken about the high metabolic rate of young children and their ability to quickly heal from trauma or overcome disease much more easily than adults.
    http://orthomolecular.org/library/jom/1975/pdf/1975-v04n03-p189.pdf
    "...LSD works the other way, stimulating intense dreams even when awake, but causing a few dreamless nights when its direct effect wears off. (Para-chloro-phenylalanine, which blocks serotonin synthesis, not only interferes with sleep — especially R.E.M. sleep —but it causes rats to reject alcohol, and to become hypersexual, Campbell, 1970). The dream process involves greater conductivity through the head, whether it happens during sleep or when awake (my unpublished observations). This suggests that it corresponds to a high efficiency "resting" state."

    Serotonin: Effects in disease, aging and inflammation
    "...Some recent reviews have discussed the evidence supporting the serotonin system as primarily inhibitory and protective (Anne Frederickson, 1998, Neil Goodman, 2002). Goodman describes the serotonergic system as one of our "diffuse neuroregulatory systems," and suggests that drugs such as LSD weaken its inhibitory, filtering effect. (Jacobs, 1983, 1987: by changes in the effects of serotonin in the brain, produced by things that affect its synthesis, release, catabolism, or receptor action.) LSD depresses the rate of firing of serotonergic nerves in the raphe nuclei (Trulson and Jacobs, 1979) causing arousal similar to stimulation of the reticular formation, as if by facilitating sensory input into the reticular formation (Bowman and Rand, 1980)."

    In confirmation of this statements, the study below discovered that the brains of awake babies have very similar activity to adult brains while in state of dreaming and the brains of animals given LSD. Blake thought that the doors on perception are artificially kept semi-closed for cultural reasons - i.e. the ability to focus and do work for the enrichment of the powers that be. While Blake is not known to have used LSD, he stated several times that the child-like state of open/full perception can be restored by increasing exposure to novel situations and avoiding authoritarian (I think he called them "stiff") minds. Aside from LSD, other anti-serotonin chemicals also have similar effects. In my experience, while serotonin antagonists like cyproheptadine are not hallucinogenic, they also have quite a liberating effect on openness to new experiences and creative thought. Less sedating alternatives like ondansetron have also been reported in animal studies to increase cognitive ability and creative problem solving.

    For Babies, Life May Be a Trip
    "...But recently, neuroscientists have started to explore other states of consciousness. In research published in Nature in 2017, Giulio Tononi of the University of Wisconsin and colleagues looked at what happens when we dream. They measured brain activity as people slept, waking them up at regular intervals to ask whether they had been dreaming. Then the scientists looked at what the brain had been doing just before the sleepers woke up. When people reported dreaming, parts of the back of the brain were much more active—like the areas that are active in babies. The prefrontal area, on the other hand, shuts down during sleep."

    "...A number of recent studies also explore the brain activity that accompanies psychedelic experiences. A study published last month in the journal Cell by David Olson of the University of California, Davis, and colleagues looked at how mind-altering chemicals affect synapses in rats. They found that a wide range of psychedelic chemicals made the brain more plastic, leading brain cells to grow more connections. It’s as if the cells went back to their malleable, infantile state."

    "...In other words, the brains of dreamers and trippers looked more like those of young children than those of focused, hard-working adults. In a way, this makes sense. When you have a dream or a psychedelic experience, it’s hard to focus your attention or control your thoughts—which is why reporting these experiences is notoriously difficult. At the same time, when you have a vivid nightmare or a mind-expanding experience, you certainly feel more conscious than you are in boring, everyday life. In the same way, an infant’s consciousness may be less focused and controlled than an adult’s but more vivid and immediate, combining perception, memory and imagination. Being a baby may be both stranger and more intense than we think."
     
  2. Vinero

    Vinero Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2013
    Messages:
    733
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Many people report feeling like a kid again when taking LSD or psilocybin. It also matches what Ray said about serotonin antagonists like LSD improving learning and increasing playfulness, and cause behavioral impairment only at very high doses.
     
  3. Evgenius

    Evgenius Member

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2016
    Messages:
    104
    Gender:
    Male
    Waiting for the next IdeaLabs supplement TripOn
     
  4. Kartoffel

    Kartoffel Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2017
    Messages:
    454
    Gender:
    Male
    I second that! LSD without harmful excipients, please!
     
