Does raising metabolism cause a need for higher fluid intake? Dehydration while raising metabolism.

[dervmai]

I can't seem to find much info on this. Although I haven't done any extensive googling. It is much easier though due to my busy schedule to just ask the forum.

Dehydration causes a lowering of metabolism. However I'm trying to understand why Ray says drinking too much liquids lower metabolism.... Anyone have any info on this?

Since raising metabolism raises the body's need for nutrients, wouldn't the same apply to water and liquids? Since every cell in our body has some water in it.

How do you hydrate adequately without overhydrating? Since overhydrating will end up unnecessarily flushing out many important minerals, as well as putting more strain on the kidneys. However underhydration is just as bad as overhydrating. I think that drinking water only when you are thirsty is bad. That means for a certain time, your body was dehydrated enough to the point where the body gives signs of dehydration. You should be drinking enough water to not feel any signs of dehydration. Yet not too much where you are getting symptoms of overhydration. Balance is key... no?

 

[mostlylurking]

Dehydration causes a lowering of metabolism. However I'm trying to understand why Ray says drinking too much liquids lower metabolism.... Anyone have any info on this?

I don't think Ray said that. I remember Ray saying that it is better to drink things like orange juice and milk than water because water has no nutritive value and milk & OJ do.

Since raising metabolism raises the body's need for nutrients, wouldn't the same apply to water and liquids? Since every cell in our body has some water in it.

My own personal experience showed me that when I successfully raised my metabolism (first with thyroid, then with high dose thiamine) I noticed my electrolytes became deficient, so I started eating more salt. Maybe finally being able to sweat had something to do with me needing more salt.... Then I figured out that water (at least for me) is a really good idea and I started drinking more water because UTIs are really not very much fun and I will do anything to avoid ever seeing a urologist again in this lifetime.

It's important to pay attention to your body and apply Ray Peat's wisdom in ways that aren't detrimental to you.

 

[LLight]

Some theories:

New post summarizing some data already posted here:

Thyroid and water homeostasis

A potential connection?

open.substack.com

1. There exist theoretical arguments allowing us to hypothesize that hyperosmolarity, induced by water restriction for example, could facilitate the synthesis of thyroid hormones while potentially lowering the requirement for TSH stimulation.
2. Rats (with an animal model of hypothyroidism) put under water restriction got an increase in their T3 levels, bringing them almost back to the control group’s levels.
3. It was found that, in rabbits, vasopressin itself seems to play a role similar to TSH regarding thyroid hormone synthesis.
4. Two studies on rats found that water restriction or deuterium depleted water (which might be interpreted by the body as water restriction) tend to lower TSH levels.
5. Finally, bile acids could be related both to the TSH and metabolic rate of tissues involved in thermogenesis, but are also related to water homeostasis as the bile acid TGR5 receptor (along with the FXR transcription factor) is involved in kidneys’ function. From this data, we can hypothesize that a TSH decrease itself could boost T3 systemic levels as it might increase bile acids synthesis and thus peripheral deiodinase enzymes.

Thus, water restriction (or deuterium depletion) could lead to a TSH decrease while keeping thyroid hormones levels maintained or increased. The TSH decrease could be explained by an increase in vasopressin, which could play the role of a TSH surrogate and stimulate bile acids synthesis and thus the conversion of T4 to T3 in peripheral tissues.

Another explanation could be that hyperosmolarity itself, by activating the NFAT5 transcription factor which would upregulate the uptake of inositol by the thyroid, or activating the CREB3L1 transcription factor, would increase the sensitivity of the thyroid gland to TSH and optimize thyroid hormones output.

Upping intake of inositol, selenium and intermittently restricting water intake to achieve hyperosmolarity may improve the function of the thyroid system.

 

[mostlylurking]

Since raising metabolism raises the body's need for nutrients, wouldn't the same apply to water and liquids? Since every cell in our body has some water in it.

How do you hydrate adequately without overhydrating? Since overhydrating will end up unnecessarily flushing out many important minerals, as well as putting more strain on the kidneys. However underhydration is just as bad as overhydrating. I think that drinking water only when you are thirsty is bad. That means for a certain time, your body was dehydrated enough to the point where the body gives signs of dehydration. You should be drinking enough water to not feel any signs of dehydration. Yet not too much where you are getting symptoms of overhydration. Balance is key... no?

A few more thoughts:

Ray Peat was concerned that clean water without additives (fluoride etc.) is unavailable to a lot of people. He promoted drinking things like milk and orange juice not only for the nutrients but also because these things have been filtered so are safer to consume; milk is filtered by the cow's body and orange juice is filtered by the orange tree.

The amount needed for optimal hydration is closely tied to thyroid function (and thiamine as well) because these things optimize oxidative metabolism. When your metabolism is working well, you urinate less and you lose more water via the skin by sweating/evaporation. If you are hypothyroid or if your metabolism is blocked for some other reason then you urinate almost the same amount as the liquid that you consume.

If your metabolism is functioning well then I think it is a whole lot easier to simply drink liquids to where you are not thirsty and things will work themselves out naturally. More liquid is needed to be ingested if you are active and outside in the sun working/playing/sweating.