My Goal Is to Cure Auditory Hallucinations

[lionsmane311]

This list above sound very much like, my mother’s. At one point while hospitalized for “dangerous” behavior, she said she was upset that the hospital was l piping in music with me singing songs, and it was annoying her. She said the voices in her head were telling her to kill me, and they had some awful plans for my sister and her newborn child, that I don’t want to describe, but she wrote those intentions in a letter to my poor grandmother. I was scared of her, yet I was her primary caretaker. Believe me I have some unbelievable stories that are movie worthy. She died 9 years ago so we can all rest in piece now. She thought the government was tracking her and that the microwave was some a source of it, and that someone on PTL was sending messages to her. She talked about demons and people teleporting into her room. It was creepy cleaning out her place after she died, with stacks of papers as tall as I am next to her computer, of her trying to prove the government was using her. Behind every one of her windows which had heavy black-out blinds was holy oil dripping down, from her trying desperately to protect herself from evil forces. How old are you? I would take the PUFA laden chicken and salmon out of your usuals.

Sad that she passed away but at least she's in peace now. Tough story. It happens too frequently. I was in a hospital too. The police forced me onto a stretcher and handcuffed me to it. I didn't curse or resist in a confrontational manner for this to happen. They were just aggressive because I didn't do what they wanted me to. I thought they were being influenced by things my voices were controlling. I had a strong fear for experimental testing because that's what they would talk about. All I did was stand by a plant and touch it hoping they would leave. It's a long story. I do want to write a book one day if I cure this and mention what happened to me. It will most likely be anonymous

I can tell you it's really the unbelievable way this condition sneaks up on you. They can say something that you may have only been exposed to once in your life and you will not remember it. I was so convinced it was coming from someone else because of how they would say something I thought I never heard. It can't come from your mind if they're saying something that's real that your mind can't produce. I once heard them tell me I'm being imprisoned in Alcatraz. I didn't recall what Alcatraz was. And I have a good memory for things I've come across before. They had a hard time fooling me in that way. Months later in a video game I saw a prison called Alcatraz in California. It's a real place

I went through the exact same thing. I believed in targetedjustice.com. The sad thing is they have doctors and people with PHDs supporting it which makes it more convincing. Maybe there could be some truth to this but no way it's happening everywhere and as much. I used to have "electronic harrassment" which is tactile hallucinations. They were electrical sensations you can feel in your body. I had the sensation of my hand being held, my neck being cut like Nearly Headless Nick from Harry Potter, brain surgery where I can feel cutting sensations in my brain or head. Just like cutting a cake with a knife and slowly slicing parts of my brain. Also an electrical storm in my head. Hard to describe but feels very real. When you go through this and you don't see much on it you can understand why someone goes into the deep end in believing it's the government. I believed people were teleporting too. I wrote a lot about what I went through and tried to prove it was the government as well. I thought it was the CIA, Mossad, FBI, NSA etc. I have endless stories that could be in a movie too

I'm 25 years old. Will see. Hans said salmon isn't so bad occasionally. I like chicken too much. I'll just up the vitamin e and live with it. One thing that gets forgotten is how hard this is for everybody else. My parents suffered a lot as I'm sure you did. Hope you're okay now

 

[lionsmane311]

When did you start eating eggs and potato daily/regulary?

Potatoes were added a month ago. Eggs since I was a baby.

 

[lionsmane311]

it is nicotinic acid you are using right? and not niacinamide? do you flush from it? (ie turn red like a lobster) Im sure Hoffer had a 100% success rate using nicotinic acid, along with some other methods like group therapy if remember correctly, proving that schizoprenia was just a long term deficiency of niacin in highly stressed people

Yeah nicotinic acid. I do get a flush. I'm still not sure if it reduces my hallucinations. Will keep taking it. Hopefully there's some build up or compound effect with everything that I'm doing

