EFA Deficiency Achievable In 2 Weeks On Fat Free Diet

[Orion]

I truly hope it works that way, Orion. What you said about the switch to sugar oxidation once you offload stored PUFAs was very helpful for me. But what about before you restore sugar metabolism - how can you selectively burn off your sat fat stores while harmlessly excreting the accumulated PUFA? Do I understand the Randle cycle correctly - does it refer to the competitive metabolism of glucose versus fat(any type), or does it refer to the competitive metabolism of glucose versus PUFA only?

Definitely not an expert on this, but you need vitamin E to properly utilize/excrete PUFA. Once PUFA is depleted RP has stated that vitamin E is no longer require, as it is not essential, but useless say after dinner out where PUFA is unavoidable. Ideally you won't start burning off SFA until PUFA is depleted, PUFA is the choke hold on metabolism. As PUFA is depleted, T4 is transported properly, as is vitamin A(along with cholesterol increasing protective steroids), PUFA interferes with pancreas and insulin, depleting PUFA gets you off stress hormones as long as you avoid excessive starch and muscle meat. PUFA depletion then energizes the liver, stores more glycogen, it can remove estrogen rapidly, it converts T4 to T3. I think its just best to go zero fat and start the process, obese or older people will take longer, children might take a couple weeks. Few members on here have posted one to two months and feeling much better, some have stuck with as they feel great with this approach. I am just over three weeks now, and experiencing the good effects, most noticeable with my skin

RP has mentioned animal studies where they are on zero fat diets but fed high quality calories, those animals have superior resistance to stress, and are very hard to kill. PUFA is UN-essential.

 

[lollipop]

I truly hope it works that way, Orion. What you said about the switch to sugar oxidation once you offload stored PUFAs was very helpful for me. But what about before you restore sugar metabolism - how can you selectively burn off your sat fat stores while harmlessly excreting the accumulated PUFA? Do I understand the Randle cycle correctly - does it refer to the competitive metabolism of glucose versus fat(any type), or does it refer to the competitive metabolism of glucose versus PUFA only?

Not sure I can adequately respond to your inquiry @shepherdgirl, but I recall Peat saying that the body prefers to burn sat fat over PUFA and is why he recommends eating sat fat to increase ratio of Sat Fat to PUFA. Maybe this answers part of your question? Also, I can be wrong and please anyone feel free to correct me.

 

[Orion]

Not sure I can adequately respond to your inquiry @shepherdgirl, but I recall Peat saying that the body prefers to burn sat fat over PUFA and is why he recommends eating sat fat to increase ratio of Sat Fat to PUFA. Maybe this answers part of your question? Also, I can be wrong and please anyone feel free to correct me.

RP weight loss quotes
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Yes, I know people who have lost weight just by eating a raw carrot every day, reducing endotoxin stress. The liver treats PUFA as it treats toxins, but when their concentration is too high, they poison the detoxifying system. Oleic acid, which we can make ourselves from carbohydrates, greatly activates the detox enzyme system.

Yes, that's why a resistant (antiseptic) fiber such as bamboo shoots or raw carrot helps with weight loss, it reduces endotoxin and the stress hormones, and lets the liver metabolize more effectively.

It's the stored PUFA, released by stress or hunger, that slow metabolism. Niacinamide helps to lower free fatty acids, and good nutrition will allow the liver to slowly detoxify the PUFA, if it isn't being flooded with large amounts of them. A small amount of coconut oil with each meal will increase the ability to oxidize fat, by momentarily stopping the antithyroid effect of the PUFA. Aspirin is another thing that reduces the stress-related increase of free fatty acids, stimulating metabolism. Taking a thyroid supplement is reasonable until the ratio of saturated fats to PUFA is about 2 to 1.

Yes, it's best to lose it slowly. When I tried adding about a tablespoon of coconut oil once a day I lost about two pounds a week, for several weeks, without eating less.
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Just wanted mentioned that B3 and aspirin didn't help me, as I think in the beginning I was too reliant on stress hormones and too much stored PUFA. Blocking FFA's with them would always make me crash and sleep quality would be greatly reduced from glycogen reduction.

 

[shepherdgirl]

@lisaferraro - yes, definitely agreed, I remember Peat saying that sat fat is protective, and meanwhile you can get rid of small amounts of PUFA safely with certain supplements. I was also wondering why/how the PUFA would get safely depleted on a VLF diet versus a normal Peat style diet, since my fat stores are probably much higher in PUFA than my present diet, so I would expect the sat fat ratio to be lower if I were burning only body fat. I started reading some things that @haidut had written in a similar post on PUFA depletion, which explains some possible reasons for why PUFA can be depleted safely, as well as experimental results:
PUFA Depletion Can (probably) Be Accomplished In 30 Days!
One thing that bothers me is that the PUFA can be replenished very easily - for example, one high PUFA meal. Guess there's no point in starting before Thanksgiving!

