Insoluble fiber vs soluble

[Birdie]

I need to mentioned my soles and palms are orange af, from too much beta carotene, probs from the carrots, orange juices and mandarins.

I just found it it can affect digestion issues...

I need more B12 and thyroid and stop all the beta carotene stuff? Not sure if its in OJ?

Do I need to stop Vitamin A in general, from eggs, liver, milk etc?

So, maybe carrots aren't for you. I use Ray's advice to rinse carrots. In fact, I cut, soak in water, rinse several times to wash out some of the beta carotene. I'm sensitive to it, but this works out. I didn't know there was enough amount of beta carotene in oj or mandarins to make a difference. But, since I've rinsed my carrot sticks or carrot salad, no more orange tinge in palms or soles.

And I alternate carrots with cooked mushrooms.

I supplement vitamin A (no beta carotene). If I don't get enough, with the Peat High Metabolism, I get breakouts on my back. So, I gage it by my body that way.

 

[Kray]

What did he say?

You need 400mg elemental mag each day maintenance.

If you want to build up stores, 6 months to one year of 800mg magnesium needed.

No need to test for magnesium. Waste of money. Your won't OD and die as you will have diarrhea and that's the body protecting you.

Magnesium carbonate is fine. Ray Peat recommends it.

@yerrag- do you mean 800mg elemental Mg to build up stores? So if my MgCarbonate says 200 elemental mg per 1/3 tsp (875mg) powder, I would need to take 1/3 tsp 4 times a day to achieve 800mg, for 6 months. If testing isn't necessary, is constipation enough of a sign that stores are low? And depending on how long stores have been low, reduce dosage to bowel tolerance? Then continue on that dose? Thank you-

 

[yerrag]

@yerrag- do you mean 800mg elemental Mg to build up stores? So if my MgCarbonate says 200 elemental mg per 1/3 tsp (875mg) powder, I would need to take 1/3 tsp 4 times a day to achieve 800mg, for 6 months. If testing isn't necessary, is constipation enough of a sign that stores are low? And depending on how long stores have been low, reduce dosage to bowel tolerance? Then continue on that dose? Thank you-

The 800mg elemental magnesium taken daily is a therapeutic dosage to build up magnesium stores. 6 months at minimum, but may even be a year. But talk of how long is dependent on the baseline magnesium stores one begins with, and there.is no hard and fast rule. You go by feel also, as when magnesium stores build up to a significantly impactful level, you can feel it in improved peristalsis and the disappearance of the tendency to constipate. There will be an urge to defecate regularly and defecating becomes effortless and short.

After some time, you can lower the dosage to a maintenance dose of 400mg/day or live a dietsry lifestyle where you get 400mg/day of magnesium. I do this my eating plenty of cooked green leaves. Although I don't know how much green leaves is needed, so far I have seen my bowel movement being good without having to resort to the use of fiber in my diet.

But there's a catch here. Ray Peat had said that ATP is needed to effect retention of magnesium taken in. So this means being euthyroid is necessary. If one is hypothyroid, building up magnesium stores would be difficult.

You can take the magnesium carbonate the way you described it.

The dosage determination for magnesium doesn't work the same way as determining vitamin C dosage where bowel tolerance is used.

When magnesium stores are enough, and you know you get better bowel movement even with low fiber intake, you already have a cue to think about going lower on dosage levels from therapeutic to maintenance.

I haven't been able to get to a point where the body has diarrhea from magnesium intake, but it's only because I found no need to push my magnesium store levels.

I only use the diarrhea effect to tell me not to worry about getting too much magnesium in my system. This way, I don't have to take any test to determine if I'm truly magnesium deficient to begin therapeutic magazine supplementation.

The tests that are affordable and available don't give us a true measure of magnesium store levels, and the ones that do aren't widely available and are expensive.

 

[Kray]

The 800mg elemental magnesium taken daily is a therapeutic dosage to build up magnesium stores. 6 months at minimum, but may even be a year. But talk of how long is dependent on the baseline magnesium stores one begins with, and there.is no hard and fast rule. You go by feel also, as when magnesium stores build up to a significantly impactful level, you can feel it in improved peristalsis and the disappearance of the tendency to constipate. There will be an urge to defecate regularly and defecating becomes effortless and short.

