Bag Breathing (revisited)

[OliviaD]

I apologize for asking re: an old topic, but posts re: this are old, thought there might be some new wisdom to guide me.
Does anyone have a particular protocol they use for this? Does one just use the paper bag as needed for particular symptoms? Does anyone do this daily (or more times throughout day) as a regular practice? I am intrigued b/c it is such an easy inexpensive procedure. Thank you in advance for any information.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I apologize for asking re: an old topic, but posts re: this are old, thought there might be some new wisdom to guide me.
Does anyone have a particular protocol they use for this? Does one just use the paper bag as needed for particular symptoms? Does anyone do this daily (or more times throughout day) as a regular practice? I am intrigued b/c it is such an easy inexpensive procedure. Thank you in advance for any information.

I bag breath at bedtime every night to help me fall asleep, and sometimes again to put me back to sleep if I wake up in the night. It works well. I use just a plain old brown paper bag. Be sure to switch it out with new ones, because of bacteria build up after many uses.

 

[OliviaD]

I bag breath at bedtime every night to help me fall asleep, and sometimes again to put me back to sleep if I wake up in the night. It works well. I use just a plain old brown paper bag. Be sure to switch it out with new ones, because of bacteria build up after many uses.

Thank you! Do you breathe for a certain amount of time?

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Thank you! Do you breathe for a certain amount of time?

I bag breathe until it starts to feel uncomfortable, like I need a breath of air. Five minutes is about how long that takes for me, but other people do it much longer.

 

[OliviaD]

I bag breathe until it starts to feel uncomfortable, like I need a breath of air. Five minutes is about how long that takes for me, but other people do it much longer.

Thank you!

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Thank you!

Anytime!

 

[xeliex]

I used the brown lunch bags for a bit as well. I used to need them more to calm down a panicky feeling. Thankfully I haven't had much of those since I started thyroid (off and on).

Now when I feel stressed, I bad breathe in small organic cotton bags from etsy. They are washable but I rarely use them so germs are not a concern. Moreover, I nose breath still when I bag breathe. I just feel awfully wrong if I mouth breath, even in a bag.

A while ago, I tried the bottle method that I think Haidut had mentioned and it was fun and good, but I adjusted it to allow nose breathing by attacking a medical cup to its mouth.

My intuition seems to point in the direction that CO2 rebreathing is a quick solution for everything.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

I used the brown lunch bags for a bit as well. I used to need them more to calm down a panicky feeling. Thankfully I haven't had much of those since I started thyroid (off and on).

Now when I feel stressed, I bad breathe in small organic cotton bags from etsy. They are washable but I rarely use them so germs are not a concern. Moreover, I nose breath still when I bag breathe. I just feel awfully wrong if I mouth breath, even in a bag.

A while ago, I tried the bottle method that I think Haidut had mentioned and it was fun and good, but I adjusted it to allow nose breathing by attacking a medical cup to its mouth.

My intuition seems to point in the direction that CO2 rebreathing is a quick solution for everything.

Bottle method?

 

[xeliex]

Yeah, you get a 1L plus bottle or a gallon and make a dime sized cut in the plastic towards the bottom of it.

When done breathing through it, you store it upside down so it retains the CO2 since the latter is heavier than air.

Alternatively, I joined two bottles together as in both ends had a screw cap. I uncapped for breathing and recapped for storing.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Yeah, you get a 1L plus bottle or a gallon and make a dime sized cut in the plastic towards the bottom of it.

When done breathing through it, you store it upside down so it retains the CO2 since the latter is heavier than air.

Alternatively, I joined two bottles together as in both ends had a screw cap. I uncapped for breathing and recapped for storing.

What is the purpose of this that makes it better than a bag? It seems storing the CO2 would breed bacteria?