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I can tell you it's really the unbelievable way this condition sneaks up on you. They can say something that you may have only been exposed to once in your life and you will not remember it. I was so convinced it was coming from someone else because of how they would say something I thought I never heard. It can't come from your mind if they're saying something that's real that your mind can't produce. I once heard them tell me I'm being imprisoned in Alcatraz. I didn't recall what Alcatraz was. And I have a good memory for things I've come across before. They had a hard time fooling me in that way. Months later in a video game I saw a prison called Alcatraz in California. It's a real place

I went through the exact same thing. I believed in targetedjustice.com. The sad thing is they have doctors and people with PHDs supporting it which makes it more convincing. Maybe there could be some truth to this but no way it's happening everywhere and as much. I used to have "electronic harrassment" which is tactile hallucinations. They were electrical sensations you can feel in your body. I had the sensation of my hand being held, my neck being cut like Nearly Headless Nick from Harry Potter, brain surgery where I can feel cutting sensations in my brain or head. Just like cutting a cake with a knife and slowly slicing parts of my brain. Also an electrical storm in my head. Hard to describe but feels very real. When you go through this and you don't see much on it you can understand why someone goes into the deep end in believing it's the government. I believed people were teleporting too. I wrote a lot about what I went through and tried to prove it was the government as well. I thought it was the CIA, Mossad, FBI, NSA etc. I have endless stories that could be in a movie too

I'm 25 years old. Will see. Hans said salmon isn't so bad occasionally. I like chicken too much. I'll just up the vitamin e and live with it. One thing that gets forgotten is how hard this is for everybody else. My parents suffered a lot as I'm sure you did. Hope you're okay now

You are brave in sharing your story. It invaluable to others with the same condition, my book will be more beneficial to those who live with someone with the same disturbance as you. My life never made sense until my forties, because, exactly as you said, those with Therese hallucinations are adamantly convincing that their reality is reality, hence my title “Living In Mother’s Mind.” With that being said I am doing excellent. I am thankful for all the good and bad in my life. It has collectively made me stronger, wiser, happier, more thankful and more mindful. I’m rooting for you! Let me know when your fascinating book comes out!

 

[Peater]

Yes I have. I noticed no affect from it for my hallucinations. So far all serotonin lowering chemicals/compounds don't affect my auditory hallucinations. I think mine is related to glutamate. Research that's just on auditory hallucinations shows that it's glutamate that's elevated in the temporal lobe and frontal lobe. They even found this to be the case in schizophrenics that were divided into groups that have hallucinations and don't. The group that had hallucinations had this increase in glutamate compared to the group that doesn't.

Interesting, thank you. I hope you find a conclusive answer.

 

[youngsinatra]

How do you respond to NMDA agonism/antagonism?

The NMDA hypofunction theory of schizophrenia is very interesting and I have read a lot about it in the past.

 

[lionsmane311]

How do you respond to NMDA agonism/antagonism?

The NMDA hypofunction theory of schizophrenia is very interesting and I have read a lot about it in the past.

I agree it is interesting. I've read about it as well. Still learning since it's complex. I haven't noticed anything from NMDA antagonism. I think Diamant which contains adamantane is a NMDA antagonist. I take about 8 drops daily and don't notice any changes in voices. Magnesium as well has no effect. I think pregnenolone stimulates NMDA. May be one of the reasons why I notice a reduction with progesterone.

 

[Razvan]

Do you have a lot of saliva in your mouth?

 

[youngsinatra]

Ever tested things like serum folate, B12, copper, zinc, homocysteine?

These were things that some of Hoffer‘s colleagues took into consideration for people with mental health problems.

I believe A. Hoffer (& Carl Pfeiffer) thought that overmethylation causes schizophrenia in about 50% of patients and that niacin works by depleting methyl groups.

I have a E-Book about it.

https://riordanclinic.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/The_Schizophrenias_Ours_to_Conquer-Riordan-Clinic-Books.pdf

 

[lionsmane311]

Do you have a lot of saliva in your mouth?

No I don't. Why?

 

[lionsmane311]

Ever tested things like serum folate, B12, copper, zinc, homocysteine?

These were things that some of Hoffer‘s colleagues took into consideration for people with mental health problems.

I believe A. Hoffer (& Carl Pfeiffer) thought that overmethylation causes schizophrenia in about 50% of patients and that niacin works by depleting methyl groups.

