What would you get checked if you suffered from this mysterious condition?

[mostlylurking]

One night at 9pm i had a full on attack of some sort that lasted for 4 hours and fits the description of serotonin syndrome, yet i really have no confidence to say what it actually was. (super cold inside, body shaking, nausea, diarrhea, distorted vision, tinnitus on 1000 super loud and tense muscles all over, and the feeling that electricity was running through my brain and my heart about to bust open through my chest).

some links for your consideration:

Vitamin B1 / Thiamine deficiency increases serotonin in the brain

This study finds that a vitmain B1 (thiamine ) deficiency causes an increase of serotonin in several brain areas . Although they avoid to use the word increase (they use "affects") in the abstract, the full study shows that this is what happened . They also found that the thiamine defiicient...

raypeatforum.com

Effect of thiamine deficiency on brain serotonin turnover - PubMed

Serotonin turnover has been investigated in regional brain areas of rats made thiamine deficient by pyrithiamine (PT). Following intracisternal injection of [14C]5-hydroxytryptamine ([14C]5-HT), a marked increase in the accumulation of [14C]5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid ([14C]5-HIAA) was found in...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Thiamine Deficiency Increases Serotonin Synthesis, Inhibits Uptake

I recently had a great experience with thiamine with regards to mental energy, and got curious as to why and how. Found some cool studies on the thiamine-serotonin connection; Thiamine deficiency: selective impairment of the cerebellar serotonergic system. - PubMed - NCBI To explore the role...

raypeatforum.com

Solving the Medically Unsolvable: Thiamine, Oxalates, and Other Complicated Health Issues - Hormones Matter

Untangling the chemistry of longstanding thiamine and B vitamin deficiencies.

www.hormonesmatter.com

Also none of that chemical exposure and thiamine did not seem to help - got the expensive one too from Elliot.

The problem with heavy metal exposure is that it stays with you forever. Exposures to heavy metals when you were a little kid are still part of your toxin load. Ever breathed any air with any motorized vehicle exhaust included, especially before they removed the lead out of gasoline? Ever drunk any water that traveled through any old metal plumbing pipes? This includes copper plumbing because it is soldered together at the joints.

I couldn't tolerate the expensive one (TTFD) from Elliot. I stuck with the cheap one, thiamine hcl from bulksupplements.com. It is important to separate taking thiamine and consuming any sugar/carbs by at least 30 minutes. If you take thiamine with juice the sugar in the juice cancels out the thiamine.

Still suspecting EMF to be playing a large part of this.

Thiamine deficiency makes you more susceptible to problems with EMF.

EMF Hypersensitivity and Thiamine - Hormones Matter

Electromagnetic hypersensitivity syndrome (EHS) has gained increasing attention over the last few years.

www.hormonesmatter.com

How does thiamine relate to EMF-hypersensitivity and brain cell dysfunction? – Objective Nutrients

www.objectivenutrients.com

Thiamine and benfotiamine counteract ultrasound-induced aggression, normalize AMPA receptor expression and plasticity markers, and reduce oxidative stress in mice - PubMed

The negative societal impacts associated with the increasing prevalence of violence and aggression is increasing, and, with this rise, is the need to understand the molecular and cellular changes that underpin ultrasound-induced aggressive behavior. In mice, stress-induced aggression is known to...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[xeliex]

some links for your consideration:

Vitamin B1 / Thiamine deficiency increases serotonin in the brain

This study finds that a vitmain B1 (thiamine ) deficiency causes an increase of serotonin in several brain areas . Although they avoid to use the word increase (they use "affects") in the abstract, the full study shows that this is what happened . They also found that the thiamine defiicient...

raypeatforum.com

Effect of thiamine deficiency on brain serotonin turnover - PubMed

Serotonin turnover has been investigated in regional brain areas of rats made thiamine deficient by pyrithiamine (PT). Following intracisternal injection of [14C]5-hydroxytryptamine ([14C]5-HT), a marked increase in the accumulation of [14C]5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid ([14C]5-HIAA) was found in...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Thiamine Deficiency Increases Serotonin Synthesis, Inhibits Uptake

I recently had a great experience with thiamine with regards to mental energy, and got curious as to why and how. Found some cool studies on the thiamine-serotonin connection; Thiamine deficiency: selective impairment of the cerebellar serotonergic system. - PubMed - NCBI To explore the role...

raypeatforum.com

Solving the Medically Unsolvable: Thiamine, Oxalates, and Other Complicated Health Issues - Hormones Matter

Untangling the chemistry of longstanding thiamine and B vitamin deficiencies.

www.hormonesmatter.com

The problem with heavy metal exposure is that it stays with you forever. Exposures to heavy metals when you were a little kid are still part of your toxin load. Ever breathed any air with any motorized vehicle exhaust included, especially before they removed the lead out of gasoline? Ever drunk any water that traveled through any old metal plumbing pipes? This includes copper plumbing because it is soldered together at the joints.

