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Think My Cat Is Dying

Discussion in 'Animals' started by Jessica Martin, Sep 30, 2019.

  1. OP
    Jessica Martin

    Jessica Martin Member

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    Hiya @redsun thanks for the advice. I have tried him with lambs liver but he refused to eat it. It was cooked, did you give it raw? I will see what I can find tomorrow in the supermarket. Cats can be so fussy.
     
  2. redsun

    redsun Member

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    You should give it raw. Mine ate beef liver or calf liver raw. Cats should not be fussy about eating organs because that's their natural food. It probably didnt like it cooked. Funnily enough, my cat or dog will not eat some cheap chicken liver I bought once from the store(cat will eat a bit, dog won't even bother). Told me that the chicken liver probably had some toxic stuff the pets could smell or something, so probably not good for me to eat it either. Beef liver they happily eat, Im pretty sure it is because the cows they come from don't get exposure to toxic stuff like the chickens probably. If not lamb, just go for beef instead, and make sure it's raw. Let us know how it goes.
     
  3. OP
    Jessica Martin

    Jessica Martin Member

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    Thank you so much. I will be running to the supermarket tomorrow. Never seen beef liver but maybe haven't been looking in the right place. Can defo get calf liver so will settle for that if not. Thank you so much and I will update you tomorrow
     
  4. boris

    boris Member

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    I assume you feed regular catfood? There is basically no good ones around. Most stuff contains grains, straight PUFA and some even toxic gums. Even the stuff marketed as "natural". Even if it says 100% meat on the package, it has no meaning in petfood.

    You should google B.A.R.F. to find raw feeding guidelines for cats.

    A basic recipe:
    1kg beef, chicken stomach, lambheart or beefheart (some cats don't like one or the other) equal amounts
    mix with broth or dissolved gelatin
    +40g of liver per kilo
    + 2-3g salt per kilo
    + 2-3g of Taurine per kilo (taurine is extremely important for cats, in nature they get a lot of it from fresh hearts and especially mice brains)
    + 5-6g of eggshell calcium
    + sprinkle of B vitamins
    + 2 drops good vitamin E if you can get it
    Optional: some blood or blood powder (depending on the meat you use up to 11g of powder, I stay at around 3-5g)

    Freeze in daily portions and heat up in a double water bath to mouse body temperature before feeding ;). I keep them in jars in the freezer and get them out one at a time. In 1 jar I put in enough to last 1-2 days in the fridge.
    +for fiber some grated carrot over the food fresh when I feed, or a teaspoon of well cooked blended up mushroom. They love the mushroom more.

    You can start with just meat if it takes time to get other ingredients. Anything is better than commercial catfood. There is some good ones around from time to time, but they also change recipes often.

    Sometimes I feed them scrambled eggs with salt for some B vitamins possibly theres more stuff in eggs that's good for them. They love it.
    One of my cats loves milk, the other hates it, but instead loves coconut oil which in turn the other one hates :D.
     
  5. OP
    Jessica Martin

    Jessica Martin Member

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    Wow! Thanks @boris that sounds delicious
    I have read about pottengers cats and the raw food diets do seem to be the best thing for cats. I have been trying to find recipes to give him a boost. I will see what I can get together tomorrow although he is an extremely fussy eater he does however like coconut oil in small doses. Will update tomorrow on how I get on. Thanks again
     
  6. boris

    boris Member

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    No problem! Yes the fussines can be a hurdle :D. I hope your cat gets better soon.
     
  7. yerrag

    yerrag Member

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    1 capsule of it. Put contents in water and give to the cat using a medicine dropper.
     
  8. methylenewhite

    methylenewhite Member

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    I forgot to say my cats are crazy for coconut oil too. They just lick straight from a spoon. I discovered it accidentally as well. Try to give it to your cat. If he doesn't want to eat it straight, fry some beef or chicken breast for him in coconut oil.
     
  9. raysputin

    raysputin Member

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    Yes!! My cat also licked the lid of a jar of coconut oil until I realized how much she liked it...I started giving her a bit throughout the day.
     
  10. boris

    boris Member

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    @methylenewhite
    you can also add some coconut oil to raw meat, my cats like it that way too! Fried I would only give small pieces as a treat.

    That Pottenger's cats study is extremely interesting, I haven't heard about it before Jessica mentionend it:



    I am a little shocked by the effect of pasteurized milk vs raw milk. ...
    I guess a obligate carnivore organism functions even more differently than I thought.
     