I have a E-Book about it.

https://riordanclinic.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/The_Schizophrenias_Ours_to_Conquer-Riordan-Clinic-Books.pdf

I tested folate and B12. They were low. On the nail test from idealabs my copper was low as well. Zinc was in range but minimal. Homocysteine was never tested. Will look into it.

I've read many links to schizophrenia and low folate. Going to read the ebook. Thanks

 

[cs3000]

So the glutamate theory = hypofunctioning NMDA receptors (the ones involved in excitotoxicity anyway there's 2 types) due to excess activation right?
I read broadly agonising NMDA e.g with glycine etc doesnt work ,

the low folate could decrease needed repair (nucleotides)

In a comprehensive narrative review Hu et al. [30], summarized studies of glutamate neuron morphology, of the synthesizing and metabolizing enzymes for glutamate and its co-agonists and of the expression of glutamate transporters and receptors. They reported clear evidence in several regions, from multiple labs of reduced dendrite length and complexity and of lower levels of synaptophysin, a marker of axon boutons.
Additionally, reduced pyramidal somal volume has been found predominantly in layer III of dorsolateral prefrontal cortex (DLPFC) and auditory cortex. Hence, the dendrites, axons and cell bodies of cortical glutamatergic neurons are clearly reduced in size in schizophrenia.

Reduced Pyramidal Cell Somal Volume in Auditory Association Cortex of Subjects with Schizophrenia - Neuropsychopharmacology

Subjects with schizophrenia have decreased gray matter volume of auditory association cortex in structural imaging studies, and exhibit deficits in auditory sensory memory processes subserved by this region. In dorsal prefrontal cortex (dPFC), similar in vivo observations of reduced regional...

www.nature.com

^ the reduced volume in auditory cortex is mainly because of smaller cell size rather than fewer cell numbers

Volume decreases were found in 62% of 37 studies of whole temporal lobe, and in 81% of 16 studies of the superior temporal gyrus (and in 100% with gray matter separately evaluated). https://www.biologicalpsychiatryjournal.com/article/S0006-3223(99)00018-9/fulltext

so less gray matter volume of superior temporal gyrus of temporal lobe (where auditory cortex is), common to schizophrenia,
and seems the volume drop is mainly due to smaller cell size instead of fewer cells

Have you tried lithium? (or lithium orotate over the counter version)

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0165032709004054

There was no association between the STG volume and number of manic/depressive episodes, family history, or clinical subtype (i.e., psychotic and nonpsychotic), but daily dosage of lithium treatment at the time of scanning was positively correlated with right PP and right rostral STG volumes. [superior temporal gyrus]

 

[lionsmane311]

So the glutamate theory = hypofunctioning NMDA receptors (the ones involved in excitotoxicity anyway there's 2 types) due to excess activation right?
I read broadly agonising NMDA e.g with glycine etc doesnt work ,

Thanks for the study. The glutamate theory is that there's too much glutamate in brain regions responsible for auditory hallucinations. These brain regions have decreased volume size and improper metabolism but have glutamate creating excessive neuronal activity.

the low folate could decrease needed repair (nucleotides)

Folate is usually low in schizophrenics. So I've been supplementing today. Just used my B complex sublingually for the first time. Still have quiet voices except for early morning and before I go to sleep

^ the reduced volume in auditory cortex is mainly because of smaller cell size rather than fewer cell numbers

That's interesting. That should be seen positively since that means we just need to restore functioning of these cells. That's a lot better than reduce cell number and having a need to regenerate neurons.

so less gray matter volume of superior temporal gyrus of temporal lobe (where auditory cortex is), common to schizophrenia,
and seems the volume drop is mainly due to smaller cell size instead of fewer cells

Yes I plan on getting TMS and fmri neurofeedback to target the superior temporal gyrus and stop it's excessive firing. This should change the metabolism of that region and create newer connections in a more functional way.