After some time, you can lower the dosage to a maintenance dose of 400mg/day or live a dietsry lifestyle where you get 400mg/day of magnesium. I do this my eating plenty of cooked green leaves. Although I don't know how much green leaves is needed, so far I have seen my bowel movement being good without having to resort to the use of fiber in my diet.

But there's a catch here. Ray Peat had said that ATP is needed to effect retention of magnesium taken in. So this means being euthyroid is necessary. If one is hypothyroid, building up magnesium stores would be difficult.

You can take the magnesium carbonate the way you described it.

The dosage determination for magnesium doesn't work the same way as determining vitamin C dosage where bowel tolerance is used.

When magnesium stores are enough, and you know you get better bowel movement even with low fiber intake, you already have a cue to think about going lower on dosage levels from therapeutic to maintenance.

I haven't been able to get to a point where the body has diarrhea from magnesium intake, but it's only because I found no need to push my magnesium store levels.

I only use the diarrhea effect to tell me not to worry about getting too much magnesium in my system. This way, I don't have to take any test to determine if I'm truly magnesium deficient to begin therapeutic magazine supplementation.

The tests that are affordable and available don't give us a true measure of magnesium store levels, and the ones that do aren't widely available and are expensive.

Thanks for clarifying dosage. I am still confused about elemental vs total mg. Here is an example:

Life Extension, Magnesium Caps, 500 mg, 100 Vegetarian Capsules

www.iherb.com

This doesn't distinguish 500mg Mg as elemental. That would seem quite high. Is there a conversion formula to know? The dosage is 1 to 3 per day.

Another brand I have used is 500mg and dose is only 1 per day, no mention of elemental. I have a MgCarb bulk powder, which gives 1/3 tsp = 875 mg = 200mg elemental magnesium. If I can't figure out the capsule brands I have on hand, I may just stick with the MgCarb since it is without any fillers, gives the elemental, and is Peat-approved. I will aim for 800mg/day if I get that far. Thank you-

 

[yerrag]

Thanks for clarifying dosage. I am still confused about elemental vs total mg. Here is an example:

Life Extension, Magnesium Caps, 500 mg, 100 Vegetarian Capsules

www.iherb.com

This doesn't distinguish 500mg Mg as elemental. That would seem quite high. Is there a conversion formula to know? The dosage is 1 to 3 per day.

Another brand I have used is 500mg and dose is only 1 per day, no mention of elemental. I have a MgCarb bulk powder, which gives 1/3 tsp = 875 mg = 200mg elemental magnesium. If I can't figure out the capsule brands I have on hand, I may just stick with the MgCarb since it is without any fillers, gives the elemental, and is Peat-approved. I will aim for 800mg/day if I get that far. Thank you-

They're confusing.

I agree its better to just use mag carb.

 

[Kray]

They're confusing.

I agree its better to just use mag carb.

Thank you. Can I ask what form(s) of magnesium you supplement, if any, and what form you think best for good bowel function?

 

[yerrag]

Thank you. Can I ask what form(s) of magnesium you supplement, if any, and what form you think best for good bowel function?

Since I take plenty of cooked green leaves. during lunch and dinner, and since my bowel movement is good without having to take a lot of fibrous foods, and since I have decent blood sugar regulation and good acid base balance, which is indicative of good sugar metabolism, I think my magnesium stores are fine. I had already done a year of therapeutic magnesium intake, and as long as I keep my magnesium intake through foods adequate, I don't see a need to supplement for now.

But many forms of magnesium are available where the anion the magnesium cation is paired with to form a salt. The choice of anion is dependent on the person's condition.

Magnesium bicarbonate to alkalize an acidic condition, but one has to know his acid base balance status first and many don't care to know and yet take mag bicarb just because ... it's alkaline. Good thing it's harder to make and expensive to purchase. You also need magnesium hydroxide and CO2 to make it as in a sodastream-like device.

