Why doesn’t thyroid raise my temperature

[firebreather]

I’ve tried several different kinds of thyroid, currently taking 1.5 Cynoplus per day (180mcg of T4 and 45mcg if T3)

At no time have any of the different forms of thyroid improved my pulse and temperature

My temperature in the morning is always between 96.5 and 96.8 and my pulse is between 55 and 65

I’ve heard that Ray said it’s possible that thyroid won’t work if there’s an infection. Years ago i did test positive for h pylori. I don’t know if that’s something that could have this effect or not

But here’s the thing, my bloodwork has improved quite a bit. My T4 came up, my T3 came way up and my cholesterol went from 350 total to 220

So it seems the thyroid is doing something, but why won’t my temp and pulse go up?

 

[youngsinatra]

What do you eat?

 

[firebreather]

What do you eat?

Probably 80/20 Peaty. I have to get more starches than he recommends and more saturated fat, otherwise hypo symptoms get worse

Eggs, beef, chicken, plenty of ripe fruits, butter, coconut oil, rice, potatoes, homemade bread. I can only do milk after a hard session of Jiu-Jitsu, otherwise it gives me a very stuffy nose - a symptom of hypo thyroid I'm sure. OJ gives me the same issues

But even if I didn’t eat mostly Peaty most people who take thyroid get relief from symptoms and most people don’t eat Peaty

 

[Peatress]

Have you tested your vitamin D levels? Raising it could raise your temperature - it did mine. You might need more calcium too

Vitamin D Deficiency and Its Association with Thyroid Disease

Vitamin D deficiency is a global health problem, its role as an immune modulator has been recently emphasized. The evidence is increasingly pointing towards vitamin D significant role in reducing the incidence of autoimmune diseases. However, at this ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[firebreather]

Have you tested your vitamin D levels? Raising it could raise your temperature - it did mine. You might need more calcium too

Vitamin D Deficiency and Its Association with Thyroid Disease

Vitamin D deficiency is a global health problem, its role as an immune modulator has been recently emphasized. The evidence is increasingly pointing towards vitamin D significant role in reducing the incidence of autoimmune diseases. However, at this ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

I get it checked yearly for work. In March it was 82 with 92 being the top of the range

I did just start taking a gram of calcium carbonate each day so maybe that will help

 

[DrJ]

I’ve tried several different kinds of thyroid, currently taking 1.5 Cynoplus per day (180mcg of T4 and 45mcg if T3)

At no time have any of the different forms of thyroid improved my pulse and temperature

My temperature in the morning is always between 96.5 and 96.8 and my pulse is between 55 and 65

I’ve heard that Ray said it’s possible that thyroid won’t work if there’s an infection. Years ago i did test positive for h pylori. I don’t know if that’s something that could have this effect or not

But here’s the thing, my bloodwork has improved quite a bit. My T4 came up, my T3 came way up and my cholesterol went from 350 total to 220

So it seems the thyroid is doing something, but why won’t my temp and pulse go up?

Too much reverse T3 maybe? Did you get a value for that from your test?

 

[xeliex]

Too much reverse T3 maybe? Did you get a value for that from your test?

Perhaps. One easy way to tell is to get off of T4 and try T3 only for a little while and evaluate.

 

[firebreather]

Too much reverse T3 maybe? Did you get a value for that from your test?

Great question

It’s been a few yrs since i had it checked but when i did it was at the very bottom of the range. I’d been on thyroid for about 4 yrs at that point in the same predicament

From what I understand Reverse T3 is usually high because of stress. I’m under even less stress now than when i got that test so while i guess it’s possible that’s the issue, it seems unlikely

 

[firebreather]

Perhaps. One easy way to tell is to get off of T4 and try T3 only for a little while and evaluate.

I have tried that twice, a couple yrs ago with cynomel. Oddly enough when I take T3 by itself I always get an adrenaline response, no matter how little and even with a big meal

I don’t understand that because from what I understand T4 is takes days to weeks to make a difference. So why would taking it with the T4 keep the adrenaline response away. I don’t know

 

[xeliex]

I have tried that twice, a couple yrs ago with cynomel. Oddly enough when I take T3 by itself I always get an adrenaline response, no matter how little and even with a big meal

I don’t understand that because from what I understand T4 is takes days to weeks to make a difference. So why would taking it with the T4 keep the adrenaline response away. I don’t know

Seems fair to assume that T4 is not being converted properly to T3. I'd try a higher T3 to T4 dose and cut back on both. At the same time, I'd address my nutrition and make sure I am well nourished. Eating liver once a week, oysters once or twice a week, taking B-complex if needed, calcium, selenium, etc... also meal frequency, general stress state. With T3, of course needs to always be with a meal.

 

[Waynish]

Because "thyroid" is a process, not a molecule. I realize likely no one on this forum will agree.

 

[firebreather]

Seems fair to assume that T4 is not being converted properly to T3. I'd try a higher T3 to T4 dose and cut back on both. At the same time, I'd address my nutrition and make sure I am well nourished. Eating liver once a week, oysters once or twice a week, taking B-complex if needed, calcium, selenium, etc... also meal frequency, general stress state. With T3, of course needs to always be with a meal.

Interesting you would say that with my t3 coming way up. To be clear, before thyroid my t4 was below the range and so was my t3. Now my t4 is in range but toward the bottom but my t3 is near the top of the range

 

[AmandaWald]

I’ve tried several different kinds of thyroid, currently taking 1.5 Cynoplus per day (180mcg of T4 and 45mcg if T3)

At no time have any of the different forms of thyroid improved my pulse and temperature

My temperature in the morning is always between 96.5 and 96.8 and my pulse is between 55 and 65

I’ve heard that Ray said it’s possible that thyroid won’t work if there’s an infection. Years ago i did test positive for h pylori. I don’t know if that’s something that could have this effect or not

But here’s the thing, my bloodwork has improved quite a bit. My T4 came up, my T3 came way up and my cholesterol went from 350 total to 220

So it seems the thyroid is doing something, but why won’t my temp and pulse go up?

