POLL: Who Are You Voting For In The 2016 Presidential Election?

[luke gadget]

How very sportsman of you to say. I guess pardons from government bureaus upon certain corporate entities, and the creation of large economic subsidies may be dismissed as "mere coincidence" with a hint "conspiracy and paranoia" in your view.

Yet more conspiracy. You're a bottomless font of the stuff.

There's indeed a lot of nefarious crap going on. But it's not ALL about whatever your paranoid fantasy dictates.

Peat once told me, there is a lot less conspiracy and more stupidity than people think.

 

[Adnada]

I don't vote, it only encourages them.

 

[Tarmander]

Luke, do you work for some type of main stream media outlet?

 

[jaguar43]

Yet more conspiracy. You're a bottomless font of the stuff.

There's indeed a lot of nefarious crap going on. But it's not ALL about whatever your paranoid fantasy dictates.

Peat once told me, there is a lot less conspiracy and more stupidity than people think.

Do you still have that quote from Peat ? that would be an interesting read.

 

[luke gadget]

Luke, do you work for some type of main stream media outlet?

Goodness no. I don't even watch TV.

What's the relationship to the conversation? That I must be part of the corrupt media empire?

 

[luke gadget]

Do you still have that quote from Peat ? that would be an interesting read.

Here's part of it. We were talking about something else, but the last line I thought was great:

"I think the problem of knowldedge is both biological and cultural. The authoritarian attitude that has found science to be as good as religion for their purposes is itself a product of culture. The folk culture contains a lot of good stuff accumulated over the centuries, but it has also been deformed by those with power and the desire to keep and enlarge their power.
People like Blake could find in the culture of their time knowledge that resonated with the future, while clashing with their contemporaries:
“The Prophets Isaiah and Ezekiel dined with me, and I asked them how they dared so roundly to assert, that God spoke to them; and whether they did not think at the time, that they would be misunderstood, & so be the cause of imposition.
Isaiah answer'd, I saw no God, nor heard any, in a finite organical perception; but my senses discover'd the infinite in every thing, and as I was then persuaded, & remain confirm'd; that the voice of honest indignation is the voice of God, I cared not for consequences but wrote.”
Knowledge based on the richness of sense perception has been constrained first by the authoritative constructions of religion, then by those of official science.
Right after the second world war, there was a broad campaign in the US to eliminate dissent from high schools, colleges, and universities. Deductive and reductionist, absolutizing, approaches became the official and only acceptable “sciences.” Departmental specialization and “professionalism” limited and narrowed the possibilities for criticism. Loyalty oaths helped to politicize conformism. This political culture became part of the way science was taught. In the 1950s, I was convinced that many well known scientists were corrupt, in their attacks on dissent. John Gofman was an outstanding example. Suddenly, in the 1960s, he switched sides. Later, he wrote that during a speech, he had suddenly recognized that what he was saying was insane, and that in a sane society he and many others should have been convicted of crimes against humanity according to the Nuremberg principles.
Over the last several decades, I have followed the careers of people who worked on some of the topics that I have been interested in (reproductive and stress hormones, nutrition and digestion, brain function, and aging), and who saw similar data, but interpreted them in very different ways. I used to refer to two of them as “my evil twin, and the commercial equivalent."
I was never sure whether they were dishonest, interpreting their data in a way that they knew would be acceptable to the major journals and funders, or just stupid. When they died, I learned that they had been applying their theories to their own treatment, and I realized that they were simply stupid. Rather than a grand conspiracy, much of our medical culture is just a great and pervasive stupidity.
....
"

 

[jaguar43]

Here's part of it. We were talking about something else, but the last line I thought was great:

"I think the problem of knowldedge is both biological and cultural. The authoritarian attitude that has found science to be as good as religion for their purposes is itself a product of culture. The folk culture contains a lot of good stuff accumulated over the centuries, but it has also been deformed by those with power and the desire to keep and enlarge their power.
People like Blake could find in the culture of their time knowledge that resonated with the future, while clashing with their contemporaries:
“The Prophets Isaiah and Ezekiel dined with me, and I asked them how they dared so roundly to assert, that God spoke to them; and whether they did not think at the time, that they would be misunderstood, & so be the cause of imposition.
Isaiah answer'd, I saw no God, nor heard any, in a finite organical perception; but my senses discover'd the infinite in every thing, and as I was then persuaded, & remain confirm'd; that the voice of honest indignation is the voice of God, I cared not for consequences but wrote.”
Knowledge based on the richness of sense perception has been constrained first by the authoritative constructions of religion, then by those of official science.
Right after the second world war, there was a broad campaign in the US to eliminate dissent from high schools, colleges, and universities. Deductive and reductionist, absolutizing, approaches became the official and only acceptable “sciences.” Departmental specialization and “professionalism” limited and narrowed the possibilities for criticism. Loyalty oaths helped to politicize conformism. This political culture became part of the way science was taught. In the 1950s, I was convinced that many well known scientists were corrupt, in their attacks on dissent. John Gofman was an outstanding example. Suddenly, in the 1960s, he switched sides. Later, he wrote that during a speech, he had suddenly recognized that what he was saying was insane, and that in a sane society he and many others should have been convicted of crimes against humanity according to the Nuremberg principles.
Over the last several decades, I have followed the careers of people who worked on some of the topics that I have been interested in (reproductive and stress hormones, nutrition and digestion, brain function, and aging), and who saw similar data, but interpreted them in very different ways. I used to refer to two of them as “my evil twin, and the commercial equivalent."
I was never sure whether they were dishonest, interpreting their data in a way that they knew would be acceptable to the major journals and funders, or just stupid. When they died, I learned that they had been applying their theories to their own treatment, and I realized that they were simply stupid. Rather than a grand conspiracy, much of our medical culture is just a great and pervasive stupidity.
....
"