@Orion - greatly appreciate hearing about your positive experience, as well as the other people who posted earlier about the beneficial effects. Thanks also for the quotes, very relevant and helpful. I also crashed trying B3, caffeine and aspirin, even with lots of food - probably still have too many stress hormones.

 

[Orion]

One thing that bothers me is that the PUFA can be replenished very easily - for example, one high PUFA meal. Guess there's no point in starting before Thanksgiving!

I cannot find a @Mittir post right now. It describes that PUFA is stored everywhere, and getting it out of lets say the liver, brain, bone marrow, lungs, mitochondria will take longer than liberating it from fat cells. But I would suspect once its depleted from those organs and fat cells, the liver would be much more capable of detox'ing it after your thanksgiving binge :) And a high PUFA meal would not replenish your critical organs. High PUFA meals should be accompanied with some good quality vitamin E, keep that on hand in the future.

 

[shepherdgirl]

Oh yes. Vitamin E for every time I am forced to be polite and eat bad stuff. Which is unfortunately fairly often! If only PUFAs would go out of fashion!

 

[Luann]

Hey guys,
(Brace youselves - this is a very vague uneducated question)
So.......some internal organs do not give up their PUFA as easily, correct? They would take longer to detox them of the unwanted fats? So these organs, whichever they are, that are more determined to contain PUFA, would they begin to comprise more saturated fats within this 2 week (or month, depending on which forum thread you're looking at.) Would a short fat-free stint also detox the 'deep' pufas of the body?

 

[Orion]

Would a short fat-free stint also detox the 'deep' pufas of the body?

From reading through Peat, I think it is suggested that being really young helps, getting older could take some time, and more time :)

 

[Ella]

Has anyone monitored their foamy urine to track pufa depletion? If we are effectively targeting and excreting pufas; the foamy urine would be a measure pufa excretion.

 

[lollipop]

Has anyone monitored their foamy urine to track pufa depletion? If we are effectively targeting and excreting pufas; the foamy urine would be a measure pufa excretion.

Interesting @Ella, could you explain more?

 

[Ella]

I remember Ray mentioned in a KMUD interview, probably a while back, that foamy urine is a sign of pufa excretion. In the same interview, he explained how to measure urine output to determine your metabolic rate. Maybe I should do this also. I need to find the interview.

I noticed my urine is more foamy at times and very little foam other times. I was thinking of using the amount of foam in the urine as a gauge in adjusting the diet, supplementation etc., to rid the body of pufas more rapidly and efficiently.

I was wondering whether OP noticed a decrease in foam when taking aspirin, niacinamide etc.

I aim to lose a further 10kg but don't want to end up with a fatty liver or stressing my pancreas or increasing TSH. Peat says a high TSH is due to FFAs. My TSH has increased while I have been shedding weight which freaks me out. Another ******* inflammatory molecule to contend with So if I can target increasing foam in the urine, then I know there is less FFAs floating around in my system causing untold damage.

Does this make sense, or should I be encouraging the muscles to burn PUFAs at rest? Slower process If so, then I will need to work my muscles more to encourage faster burning. My aim is to get rid of the fat without stressing or damaging my other organs. I do not want to be that lady that succeeds in shedding weight but ends up dead in the process.

Peat says 30% fat is healthy for females. Still, it is the quality of the fat that matters. If this fat is high in PUFAs, which I don't think mine would be anywhere close to those that eat a processed diet. I think I'll do a fatty acid profile, so I stop torturing myself over this. Again, I read (somewhere???) where he mentions what a good ratio is. Which makes me think, it may not matter what %fat I am, as long as I meet this ratio.

Thoughts appreciated.

 

[docall18]

I remember Ray mentioned in a KMUD interview, probably a while back, that foamy urine is a sign of pufa excretion.

Its a sign of stress..

 

[EIRE24]

Has anyone monitored their foamy urine to track pufa depletion? If we are effectively targeting and excreting pufas; the foamy urine would be a measure pufa excretion.

I always thought foamy urine was to do with excess protein excretion or something along those lines?

 

[Ella]

Its a sign of stress..

Thanks for finding. I am listening to all the interviews trying to find it. So the foam is due to both fatty acids and steriod hormones.

Peat says that it happens during the dark hours when there is no light.