  11. OP
    Jessica Martin

    Jessica Martin Member

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    Hi all, sorry for not getting back to you all.
    Quick update, cat is doing a bit better. Have him on raw food diet, which I'm hand feeding to him @boris thanks for the recipe. He seems to really like it and is eating more. We are currently feeding him beef, lamb liver and kidney as these are all I could get. Along with apple cider vinegar, oat bran for fiber as he is constipated, with raw egg.
    I also am rubbing progesterone in his ears and rubbing DMSO in ears on separate occasions. Hope I'm doing the right thing.
    He also loves coconut oil.
    His breathing has gotten a bit better but still up and down and has a swollen belly. And still quite weak.
    I'm totally perplexed, I still feel he would not cope going to vet and he is up and down so very confusing.
    I've researched FIP, heart failure, chronic kidney disease and renal failure. Symptoms are confusing as not fitting one thing or another. Wondering if it may be a parasite or gastro related. But no diarrhoea also vomiting has completely stopped.
    Any suggestions greatly appreciated.
    Jess
     
  12. redsun

    redsun Member

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    Oh god, where did you learn this? That obligate carnivores need fiber? The fiber will clog up the intestines of the cat, wouldn't be surprised if that is the cause of the swollen stomach. And even if it isnt directly causing it, it definitely is not helping, probably making it worse and worsening constipation. Cats should not be given any fiber at all. The cat will poop when it needs to.

    The vomiting stopped because you started feeding its natural diet.
     
  13. methylenewhite

    methylenewhite Member

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    I agree with @redsun It's better to substitute fiber with chitin of prawns or insects. My cats eat lots of insects, they hunt for them.
     
  14. Rafael Lao Wai

    Rafael Lao Wai Member

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    Glad he's a little better. Technically I don't have a cat, but there is this stray cat that comes to my house everyday and I feed her raw meat. She loves it, especially when the meat has a lot of blood. Beef heart usually releases a lot of blood as it thaws. When I once gave her microwaved meat, she thew up all of it, so I never gave her any form of cooked meat again. When I gave her store-bough, pasteurized milk, she started to cough, so that's something I didn't give again either.

    I think you're feeding him right. The only thing I'm not sure are great for him are vinegar and oat bran. Vinegar lowers blood sugar( at least in humans), so that would put more pressure on gluconeogenesis to maintain adequate blood sugar for the cat's organs. Carnivores, as far as I know, don't eat any fiber in the wild, unless they want to flush something out of their bowels( my grandmother's dog would eat a little bit of grass after eating something that didn't sit right in their gut). I'm afraid the oat bran will make him more constipated, since I myself get constipated from oat bran. I think the raw meat will do a better job at keeping him regular, since there are studies( in humans) showing that a very low fiber diet solves chronic constipation.

    Also, maybe giving him cyproheptadine is a good idea? Hopefully other forum members will chime in and say whether or not this is a good idea. I've given my stray cat cypro once or twice, but she wasn't constipated or bloated, so I cant say it's gonna work just as well for your cat, since the situation is very different.
     
  15. boris

    boris Member

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    I agree with oat bran being problematic. My cats get diarrhea eventually if I don‘t add fiber. That‘s why I stick with cooked ground mushroom. They like it, it adds a little umami to their food too.
     
  16. alywest

    alywest Member

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    When researching taurine supplements on amazon a bunch of people state that they gave it to cats with serious kidney issues and it was a lifesaver. Don't know why that isn't more common knowledge!
     
  17. boris

    boris Member

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    @alywest Yes!
    Taurine is an essential amino acid for cats. They need it to create bile salts and they can't synthesize sufficent taurine on their own, that's why it's important to add plenty of heart if you don't have a supplement.

    @Jessica Martin
    Good to hear your cat is doing a little better :)
     
  18. alywest

    alywest Member

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    I wish vets would share that information although commercial foods have taurine added so they probably figure they have enough. However, it seems based on people's reviews online that adding extra taurine has helped many a dying feline, so perhaps when the source is synthetic it needs to be given in greater amounts. With the raw food diet that the OP is attempting taurine should be plentiful but that is for an otherwise healthy cat.
     
  19. boris

    boris Member

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    Yes, extra taurine is super safe for cats. Even multiple times the recommended amount cause no bad side effects.

    Interesting to hear that it helped sick cats, I always had this feeling that commercial catfood has only the minimum amount of taurine.
     
  20. OP
    Jessica Martin

    Jessica Martin Member

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    @alywest @boris

    I have always been aware that taurine is a very important amino acid for cats, I just assumed that the pet industry always put enough in their food, obviously they didn't . They were aware of the importance of taurine in the early 70s but did nothing until 1987 I think when lots of cats died I think it was hundreds possibly more only then did they add taurine,absolutely shocking.

    I also found out in my research that when you grind raw meat for cats that are sick as mine is
    a lot of the taurine evaporates or oxidises not quite sure because it's more exposed and breaks down.
    I will buy some taurine powder and add to the meats.


    https://feline-nutrition.org/nutrition/how-much-taurine-should-i-add
     
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