Brilliant ! Thanks for the quote.

 

[SarahBeara]

Here's part of it. We were talking about something else, but the last line I thought was great:

"I think the problem of knowldedge is both biological and cultural. The authoritarian attitude that has found science to be as good as religion for their purposes is itself a product of culture. The folk culture contains a lot of good stuff accumulated over the centuries, but it has also been deformed by those with power and the desire to keep and enlarge their power.
People like Blake could find in the culture of their time knowledge that resonated with the future, while clashing with their contemporaries:
“The Prophets Isaiah and Ezekiel dined with me, and I asked them how they dared so roundly to assert, that God spoke to them; and whether they did not think at the time, that they would be misunderstood, & so be the cause of imposition.
Isaiah answer'd, I saw no God, nor heard any, in a finite organical perception; but my senses discover'd the infinite in every thing, and as I was then persuaded, & remain confirm'd; that the voice of honest indignation is the voice of God, I cared not for consequences but wrote.”
Knowledge based on the richness of sense perception has been constrained first by the authoritative constructions of religion, then by those of official science.
Right after the second world war, there was a broad campaign in the US to eliminate dissent from high schools, colleges, and universities. Deductive and reductionist, absolutizing, approaches became the official and only acceptable “sciences.” Departmental specialization and “professionalism” limited and narrowed the possibilities for criticism. Loyalty oaths helped to politicize conformism. This political culture became part of the way science was taught. In the 1950s, I was convinced that many well known scientists were corrupt, in their attacks on dissent. John Gofman was an outstanding example. Suddenly, in the 1960s, he switched sides. Later, he wrote that during a speech, he had suddenly recognized that what he was saying was insane, and that in a sane society he and many others should have been convicted of crimes against humanity according to the Nuremberg principles.
Over the last several decades, I have followed the careers of people who worked on some of the topics that I have been interested in (reproductive and stress hormones, nutrition and digestion, brain function, and aging), and who saw similar data, but interpreted them in very different ways. I used to refer to two of them as “my evil twin, and the commercial equivalent."
I was never sure whether they were dishonest, interpreting their data in a way that they knew would be acceptable to the major journals and funders, or just stupid. When they died, I learned that they had been applying their theories to their own treatment, and I realized that they were simply stupid. Rather than a grand conspiracy, much of our medical culture is just a great and pervasive stupidity.
....
"

Bravo! I always say never attribute to malicious conspiracy that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.

 

[yerrag]

And that was said in all humility.

 

[aquaman]

Systemic voter fraud does not exist for especially national elections. Maybe for city council say, but that's not here.

Of course a bunch of honest voters needing a lift might get intimidated by a Trump "poll watcher" - so yes I can see what side is engaging in fraud, very clearly.

So Naive, Luke. There's clearly 1000s of people involved in calling up mainly black, democratic voters and asking them "hey, you want to register in multiples counties and states and we'll bus you in to vote in them?". And loads of these random people are like 'YEAAAAH!' and the others who don't want to do it all agree to be super quiet and never mention it to anyone, because people are so good at keeping huge national security secrets. And then they have organisers working out exactly where people should be bused, and what time and place they are picked up, where they are returned. And none of their friends get concerned when they all jump on a bus to "somewhere" and then return en-masse half a day later and then don't talk about where they went. And all the organisers never blab to their friends either, because secrets never get out.

If Clinton wins the popular vote by 3-4 million, it's probably because of the millions getting bussed around.

And that whole expose by Rolling Stone showing that actually it could be a political smokescreen from the Republicans to delete legitimate voters with vaguely similar names? That was all made up by the reporter who doesn't do anything, just waits for the Democrat guys to call and tell him what latest story they have fabricated and what he has to put his name to. He's just one of 1000s and 1000s of reporters who don't actually do anything, they're just waiting for the Illuminati to dictate their stories.

In fact, you're probably one of the Crooked Hillary media - the one who was implanted into the Ray Peat Forum ahead of time to sway the 50 Trump supporters.

 

[aquaman]

Sounds like somebody needs a hug

That's a great put-down. It certainly does not reveal you have nothing to respond to a well-articulated, thought-out post.