Have you tried lithium? (or lithium orotate over the counter version)
View attachment 60351

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0165032709004054

Funny you mention it. I actually will be trying to obtain lithium carbonate which was used to raise N acetyl aspartate. This is low in those with auditory hallucinations and the result is a rise in glutamate. I have a new psychiatrist who's very open minded and will be discussing all of this with her. Hopefully she'll prescribe it to me so I can see if there's any benefit

 

[cs3000]

Funny you mention it. I actually will be trying to obtain lithium carbonate which was used to raise N acetyl aspartate. This is low in those with auditory hallucinations and the result is a rise in glutamate. I have a new psychiatrist who's very open minded and will be discussing all of this with her. Hopefully she'll prescribe it to me so I can see if there's any benefit

something extra , copper relevance
typically excess in blood while at the same time lacking in brain in people with schizophrenia symptoms,
so problem is with transport typically instead of levels, leading to functional deficiency in the brain:

ATP7A and B, and CTR1 is involved in copper transport

insightful studies

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6424639/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7987889/

These results provide the first evidence of disrupted copper transport in schizophrenia SN that appears to result in a copper-deficient state. Furthermore, copper homeostasis may be modulated by specific dysbindin isoforms and antipsychotic treatment.

Interestingly, decreasing copper activity through by inhibiting transporters or administering the copper chelator cuprizone to mice produces demyelination, altered neurotransmitters, and decreased oligodendrocytic protein expression (Gokhale et al. 2015; Gregg et al. 2009; Herring and Konradi 2011). Additionally, reduced copper activity results in schizophrenia-like behavioral impairments, such as deficits in novel object recognition, spatial memory tasks, pre-pulse inhibition, social interaction, and anxiety

Additionally, schizophrenia patients exhibit decreased metallothionein and glutathione, responsible for intracellular copper chaperoning and transport, that are rescued with antipsychotic treatment (Xuan et al. 2015; Do et al. 2000)(Figure 1B)
In addition to those mentioned previously, lack of copper also exacerbates NMDA-mediated excitotoxic cell death in primary hippocampal neurons

Given the excess of copper in the blood of schizophrenia patients and the increasingly mounting evidence of an abnormal or “leaky” BBB in psychosis, we hypothesize that schizophrenia patients exhibit excess blood copper due to faulty copper transport across the blood brain barrier (BBB). This abnormality would result in a copper-deficient brain state and contribute to the cognitive and behavioral deficits observed in schizophrenia. Our results suggest extracellular copper binding and transport into the cell via CTR1 is impaired in schizophrenia, and not rescued with treatment

when subdivided by medication status, the N-terminus [ATP7a] protein levels were significantly lower in unmedicated patients versus medicated patients (p=0.02) and controls
Analysis of treatment status revealed that C-terminal ATP7A protein levels were significantly increased only in medicated patients versus controls

Copper transport proteins ^ ,
people with schizophrenia not on medication have much lower n-terminus ATP7A expression. much lower transmembrane CTR1 expression. lower ATP7b expression.

and less copper in the substantia nigra brain area tested for copper content

[So this suggests another potentially helpful area of focus is finding stuff that increases ATP7a and especially CTR1 expression]

2 basic things Vitamin A could help increase atp7a and vitamin D could help increase ctr1 (but need to be balanced)

Interestingly there's been some mention of how schizophrenia has some commonalities with vitamin a excess or deficiency
(i) neurological congenital abnormalities reported in some schizophrenia cases are comparable to those observed with vitamin A deficiency or altered at-RA
(probably either deficiency or excess because like ive mentioned in another post, overload could take away from vitamin D making CTR1 expression worse, where deficiency = not enough ATP7a) ​

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41380-019-0566-2#Sec7
intake of beta-carotene was demonstrated to be low in some schizophrenia cohorts

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24434091/
^ here a synthetic vitamin a drug was used with positive effect in people with schizophrenia

too much vitamin A could skew things away from CTR1 more by countering vitamin D maybe. so personally i would like a closer ratio of vit D to A than normal. maybe even 1:1 idk its guess work. beef liver is good source of vitamin A + copper but dont want too much

here's vitamin D effect in schizophrenia

The psychotropic effect of vitamin D supplementation on schizophrenia symptoms - BMC Psychiatry

