Sugar And Skin Aging

[andy]

Just wondering if anyone knows if sugar increases the aging of the skin .Watched a programme yesterday by cosmetic surgeons who specifically said that sugar damages the structure of the skin ie the collagen and the elastin(which decrease with age)Also pointed out that facial skin aging is primarily sun damage(body skin is usually much more youthful).also pointed out the skin needs to hold onto moisture hence the need for essential fatty acids .In the context of the Ray Peat diet does anyone know of any specific recommendation of what foods can delay facial aging(helping to keep volume in face) and how on earth to stop the sun aging the face.Sunscreens were recommended also to stop UVA light damaging the skin.Does Ray recommend sugar etc to stop skin aging or is that not one of his goals.By the way does anyone know how to contact Ray.I am eating potatoes and feel my skin getting more haggard and remember Andrew Kim pointing out that starches were bad for the skin and health in general.Thanks for any help

 

[Orion]

Just wondering if anyone knows if sugar increases the aging of the skin .Watched a programme yesterday by cosmetic surgeons who specifically said that sugar damages the structure of the skin ie the collagen and the elastin(which decrease with age)Also pointed out that facial skin aging is primarily sun damage(body skin is usually much more youthful).also pointed out the skin needs to hold onto moisture hence the need for essential fatty acids .In the context of the Ray Peat diet does anyone know of any specific recommendation of what foods can delay facial aging(helping to keep volume in face) and how on earth to stop the sun aging the face.Sunscreens were recommended also to stop UVA light damaging the skin.Does Ray recommend sugar etc to stop skin aging or is that not one of his goals.By the way does anyone know how to contact Ray.I am eating potatoes and feel my skin getting more haggard and remember Andrew Kim pointing out that starches were bad for the skin and health in general.Thanks for any help

RP talks about how PUFA cause aging and skin damage. Sunburns are caused by PUFA in skin cells being oxidize by sunlight.

An early study took rabbits and shaved their fur, rabbits on a PUFA diet exposed to sunlight aged and had damaged skin. SFA diet rabbits were fine and young looking.

 

[ilovethesea]

Unsaturated fatty acids: Nutritionally essential, or toxic?

The so-called "advanced glycation end products," that have been blamed on glucose excess, are mostly derived from the peroxidation of the "essential fatty acids." The name, “glycation,” indicates the addition of sugar groups to proteins, such as occurs in diabetes and old age, but when tested in a controlled experiment, lipid peroxidation of polyunsaturated fatty acids produces the protein damage about 23 times faster than the simple sugars do (Fu, et al., 1996).

 

[EIRE24]

Just wondering if anyone knows if sugar increases the aging of the skin .Watched a programme yesterday by cosmetic surgeons who specifically said that sugar damages the structure of the skin ie the collagen and the elastin(which decrease with age)Also pointed out that facial skin aging is primarily sun damage(body skin is usually much more youthful).also pointed out the skin needs to hold onto moisture hence the need for essential fatty acids .In the context of the Ray Peat diet does anyone know of any specific recommendation of what foods can delay facial aging(helping to keep volume in face) and how on earth to stop the sun aging the face.Sunscreens were recommended also to stop UVA light damaging the skin.Does Ray recommend sugar etc to stop skin aging or is that not one of his goals.By the way does anyone know how to contact Ray.I am eating potatoes and feel my skin getting more haggard and remember Andrew Kim pointing out that starches were bad for the skin and health in general.Thanks for any help

I wouldn't say sugar damages skin at all and I'd also disagree that starch is bad for health. Look at all the healthy generations that consumed it. I do agree about the fat helping to hold on to moisture as my fat free diet absolutely wrecked my skin and made it disgustingly dry

 

[ecstatichamster]

of course starch isn't bad for health. And Ray doesn't say it is either. Ray says that if you have a choice, in other words, the resources or money, why would you choose starch? You choose ripe fruit and dairy (sugar) and expensive things like that.