I have tried that twice, a couple yrs ago with cynomel. Oddly enough when I take T3 by itself I always get an adrenaline response, no matter how little and even with a big meal

I don’t understand that because from what I understand T4 is takes days to weeks to make a difference. So why would taking it with the T4 keep the adrenaline response away. I don’t know

Ray Peat recommends that, when taking T3 for the first time, you take 100mcg of magnesium along with the T3. Have you tried that before?

 

[AmandaWald]

Probably 80/20 Peaty. I have to get more starches than he recommends and more saturated fat, otherwise hypo symptoms get worse

Eggs, beef, chicken, plenty of ripe fruits, butter, coconut oil, rice, potatoes, homemade bread. I can only do milk after a hard session of Jiu-Jitsu, otherwise it gives me a very stuffy nose - a symptom of hypo thyroid I'm sure. OJ gives me the same issues

But even if I didn’t eat mostly Peaty most people who take thyroid get relief from symptoms and most people don’t eat Peaty

If you have histamine issues - the stuffy nose and reacting to orange juice are typical symptoms - then you likely need to work on supporting your liver. I have problems with histamine clearance as well, the symptoms come and go and I never quite know what makes them come and go.

Cyproheptadine can be quite helpful for histamine problems, in my experience, and Progest-E always helps me as well, but I don't know about dosage of this for men.

From my reading on the subject, poor histamine clearance involves the liver, estrogen, magnesium, the adrenals, to mention but a few that come to mind straight away.

I would try a week of eating the carrot salad every afternoon between meals and then try having some orange juice or milk to see if your histamine response is less extreme.

You don't mention if you take any supplements at all, but perhaps selenium would be a good one to try first. If I recall correctly, it is needed to convert T4 to T3. 180mcg is a big dose of T4, and taking it in the form of cynomel seems to mean that you get quite a large dose of T3 at once. Ray Peat always talks about "nibbling" on a T3 tablet and I personally take my T3 in doses of 5mcg at a time. If I remember rightly, anything above that exceeds a physiological dose and the excess will be converted into something else and excreted by the body.

I hadn't been taking selenium regularly in the last few months and had been feeling quite lethargic, fatigued and unmotivated, also a bit depressed, too. But I started taking it again every day a few days ago and it has already made a difference to how I feel. Maybe this is the missing link for you?

Do you take any supplements, by the way? And if you do, could you let us know which ones, dose and how often you take them?

How do you respond to salt? I always find that salt in OJ warms me up quickly, perhaps you can try salt in some other juice (grape juice seems to be one that works better for people suffering from histamine problems) and see what effect that has? Having extra salt can help hypothyroid people retain magnesium better, according to Peat. He also says that hypothyroid people lose salt and magnesium easily, so getting some extra salt might be a good thing to experiment with, too. I know of one practitioner who says that some people need up to 10g of salt a day, i.e. two teaspoons. At one point, I measured out 10mg of salt every day and tried to have as much of it as possible over the course of the day. I now have half a teaspoon of baking soda in warm water on a regular basis to get extra salt in and for its other therapeutic qualities, that always makes me feel better.

Anyway, I hope I have given you some food for thought and wish you all the best with improving your temps and pulse.

 

[DrJ]

Great question

It’s been a few yrs since i had it checked but when i did it was at the very bottom of the range. I’d been on thyroid for about 4 yrs at that point in the same predicament

From what I understand Reverse T3 is usually high because of stress. I’m under even less stress now than when i got that test so while i guess it’s possible that’s the issue, it seems unlikely

Too much reverse T3 will prevent the liver from converting T4 to more T3. Reverse T3 can also build up if your glucuronidation pathway isn't working well. This can happen if you have Gilbert's syndrome or if you're diet is too restrictive (e.g. cruciferous vegetables strongly support the glucuronidation pathway).

 

[youngsinatra]

I notice that I need more B vitamins since taking thyroid. Sometimes I feel a bit less good with my usual dose of thyroid and taking some extra B1, B2, biotin or folate helps to get back on track.

I think thyroid raises the nutritional requirements, even though it improves nutrient retention overall too. @Mauritio mentioned that he needed more B’s (B2 and biotin if I remember correctly) on thyroid aswell.

Have you checked your cronometer micronutrient breakdown?

 

[firebreather]

Too much reverse T3 will prevent the liver from converting T4 to more T3. Reverse T3 can also build up if your glucuronidation pathway isn't working well. This can happen if you have Gilbert's syndrome or if you're diet is too restrictive (e.g. cruciferous vegetables strongly support the glucuronidation pathway).

It’s been a while since I had my Reverse T3 checked but when i did i had already been on thyroid for multiple yrs with it not working and my Reverse T3 was below or tight at the bottom of the range

 

[firebreather]

I notice that I need more B vitamins since taking thyroid. Sometimes I feel a bit less good with my usual dose of thyroid and taking some extra B1, B2, biotin or folate helps to get back on track.

I think thyroid raises the nutritional requirements, even though it improves nutrient retention overall too. @Mauritio mentioned that he needed more B’s (B2 and biotin if I remember correctly) on thyroid aswell.

Have you checked your cronometer micronutrient breakdown?

I haven’t checked my cronometer in a while but when i do my b vitamins are pretty much good