Glycine / Overmethylation

[martybyrde]

I’ve been experiencing a lot of anxiety this past year that might be caused by Overmethylation after experimenting with high dose methyl folate. I tried to shut off this anxiety using B3 but did not have much success. After a year of being a bit more on edge and overthinking a lot more than usual (relative to the time prior to this year) I started consuming collagen powder about a week ago and I have consistently shut off the anxiety every day since starting. I read from Chris Masterjohn that glycine is used to buffer excess methyl groups. I’m curious, because lean muscle meat has quite a bit of glycine yet it doesn’t really help.. also whey protein causes a worsening of symptoms. Since starting collagen I’ve finally felt the relief of anxiety and it feels right.. not like a benzo but more so I feel naturally more calm. Also transit time reduced since beginning. In a way that’s hard to describe in words something feels right about taking the collagen. Many little things that popped up this year seem to be reversing. It’s even helping with some Anhedonia.

Why is it that when getting glycine from collagen helps but not other meats. Is it the ratios?

Since starting I feel better and my face and hair look better too.

Is there such thing as a glycine deficiency?

And lastly, can anyone comment about the relationship between glycine and libido? I’ve had nearly dead libido for the past year and since starting I’ve noticed something interesting. Now I either have high libido or zero libido and it goes back and forth. But prior to collagen it was only dead 24/7. And I had dull orgasms and now I don’t. So many interesting observations about collagen.

 

[martybyrde]

I’ll mention that my diet is pretty nutritious on average, and I avoid things like bread / grains. While I get good mineral and vitamin intake, I think my amino acid intake is not diverse at all, primarily just red muscle meat.

 

[LucH]

Perhaps a lack of converted methionine. Problem of methylation if some amino-acid from meat (methionine) is not converted.
How is your homocysteine?
=> If too high, make a search with "effect of methionine deficiency on anxiety and depression".
See MTHFR gene deficiency, too. Just to shut a door.
I try to see which amino-acid is brought by meat and not by collagen, that could create a problem.

 

[martybyrde]

Perhaps a lack of converted methionine. Problem of methylation if some amino-acid from meat (methionine) is not converted.
How is your homocysteine?
=> If too high, make a search with "effect of methionine deficiency on anxiety and depression".
See MTHFR gene deficiency, too. Just to shut a door.
I try to see which amino-acid is brought by meat and not by collagen, that could create a problem.

Well MTHFR is what lead to this issue. Yes I have double mutation and that’s why I was interested in methyl folate, B2, methylation as a whole. Supplementing methyl folate didn’t actually do much at first but after a week I got a bunch of weird symptoms. I have high B12 on blood work though but even then I still supplemented B12 with the folate just in case. I avoid supplemental b vitamins now entirely they cause too many issues especially muscle twitching, idk the connection there.

 

[Deadpool]

Very interesting. I have a very similar story to a tea and am also experimenting with allsorts of different things including glycine.

I think there is definitely merit to Chris Masterjohns theory. I have been diagnosed with "Overmethylation" with very low blood histamine according to the Walsh test and my practitioner actually wants me on regular folic acid because apparaently it quenches excess methyl groups. However, my experience with that has been all over the place. Sometimes I think its doing that, other times I think its still just increasing methylation and increasing anxiety all over the place.

I have experimented with glycine as well and thought maybe that is more of a focus point. I don't know if its the root cause but it definitely can help for some people. One big problem for me is it causes endogenous oxalate production which comes with a host of problems as well. But other than that, I definitely think it increases GABA and helps with anxiety.

Following this thread to see where it goes.

 

[Dutchie]

I have experimented with glycine as well and thought maybe that is more of a focus point. I don't know if its the root cause but it definitely can help for some people. One big problem for me is it causes endogenous oxalate production which comes with a host of problems as well. But other than that, I definitely think it increases GABA and helps with anxiety.

Are you getting enough B6? Low b6 can trigger endogenous oxalate production.