I couldn't tolerate the expensive one (TTFD) from Elliot. I stuck with the cheap one, thiamine hcl from bulksupplements.com. It is important to separate taking thiamine and consuming any sugar/carbs by at least 30 minutes. If you take thiamine with juice the sugar in the juice cancels out the thiamine.

Thiamine deficiency makes you more susceptible to problems with EMF.

EMF Hypersensitivity and Thiamine - Hormones Matter

Electromagnetic hypersensitivity syndrome (EHS) has gained increasing attention over the last few years.

www.hormonesmatter.com

How does thiamine relate to EMF-hypersensitivity and brain cell dysfunction? – Objective Nutrients

www.objectivenutrients.com

Thiamine and benfotiamine counteract ultrasound-induced aggression, normalize AMPA receptor expression and plasticity markers, and reduce oxidative stress in mice - PubMed

The negative societal impacts associated with the increasing prevalence of violence and aggression is increasing, and, with this rise, is the need to understand the molecular and cellular changes that underpin ultrasound-induced aggressive behavior. In mice, stress-induced aggression is known to...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Thanks Mostlythiamine.

I am experimenting with frequent small doses of Energin from Idealabs. Would you think it's enough thiamine?

 

[mostlylurking]

Thanks Mostlythiamine.

I am experimenting with frequent small doses of Energin from Idealabs. Would you think it's enough thiamine?

I have no idea if there's enough thiamine in frequent small doses of Energin. I follow Dr. Costantini's protocol: HDT Therapy . I found great improvement when I got up to 1 gram of thiamine hcl 2Xday. If you take this amount for seven days, it equals to the amount of thiamine you get from a single 100mg injection of thiamine hcl taken weekly. If all of the thiamine in the doses of Energin taken in a week were to get inside your bloodstream, how much Energin would you have to take to equal 100mg?

In 2020 when I was so sick, I looked into getting thiamine hcl injections. My endocrinologist told me he would refer me to a psychiatrist who is the kind of physician who does thiamine hcl injections. I decided I didn't want to go down that road so I just stuck with taking the thiamine hcl orally per Dr. Costantini's protocol. Dr. Costantini's videos of his Parkinson's Disease patients made a big impression on me: https://www.ultimaedizione.eu/videos-parkinsons-patients-treatment/

I knew I was very sick and I knew that my brain was in jeopardy. I read up on Wernicke's Encepholapathy and Korsakoff's Syndrome and got real enthusiastic about taking thiamine hcl orally with water.

Wernicke's Encephalopathy and Korsakoff's Syndrome Revisited

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Carl Wernicke, a German neurologist, published the formal description of the encephalopathy for whom it is named 131 years ago. The clinical symptoms included lethargy, ophthalmoplegia, ataxia, and mental compromise. Within the same decade but unaware of Wernicke's description, Sergei Korsakoff, a Russian psychiatrist, presented his doctoral dissertation, "Alcoholic Paralysis," on the circumscribed amnesia occurring in certain cases of chronic alcoholism. More than half a century lapsed before the common etiology of thiamine deficiency was discovered as the cause of the signs, symptoms, and link between these conditions (for historical reviews, see Charness, Simon, & Greenberg, 1989; Victor, Adams, & Collins, 1989). We now acknowledge the temporal linkage of Wernicke's Encephalopathy (WE) and Korsakoff's Syndrome (KS), depicted in Fig. 1 (cover image): 1) the acute phase of the encephalopathy, which results in bilateral lesions of periventricular nuclei, thalami, and structures of Papez's circuit, notably the mammillary bodies; and 2) the chronic phase of the syndrome, which resolves into relatively permanent bilateral lesions and enduring global amnesia. In recognition of this linkage, the resulting condition is often referred to as the Wernicke-Korsakoff Syndrome (WKS). The profound amnesia provided a compelling link to neuropsychology and set the stage for dissecting memory's component processes and identifying its dissociable neural substrates."