 

[xeliex]

The advantage is that there is no time needed to build up the CO2 again - it's almost good to go immediately. With the paper bag, it does take time for a significant amount of CO2 to build up. I am not sure about the bacteria though. It would be super easy to wash after few sessions if concerned. Moreover, plastic will most likely be lest prone to harboring microorganisms as compared to an absorbing material.

 

[xeliex]

There is also a nice thread posted a while ago about this diy gizmo

Poor Man's Rebreather Kit

This works better than a bag and doesn't fill your lungs with that lovely plastic smell. You need two empty bottles and a pair of scissors. Adjust the distance between the bottles until you can obtain a comfortable concentration of carbon dioxide and oxygen. :mask: (Inspired by Ray Peat for...

raypeatforum.com

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

The advantage is that there is no time needed to build up the CO2 again - it's almost good to go immediately. With the paper bag, it does take time for a significant amount of CO2 to build up. I am not sure about the bacteria though. It would be super easy to wash after few sessions if concerned. Moreover, plastic will most likely be lest prone to harboring microorganisms as compared to an absorbing material.

All good stuff to ponder, thanks!!

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

“Carbon dioxide inhibits the release of serotonin.” -Ray Peat

 

[ecstatichamster]

I use a woven shopping bag, wrap it loosely around my neck, and listen to a podcast of music while I breathe. When it gets tough, I open the bottom a bit and breathe more oxygenated air, then close it again around my neck. A woven bag will allow enough oxygen not to asphyxiate if I were to fall asleep.

 

[OliviaD]

I use a woven shopping bag, wrap it loosely around my neck, and listen to a podcast of music while I breathe. When it gets tough, I open the bottom a bit and breathe more oxygenated air, then close it again around my neck. A woven bag will allow enough oxygen not to asphyxiate if I were to fall asleep.

Thanks! Not asphyxiating definitely a plus! :) This seems nice and relaxing to not have to hold onto the bag. I read someone doing this with a big paper bag over their head. Good to have a few options.

So - while I'm on this topic - this CO2 rebreathing has made me wonder about the mask wearing. I've been disturbed by the great amount of mask wearing I continue to see in place where it is no longer required. The majority of the people I observe wearing these muzzles are young - i.e. teenagers, 20s ( think any rational person now realizes they don't do a thing for disease prevention, etc. ) . I admit to getting 'triggered' by this, since it disturbs me that these young people are so brainwashed. I've always been using the 'lack of oxygen' as an argument against them. I suspect initially there are negative symptoms in people who have to wear them for long periods, i.e. 8 hours/day; but if they are young and healthy, I suppose they adapt. I was wondering if additionally, it might start to feel 'good', b/c of the CO2 rebreathing. I guess then, if a person feels 'good' and is choosing to voluntarily wear a mask, it should change my thinking about it. I think it disturbs me still b/c it is a 'fraud' - i.e. they are being promoted and worn as some kind of disease prevention device.

I cyclist friend told me they trained with masks to mimic high altitude - way before Covid.

Curious if anyone has any thoughts.

 

[Apple]

Thanks! Not asphyxiating definitely a plus! :) This seems nice and relaxing to not have to hold onto the bag. I read someone doing this with a big paper bag over their head. Good to have a few options.

So - while I'm on this topic - this CO2 rebreathing has made me wonder about the mask wearing. I've been disturbed by the great amount of mask wearing I continue to see in place where it is no longer required. The majority of the people I observe wearing these muzzles are young - i.e. teenagers, 20s ( think any rational person now realizes they don't do a thing for disease prevention, etc. ) . I admit to getting 'triggered' by this, since it disturbs me that these young people are so brainwashed. I've always been using the 'lack of oxygen' as an argument against them. I suspect initially there are negative symptoms in people who have to wear them for long periods, i.e. 8 hours/day; but if they are young and healthy, I suppose they adapt. I was wondering if additionally, it might start to feel 'good', b/c of the CO2 rebreathing. I guess then, if a person feels 'good' and is choosing to voluntarily wear a mask, it should change my thinking about it. I think it disturbs me still b/c it is a 'fraud' - i.e. they are being promoted and worn as some kind of disease prevention device.