Magnesium acetate and magnesium succinate is much easier to make. Although it's easier made with 20% Acetic Acid as it's harder to make with just the usual 5% form in regular vinegar, with mag carb. You can also make mag succinate with succinic acid in a water solution.

You can also make mag ascorbate with mag carbonate and ascorbic acid in a water solution. I don't think it keeps for long, so you just have to make just enough for you to use shortly.

More convenient but expensive forms are the chelates. Such as glycinates, bisglycinates, threonates.

Cheaper are citrates, but there is the fear that citrates end up pairing with calcium and are excreted, but that is a matter of acid base balance and most people have no clue what their acid base balance status is.

 

[Kray]

Since I take plenty of cooked green leaves. during lunch and dinner, and since my bowel movement is good without having to take a lot of fibrous foods, and since I have decent blood sugar regulation and good acid base balance, which is indicative of good sugar metabolism, I think my magnesium stores are fine. I had already done a year of therapeutic magnesium intake, and as long as I keep my magnesium intake through foods adequate, I don't see a need to supplement for now.

But many forms of magnesium are available where the anion the magnesium cation is paired with to form a salt. The choice of anion is dependent on the person's condition.

Magnesium bicarbonate to alkalize an acidic condition, but one has to know his acid base balance status first and many don't care to know and yet take mag bicarb just because ... it's alkaline. Good thing it's harder to make and expensive to purchase. You also need magnesium hydroxide and CO2 to make it as in a sodastream-like device.

Magnesium acetate and magnesium succinate is much easier to make. Although it's easier made with 20% Acetic Acid as it's harder to make with just the usual 5% form in regular vinegar, with mag carb. You can also make mag succinate with succinic acid in a water solution.

You can also make mag ascorbate with mag carbonate and ascorbic acid in a water solution. I don't think it keeps for long, so you just have to make just enough for you to use shortly.

More convenient but expensive forms are the chelates. Such as glycinates, bisglycinates, threonates.

Cheaper are citrates, but there is the fear that citrates end up pairing with calcium and are excreted, but that is a matter of acid base balance and most people have no clue what their acid base balance status is.

Thank you, yerrag. I really appreciate your applying context and sorting out the pros/cons of various forms.

I was considering going back to Mg Bicarb but your point on acid/alkaline is well taken, and I don't know where I am on the scale. I do have Mg Carb and AA, so I could easily do an ascorbate quickly and easily. On that note, do you believe taking those two together has any added benefit than taking them apart?

Now I understand better your earlier point about building stores-- now you can get by with food sources since you have restored your levels. I'm not in a place right now where it is convenient to get what I need with foods, but I have no doubt that is the best way to go. My family from southern USA have cooked greens abundantly in their diet and probably don't have as much Mg deficiency overall in that part of the country as elsewhere. Funny how I can make excuses for not making something that other people wouldn't do without, just on tradition!

Since my last post, I looked into other fiber options. I feel I need something added to Mg dosing, as I don't know if taking up to 1500mg/day of Mg is a good thing. I found several companies that sell cellulose fiber, and purchased some to try. I have wheat allergy so I decided against wheat bran, and psyllium has too much soluble fiber for my liking. Cellulose is all insoluble. I may just add a bit at each meal for starters and see if it helps.

And I will try to incorporate more greens into my recipes-- something not hard to do, really!

 

[SamYo123]

Cooked greens are fiber?

 

[yerrag]

Cooked greens are fiber?

Yes, and a lot of cellulose fiber - insoluble as well @Kray Also, calcium and vitamin K

 

[Kray]

Yes, and a lot of cellulose fiber - insoluble as well @Kray Also, calcium and vitamin K

Good to remember- motivation!

 

[lilsticky]

The premise of the question is faulty.

nice cognitive dissonance you got there bro

 

[yerrag]

nice cognitive dissonance you got there bro

Thank you for just reading one post while OP engaged me with earnest in a follow-up on this thread.

You just spouted a nice term without knowing what it means. Blah.