"Mostlythiamine".... has a nice ring to it. Although I have spent over 7 years studying Ray Peat's work and so am pretty familiar with his views. Reading his articles provided the information I needed to recover after succumbing to rheumatoid arthritis due to 20 chelation EDTA IV treatments for lead poisoning in 2014. Evidently, I was thiamine deficient at that time (because of the lead poisoning). Doctors are supposed to test you for thiamine deficiency before chelation treatment as death can result if the thiamine deficiency isn't addressed first. Fortunately I didn't die; I just got rheumatoid arthritis. It's gone now, thanks to Dr. Peat and Dr. Costantini.

 

[xeliex]

I have no idea if there's enough thiamine in frequent small doses of Energin. I follow Dr. Costantini's protocol: HDT Therapy . I found great improvement when I got up to 1 gram of thiamine hcl 2Xday. If you take this amount for seven days, it equals to the amount of thiamine you get from a single 100mg injection of thiamine hcl taken weekly. If all of the thiamine in the doses of Energin taken in a week were to get inside your bloodstream, how much Energin would you have to take to equal 100mg?

In 2020 when I was so sick, I looked into getting thiamine hcl injections. My endocrinologist told me he would refer me to a psychiatrist who is the kind of physician who does thiamine hcl injections. I decided I didn't want to go down that road so I just stuck with taking the thiamine hcl orally per Dr. Costantini's protocol. Dr. Costantini's videos of his Parkinson's Disease patients made a big impression on me: Videos Parkinson's Patients before and after treatment - Ultima Edizione.Eu

I knew I was very sick and I knew that my brain was in jeopardy. I read up on Wernicke's Encepholapathy and Korsakoff's Syndrome and got real enthusiastic about taking thiamine hcl orally with water.

Wernicke's Encephalopathy and Korsakoff's Syndrome Revisited

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"Carl Wernicke, a German neurologist, published the formal description of the encephalopathy for whom it is named 131 years ago. The clinical symptoms included lethargy, ophthalmoplegia, ataxia, and mental compromise. Within the same decade but unaware of Wernicke's description, Sergei Korsakoff, a Russian psychiatrist, presented his doctoral dissertation, "Alcoholic Paralysis," on the circumscribed amnesia occurring in certain cases of chronic alcoholism. More than half a century lapsed before the common etiology of thiamine deficiency was discovered as the cause of the signs, symptoms, and link between these conditions (for historical reviews, see Charness, Simon, & Greenberg, 1989; Victor, Adams, & Collins, 1989). We now acknowledge the temporal linkage of Wernicke's Encephalopathy (WE) and Korsakoff's Syndrome (KS), depicted in Fig. 1 (cover image): 1) the acute phase of the encephalopathy, which results in bilateral lesions of periventricular nuclei, thalami, and structures of Papez's circuit, notably the mammillary bodies; and 2) the chronic phase of the syndrome, which resolves into relatively permanent bilateral lesions and enduring global amnesia. In recognition of this linkage, the resulting condition is often referred to as the Wernicke-Korsakoff Syndrome (WKS). The profound amnesia provided a compelling link to neuropsychology and set the stage for dissecting memory's component processes and identifying its dissociable neural substrates."


"Mostlythiamine".... has a nice ring to it. Although I have spent over 7 years studying Ray Peat's work and so am pretty familiar with his views. Reading his articles provided the information I needed to recover after succumbing to rheumatoid arthritis due to 20 chelation EDTA IV treatments for lead poisoning in 2014. Evidently, I was thiamine deficient at that time (because of the lead poisoning). Doctors are supposed to test you for thiamine deficiency before chelation treatment as death can result if the thiamine deficiency isn't addressed first. Fortunately I didn't die; I just got rheumatoid arthritis. It's gone now, thanks to Dr. Peat and Dr. Costantini.

Mostlythiamine, I am glad you didn't die.

Come to think of it, my symptoms started around the time when I started applying Eugenol topically and after taking Flagyl. I know there is also a link between flagyl and thiamine. I will try to take thiamine again per Constantini as you recommended. I used to always take it with OJ, I will take it away from sugar now.

As I am typing this on break at work, my left tricep is twitching noticeably and has been for the past 2 hours. OP, I do what I can and never give up but life has to go on. I refuse to succumb. I will get up and continue working while feeling hopeful that thiamine may help.

 

[mostlylurking]

Mostlythiamine, I am glad you didn't die.

Come to think of it, my symptoms started around the time when I started applying Eugenol topically and after taking Flagyl. I know there is also a link between flagyl and thiamine. I will try to take thiamine again per Constantini as you recommended. I used to always take it with OJ, I will take it away from sugar now.

As I am typing this on break at work, my left tricep is twitching noticeably and has been for the past 2 hours. OP, I do what I can and never give up but life has to go on. I refuse to succumb. I will get up and continue working while feeling hopeful that thiamine may help.

after taking Flagyl. I know there is also a link between flagyl and thiamine.

