Will these help or hinder low cholesterol

[movebetter]

Hi, my cholesterol is about 135 lately and I feel very low and tired. I am thinking of trying progest e, and or DHEA, or pregnenolone. Searching around I find information that they can lower cholesterol and other information that they can increase it.

I would appreciate anyone's experience or information.

I am a 77 yo male 145lbs 6 ft with belly fat.

 

[John mcclain]

My cholesterol increases when I pull out fibre...and add more fats...basically go carnivore....also feel amazing

 

[Peatress]

Belly fat could be cortisol. Are you restricting calories? Do you eat animal products? Have you tested your hormones including thyroid?

You've probably read this article but reading again might help. The interview also discusses ways to increase cholesterol.

Cholesterol, longevity, intelligence, and health.

Ray Peat

raypeat.com

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OuN70rMqpk&t=21s

 

[movebetter]

Belly fat could be cortisol. Are you restricting calories? Do you eat animal products? Have you tested your hormones including thyroid?

You've probably read this article but reading again might help. The interview also discusses ways to increase cholesterol.

Cholesterol, longevity, intelligence, and health.

Ray Peat

raypeat.com

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OuN70rMqpk&t=21s

Hi Peatress,

thanks for your reply. I have been wondering about cortisol. I am now doing a 4 times per day cortisol saliva test.

I have been eating dairy, eggs and fish/shell fish. No other animal products.

Here are some blood tests.
Cholesterol 134 mg/dL <200

Triglycerides 78 mg/dL <150

HDL-Cholesterol 60 mg/dL >=40

LDL-Cholesterol, calc 58 mg/dL <100 optimal

Non-HDL Cholesterol, calc 74 mg/dL <130 optimal

TSH 3.57 q 0.27-4.20
T3, Total 81 80-200

Afternoon temp 98.4 t0 98.9

Pulse high 70s to low 80s

Low blood pressure

Bowel movements ok

Testosterone, Total 562 ng/dL 193-740

Progesterone 0.4 H ng/mL < 0.2

Estradiol 45 pg/mL <61 ma
le

no, i am not resticting calories. eating about 2000 per day.

Do you think progesterone would help? Jman replies on another tread that it really helped him.

 

[Peatress]

You are quite tall, 6ft, so 2000 may not be sufficient calorie intake. According to your TSH you are hypo. I will tag @Jennifer because she has experience with low cholesterol and low blood pressure. Progesterone will activate your thyroid but with low cholesterol I don't know how you will react to it. I think Dr Peat said low cholesterol could be caused by gut inflammation. Are you getting enough protein?

55:40 – Dr Peat on the importance of protein

 

[movebetter]

You are quite tall, 6ft, so 2000 may not be sufficient calorie intake. According to your TSH you are hypo. I will tag @Jennifer because she has experience with low cholesterol and low blood pressure. Progesterone will activate your thyroid but with low cholesterol I don't know how you will react to it. I think Dr Peat said low cholesterol could be caused by gut inflammation. Are you getting enough protein?

55:40 – Dr Peat on the importance of protein

Yes, I see my TSH is high and with low cholesterol I understand thyroid supplementation will not be helpful. That is why I am trying to find ways to up my cholesterol levels.

My protein level at the time of the test was about 100 g per day but after I heard a few of repeats interviews in the last year of his life he was talking about 50 g per day. I've tried to lower it but it's very hard to get to 50 so I'm averaging about 60 or 70. In the interview you sent he says 100 or more for for older people so I am confused?

I'm also dealing with a mostly asymptomatic slow-growing cancer called waldenstrom's macroglobulinemia. I've recently heard an interview with Georgi where he was saying that with cancer you should keep your fat level below 15%. So I've been trying to do that also but that also isn't easy.

I'm guessing the fatigue I'm feeling is somehow based on the low cholesterol.

Thank you for tagging Jennifer. I hope she can make some suggestions.

Maybe it's a cortisol saliva test will show something. I know it said that high cortisol creates belly fat but I also thought that high cortisol doesn't go along with low energy.

Thank you so much for your help, I really appreciate it!