Starch does fine for 99% of the world as the primary means of calories. But it is largely empty calories (arguably) and also when you combine with high abundance of things like fatty cheese and meats, it causes rapid weight gain.

Sugar for me has been a godsend, but I don't eat plain sugar. I get my sugar in OJ, a little maple syrup, milk, and fruit. Also Cokes once or twice a day.

I have noticed that me teeth are in perfect shape, and my skin is fine too. I don't think sugar affects either skin or teeth provided you have good nutrition in other ways (micronutrients, fat-soluble vitamins, protein, etc.)

 

[tara]

I believe there are people who deliberately apply sugar to the skin and say that has improved it.

 

[encerent]

In my experience, sugar doesn't affect the skin. And neither do starches.

UVA and UVB from natural sunlight (which I think RP advocates for) will age the skin though. If you're very concerned about skin aging, then use a sunscreen and compensate for a lack of sunglight with a red light. Red lights don't emit the harmful blue to violet and ultra-violet wavelengths.

 

[amethyst]

Unsaturated fatty acids: Nutritionally essential, or toxic?

The so-called "advanced glycation end products," that have been blamed on glucose excess, are mostly derived from the peroxidation of the "essential fatty acids." The name, “glycation,” indicates the addition of sugar groups to proteins, such as occurs in diabetes and old age, but when tested in a controlled experiment, lipid peroxidation of polyunsaturated fatty acids produces the protein damage about 23 times faster than the simple sugars do (Fu, et al., 1996).

That's very interesting! I wonder what the exact scientific (process) it is that aged the rabbits? Rabbits don't normally eat saturated fat oils in their diet..Wild Rabbits eat mostly wild grasses, berries ?lettuce, veggies-carrots, twigs, leaves, some grains if they can find them.....wonder why they chose rabbits. Probably had to inject the poor rabbits with saturated fat as they don't normally eat that

 

[Orion]

That's very interesting! I wonder what the exact scientific (process) it is that aged the rabbits? Rabbits don't normally eat saturated fat oils in their diet..Wild Rabbits eat mostly wild grasses, berries ?lettuce, veggies-carrots, twigs, leaves, some grains if they can find them.....wonder why they chose rabbits. Probably had to inject the poor rabbits with saturated fat as they don't normally eat that

RP talks about how the oxidation of the PUFA disrupts collagen and other process in the skin(wrinkles, age spots...) Covers this in the KMUD interviews.

Rabbits can produce their own saturated fat from eating carbs, so they have saturated fat in their bodies (warm blooded mammals). Probably didn't need to inject them.

 

[amethyst]

Rabbits can produce their own saturated fat from eating carbs, so they have saturated fat in their bodies (warm blooded mammals). Probably didn't need to inject them.

hmm, that's interesting too. Yeah, if they already have saturated fat in their bodies, they wouldn't need to be injected.

 

[andy]

I know Ray does not like any pufa at all but how can you explain the mechanism for the skin going dry when eliminate say for example evening primrose oil and oily fish.I have for instance been recommended the evening primrose oil and also the eating of mackerel (3 times a week)When I did this for about a week my skin cosmetically was very enhanced (the epo has almost a rejuvenating effect )I am 50 and naturally my skin is no longer like it used to be but with the oils I look about 10 years younger.When I eliminate the oils the skin eventually starts looking more drier and definately older looking. I eat lambs liver twice a week,have egg yolks ,coconut oil ,lots of white sugar ,milk ,potatoes ,chocolate, but if no oils the skin just looks rough and dry. Chris Masterjohn wrote an article which specified that the more sucrose you eat the more essential fatty acids you need and conversely if have low sucrose then the needs of the EFA is less.could it be that to eliminate my skin dryness I should have very little sucrose and just increase my potatoes.