 

[Tarmander]

Goodness no. I don't even watch TV.

What's the relationship to the conversation? That I must be part of the corrupt media empire?

I was curious because you have a lot of the same views...calling wikileaks a Russian hack, belittling project veritas and the evidence he is offering, down playing voter fraud as not possible, conspiracy theories etc.

 

[SarahBeara]

So Naive, Luke. There's clearly 1000s of people involved in calling up mainly black, democratic voters and asking them "hey, you want to register in multiples counties and states and we'll bus you in to vote in them?". And loads of these random people are like 'YEAAAAH!' and the others who don't want to do it all agree to be super quiet and never mention it to anyone, because people are so good at keeping huge national security secrets. And then they have organisers working out exactly where people should be bused, and what time and place they are picked up, where they are returned. And none of their friends get concerned when they all jump on a bus to "somewhere" and then return en-masse half a day later and then don't talk about where they went. And all the organisers never blab to their friends either, because secrets never get out.

If Clinton wins the popular vote by 3-4 million, it's probably because of the millions getting bussed around.

And that whole expose by Rolling Stone showing that actually it could be a political smokescreen from the Republicans to delete legitimate voters with vaguely similar names? That was all made up by the reporter who doesn't do anything, just waits for the Democrat guys to call and tell him what latest story they have fabricated and what he has to put his name to. He's just one of 1000s and 1000s of reporters who don't actually do anything, they're just waiting for the Illuminati to dictate their stories.

In fact, you're probably one of the Crooked Hillary media - the one who was implanted into the Ray Peat Forum ahead of time to sway the 50 Trump supporters.

Voter fraud doesn't happen that often, that's a myth. I mean you're entitled to believe what you want but if you talk to people outside of your immediate circle, a lot of them strongly dislike Trump, he's extremely divisive as a candidate (not that everyone loves Hillary, but she's ever so slightly more palatable to a moderate.)

Hillary is winning fair and square because Trump can't keep his ego in check long enough to appeal to moderates. He basically threw away his chance. Time to start accepting that and make alternative plans, otherwise you might be very disillusioned in the near future.

 

[whodathunkit]

And that whole expose by Rolling Stone showing that actually it could be a political smokescreen from the Republicans to delete legitimate voters with vaguely similar names?

NOBODY I know is quibbling about "similar names". That dumb argument is the real smokescreen put forth by people who don't want voter ID so they and other unethical people can vote multiple times.

The real issue here is that in states without voter ID laws, anyone can show up at any precinct to vote. Net result is they can vote as many times as they can afford to with the time and ability to travel they have on that day.

The ONLY reason to not support voter ID laws where you have to show up at your designated precinct to show your ID to vote ONE AND ONLY ONE TIME is because you support the ability of unethical people to perpetrate voter fraud.

There is no "disenfranchisement" inherent in the process of voter ID. Non-citizens do not have the right to vote. Sorry. Americans don't go to another country and expect to vote and no non-citizen has the right to expect to do that here. Or at least, they shouldn't have the right to expect to vote, although many apparently do, aided and abetted by the corrupt (or the dim-witted who buy into the corrupt's arguments).

Voter ID DOES NOT disenfranchise "the poor". EVERY legal citizen has the ability to get a state-issued ID now, and the vast majority have them. Every adult has the ability to make sure their voter registration is in order well before election day. And if you don't and you can't, and you're too lazy to make the effort one time every 4-8 years or so to make sure it's all in order, then you're too shiftless and brainless to vote anyway. The days when America was very rural and there was a large swath of poor and often minority people who did not have access to get an ID are OVER. The "disenfranchisement" argument no longer holds water. Further, to suppose that minorities and the poor don't have the wherewithal to take care of these details properly, and to encourage them in "helplessness" with regards to them, is the real disenfranchisement. It's paternalistic and condescending. It teaches a segment of the population that they're incapable of living up to reasonable minimum objective standards of civic participation.

 

[charlie]

Donald Trump via twitter: We are winning and the press is refusing to report it. Don't let them fool you- get out and vote! #DrainTheSwamp on November 8th!

 

[Ahanu]

Hillary is winning fair and square because Trump can't keep his ego in check long enough to appeal to moderates. He basically threw away his chance

So true.he is like a child. and this man would be the head of your Military.. good luck with that ;-)

 

[SarahBeara]

Donald Trump via twitter: We are winning and the press is refusing to report it. Don't let them fool you- get out and vote! #DrainTheSwamp on November 8th!

Yes, the press generally want stupid things like facts, evidence or reality before they report on something. He's losing, and losing badly.

 

[dbh25]

Luke, do you work for some type of main stream media outlet?

Breaking news, luke gadget, spokesperson for the Clinton campaign made a statement on the Wikileaks emails and the O"Keefe videos-

 

[dbh25]

That's a great put-down. It certainly does not reveal you have nothing to respond to a well-articulated, thought-out post.

Thank you for the compliment. I did make a comment about the screed you referenced.

 

[charlie]