 

[Peatress]

You are right about protein – Dr Peat did say less is needed as we age.

Sorry to hear about your cancer.

Have you seen the thread on another type of bone marrow cancer? Those suggestions might prove helpful for your condition too

Myelofibrosis

From that thread

“I suggest you contact Peat as well, but in addition to the aspirin and methylene blue, I would also consider vitamin K2, vitamin A and cyproheptadine. The first two are commonly used for any type of blood or bone marrow cancers, and the cyproheptadine has recently shown great promise for all myeoloproliferative disorders and is being withdrawn from the market in anticipation of approval for those conditions.” Haidut

“Has his serum estrogen been measured? High estrogen, relative to androgens and progesterone, is toxic to the bone marrow, and stimulates fibrocyte growth, and decreases kidney function. Has he used any serotonin-related drugs? Progesterone and thyroid both increase kidney function and improve the balance of androgens and estrogen. Vitamin D and DHEA are other things that might be helpful.” Ray Peat

Progesterone does oppose estrogen and cortisol

I haven’t listened to this – he is the guy who wrote the book Cholesterol Myth

Dr. Uffe Ravnskov - Low Cholesterol and Cancer | One Radio Network

Listen to Uffe Ravnskovtalked about the connection between low cholesterol and cancer, sharing an amazing amount of information from independent studies.

oneradionetwork.com

His website

Uffe Ravnskov – The Cholesterol Myths by UffeRavnskov, MD, PhD

www.ravnskov.nu

 

[Jennifer]

Hi @movebetter, I’m very sorry to hear you’re having health struggles. I raised my cholesterol level from 115 to 178 by removing fiber from my diet and keeping my carb intake up with honey and fruit juice, and I raised my blood pressure from a low of 85/50 to 120/70 by increasing my protein intake from a daily average of 50 g to over 100 g. I’ve used Progest-E in the past and it neither raised my cholesterol nor lowered it. In regards to Ray’s opinion on protein intake, I’ll answer your question in your other thread?

 

[movebetter]

Hi @movebetter, I’m very sorry to hear you’re having health struggles. I raised my cholesterol level from 115 to 178 by removing fiber from my diet and keeping my carb intake up with honey and fruit juice, and I raised my blood pressure from a low of 85/50 to 120/70 by increasing my protein intake from a daily average of 50 g to over 100 g. I’ve used Progest-E in the past and it neither raised my cholesterol nor lowered it. In regards to Ray’s opinion on protein intake, I’ll answer your question in your other thread?

Hi Jennifer,

thanks for your kind concern. And thanks for sharing your experiences. I don't eat much starch only well cooked potatoes and well cooked greens.

I am Drinking lots of fruit juice and honey in milk. I will try more.

Did you experience fatigue from the low cholesterol? That is my primary complaint now. Plus I can't try thyroid supplementation with cholesterol this low. Have you tried thyroid supplementation?

I am thinking to increase my protein. Keeping it around 50 is difficult. I will check the other thread for your reply.

Thank you for taking the time to offer some suggestions. I greatly appreciate it.

Deekran,

 

[gaze]

hve you checked vitamin D. progest E and pregnenolone would help but topical would probably be safer so as to not risk irritating the intestine, and low cholesterol predisposes one to be senstive to intestinal irritation. idealabs makes a topical pregnenolone product. i would stay away from dhea with low cholesterol, low thyroid, and cancer, as it may be too stimulating/estrogenic in that scenerio and can risk making the cancer grow faster

 

[movebetter]

hve you checked vitamin D. progest E and pregnenolone would help but topical would probably be safer so as to not risk irritating the intestine, and low cholesterol predisposes one to be senstive to intestinal irritation. idealabs makes a topical pregnenolone product. i would stay away from dhea with low cholesterol, low thyroid, and cancer, as it may be too stimulating/estrogenic in that scenerio and can risk making the cancer grow faster

thanks Gaze, i have been using vitamin D. my level is at 85. Thanks for the info on DHEA. i will stop taking it. i have been trying Progest e orally at about 5mg. i have not felt any effect on my fatigue. i have heard there are no good pregnenolone sources. do you know of any?