The fact they are being excreted is a good sign, instead of being unconjugated by beta-glucoronidase and recirculating back to the liver?? Thus estrogen and cortisol will be rapidly disposed off as quickly as they are produced??

Fatty acids as soon as they are released during (stress and weight loss) into circulation are also conjugated for immediate removal and less likely to end in the liver contributing to fatty liver during weight loss.

During weight loss it should be a positive sign and not a negative sign??

Once you have shifted a large portion of fat out of adipose and tissue sites, you should see a reduction in foamy urine?

 

[Giraffe]

Important to note here, is that the eight men in study I were kept on an eucaloric diet by a "constant drip over a 24-h period".

In study II one young man was on the fat-free diet (24-hour drip) for 10 days (period A), followed by a 24-hour fast (period B), followed by three days intermittent feeding (3 meals a day), followed by "refeeding".

With increased free fatty acid outflow during fasting and intermittent feeding, linoleic acid rose and eicosatrienoic acid decreased.

Biopsies done at the beginning and end of the study showed similar linoleic acid contents of the adipose tissue, about 12% of the total fatty acids. In addition, the free fatty acid composition after the 24-h fast of Period B was similar to that at base line indicating that no gross changes in adipose tissue had occurred during Period A.

In both experiments they noted, that palmitoleic acid (C16:1) and oleic acid (C18:1) increased as linoleic acid decreased.

Dermatitis, which is usually the first clinical sign of EFA deficiency was not detected at any time in the study.

....

I changed the title of the thread a bit. I exchanged "PUFA depletion" for "EFA Deficiency"

 

[ecstatichamster]

I've been pursuing Very Low Fat last week until now. Before, about a year ago and more recently, it made me feel HORRIBLE. This time, I don't feel bad at all. I think it's that EFAs have greatly depleted and aren't flooding my bloodstream with PUFA free fatty acids. I am not yet losing weight, but there are good signs.

 

[Orion]

I've been pursuing Very Low Fat last week until now. Before, about a year ago and more recently, it made me feel HORRIBLE. This time, I don't feel bad at all. I think it's that EFAs have greatly depleted and aren't flooding my bloodstream with PUFA free fatty acids. I am not yet losing weight, but there are good signs.

I am in month 6 of zero fat and zero starch. Excess fat started to shed in month 5, went from 213lbs to 205lbs in the last ~30days (I'm 6'2), I did tweak my white sugar intake down from 1/2 cup per day to 1/4 per day in my coffees, and that seems to have started the transition. I think 195lbs would be a good set point for me, see what happens in the next few months. But I do believe this is the effect of PUFA depletion. Used alot of tocovit in those 5months, and now use it sparingly with very small amount of aspirin/B3.

Sleep improves, acne still healing, joint improvements, heavy lifts improving, body comp looking good for summer. Best decision I have made yet with respect to my health, this forum and RPs articles/interviews are a life saver for me.

 

[Milena]

Good jobs, chaps. I am still putting on fat like, well a person on PUFA. Minimal PUFA here. At the moment, the only time I feel like I am burning fat is at night (stress hormones) or when the Caffeine isn't inhibited by aspirin or B3. Is that how I will have to burn my fat off in the future or can someone describe the uncoupling mechanism where I waste some input but still have energy (ATP) produce to do stuff.

 

[Orion]

Good jobs, chaps. I am still putting on fat like, well a person on PUFA. Minimal PUFA here. At the moment, the only time I feel like I am burning fat is at night (stress hormones) or when the Caffeine isn't inhibited by aspirin or B3. Is that how I will have to burn my fat off in the future or can someone describe the uncoupling mechanism where I waste some input but still have energy (ATP) produce to do stuff.

Muscles constantly burn fat from what I understand, this is why lifting to build muscle will help with fat loss.

Also when mitochondrion are filled with PUFA, they most likely will not uncouple.

Focusing on low fat to deplete PUFA could be a strategy, utilizing vitamin E, B3 and aspirin to mitigate the effects of unsaturated FFA's during the process. Once depleted, larger amounts of B3, caffeine, aspirin, and methylene blue, etc... should promote mitochondrial uncoupling.

 

[Milena]

Muscles constantly burn fat from what I understand, this is why lifting to build muscle will help with fat loss.

Also when mitochondrion are filled with PUFA, they most likely will not uncouple.

Focusing on low fat to deplete PUFA could be a strategy, utilizing vitamin E, B3 and aspirin to mitigate the effects of unsaturated FFA's during the process. Once depleted, larger amounts of B3, caffeine, aspirin, and methylene blue, etc... should promote mitochondrial uncoupling.

Chicken and egg, it seems :)
Continuing pretty low-fat but no too low that I get degraded skin.