Fit Vs Healthy

kettlebell

Member
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
417
Location
UK
I saw on another thread the mention of Paul Jaminet and his heart rate of 50 and thought it worthy of discussion.

I know a lot of people who play sports, are in "Good shape" and have resting heart rates in the mid to low 40's (Two of them are gymnasts).

Those guys consider themselves fit and healthy. One of the reasons they consider themselves healthy is due to the low heart rate. This low heart rate is thanks to a stronger heart enabling more blood to be circulated per heart beat therefore fewer heart beats per minute (Or that's what I learned in biology at school).

This is where I struggle slightly.

What would happen if someone like that tried to achieve a heart rate of 75-80 while rested? Their heart would be circulating a lot more blood per minute than that of a life long sedentary person. Would that have any detrimental effect (Light headedness etc)

Many of the people with heart rates that low are likely hypothyroid BUT many of them may not be?

How do you measure fitness versus health? Especially in the context of the heart rate where cardiovascular fitness is measured by heart rate among other things
 

cliff

Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2012
Messages
425
Age
32
Location
Los Angeles
Stroke volume only goes up 2x. If your HR goes down 2x(80->40) then you have effectively lost all benefits of stroke volume and you get just as much oxygen to your muscles as sedentary people. Because of EPOC(oxygen debt) more oxygen is needed for athletes even at rest.

In this study the older people had lower VO2 max because their max HR was lower than the younger people.(http://jap.physiology.org/content/51/3/634.short)
 

kettlebell

Member
Thread starter
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
417
Location
UK
Thanks Cliff.

Interesting, and rings a bell.

So getting a stronger heart through exercise at some point as the heart rate goes down has diminishing returns.
 

nwo2012

Member
Joined
Aug 28, 2012
Messages
1,107
kettlebell said:
Thanks Cliff.

Interesting, and rings a bell.

So getting a stronger heart through exercise at some point as the heart rate goes down has diminishing returns.

I think also the stressful exercise affects their thyroid negatively and this also lowers the heart rate further. Also many, such as Ray Peat, do not believe it a health benefit to get extra oxygen.

RP
I’m not sure who introduced the term “aerobic” to describe the state of anaerobic metabolism that develops during stressful exercise, but it has had many harmful repercussions. In experiments, T3 production is stopped very quickly by even “sub-aerobic” exercise, probably becaue of the combination of a decrease of blood glucose and an increase in free fatty acids. In a healthy person, rest will tend to restore the normal level of T3, but there is evidence that even very good athletes remain in a hypothyroid state even at rest. A chronic increase of lactic acid and cortisol indicates that something is wrong. The “slender muscles” of endurance runners are signs of a catabolic state, that has been demonstrated even in the heart muscle. A slow heart beat very strongly suggests hypothyroidism. Hypothyroid people, who are likely to produce lactic acid even at rest, are especially susceptible to the harmful effects of “aerobic” exercise. The good effect some people feel from exercise is probably the result of raising the body temperature; a warm bath will do the same for people with low body temperature.
 

kettlebell

Member
Thread starter
Joined
Oct 14, 2012
Messages
417
Location
UK
Thanks for the RP quote! Very interesting.

It has taken me a while to recondition myself in regards to this.

Healthy and fit are far from each other on a spectrum, that much is very clear and almost all athletes train a specific attribute at the expense of health although they mistakenly think the go hand in hand.

Expanding on this a little - What do you guys do, if anything at all to maintain an ability to run, sprint without getting out of breath too quickly? What exercise would you consider increases your ability to run, sprint for extended periods when necessary without being detrimental to your health?


I think this is important because thanks to either a meteor strike or the medical industry releasing a deadly genetically modified bug, a zombie apocalypse is probably just around the corner. Therefore I want to maintain my ability to be able to run away when they attack.

I was the worst kind of athlete in regards to damaging health - 400m runner. Plenty of extended 40-60 minute runs on some days and sprint training from anything between 200-500m on other days. Every session would end in an overload of lactic acid, nausea and in almost all cases I would throw up between sprint reps. I did that every week for years. And to top it off, that whole time I never ate much and when I did it was PUFA rich.

I could run fast and run a long way. I was very fit, not at all healthy.
 