I cyclist friend told me they trained with masks to mimic high altitude - way before Covid.

Curious if anyone has any thoughts.

The idea of CO2 rebreathing by wearing mask is intriguing , but then... bacteria proliferate quickly inside the mask, gets into your lung.
Are we sure that this bacteria won't cause pneumonia ?

 

[OliviaD]

The idea of CO2 rebreathing by wearing mask is intriguing , but then... bacteria proliferate quickly inside the mask, gets into your lung.
Are we sure that this bacteria won't cause pneumonia ?

Oh, I'm sure that is possible - probably more so in more vulnerable, i.e. elderly people. Unless one is already harboring some kind of pathological organism or toxin, most of what proliferates on the mask are probably benign organisms that are normally present. Although our exhaled breath is one of the major ways we get rid of 'waste', which would include material in exosomes, which is stuff you would not want accumulating, and then being re-breathed.

I don't think it is a good idea at all - I was just wondering if perhaps 'feeling good' makes wearing a mask less of a problem. I'm just stymied as to why so many, especially young people, are still doing this, when they don't have to! I suspect young, healthy people have immune systems that take care whatever is growing in their masks, although maybe they do get sick more often - I'm pretty sure we will never see any accurate data re: this.

I have also read a couple of articles about possible fibers from masks getting into the lungs, and chemicals used in the manufacture of them being problematic, although I've never seen any 'official' reports re: this.

 

[xeliex]

Oh, I'm sure that is possible - probably more so in more vulnerable, i.e. elderly people. Unless one is already harboring some kind of pathological organism or toxin, most of what proliferates on the mask are probably benign organisms that are normally present. Although our exhaled breath is one of the major ways we get rid of 'waste', which would include material in exosomes, which is stuff you would not want accumulating, and then being re-breathed.

I don't think it is a good idea at all - I was just wondering if perhaps 'feeling good' makes wearing a mask less of a problem. I'm just stymied as to why so many, especially young people, are still doing this, when they don't have to! I suspect young, healthy people have immune systems that take care whatever is growing in their masks, although maybe they do get sick more often - I'm pretty sure we will never see any accurate data re: this.

I have also read a couple of articles about possible fibers from masks getting into the lungs, and chemicals used in the manufacture of them being problematic, although I've never seen any 'official' reports re: this.

Right. The CO2 training masks are not made of material meant for post use disposal afaik. Sometimes can be adjusted at different levels.


Another problem with these disposable masks and the N95, kn95 etc... vs the methods discussed above is pressure and resistance. Through a bag, resistance is minimal. Through face diapers, sometimes I have exhale through my mouth to be able to push out the constricted volume of air. If I understand correctly, resistance as such can be harmful for the lungs long term.

 

[OliviaD]

Right. The CO2 training masks are not made of material meant for post use disposal afaik. Sometimes can be adjusted at different levels.


Another problem with these disposable masks and the N95, kn95 etc... vs the methods discussed above is pressure and resistance. Through a bag, resistance is minimal. Through face diapers, sometimes I have exhale through my mouth to be able to push out the constricted volume of air. If I understand correctly, resistance as such can be harmful for the lungs long term.

Ah - yes, good point re: the resistance! Which would be amplified if one is exercising/active I would imagine. So - I guess perhaps the likelihood is that the 'kids' aren't getting a 'feel good' from their face diapers... they just have sadly fallen prey to the mass hypnosis..

On that note - I am VERY excited b/c I found a small brown paper bag with some twine loop handles, when put over my ears, the bag fits perfectly over my face, covering my mouth and nose!!! So I can now sit or lie without holding it. Hopefully this bag is not too toxic :) Obviously I'll have to discard this one after a couple of uses, but I think I could make some more :)