 

[gaze]

thanks Gaze, i have been using vitamin D. my level is at 85. Thanks for the info on DHEA. i will stop taking it. i have been trying Progest e orally at about 5mg. i have not felt any effect on my fatigue. i have heard there are no good pregnenolone sources. do you know of any?

if you tolerate the progest e orally, its probably fine. you could even try a tad higher dose since you have cancer and your testosterone is relatively high for your age so you dont have to worry much about androgen suppression. in fact, the belly fat and the high testosterone for that age probably means your adrenals are stimulating the testosterone in a bad way, some of it probably being converted to estrogen. high cortisol is likely and that can cause fatigue. pregnenolone can help regulate the adrenals. i like stressnon topically which is pregnenolone. StressNon both pregnenolone and progesterone can help lower cortisol
do you drink coffee? that may help the fatigue and has some anti cancer properties.

 

[Jennifer]

Hi Jennifer,

thanks for your kind concern. And thanks for sharing your experiences. I don't eat much starch only well cooked potatoes and well cooked greens.

I am Drinking lots of fruit juice and honey in milk. I will try more.

Did you experience fatigue from the low cholesterol? That is my primary complaint now. Plus I can't try thyroid supplementation with cholesterol this low. Have you tried thyroid supplementation?

I am thinking to increase my protein. Keeping it around 50 is difficult. I will check the other thread for your reply.

Thank you for taking the time to offer some suggestions. I greatly appreciate it.

Deekran,

You’re welcome. :) I didn’t experience fatigue from the low cholesterol, no. My thyroid function was so poor that the stress hormones that were compensating for the thyroid hormone deficiency were keeping me energized. I do supplement thyroid, yes. When I first started taking it, there was a two week period where I could barely get out of bed and needed long naps because it had lowered the stress hormones that my body had become dependent on. It’s certainly difficult keeping protein around 50 g. The only way I was ever able to keep protein that low was following a fruitarian diet, similar to the diet Ray was experimenting with the year leading up to his passing.

 

[Jennifer]

@movebetter, while looking for a specific quote in my notes to post in your other thread, I came across something Ray had written to me in an email exchange back in 2015 regarding my low cholesterol level:

On Feb 18, 2015, at 4:20 PM, Ray Peat wrote:

“Low cholesterol can be caused by intestinal inflammation, and starches are a common cause. Sweet potatoes are effective promoters of bacterial growth, rice and potatoes can cause gas especially if they aren't well cooked. Do you check your temperature and resting pulse rate occasionally to see if the thyroid is working?”

 

[movebetter]

You are right about protein – Dr Peat did say less is needed as we age.

Sorry to hear about your cancer.

Have you seen the thread on another type of bone marrow cancer? Those suggestions might prove helpful for your condition too

Myelofibrosis

From that thread

“I suggest you contact Peat as well, but in addition to the aspirin and methylene blue, I would also consider vitamin K2, vitamin A and cyproheptadine. The first two are commonly used for any type of blood or bone marrow cancers, and the cyproheptadine has recently shown great promise for all myeoloproliferative disorders and is being withdrawn from the market in anticipation of approval for those conditions.” Haidut

“Has his serum estrogen been measured? High estrogen, relative to androgens and progesterone, is toxic to the bone marrow, and stimulates fibrocyte growth, and decreases kidney function. Has he used any serotonin-related drugs? Progesterone and thyroid both increase kidney function and improve the balance of androgens and estrogen. Vitamin D and DHEA are other things that might be helpful.” Ray Peat

Progesterone does oppose estrogen and cortisol

I haven’t listened to this – he is the guy who wrote the book Cholesterol Myth

Dr. Uffe Ravnskov - Low Cholesterol and Cancer | One Radio Network

Listen to Uffe Ravnskovtalked about the connection between low cholesterol and cancer, sharing an amazing amount of information from independent studies.

oneradionetwork.com

His website

Uffe Ravnskov – The Cholesterol Myths by UffeRavnskov, MD, PhD

www.ravnskov.nu

Hi Peatress, thanks again. I will check out his video.