Similar threads
Thread starter Title Forum Replies Date
Mito S.F. Millennial was fit and healthy before COVID-19. He’s a disabled ‘long-hauler’ now. Miscellaneous Health Discussions 77
A Why You Need Calcium And Fat (Butyrate) To Be Fit And Healthy Dairy, Eggs 93
Energizer Ray Peat Interview Get Fit With Jodelle - Iodine, Spider Veins, Oxalates, Fat Loss (July 31) Interviews 26
Inaut Ray Peat Interview Jodelle Fit - Dr. Ray Peat Q&A - How To Sleep Better, Sleep Solutions, & Supplements Jodellefit 15
walker_in_aus Can A Hypothyroid Person Become "fit"? Exercise 19
J Freewheel Running Prevents Learned Helplessness (How Would This Fit Into Peat's View Of Exercise? Exercise 5
Westside PUFAs Is Fat The New Fit? Josh Rubin Interview With The RawBrahs Miscellaneous Health Discussions 5
Lokzo Ten days of complete fasting affected subjective sensations but not cognitive abilities in healthy adults - PUBMED 2021 Scientific Studies 6
Mito Early decline of androgen levels in healthy adult men: an effect of aging per se? Scientific Studies 1
E Healthy Game of Good, Better, and Best Ask For Help or Advice 9
Drareg Long COVID And Young "healthy" Articles & Scientific Studies 6
Lokzo 5-HTP Increases Cortisol In Healthy Volunteers Scientific Studies 5
Lokzo Fish Oil Supplements Improve Testicular Health: Study Of 1,679 Healthy Young Men Scientific Studies 30
lyfe Is Being Thin By Todays Standards Even Healthy? How Do You Deal With Being Overweight? Weight 20
A Healthy & Slim 23yr Old Female Looking For Longevity Ask For Help or Advice 10
Drareg Quadruple-stranded DNA Seen In Healthy Human Cells For The First Time Read More: Https://www.newsci Articles & Scientific Studies 0
L Reduction Of "vicarious" Stress But Remaining Empathic. Is That Androgenic/healthy? Scientific Studies 3
Ecto Personal Log: Journey Into Getting Healthy Logs 2
Y Why Did A Healthy 16 Year Old Die From Covid Ask For Help or Advice 109
Frankdee20 How Much Sex In A Week Is Healthy ? Male Issues 20
K Which Condiments Are Safe And Healthy? Diet 3
GorillaHead Just How Healthy Or Normal Is A High High Sex Drive Male Issues 31
berk Resistant Starch Healthy Or Not? Diet 0
L How Do You Keep Your Teeth Healthy And White On This Diet? Oral Health 26
_lppaiva Effect Of The Fat Composition Of Single HF Meal On Inflammatory Markers In Healthy Young Women Scientific Studies 1
D John Paul George Ringo - How Healthy Were They The Ray Peat Forum Lounge 9
Vinny Ghost Whipe = Healthy Colon? Ask For Help or Advice 80
Mito Metabolic Effects Of A Prolonged, Very-high-dose Dietary Fructose Challenge In Healthy Subjects Scientific Studies 11
Lokzo Lactobacillus + Inulin Raises Corticosterone In Healthy Juvenile Rats Scientific Studies 3
P Is Cheese As Healthy As Milk? Diet 46
N Keeping Teeth Healthy Oral Health 37
ScurveDream "I'm Alive Therefore I'm Healthy" -- Where Does This Presumption Come From? Diet 2
M Healthy Cells Adjacent To Cancer Cells Trun Into Stem Cells Scientific Studies 4
Viiiiyu Wanna Go Super Light Weight,Healthy?(I Am A Trap) Weight 23
Lokzo Decreased Serotonin In Healthy Adults After Consumption Of Wholegrain Rye: PubMed 2019 Scientific Studies 17
milkboi Success In The Modern World Vs. Getting/Being Healthy Ask For Help or Advice 49
M Healthy Alternatives For Ketchup , Mustard , Mayonnaise? Diet, Recipes 17
A Do You Think That Nescafe Classic Is Safe And As Healthy As Other Coffee Types? Ask For Help or Advice 7
Lokzo Oral Glucose Load And Mixed Meal Feeding Lowers Testosterone Levels In Healthy Eugonadal Men Scientific Studies 2
Lokzo DHT Is Elevated Following Sprint Exercise In Healthy Young Men Scientific Studies 1
GutFeeling The Development Of Essential Fatty Acid Deficiency In Healthy Men Fed Fat-free Diets Scientific Studies 2
bistecca Is Enough Emphasis Placed On Healthy Animal Products? Diet 2
Lokzo High Protein Intake Is Associated With Low Plasma NAD+ Levels In A Healthy Human Cohort Scientific Studies 0
haidut Blood Glucose Varies Widely In Healthy People, Can Reach Even Diabetic Levels Scientific Studies 3
Lokzo Can Someone Explain How Animal Fat Is HEALTHY Diet 13
T Does Garlic Contain A Form Of Endotoxin, And Is Black Garlic Peat-healthy? Ask For Help or Advice 7
japanesedude Addictive To People - Is That Healthy Or Not? Mental Issues 2
Captain_Coconut How Much Superoxide Dismutase Can A Healthy Body Make In A Day? Ask For Help or Advice 0
jamies33 Healthy Peaty Smokers - Would You Recommend Smoking To Non-smokers? Alcohol, Tobacco, Drugs 29
lvysaur A Healthy Rabbit Liver Organ Meat 1

Similar threads

Top