The "Chad" of oils. Is this seed oil the savior we have been waiting for? High stearic sunflower oil.

[RealNeat]

Upon seeing that sunflowers have a high amount of vitamin E compared to other foods I investigated how to incorporate them in the diet without supplements but also without PUFA, or at least not very much, High oleic sunflower oil has about 5.5mg of Vitamin E per tablespoon which is pretty good, but it still has some omega 6, not as much as "normal" sunflower but still iffy. Then I saw what seemed to be he an ideal option Technology | AdvantaSeeds Global I quote,"Nutrisun is a patented, proprietary germplasm that delivers sunflower oil that does not raise the levels of bad cholesterol. This GMO-free sustainable source of oil is a natural, high stearic, high oleic, sunflower oil that is derived from the conventional breeding of hybrid seeds. Compared to regular sunflower oil fatty acid profile, Nutrisun contains 4 times more stearic acid and 3 times more oleic acid." As far as attaining the oil, im not sure where to start as it may not be consumer available however I gather that this may be a new favorite oil/ snack for the Peat sphere. Its high in mono and saturated fats along with high Vitamin E, seems ideal. Will the Vitamin E of this seed diminish in time as it realizes that it doesnt "need it" im not sure, but for now I will try and find a source to try these out.

 

[canadianboymike]

Upon seeing that sunflowers have a high amount of vitamin E compared to other foods I investigated how to incorporate them in the diet without supplements but also without PUFA, or at least not very much, High oleic sunflower oil has about 5.5mg of Vitamin E per tablespoon which is pretty good, but it still has some omega 6, not as much as "normal" sunflower but still iffy. Then I saw what seemed to be he an ideal option Technology | AdvantaSeeds Global I quote,"Nutrisun is a patented, proprietary germplasm that delivers sunflower oil that does not raise the levels of bad cholesterol. This GMO-free sustainable source of oil is a natural, high stearic, high oleic, sunflower oil that is derived from the conventional breeding of hybrid seeds. Compared to regular sunflower oil fatty acid profile, Nutrisun contains 4 times more stearic acid and 3 times more oleic acid." As far as attaining the oil, im not sure where to start as it may not be consumer available however I gather that this may be a new favorite oil/ snack for the Peat sphere. Its high in mono and saturated fats along with high Vitamin E, seems ideal. Will the Vitamin E of this seed diminish in time as it realizes that it doesnt "need it" im not sure, but for now I will try and find a source to try these out.

I’m interested in this for sure…

 

[Logan-]

If you can find high quality olive oil, which is rare, it would have a much higher vitamin E concentration than what nutrition data charts show for regular EVOOs.

 

[Peater]

Coconut oil is still the king of plant oils IMHO!

 

[feedandseed]

Upon seeing that sunflowers have a high amount of vitamin E compared to other foods I investigated how to incorporate them in the diet without supplements but also without PUFA, or at least not very much, High oleic sunflower oil has about 5.5mg of Vitamin E per tablespoon which is pretty good, but it still has some omega 6, not as much as "normal" sunflower but still iffy. Then I saw what seemed to be he an ideal option Technology | AdvantaSeeds Global I quote,"Nutrisun is a patented, proprietary germplasm that delivers sunflower oil that does not raise the levels of bad cholesterol. This GMO-free sustainable source of oil is a natural, high stearic, high oleic, sunflower oil that is derived from the conventional breeding of hybrid seeds. Compared to regular sunflower oil fatty acid profile, Nutrisun contains 4 times more stearic acid and 3 times more oleic acid." As far as attaining the oil, im not sure where to start as it may not be consumer available however I gather that this may be a new favorite oil/ snack for the Peat sphere. Its high in mono and saturated fats along with high Vitamin E, seems ideal. Will the Vitamin E of this seed diminish in time as it realizes that it doesnt "need it" im not sure, but for now I will try and find a source to try these out.

I believe they use this commonly in many parts of Italy for processed food like potato chips. I definitely didn't feel as disgusting eating it there as I do eating sunflower oil products in the US. Regardless, I still think coconut is king.

 

[peter88]

Cocoa butter is king

 

[RealNeat]

Yes coconut oil and cacao butter are both great fats but coconut oil has no vitamin E though it's very saturated and it has a low smoke point. As for cacao butter it is high in heavy metals and also has no vitamin E plus hard to digest. I think this would be a great addition to the choices.