 

[amethyst]

I know Ray does not like any pufa at all but how can you explain the mechanism for the skin going dry when eliminate say for example evening primrose oil and oily fish.I have for instance been recommended the evening primrose oil and also the eating of mackerel (3 times a week)When I did this for about a week my skin cosmetically was very enhanced (the epo has almost a rejuvenating effect )I am 50 and naturally my skin is no longer like it used to be but with the oils I look about 10 years younger.When I eliminate the oils the skin eventually starts looking more drier and definately older looking. I eat lambs liver twice a week,have egg yolks ,coconut oil ,lots of white sugar ,milk ,potatoes ,chocolate, but if no oils the skin just looks rough and dry. Chris Masterjohn wrote an article which specified that the more sucrose you eat the more essential fatty acids you need and conversely if have low sucrose then the needs of the EFA is less.could it be that to eliminate my skin dryness I should have very little sucrose and just increase my potatoes.

I really think butter would help you.. Maybe try adding that to your diet. Good grassfed butter. I've always eaten butter so I think that is partially why I have good skin. That, and I've always taken pretty good care of myself- no smoking etc. that sort of thing. But butter is good stuff!

 

[amethyst]

of course starch isn't bad for health. And Ray doesn't say it is either. Ray says that if you have a choice, in other words, the resources or money, why would you choose starch? You choose ripe fruit and dairy (sugar) and expensive things like that.

Starch does fine for 99% of the world as the primary means of calories. But it is largely empty calories (arguably) and also when you combine with high abundance of things like fatty cheese and meats, it causes rapid weight gain.

Glad you said that. True. Asian countries eat a ton of starch, or they did and appear to be healthy as a result. Low obesity, that sort of thing. But fruit has more nutrients, antioxidants.

 

[Ideonaut]

RP talks about how the oxidation of the PUFA disrupts collagen and other process in the skin(wrinkles, age spots...) Covers this in the KMUD interviews.

Rabbits can produce their own saturated fat from eating carbs, so they have saturated fat in their bodies (warm blooded mammals). Probably didn't need to inject them.

I thought Peat said it was just ruminants that change ingested PUFAs into saturated fat. Pigs and chickens don't.

 

[Orion]

I thought Peat said it was just ruminants that change ingested PUFAs into saturated fat. Pigs and chickens don't.

Yes that is true of ruminants. Pigs and chickens could produce their own SFA being feed the right diet, but pigs are feed corn and soybean, chickens feed veggie seeds. Both are natural omnivores.

 

[ilovethesea]

I know Ray does not like any pufa at all but how can you explain the mechanism for the skin going dry when eliminate say for example evening primrose oil and oily fish.I have for instance been recommended the evening primrose oil and also the eating of mackerel (3 times a week)When I did this for about a week my skin cosmetically was very enhanced (the epo has almost a rejuvenating effect )I am 50 and naturally my skin is no longer like it used to be but with the oils I look about 10 years younger.When I eliminate the oils the skin eventually starts looking more drier and definately older looking. I eat lambs liver twice a week,have egg yolks ,coconut oil ,lots of white sugar ,milk ,potatoes ,chocolate, but if no oils the skin just looks rough and dry. Chris Masterjohn wrote an article which specified that the more sucrose you eat the more essential fatty acids you need and conversely if have low sucrose then the needs of the EFA is less.could it be that to eliminate my skin dryness I should have very little sucrose and just increase my potatoes.

In Ray's fish oil article he talks about it "working" because it does lower inflammation (while suppressing the immune system and thyroid).

Also maybe the PUFA oil is lowering your nutrition requirements. I think vitamin A deficiency is linked to dry skin. So maybe it "works" because you need less. Have you tried increasing your A and see if that helps?