  5. tca300

    tca300 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 29, 2013
    Messages:
    1,311
    Gender:
    Male
    :clap:
     
  6. Wagner83

    Wagner83 Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2016
    Messages:
    2,980
    Gender:
    Male
    [Beautiful]

    Why would a certain of anti-serotonin chemical do everything you described the first few times it's used and then have completely different effects when used also acutely but weeks later or so?
     
  7. lampofred

    lampofred Member

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2016
    Messages:
    691
    Gender:
    Male
    This doesn't make sense...

    Peat said alcohol reduces dreaming while it's in your system and increases rebound dreaming when it's out of your system, and that LSD increases "awake" dreaming while it's in your system and decreases dreaming temporarily once it's out of your system. He also says that para-chloro-phenylalanine which blocks serotonin synthesis and blocks REM sleep (dreaming sleep). Alcohol also temporarily decreases serotonin (which is why people with high serotonin are drawn to alcohol). So that means LSD increases awake dreaming by increasing serotonin activity, not by decreasing serotonin activity. Also, isn't a shut-down prefrontal area is also a sign of high serotonin/low dopamine activity, since the frontal part of the brain is powered by dopamine?
     
  8. pimpnamedraypeat

    pimpnamedraypeat Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2014
    Messages:
    963
    Gender:
    Male
    What is awake dreaming?
     
  9. pinacolada

    pinacolada Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2016
    Messages:
    1,090
    Gender:
    Female
    I think @debored13 has also mentioned this discrepancy elsewhere regarding LSD and serotonin. I’m curious as well regarding the relationship.
     
  10. pinacolada

    pinacolada Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2016
    Messages:
    1,090
    Gender:
    Female
    LSD’s ability to induce malleability in adults would only be useful and good in a society that was not already trying to control its (children) and adults all the time with malicious intent.
     
  11. Prosper

    Prosper Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    516
    Gender:
    Male
    LSD makes me feel like I am peeing all over my pants.
     
  12. x-ray peat

    x-ray peat Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2016
    Messages:
    2,343
    Gender:
    Male
    hmmm no wonder the CIA was pushing it. Like most things the dose makes the poison
     
  13. Collden

    Collden Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2012
    Messages:
    145
    Why don't clearly antiserotonergic drugs like caffeine, amphetamine or cocaine have psychadelic effects?

    The articles cited seem to indicate that the effect produced by psychadelic drugs is due to inhibition of serotonergic signaling specifically in the dorsal raphe nucleus, so whether a drug is dopaminergic or serotonergic seems less important than where and on what neurons it acts.

    Other than that it's a very interesting topic and a fascinating idea that psychadelics make your brain function like that of a newborn. Whenever I took mushrooms and marveled at how vivid and wonderously alive reality became I always was thinking that this is how a baby must perceive the world, before its perception is hardened and flattened by learning to break down the world into objects and concepts and filter out any information that doesn't match these learned notions.

    Also why psychadelics can be useful for psychotherapy since they facilitate breaking up old synaptic connections that were hardwired during childhood, and make rewiring possible.
     
  14. Insaneacinamide

    Insaneacinamide Member

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2016
    Messages:
    115
    Direct from the OP "the brains of dreamers and trippers looked more like those of young children than those of focused, hard-working adults."
    LOL Turn adults into children.

    The title of this thread could also read "Adults using lsd experience life as young children.

    Meanwhile the CIA is emailing Peat about what to give it's armies to rule the world by fighting super hard, get amazing sleep, and have great motivation. That ain't gonna be lsd.
    More like ghb or gaba med for precise sleep, testosterone/dhea, caffeine or some type of stimulant during the day... all Peat approved.

    Good luck fighting against that Peat approved stack

     
  15. Kartoffel

    Kartoffel Member

    Joined:
    Sep 29, 2017
    Messages:
    454
    Gender:
    Male
    "This man nearly succeeded in felling this tree using only a spade" - I wonder what was going through his mind :D
     
  16. pimpnamedraypeat

    pimpnamedraypeat Member

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2014
    Messages:
    963
    Gender:
    Male
    Perhaps you have a tight pelvic floor and it relaxes it
     
  17. Prosper

    Prosper Member

    Joined:
    Mar 1, 2017
    Messages:
    516
    Gender:
    Male
    That sounds homosex. I think it's due to the sensory enhancement to the point where you can feel every tiny detail on your skin.
     