Bingo. Flagyl did it. You've been "floxed".

Metronidazole Toxicity, Thiamine Deficiency, and Wernicke's Encephalopathy - Hormones Matter

Does the antibiotic known as Flagyl or metronidazole induce encephalopathy? Is thiamine involved?

www.hormonesmatter.com

You searched for flagyl - Hormones Matter

www.hormonesmatter.com

(additional reading)
Thiamine would be very helpful. Hang in there. Keep researching. You will recover.

 

[Peatful]

I understand that most people will doubt many things in this story, which is part of the reason it's hard to get help. Most doctors simply don't believe me, I'm convinced most people who hear this won't believe it. So please humor me and just pretend this is all true and accept that maybe freak occurrences like this do happen, and if you were in this situation, what would you do?

Ill try to write a quick version of this. In April of 2020 it all started with a powerful sudden case of restless leg syndrome in my right leg which was also felt in my right arm and sometimes my whole body. It was a horrible month until i found i was vitamin d deficient and upon taking prescribed 50,000iu of vitamin d I felt incredible relief. I continued taking 50,000iu for about a week and also took k2 and magnesium but was also taking loratadine for allergies and supplements with 5ht for sleeping problems. One night at 9pm i had a full on attack of some sort that lasted for 4 hours and fits the description of serotonin syndrome, yet i really have no confidence to say what it actually was. (super cold inside, body shaking, nausea, diarrhea, distorted vision, tinnitus on 1000 super loud and tense muscles all over, and the feeling that electricity was running through my brain and my heart about to bust open through my chest). I thought i was living the last minutes of my life the whole time, but after taking an ungodly amount of my sleeping supplement, eventually i fell asleep. The next night, after being reassured vitamin d couldn't hurt me, i took another 50,000iu pill and that night at the same time i had the same attack, this time i went to the ER. (I'm not blaming the vitamin d, i have no clue why it happened) They connected me to machines that monitor my brain and heart and showed me that the machine said absolutely nothing was wrong with either. they gave me a number to a psychiatrist and some xanax seemed to help a little but the damage was done. Now every single day i would get a slighly less intense version of this attack. i stopped taking vitamin d and after about a month i started to feel normal again. This was the beginning of my decline. Having no clue about anything health-related i started looking for answers online. Nothing i did gave me relief, i had no clue that what i put in my body could be causing it and thought only something i could put in my body would be able to fix it.

I lived this way for 9 months, having intense reactions randomly on a daily basis clueless as to why. Fighting suicidal thoughts daily. Went to south america and decided the sun could heal me. Thats when i realized the sun was one of the things that was causing these powerful reactions. I found this interesting because it was high vitamin d that i took initially when this all started. My 3rd attack happened 9 months later when i went under that powerful sun and had a delayed reaction. After about an hour under the sun, it wasn't until 10 pm when i was awakened from my sleep with the same exact attack i had on day 1. There is no question that the same thing just happened from the sun, that happened the day i took all that vitamin d and loratadine. I finally found Ray Peat forums after 9 months of looking for answers, came across the FPS course and it was the first time I had an idea of what was going on. Learning how to eat metabolically and avoid stress responses was a life-saving experience. I still have no clue what was wrong with me, but by paying attention to how things affected me, i quickly found that most proteins gave me a horrible reaction. I say reaction because these are not normal stress responses, the reactions are smaller versions of the full-fledged attack I had on day one.

So after a lot of trial n error, i found that most of what i was eating was causing these reactions. Even many supplements give me a powerful reaction. Calcium carbonate messes me up pretty bad. Most protein will give me a week-long reaction. I can only eat great lakes gelatin and only with a high amount of fresh OJ to avoid a stress response and Parmigiano Reggiano is my main source of fat except for when i have the carrot salad with coconut oil which does not cause reactions so i eat it daily. I finally reached the point where i can avoid reactions and now the only things i can eat are fresh squeezed OJ, cheese, and gelatin and coffee with honey. The only supplements i can use without a stress response is Solban from idea labs rubbed all over my gut since i gained 60 pounds being that the only thing that can calm my stress responses are massive amounts of OJ, but the solban does a great job of heating me up. It seems like anything i put in my stomach will cause a powerful reaction. Last time i tried even 400iu of vitamin d oil i had a weeklong reaction. Even vegetable broth of spinach and kale that i tried gave me a reaction. I believe tryptophan and calcium are causing reactions. The good news is my brain is working again and im able to work but my energy is still super limited, i can't be on my feet for more than a couple of hours without a stress response if I don't have enough OJ. I can get away with activity, but only with a bottle of OJ with me constantly feeding me sugar.