 

[schultz]

I know Ray does not like any pufa at all but how can you explain the mechanism for the skin going dry when eliminate say for example evening primrose oil and oily fish.I have for instance been recommended the evening primrose oil and also the eating of mackerel (3 times a week)When I did this for about a week my skin cosmetically was very enhanced (the epo has almost a rejuvenating effect )I am 50 and naturally my skin is no longer like it used to be but with the oils I look about 10 years younger.When I eliminate the oils the skin eventually starts looking more drier and definately older looking. I eat lambs liver twice a week,have egg yolks ,coconut oil ,lots of white sugar ,milk ,potatoes ,chocolate, but if no oils the skin just looks rough and dry. Chris Masterjohn wrote an article which specified that the more sucrose you eat the more essential fatty acids you need and conversely if have low sucrose then the needs of the EFA is less.could it be that to eliminate my skin dryness I should have very little sucrose and just increase my potatoes.

In his PUFA report paper he says the requirement for adults is very low. He does mention sugar but I think he mentions it because sugar increases your need for certain b vitamins (especially if the sugar contains no b vitamins itself) Here is a quote from the "PUFA report"

"Even on highly purified diets composed mostly of sugar, the requirement of young, growing animals for EFA from natural animal fats is less than 0.5 percent of calories. The need would be much lower on diets low in sugar and rich in vitamin B6; and in non-pregnant adults, the requirement is likely so low that it would be impossible to acquire a deficiency no matter
how strictly one tried avoiding PUFA so long as one consumed a mix of natural foods of animal and plant origin."

Personally, my PUFA is very low and my sugar intake is very high. My face is perfectly clear and is not dry or overly oily. I used to get the occasional blemish on my face before "Peating" but now it's very rare. I maybe get 1 a year lol.

As far as the wrinkles go, I'm too young to tell maybe (I'm 31 years old). I'll report back in 30 years.

 

[andy]

When I eat butter my skin becomes even more dry (although love the taste)If I eat lambs liver twice a week for vitamin A (use coffee to reduce iron) and skin still dry does this mean I may need a lot more vitamin A,Yes ideally I wouldl like to cut out pufa.When I do eat about 6 tablespoons of sugar(yes it does reduce anxiety) eventually my skin starts to get acne on chest and legs.What can this indicate?Thanks guys.

 

[Orion]

When I eat butter my skin becomes even more dry (although love the taste)If I eat lambs liver twice a week for vitamin A (use coffee to reduce iron) and skin still dry does this mean I may need a lot more vitamin A,Yes ideally I wouldl like to cut out pufa.When I do eat about 6 tablespoons of sugar(yes it does reduce anxiety) eventually my skin starts to get acne on chest and legs.What can this indicate?Thanks guys.

Dry skin is a hypothyroid symptom.

The resonant theme I get from reading and listening to RP, is that PUFA is the root. When I started experimenting with RP ideas, I increased my acne. This was due to pushing metabolism to fast with things like large amounts of sugar, caffeine, T3, biotin, B3, aspirin, etc... and still using starch, muscle meat and a moderate fat intake. These would always cause a blood sugar crash, which increased adrenaline/cortisol/estrogen (acne). This is due to the stored PUFA and PUFA in blood. PUFA blocks transthyretin (vitamin A and thyroid transport), disrupt livers ability to convert T4 to T3, lowers livers glycogen storage ability, PUFA inhibits the pancreas and insulin, this leads to a cycle where eating sugar brings you up then you crash hard. Starch and muscle meat will cause significant crashes. Greatly limiting PUFA(butter has PUFA too) or doing a short zero fat approach can help. I am 3 weeks into a zero fat or VLF approach, seeing great things with my skin, basically my skin has never looked this good in my adult life.

How is your sleep quality? 7-8hrs deep uninterrrupted?
Can you go a few hours with food and feel good, not agitated?
Pulse and temps? Hands and feet always warm?

RP has mentioned animal studies where they are on zero fat diets but fed high quality calories, those animals have superior resistance to stress, and are very hard to kill. PUFA is UN-essential.

 

[Orion]

Listen to Ray talk about this, great interview https://www.toxinless.com/kmud-100917-sugar-1.mp3