 

[daphne]

Here is a cut and paste of a recent Mercola article summary re Glycine. I downloaded his pdf and could share if anyone is interested:
STORY AT-A-GLANCE
Collagen — which provides structural support and strength to your tissues —accounts for about 30% of the total protein in your body. Twenty-eight percent ofcollagen, in turn, is made up of the amino acid glycine.Glycine Reverses Aging in CellsAnalysis by Dr. Joseph Mercola  Fact Checked October 02, 2023Collagen is one-third of the protein in your body and 28% of it is made up of the aminoacid glycine. One study estimates most people are about 10 grams short of what theirbodies need for all metabolic uses on a daily basisMounting research suggests glycine may play an important role in the aging process. It’sbeen shown to extend lifespan in worms, mice and rats, and improve health inmammalian models of age-related diseaseGlycine is a precursor to glutathione, a powerful endogenous antioxidant that declineswith age, and the lack of glutathione in older adults may be an element that drives theoxidative stress and mitochondrial dysfunction that lead to age-related degenerationGlycine also acts as a neurotransmitter and may play an important role in depression,neuroinflammation, neurodegeneration and cognitive declineGlycine may even be responsible for the epigenetic regulation that drives the agingprocess. Regulation of the aging process in your mitochondria appears to be ruled by twogenes that regulate glycine production in the mitochondria. Adding glycine to the culturemedium of fibroblast cells taken from 97-year old people restored the cells’ respiratoryfunction, which suggests that glycine treatment can reverse the age-associatedrespiration defects in human fibroblasts

Probably tmi?

 

[LucH]

I downloaded his pdf and could share if anyone is interested:

Hi,
I'm interested if Dr joseph Mercola cites sources in the PDF. Is it a "summary" of his video?
How L-GLYCINE Promotes Overall Wellness for Healthy Aging

 

[Deadpool]

Are you getting enough B6? Low b6 can trigger endogenous oxalate production.

Actually yea. Well, I know for a fact I have problems with B6 metabolism since I have pyroluria. However, just taking b6 doesnt help and comes with its own problems. Its hyper stimulative for me. Feel like I am on speed.

Sometimes, I also feel like it actually triggers an oxalate dump.

 

[daphne]

Hi,
I'm interested if Dr joseph Mercola cites sources in the PDF. Is it a "summary" of his video?
How L-GLYCINE Promotes Overall Wellness for Healthy Aging

Hi, I haven't watched the video, but I looked again at the 9 pg. pdf. It contains 40 citations with highlighted sources listed on the last page. He posted on this topic on June 23rd too. Title of that article was "Collagen and gelatin are crucial for optimal health" - a 13 pg pdf with 28 citations. This one discusses difference between collagen and gelatin and also has a bit about how non-organic collagen is made. I was interested b/c he'd mentioned that gelatin had been given to a small group of women and lessened or improved sarcopenia in a video I watched, or something I read, iirc. I subsequently looked for this 'research' or a citation online and could never find it. Nevertheless, I've stared taking ~20 grams of organic bone sourced gelatin every day and do notice a difference in my muscle tone, strength, skin health etc.

 

[daphne]

Hi,
I'm interested if Dr joseph Mercola cites sources in the PDF. Is it a "summary" of his video?
How L-GLYCINE Promotes Overall Wellness for Healthy Aging

I looked at 3 minute youtube vide link above. The article I reference is much more in-depth. I subscribe to his email list (free) and receive his daily sends. If an article is of interest to me, I will open and watch interviews and/or read the summary. I do download some pdfs and place in folder for reference. During CoVid, his extensive and free online resources were taken down and put on his Substack site. It requires a small fee to access there, but he says he doesn't profit from this cost. Unfortunately, it isn't easy to search for specific articles there - or perhaps I haven't figured out how to do that.

 

[Dutchie]

Actually yea. Well, I know for a fact I have problems with B6 metabolism since I have pyroluria. However, just taking b6 doesnt help and comes with its own problems. Its hyper stimulative for me. Feel like I am on speed.

Sometimes, I also feel like it actually triggers an oxalate dump.

Yeah, too much b6 can work negatively on the nervous system.
What form did you try....pyridoxine or p5p? I find I do better with some p5p, not pyridoxine.

 

[LucH]

can anyone comment about the relationship between glycine and libido? I’ve had nearly dead libido for the past year and since starting I’ve noticed something interesting.

glycine has gaba-like effects. So, relax. On a further way, you're perhaps enable to produce more CO2, less stressful hormones (NO, cortisol, estrogen).
And by the way K2 (600 - 1500 mcg MK4) + mix toco (50 mg) and some b-carotene (5-10 mg)(carotenes from food only); this would optimize fit membranes and vessels.
Not necessarily every day, for vitamin E e.g. To0 much of a good thing is bad.
Mind K2 MK7 if not well encapsulated. 2-3 months lifetime.