My brain is doing better today because i can go longer without a reaction to let my mind heal. But the bad news is that it feels like a window is closing on me. it feels like as time goes by, i become more reactive to more things. I used to be able to drink milk, supplement DHEA, have bone broth, and all the stuff i needed to heal, over time my body started reacting badly to those too. This is the part that scares me the most. By avoiding reactions my mind does heal, but my body seems to slowly change for the worse, not better.

oh and here is an interesting fact, when i get these reactions strong enough, they operate completely independent of my blood sugar and metabolism. The FPS course did a great job of teaching me how to support my thyroid function and balance blood sugar and avoid harmful substances, but when i get a powerful reaction, it doesn't matter how good my temperature is, the serotonin-like feelings just continue, even if my pulse and temp are perfect. I know it isn't adrenaline because of what i am consuming, the science says that my thyroid is functioning well.
And there lies the mystery, NOBODY even has a clue as to what could be the issue. my blood work is mostly normal except for high eosiniphilios and lactic acid. most stuff is normal. 17 doctors couldn't help me and 5 sent me to a psychiatrist. They bring up stuff like anxiety and fear of the sun, no, I do not suffer from any social fear, I love people, I love the sun *and enjoyed it on a tropical vacation only months before this happened., I am not seeking attention. Something happened to me and it may be a one-in-a-million case. Its been 2 and a half years and thanks to my high temps im able to maintain i can keep a positive mind and not really get depressed.

its been 2 and a half years now. I live indoors during the day and only go out at night and have to bring my OJ and cheese everywhere i go along with progesterone and activated charcoal which seem to be the only things that help me find relief from these strong reactions along with the OJ. I have to avoid sun exposure even through glass windows it can cause reactions. But i am worried that I'm not doing enough, this isn't going to fix itself, and I feel really embarrassed talking about it because most people just think I'm crazy because this doesn't fit anybody's medical expertise, but im done feeling embarrassed, im desperate and i have to find a way, i can't live like this. I just want to be able to walk down the street like normal people without being wrecked for a week with serotonin-like symptoms.

So if you were able to get through all that, i am looking for ideas. What mechanisms can i test that arent your basic bloodwork? What would you look for if this happened to you? Basic bloodwork seems pointless. I wish there were doctors like TV doctors that find a patient and try to find out what is wrong with them. I am willing to give up my life savings to fix this. But i am lost. When every doctor i talk to looks at me sideways. When everything they say will help me only gives me horrible reactions. Are there any organizations i can reach out too? Any special doctors who take on mysterious cases? I feel like im in the twilight zone sometimes. keeping high temps is preventing me from suicidal thoughts and is actually helping me find the energy to keep fighting and looking for solutions. if i can just get a professional to believe this is true, maybe I can get some direction on what to check my body for.

if you read all of this, thank you. ive been previously too embarassed and feeling stupid to ask for help. i think i have been traumatized by the look on doctors faces that i stopped asking around. but i dont have the luxury of not trying anymore, whatever this is, its not showing any signs of naturally being healed, even with the minimal diet of OJ gelatin and cheese and constantly having raised temperatures. im open to any suggestions.

Lots here huh?

Thoughts and suggestions.
Random. No particular order.


- I believe you.
- it’s never one thing. Could be a series of things. Things compounded. One major tipping point. But hardly ever one thing.
- OJ and cheese? Great. Think about it. A meal that is 40/30/30 macros or close.
Meaning stabilized blood sugar.
- when our BS is stable; it settles our adrenals down
- too many supplements. You can judiciously go back and use them to SUPPLEMENT what your diet can’t deliver. But it only adds to the chaos and confusion. You clearly state this above yourself. I would lay off. Think. Perceive. Act accordingly.
- being in the sun requires energy. If you’re not meeting your metabolic needs- the sun will cause symptoms. You again clearly state this yourself. The sun isn’t a problem. It’s your metabolic state.
- so high estrogen. High serotonin. Low metabolism. Weak adrenals. Gut is surely compromised as well.
- your body wants to heal. All these signs and symptoms are your roadmap to health.
- for a body in chaos; keeping it simple. Keeping it structured. Keeping a food, activity and temperature log would be insightful.

Best.

 

[mostlylurking]

Mostlythiamine, I am glad you didn't die.