  18. milk

    milk Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2015
    Messages:
    244
    12 mg of cyproheptadine gives me a very good feeling, indeed a kind of "heightened awareness" feeling. Nothing psychedelic about it, just a slight euphoria and everything feeling more vivid. And indeed, it feels like being a kid again. I even get a kind of slightly sad feeling sometimes when I take a high dose of cypro, a melancholia, that I remember often feeling as a kid, but that I don't remember feeling after childhood. A bittersweet feeling, it's not bad, I think it comes with the "groundedness" of the low serotonin state.

    Conversely, SSRIs, when I took them, had a mild druggy feeling. Venlafaxine dissipated my depression, made everything feel alright, but it did feel like I wasn't on something quite natural. Escitalopram greatly diminished my anxiety for the one week I took it, but it felt quite druggy, more than venlafaxine. Like flipping a switch and hey, the anxiety's gone, but it was like... as if there were a druggy fog all around my vision or my being, and I'm feeling quite fine, somewhat sedated, at the center of this druggy fogginess.

    (But I took SSRIs mostly because they alleviated my TMD symptoms, and I have since solved my TMD through mewing. Mewing truly was a godsend for me.)
     
  19. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    14,231
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    I think the body has remarkable ability to adapt to any chemical it is exposed to. In my experience, the tolerance to something like cyproheptadine disappears after a week or two off. Maybe some people adapt better to it than others and takes longer to "reset".
     
  20. OP
    haidut

    haidut Member

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2013
    Messages:
    14,231
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA / Europe
    Alcohol lowers cortisol due to its GABA agonism and is a short-term powerful antidepressant due to NMDA antagonism (similar to ketamine). Those are probably the main reasons for alcohol "addiction". However, alcohol is actually quite serotonergic and is a direct and potent 5-HT3 agonist. I have not seen studies showing alcohol reduced serotonin, quite the opposite actually.
    But I do agree that LSD is not entirely anti-serotonergic. It is a mixed agonist/antagonist on several 5-HT receptors and is an agonist on several dopamine receptors. The full mechanism of action of LSD is still not well-known even though it is known that its hallucinogenic effects are due to 5-HT2A agonism. That is why 5-HT2A antagonists like cyproheptadine can stop a LSD "trip".
    However, 5-HT2A serotonin antagonists like methysergide (an LSD derivative similar to lisuride) can also induce trips identical to LSD when used in higher doses.
    https://jnnp.bmj.com/content/76/7/1037
    "...To date, there have been relatively few reports of psychiatric side effects of methysergide,5–7 even though this molecule is known “on the street” as a substitute for LSD5 and has been used for a very long time in clinical practice. To highlight this issue in neurological practice at a time of renewed interest in the side effects of ergot related medicines,8 we describe a patient who developed an adverse psychiatric reaction following the administration of methysergide."
    "...Methysergide was prescribed as initially at a dose of 1 mg daily with a slow increment over seven weeks up to 12 mg a day. During that period, the patient reported a reduction in both the frequency and the severity of headaches. Three weeks after the does of 12 mg/day was started he developed temporal and spatial perceptual disturbances. Objects began to look out of proportion and his sense of time was altered. He had déjà vu, a sense of depersonalisation, and the conviction of being able to broadcast his thoughts, as well as the belief that the telephone could read his mind. "

    Hallucinogenic drugs are partial agonists of the human platelet shape change response: a physiological model of the 5-HT2 receptor. - PubMed - NCBI
    "...The hallucinogenic drugs lysergic acid diethylamide (LSD-25), N,N-dimethyltryptamine (N,N-DMT), 5-methoxy-N,N-dimethyltryptamine (5-MeODMT), 4-iodo-2,5-dimethoxyphenylisopropylamine (DOI), bufotenine, and mescaline all showed a characteristic 5-HT2 partial agonist effect on platelet shape change. Nonhallucinogens with structural similarity to hallucinogens did not share this profile. Lisuride, methysergide, and lysergic acid showed antagonism of 5-HT-induced shape change, but none were shape change agonists. Other "psychoactive" or mood-altering drugs (cocaine, amphetamine, phencyclidine) showed poor antagonism of 5-HT-induced platelet shape change."

    So, even a drug with more or less full antagonism on serotonin 5-HT2 receptors can cause trips. I think that shows something else is at play in opening the "door" of perception and the only thing that remains of the known properties is the interaction with dopamine receptors and their interplay with central serotonin receptors.
    Anyways, interesting stuff to think about.
     
Loading...