I am concerned my cortisol might be low. My last blood test which only measured the morning lever was very low normal range. So I am afraid of anything that lowers cortisol. I just did a 4 times per day saliva cortisol test. I will see what that says. But I hear they can be inaccurate. I am kind of stuck on what to do. If progesterone lowers cortisol then it might make me feel worse and since my cholesterol is low I can't try thyroid supplementation. Maybe pregnenolone will help. But I hear that it too lowers cholesterol

Gaze says DHEA can be a problem. "I would stay away from dhea with low cholesterol, low thyroid, and cancer, as it may be too stimulating/estrogenic in that scenerio and can risk making the cancer grow faster"

I am also limited by very low platelets count so aspirin is not good.

As you can see my progesterone was high in my blood test. I was taking 10mg of pregnenolone for about 1 week before the test.

Do you think my estrogen is too high?

Testosterone, Total 562 ng/dL 193-740

Progesterone 0.4 H ng/mL < 0.2

Estradiol 45 pg/mL <61 ma
le

So I am very confused on how to make things better.

 

[Peatress]

Are you getting enough salt @movebetter ?

Tracking your temperature and pulse like @Jennifer suggested would give a better idea of your thyroid status

Your blood work for estrogen seems ok but remember tissue bound estrogen

 

[Peatress]

Can Pregnenlone Help With Low Cortisol?

Hello, I suffer from Subclinical Hypothyroidism : Averige TSH is 5 t 4 is 13 Free T3 3.19 (ref. 2.1-4.2) Reverse T 3 0.40 (ref. 0.14-0.54) I seem to have Low Cortisol Is it possible to raise Cortisol with Pregnenlone so the reverse T3 wil go down so the T3 wil get absorbed better in the...

raypeatforum.com

 

[movebetter]

Are you getting enough salt @movebetter ?

Tracking your temperature and pulse like @Jennifer suggested would give a better idea of your thyroid status

Your blood work for estrogen seems ok but remember tissue bound estrogen

I think I am getting enough salt. Sometimes a put some in wate
r and drink it and put a lot on my food because I like it. My temp is usually around 98.6 a little lower in the morning and pulse is usually mid 70s to mid 80s. The one reason I think I need thyroid is high TSH of 3.57

 

[movebetter]

if you tolerate the progest e orally, its probably fine. you could even try a tad higher dose since you have cancer and your testosterone is relatively high for your age so you dont have to worry much about androgen suppression. in fact, the belly fat and the high testosterone for that age probably means your adrenals are stimulating the testosterone in a bad way, some of it probably being converted to estrogen. high cortisol is likely and that can cause fatigue. pregnenolone can help regulate the adrenals. i like stressnon topically which is pregnenolone. StressNon both pregnenolone and progesterone can help lower cortisol
do you drink coffee? that may help the fatigue and has some anti cancer properties.

Hi gaze,

Thanks for your reply. I have been trying coffee on and off. It seems to help the first day but after a few days I feel much worse.

Please see my reply to Peatress. I think my cortisol is low. If true then would progesterone and pregnenolone lower it more?

When you says adrenals are stimulating testosterone, do you mean cortisol is the adrenal hormone that is stimulating it?

My progesterone is high. I think because I was taking pregnenolone at 10mg per day for about 1 week before the test.

I feel stuck and confused. If both cortisol and cholesterol are low then I don't know what to do to feel better.

Testosterone, Total 562 ng/dL 193-740

Progesterone 0.4 H ng/mL < 0.2

Estradiol 45 pg/mL <61 ma
le

 

[Peatress]

Can Pregnenlone Help With Low Cortisol?

Hello, I suffer from Subclinical Hypothyroidism : Averige TSH is 5 t 4 is 13 Free T3 3.19 (ref. 2.1-4.2) Reverse T 3 0.40 (ref. 0.14-0.54) I seem to have Low Cortisol Is it possible to raise Cortisol with Pregnenlone so the reverse T3 wil go down so the T3 wil get absorbed better in the...

raypeatforum.com

@movebetter there is an email reply from Dr Peat about low cortisol on this thread