Come to think of it, my symptoms started around the time when I started applying Eugenol topically and after taking Flagyl. I know there is also a link between flagyl and thiamine. I will try to take thiamine again per Constantini as you recommended. I used to always take it with OJ, I will take it away from sugar now.

As I am typing this on break at work, my left tricep is twitching noticeably and has been for the past 2 hours. OP, I do what I can and never give up but life has to go on. I refuse to succumb. I will get up and continue working while feeling hopeful that thiamine may help.

Hi xeliex,
I found an article I want to share with you:

Wernicke's encephalopathy in non-alcoholics. An autopsy study - PubMed

In a 5-year autopsy material constituting 6,964 autopsies, there were 52 cases of Wernicke's encephalopathy of which 12 (23%) occurred in non-alcoholics. Among 18 cases with active (acute) disease, 7 cases (39%) were found in non-alcoholics. Only 4 cases of active Wernicke's disease were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

"None of the non-alcoholics were given specific thiamine therapy, whereas some alcoholics received large doses of the vitamin as a routine procedure. However, the thiamine therapy was often instituted too late. It is concluded that active Wernicke's encephalopathy should be considered in all patients with prolonged malnutrition and that disorientation and depressed levels of consciousness may be the predominating symptoms of the disease. Even the slightest suspicion of Wernicke's encephalopathy should prompt immediate administration of large doses of thiamine parenterally."
-end-

Physicians seem to only consider the possibility of Wernicke/Korsakoff Syndrome if they are dealing with an alcoholic. Lots of other things can interfere with thiamine function; heavy metals accumulation and multiple pharmaceutical drugs (Flagyl, Bactrim, many more) are front and center in my mind. Most people carry some heavy metals, the older you get the more you accumulate. And yet the RDA for thiamine is less than 1.5mg/day, enough to keep you breathing but not much more.

 

[Tim Lundeen]

Good catch re Flagyl, that could certainly cause problems like this, especially combined with high-dose Vit D, which raises calcium in the cell and increases mitochondrial stress.

Things that heal mitochondria should help, which includes thiamin. PQQ should also help.

This protocol is supposed to cause damaged mitochondria to be removed. I haven't tried it... Manipulating mitochondrial dynamics - Page 58 - NAD+

 

[dreamcatcher]

@qminati have you thought about the possibility of low B12 levels?


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lQijasr7oNg

A More Accurate Way of Measuring Vitamin B12 Status than a B12 Blood Level

MMA Measurement is a More Accurate Way to Evaluate Vitamin B12 Status | by: Jonathan Bortz MD

www.xeragenx.com

B12 Deficiency Misconceptions | Stichting B12 Tekort

The most common misconceptions about B12 deficiency: anaemia, testing during treatment, just elderly, only one cause and more.

stichtingb12tekort.nl

 

[qminati]

What were your vitamin D levels after taking so much? Sounds like you got poisoned with it. It is in fact used to poison rats! Albeit at extremely high doses but it says that it isn't without risk in high doses. Look into binding up your bile acids which is where the fat soluble vitamins will be excreted and if you do not consume fiber they just get recirculated. And unfortunately if you start consuming them they can cause bile dumping and thus more reactions. But it's the only way through it, have to get the toxic bile out. You can try to find one that works for you. Some examples are beans, oats and psyllium. Cooked carrots actually bind bile better than raw. Just go slowly with fiber.


If that's not the problem which I suspect it is as sunlight can cause bile dumping the symptoms sound similar to serotonin syndrome and you were in fact taking 5ht which can cause it. If you can get cyproheptadine and take it for a couple weeks you would know pretty quick if it's serotonin or the vitamin D toxicity.

My vitamin D levels jumped up to 47 after a while and when i stopped taking vitamin d it went back down to about 15 when i checked in january, for some reason just last month it has gone up to 24 although i have not touched the sun or supplemented at all. Im guessing its from this new way of eating. But my vitamin d levels seem to have zero impact on my condition anymore. Also sunlight is not the only thing that gives me this reaction, eating a steak can cause a similar reaction just not as strong. I live in a country where i can buy cypro at the store and have it in the stash. It did help me sleep but i never felt powerful relief from it, i feel much more relief from progesterone and activated charcoal with OJ and salt when i get these reactions.

 

[qminati]

and another one:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mG3m3tbEGU0

Wow, lots to digest here, I have Dr Clarks B1 and i did feel like it helped when i was taking it last year. This year it started causing stress responses. I just took some earlier and got a "reaction" although it did make my temperature go up to 99 degrees rather than my usual afternoon temp of 98.8 so it probably did give me a boost, but I still have head pressure and neck muscle tension from the slight reaction. I will see if i sleep well tonight though.