 

[Runenight201]

Would it to be safe to cook with or would the heat cause the unsaturated fat to become toxic?

@peter88 your profile pic is amazing. Someone should recreate a Chad Peat Avatar who hears your health problems and recommends milk, oj, and liver. AI Peat lives on forever!

 

[mostlylurking]

I quote,"Nutrisun is a patented, proprietary germplasm that delivers sunflower oil that does not raise the levels of bad cholesterol.

Do they delve deeper into this topic of the "bad" cholesterol? Since hdl cholesterol increases in response to toxic things, and ldl is basically the transport tool to move cholesterol to where it's needed, things like "good" and "bad" can really be confusing. I know mainstream medicine labels hdl as "good" and ldl as "bad" but they never seem to explain the why of these labels.

I'd be disinclined to try this product simply because it is "patented"; which means it does not exist in nature, which means the product would be something that the body has never experienced before.

I'll paste a few Peat quotes from here: bioenergetic search (search for "hdl", then search for "ldl".)

" And it happens that that protein that forms the HDL is anti-inflammatory. So it's a defensive reaction to stress. Estrogen and alcohol, for example, will increase the HDL defensively. But the LDL is a protective source of the cholesterol. And if the triglycerides are fairly saturated, they aren't very harmful."

"And the HDL has probably some more specific antitoxic effects where the LDL is more a delivery system of cholesterol itself. And toxins will tend to increase the HDL relative to the LDL. Toxins of most types will increase, both of them defensively, but the chlorinated hydrocarbons, radiation, estrogen, and alcohol, for example, will increase the HDL relative to the LDL because it has some more specific antitoxic effects."

"The HDL is associated with allergy and the higher LDL is associated with less likelihood of allergy. PUFA and HDL, the supposedly good things, which have been increasingly promoted, are believed by quite a few allergists now to be responsible for the great increase in allergy in Europe and America. Because they're signaling for inflammation. Yeah, they increase the, among other things, the prostaglandins, which increase the histamine production."

"HDL, LDL, and triglycerides? But I know that you view LDL and HDL differently to the way that they would class them good and bad cholesterol. You don't actually look at them that way. So the question was the relative proportions in terms of what would be healthy or normal, given that you advocate a slightly higher cholesterol than what would typically be seen as a regular normal cholesterol. Yeah. When you're low density, cholesterol is low. That's what increases the cancer risk or dementia risk, too. But the things that poison your liver or stress you increase the HDL."

"...the differences between HDL and LDL? Both of them are able to participate in detoxification. The protein that helps to carry the cholesterol in the bloodstream itself has some very specific antistress, even antiviral activity. So they're part of our ability to respond to stress, the protein as well as the cholesterol associated with the protein. And they're both defensive and both important, but the LDL is mostly the one that carries cholesterol into the places where it's needed, the brain, the ovaries, testicles, and adrenal glands, but anywhere you're making steroids and that includes the skin...."

 

[supercoolguy]

Good Luck with that.

 

[A-Tim]

T

Upon seeing that sunflowers have a high amount of vitamin E compared to other foods I investigated how to incorporate them in the diet without supplements but also without PUFA, or at least not very much, High oleic sunflower oil has about 5.5mg of Vitamin E per tablespoon which is pretty good, but it still has some omega 6, not as much as "normal" sunflower but still iffy. Then I saw what seemed to be he an ideal option Technology | AdvantaSeeds Global I quote,"Nutrisun is a patented, proprietary germplasm that delivers sunflower oil that does not raise the levels of bad cholesterol. This GMO-free sustainable source of oil is a natural, high stearic, high oleic, sunflower oil that is derived from the conventional breeding of hybrid seeds. Compared to regular sunflower oil fatty acid profile, Nutrisun contains 4 times more stearic acid and 3 times more oleic acid." As far as attaining the oil, im not sure where to start as it may not be consumer available however I gather that this may be a new favorite oil/ snack for the Peat sphere. Its high in mono and saturated fats along with high Vitamin E, seems ideal. Will the Vitamin E of this seed diminish in time as it realizes that it doesnt "need it" im not sure, but for now I will try and find a source to try these out.

That's pretty cool. I would like to know how low the linoleic acid component is, as I assume that is the fatty acid most valuable to avoid. I did have a look around their site, but couldn't see anything about that. If it does end up having very low linoleic acid, then great find!