Background Schizophrenia is a multifactorial disease involving interactions between genetic and environmental factors. Vitamin D has recently been linked to many metabolic diseases and schizophrenia. Vitamin D plays essential roles in the brain in the context of neuroplasticity, neurotransmitter...

bmcpsychiatry.biomedcentral.com

(interestingly only 3.8% of people tested had vit d in normal range even though it wasnt winter

"Although our study population consisted of outpatients and blood samples were taken between May and July when sunlight is more intense, the rates of low vitamin D levels were found to be high"

<-- before & after vitamin d replenishment, 8 weeks

-
Our finding of decreased CTR1 in the cells and fibers of the superficial layers of the entorhinal cortex lends is consistent with the importance of copper in myelin integrity and dendritic spine formation, as well as cellular function. Deficits of myelin and associated oligodendrocytes have been well replicated in schizophrenia in several brain regions


Cortical areas exhibit decreased markers of myelin basic protein (a key component of myelin), fewer oligodendrocytes, abnormal oligodendrocyte morphology, oligodendrocyte degeneration, myelin thickness and laminar abnormalities, as well as downregulation of key myelin related genes and proteins in schizophrenia

. Interestingly, application of the copper chelator cuprizone results in massive, albeit reversible, demyelination and oligodendrocyte death. indicating that copper must play a crucial role in myelin and oligodendrocyte function and integrity. If a deficit of cuprinergic signaling and copper content exists in the superficial layers of the entorhinal cortex in schizophrenia as indicated by our finding of decreased CTR1, this could impact white matter integrity in this area.



In contrast to our findings in the superficial layers of the entorhinal cortex, we observed significantly elevated immunolabeling of CTR1 in the molecular layer of the dentate gyrus, consistent with a trending increase of CTR1 mRNA within the middle temporal area
In further support of our suggestion of compensatory upregulation of CTR1 in the molecular layer of the dentate gyrus in response to copper deficit is the observation that the dentate gyrus exhibits deficient signaling in schizophrenia

Taken together, our data suggest dysregulation of copper transport and homeostasis in the hippocampus and entorhinal cortex in schizophrenia that is region and layer specific, a potential mechanism of schizophrenia pathology that was previously unstudied. Deficient copper within the hippocampus could have deleterious effects, including decreased energy metabolism and neuronal signaling, deficits of myelin maintenance and integrity, and an overall pathological modulation of the trisynaptic pathway crucially involved in memory and cortical function


Therefore, further study is needed to assess cellular copper content and transporter status of each layer and cell type of the hippocampus in schizophrenia, as well as replication of the current study. Abnormal copper and other trace metals are becoming increasingly associated with schizophrenia and other forms of psychosis (Bitanihirwe and Cunningham, 2009; Joe et al., 2018; Schoonover et al., 2018) and therefore could provide a new mechanism to be targeted for development of better treatments. For instance, treatments that mimic the functions of CTR1 might enhance copper transport from the blood to the brain parenchyma could be therapeutic.

 

[lionsmane311]

something extra , copper relevance
typically excess in blood while at the same time lacking in brain in people with schizophrenia symptoms,
so problem is with transport typically instead of levels, leading to functional deficiency in the brain:

ATP7A and B, and CTR1 is involved in copper transport

insightful studies

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6424639/

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7987889/

Copper transport proteins ^ ,
people with schizophrenia not on medication have much lower n-terminus ATP7A expression. much lower transmembrane CTR1 expression. lower ATP7b expression.