Can you think back and try to remember if anything happened the month or two before this time? Did you have any illnesses? Did you take any antibiotics?

no but i did start keto and remember my heart beating through my chest at night months before this happened. I was so ignorant to health that i just ignored it. Last time i took antibiotics was in 2017 when i had my appendix taken out which i know is related to high serotonin. The 5htp i was taking i had been taking for years, i think that has a lot to do with what happened

How often were you taking this pill? Once or twice a week?

50,000 iu Daily for about 2 weeks

Leaky gut?

I need to learn more about this

About blood tests: Thiamine Deficiency Testing: Understanding the Labs- Hormones Matter

Definitely going to do this.

 

[qminati]

You are not alone. For a couple of years, I've been trying to cope with similar symptoms. I just haven't seen a doctor because I know they won't be of any help, being in the medical field myself.

Nighttime seems to be the worst. I wake up sometimes with my whole body shivering or few muscles twitching annoyingly. Muscle twitches happen during the day too but not the whole body low level tremor. for the night time i found l-theanine the most helpful to control my twitches

Throughout the years, I kept saying, this is the problem, that is the problem, etc... It has happened so many times that I have become jaded.

I will share with you what has helped cope and relief symptoms.

1) cyproheptadine, 2mg for symptom relief. Can be repeated. It does help. gives me slight relief, but makes me too fatigued unfortunately
2) not overdosing D and balancing it with K2 and retinol even 400iu of D messes me up pretty bad, k2 sits well with me though
3) going outside, sun or not and grounding naturally. Touching trees, metals and concrete
4) minimizing very high emf exposure. Daytime exposure = messed up nights for me this i do feel is hurting me, but i have to work on a laptop all day. I wish i could find another source of income
5) caramel candy with cyproheptadine seems to help more. I keep both at bedside
6) making the decision that those symptoms will not prevent me from living my life
7) meditation (though can be difficult) i have tried for years, my brain is way too busy and i have no clue how to relax my mind
8) B-complex (idealabs or pure encapsulations) Is there a such thing as a topical b-complex?
9) thyroid as needed, don't overdo based on what i learned with the FPS course, my thyroid seems to respond really well to my meals and activity, getting my temps up is very easy for me to do nowadays, it just doesnt seem to do much for my "reactions" which is what doesnt fit what we have learned from Ray Peat. Why is it that i can fix my blood sugar, raise my metabolism, support my thryoid, and yet it does not help my "reactions" at all, or at least not right away. And my reactions are always delayed and prolonged, none of it makes sense.
10) 10 metoxyharmalan. This is new to me but it seems to be helping with serotonin symptoms. Going to look this up

Please be flexibles and know that things that exacerbated your condition in the past might not bow or in the future. Things that helped in the past might not now or in the future. 100%

What seems to be constant is that those symptoms sound serotonergic and we have ways to mitigate that.

Stay strong and hopeful.

thank you for this post, your time is appreciated

 

[qminati]

Could it be an infection, like Lyme, the great imitator? Since any improvements in immunity is followed by herxing

checked out lyme disease from the very beginning, it was the doctors first thought before abandoning ship when my bloodwork came back great. no lyme disease according to the bloodwork.

 

[qminati]

I agree with this post, and I think bad reactions were to all those things you were taking.

100%, the problem is i feel like it caused some sort of damage and created a new problem. now that i dont put anything bad in my body, why dont i see improvement, i fear i may have caused permanent damage somehow.

 

[qminati]

Another quick question (or two):
Do you have fillings in your teeth? Are any of them silver amalgam fillings? These have mercury in them and are very toxic. Did you have dental work prior to getting so sick?

Have you had any heavy metal exposure? Lived in any older buildings (built prior to 1970) while they were being renovated? Have you done any welding or been close to the fumes of welding? Stripped any old painted wood with chemical stripper? I'm sure there's other ways to get a load of heavy metal.... Oh, yeah... have you been exposed to dust particles in a work site that included working with pot metal and acid? Heavy metal toxicity, especially lead and mercury will massively increase your need for thiamine because these metals bond to the thiamine molecule and make it unavailable to the body. Heavy metal poisoning symptoms match exactly thiamine deficiency symptoms and high dose thiamine will resolve the symptoms of heavy metal poisoning.

i did when it first happened, after the first year i got them taken out and replaced with the white fillings. As for heavy metals i dont think so, i did work construction and sanded to the point of coughing up blood but that was years before all this. i was a heavy drinker a couple years before my first attack which does deplete thiamine.