 

[martybyrde]

Update. Switched to just straight beef gelatin. Want to mention this is the longest I have received beneifits from a single supplement / dietary change. Benefits continue and libido continues to rise. I had morning wood today! More importantly, gut is normalizing and feeling less endotoxin symptoms contrary to many reports about gelatin feeding bacteria / increasing endotoxin symptoms across this forum. Also sleep is incredibly restful now.

despite my issues with fatigue and anxiety this year I still lift quite a bit and nearly all my joints are shot. Today I realized every single joint issue I have has fully reversed. Zero pain and my strength went up in the gym. Another interesting point… collagen made me way sleepier than beef gelatin. I don’t feel too much sedation from beef gelatin. This is good, as it still is relieving my anxiety.

Overall, loving this. I feel so much better and hopefully changes will continue. I still don’t get how I can get so many benefits when I’ve eaten meat probably every single day this year. Naturally I’m a big meat eater especially beef. It does seem amino acid ratios really do make all the difference.

 

[martybyrde]

Actually I should mention one side effect.. my urine smells different. I don’t think it smells like ammonia but more sweet but I need to pee again to confirm. It didn’t happen this morning though.

 

[martybyrde]

glycine has gaba-like effects. So, relax. On a further way, you're perhaps enable to produce more CO2, less stressful hormones (NO, cortisol, estrogen).
And by the way K2 (600 - 1500 mcg MK4) + mix toco (50 mg) and some b-carotene (5-10 mg)(carotenes from food only); this would optimize fit membranes and vessels.
Not necessarily every day, for vitamin E e.g. To0 much of a good thing is bad.
Mind K2 MK7 if not well encapsulated. 2-3 months lifetime.

Had a weird experience with vitamin k2 mk4. Sometimes it causes a nice calmness, and others clear endotoxin symptoms. Overall I avoid it.

I have very low estradiol relative to testosterone and try to limit aromatase inhibitors.

 

[martybyrde]

I know testosterone injecting screws up collagen. I did have a stint with using testosterone when I was younger for bodybuilding, and I know I aged pretty rapidly during this time. Perhaps it screwed up my amino acid profile. Idk enough about the subject

 

[LucH]

Actually I should mention one side effect.. my urine smells different. I don’t think it smells like ammonia but more sweet but I need to pee again to confirm. It didn’t happen this morning though.

take into account the second urine of the morning.
Control with pH-strips.. If you don't balance electrolytes with enough potassium, the problem will take another side to come back. your urine must be yello-clear but not too clear.
I'm not talking about one or three days but the whole week. And you need to vary your sources of food for microbiota: vegetables - meat - starch if good transit - some fruits too.
You need some kind of bacteria to produce special fats for tight junctions: butyrate. From butter (or ghee) or from akkermansia muciniphila probiotics (not cheap: +/ 55 $)

 

[martybyrde]

take into account the second urine of the morning.
Control with pH-strips.. If you don't balance electrolytes with enough potassium, the problem will take another side to come back. your urine must be yello-clear but not too clear.
I'm not talking about one or three days but the whole week. And you need to vary your sources of food for microbiota: vegetables - meat - starch if good transit - some fruits too.
You need some kind of bacteria to produce special fats for tight junctions: butyrate. From butter (or ghee) or from akkermansia muciniphila probiotics (not cheap: +/ 55 $)

Whenever my anxiety gets bad potassium stops it. I’ve actually been dependent on this as a tool. This week I didn’t have to. But I will get back to drinking high potassium juices. Do you know why I was consistently able to stop anxiety with coconut water / high potassium intake?

 

[LucH]

Whenever my anxiety gets bad potassium stops it.

Perhaps that whenever you're stressed, your Ca enters the cell (contraction), setting K out of the cell. Mg is called to calm down, but we're often deficient. Electrical and chemical unbalance follows.
Potassium is the key mineral to balance electrolytes. Not Mg. Mg acts as a fireman. Needed but not sufficient.