View attachment 60506
and less copper in the substantia nigra brain area tested for copper content

[So this suggests another potentially helpful area of focus is finding stuff that increases ATP7a and especially CTR1 expression]

2 basic things Vitamin A could help increase atp7a and vitamin D could help increase ctr1 (but need to be balanced)

Interestingly there's been some mention of how schizophrenia has some commonalities with vitamin a excess or deficiency
(i) neurological congenital abnormalities reported in some schizophrenia cases are comparable to those observed with vitamin A deficiency or altered at-RA
(probably either deficiency or excess because like ive mentioned in another post, overload could take away from vitamin D making CTR1 expression worse, where deficiency = not enough ATP7a) ​

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41380-019-0566-2#Sec7
intake of beta-carotene was demonstrated to be low in some schizophrenia cohorts

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/24434091/
^ here a synthetic vitamin a drug was used with positive effect in people with schizophrenia

too much vitamin A could skew things away from CTR1 more by countering vitamin D maybe. so personally i would like a closer ratio of vit D to A than normal. maybe even 1:1 idk its guess work. beef liver is good source of vitamin A + copper but dont want too much

here's vitamin D effect in schizophrenia

The psychotropic effect of vitamin D supplementation on schizophrenia symptoms - BMC Psychiatry

Background Schizophrenia is a multifactorial disease involving interactions between genetic and environmental factors. Vitamin D has recently been linked to many metabolic diseases and schizophrenia. Vitamin D plays essential roles in the brain in the context of neuroplasticity, neurotransmitter...

bmcpsychiatry.biomedcentral.com

(interestingly only 3.8% of people tested had vit d in normal range even though it wasnt winter

View attachment 60507 <-- before & after vitamin d replenishment, 8 weeks

This is very interesting. Thank you. I wonder if transport to the brain would be different if copper was administered sublingually. Would be interested in your opinion. Either way it's very easy to raise vitamin A and D to fix the root problem. Was there anything else they mentioned to cause issues with transport of copper?

I really believe one day we're going to be able to pay for tests to see brain levels of vitamins and minerals. We'll be able to detect deficiencies or transport issues and prevent diseases way ahead of time instead of always trying to cure them. The simplicity of keeping a perfectly well designed system running instead of trying to alter so many different aspects of it with side effects will make a lot of research and medicine look stupid in the history books.

 

[Highserotonin90]

If zinc and magnesium make your situation worse it means that the NMDA receptors work little or badly while if pregnenolone helps it means that you are in the right direction because it is a sigma and NMDA agonist. Personally I don't know how you get all those things in one day...you should do some cleaning. Have you tried NAC?

 

[Matt1951]

Yes, to Highserotonin90. Also consider high dose 100mg B1 and glynac. Glynac can be two separate pills, 1000 mg glycine, 600 mg NAC. Low cost on Amazon.

An inexpensive blood test for methylation, runs abut $35. Homocysteine. Should range between 5 and 12. If over 12, you will have to reduce niacin supplements, niacin is a powerful methyl burner.

Nicotine - one cigar a day is beneficial. You can try it and see.

Gluten free has often helped others. Calcium is good, milk is good.

 

[Highserotonin90]

@Matt1951 Doesn't B1 cause you problems with acetylcholine?

 

[lionsmane311]

If zinc and magnesium make your situation worse it means that the NMDA receptors work little or badly while if pregnenolone helps it means that you are in the right direction because it is a sigma and NMDA agonist. Personally I don't know how you get all those things in one day...you should do some cleaning. Have you tried NAC?

Zinc and magnesium doesn't make it worse. Currently not working. My only goal is to get better. So I'm trying anything to see if I make progress. So many of my symptoms went away so this has to be able to be removed as well.

I have tried NAC and still take it. Doesn't seem to do much but I've read good things about it for my condition

 

[lionsmane311]

Yes, to Highserotonin90. Also consider high dose 100mg B1 and glynac. Glynac can be two separate pills, 1000 mg glycine, 600 mg NAC. Low cost on Amazon.

An inexpensive blood test for methylation, runs abut $35. Homocysteine. Should range between 5 and 12. If over 12, you will have to reduce niacin supplements, niacin is a powerful methyl burner.

Nicotine - one cigar a day is beneficial. You can try it and see.

Gluten free has often helped others. Calcium is good, milk is good.

Just got my sublingual vitamins and minerals. Took the B1 already. Should be noticing something in a few days. So far my mind feels clear and I have a drive to get stuff done.

I'm currently waiting on some test results. When I get those I will look into homocysteine.

I wish I could use Tobacco. My parents won't let me anymore. I used to enjoy swedish snus.