 

[Blossom]

100%, the problem is i feel like it caused some sort of damage and created a new problem. now that i dont put anything bad in my body, why dont i see improvement, i fear i may have caused permanent damage somehow.

It’s not permanent. I believe you are in the right place and will turn this around!

 

[qminati]

Lots here huh?

Thoughts and suggestions.
Random. No particular order.


- I believe you. thank you
- it’s never one thing. Could be a series of things. Things compounded. One major tipping point. But hardly ever one thing. agreed
- OJ and cheese? Great. Think about it. A meal that is 40/30/30 macros or close. according to cronomoter i get most of what i need except for choline and b12
Meaning stabilized blood sugar.
- when our BS is stable; it settles our adrenals down
- too many supplements. You can judiciously go back and use them to SUPPLEMENT what your diet can’t deliver. But it only adds to the chaos and confusion. You clearly state this above yourself. I would lay off. Think. Perceive. Act accordingly. i laid off everything that made me feel bad, and have solified the ones that are actually helpful, the only thing i take daily is solban because it does a great job warming me up
- being in the sun requires energy. If you’re not meeting your metabolic needs- the sun will cause symptoms. You again clearly state this yourself. The sun isn’t a problem. It’s your metabolic state. I thought the same thing at first, but when my temps are at a nice 98.8 from my meals, 30 seconds of sun exposure will still create the reaction, this is the part that becomes confusing and causes people not to believe it. As much as Ray Peats work saved me from suicide, it still doesn't explain why this could be happening. It goes against the theory that stress responses are fixed with metabolism and blood sugar balance. When i get these reactions, only time and nothing else will make it go away, no matter how good my temps are. and i always check pulse as well which will be around 80, still no relief from the serotonin like symptoms unless i take massivee amount of progest-e and drink massive amount of OJ with salt and take activated charcoal. This is the reason i gained so much weight. It seems as if the amount of relief i need from the OJ exceeds the amount my blood cell can take at any given time. Only after a coupl hours of constant drinking in excess do i get some relief. It gets really intense and im not in my right mind during these reactions to properly measure how much OJ it actually takes. So in desperation for relief i keep chugging more juice.
- so high estrogen. High serotonin. Low metabolism. Weak adrenals. Gut is surely compromised as well. I actually feel like my adrenals have improved since peating. When i wake up in the morning i know for a fact im running on adreanline and it doesnt feel horrible anymore, no more beating heart. I drink my OJ before getting out of bed and i can feel my adrenaline go down and i feel horrible and shaky for about 20 minutes until my thyroid kicks in, only then do i get up and i reach 98.6 usually before noon. Once again, this doesnt make sense, its as my thyroid is responding super well, but doesnt provide releif for any of my other issues.
- your body wants to heal. All these signs and symptoms are your roadmap to health.
- for a body in chaos; keeping it simple. Keeping it structured. Keeping a food, activity and temperature log would be insightful. at this point its exactly the same every day, cheese and OJ, temps go right up, no issues there.

Best.

thank you for your post

 

[qminati]

@qminati have you thought about the possibility of low B12 levels?


View: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=lQijasr7oNg

A More Accurate Way of Measuring Vitamin B12 Status than a B12 Blood Level

MMA Measurement is a More Accurate Way to Evaluate Vitamin B12 Status | by: Jonathan Bortz MD

www.xeragenx.com

B12 Deficiency Misconceptions | Stichting B12 Tekort

The most common misconceptions about B12 deficiency: anaemia, testing during treatment, just elderly, only one cause and more.

stichtingb12tekort.nl

most definitely as i thought it was related to resltess leg syndrome. I used to eat a lot of steak and my b12 was even high at one point. But nowadays i barely get any b12, i dont think there is anything i can tolerate to get b12 though, defintiely worries me that there is very little in my diet. Although its interesting that i only get 50% calcium requirements daily and still have good calcium bloodwork.

 

[qminati]

It’s not permanent. I believe you are in the right place and will turn this around!

i cant lie reading this felt nice, lol. i shouldnt think negative like that

 

[dreamcatcher]

most definitely as i thought it was related to resltess leg syndrome. I used to eat a lot of steak and my b12 was even high at one point. But nowadays i barely get any b12, i dont think there is anything i can tolerate to get b12 though, defintiely worries me that there is very little in my diet. Although its interesting that i only get 50% calcium requirements daily and still have good calcium bloodwork.

If we don't eat enough calcium rich foods, the body releases calcium into the bloodstream from the bones (and teeth) as well, as far as I understand.
Sugar is important for strong bones.