 

[RealNeat]

Do they delve deeper into this topic of the "bad" cholesterol? Since hdl cholesterol increases in response to toxic things, and ldl is basically the transport tool to move cholesterol to where it's needed, things like "good" and "bad" can really be confusing. I know mainstream medicine labels hdl as "good" and ldl as "bad" but they never seem to explain the why of these labels.

I'd be disinclined to try this product simply because it is "patented"; which means it does not exist in nature, which means the product would be something that the body has never experienced before.

I'll paste a few Peat quotes from here: bioenergetic search (search for "hdl", then search for "ldl".)

" And it happens that that protein that forms the HDL is anti-inflammatory. So it's a defensive reaction to stress. Estrogen and alcohol, for example, will increase the HDL defensively. But the LDL is a protective source of the cholesterol. And if the triglycerides are fairly saturated, they aren't very harmful."

"And the HDL has probably some more specific antitoxic effects where the LDL is more a delivery system of cholesterol itself. And toxins will tend to increase the HDL relative to the LDL. Toxins of most types will increase, both of them defensively, but the chlorinated hydrocarbons, radiation, estrogen, and alcohol, for example, will increase the HDL relative to the LDL because it has some more specific antitoxic effects."

"The HDL is associated with allergy and the higher LDL is associated with less likelihood of allergy. PUFA and HDL, the supposedly good things, which have been increasingly promoted, are believed by quite a few allergists now to be responsible for the great increase in allergy in Europe and America. Because they're signaling for inflammation. Yeah, they increase the, among other things, the prostaglandins, which increase the histamine production."

"HDL, LDL, and triglycerides? But I know that you view LDL and HDL differently to the way that they would class them good and bad cholesterol. You don't actually look at them that way. So the question was the relative proportions in terms of what would be healthy or normal, given that you advocate a slightly higher cholesterol than what would typically be seen as a regular normal cholesterol. Yeah. When you're low density, cholesterol is low. That's what increases the cancer risk or dementia risk, too. But the things that poison your liver or stress you increase the HDL."

"...the differences between HDL and LDL? Both of them are able to participate in detoxification. The protein that helps to carry the cholesterol in the bloodstream itself has some very specific antistress, even antiviral activity. So they're part of our ability to respond to stress, the protein as well as the cholesterol associated with the protein. And they're both defensive and both important, but the LDL is mostly the one that carries cholesterol into the places where it's needed, the brain, the ovaries, testicles, and adrenal glands, but anywhere you're making steroids and that includes the skin...."

honestly i didnt even pay attention to that claim, im not concerned with their theories, im just glad they are saturating an unsaturated fat with high vitamin E regardless of lipid implications. Its hybridized, which im much less inclined to avoid than GMO, hybridization happens all the time in nature depending on many natural factors, many of the foods you eat are highly hybridized. And though you may disagree with him too, Ray frequently sought out and recommended fully hydrogenated coconut oil, which is also "unnatural."

 

[RealNeat]

If you can find high quality olive oil, which is rare, it would have a much higher vitamin E concentration than what nutrition data charts show for regular EVOOs.

do you have an example of olive oil thats at least 5.5mg per tablespoon?

 

[RealNeat]

@A-Tim

"Although the tocopherols present in sunflower oil confer some extra oxidative stability to this oil, its high levels of linoleic acid make regular sunflower oil more unstable at high temperatures or during long periods of storage than other oils like peanut or olive (Martín-Polvillo et al., 2004). The oxidative performance of regular sunflower oil is clearly surpassed by high oleic sunflower, which was developed from a mutant found and reported by Soldatov (1976). This mutant displays a much higher content of oleic acid, which ranges from 70 to 90% at the expense of linoleic acid." ...So as far as high oleic sunflower goes it seems to have been a natural mutation.

And with the previous context we can interpret high stearic sunflower oil to have a very low linoleic %, "The original CAS-3 mutant was obtained in a standard linoleic background, but this trait was transferred to high oleic lines giving high stearic-high oleic combinations, which received the name of CAS-15 (Tab. 1, Garcés et al., 2009). These lines can show up to 20% stearic acid in a very high oleic background. Such fatty acid composition makes the oil from these lines extremely stable, and it has been proved to have high thermal stability (Márquez-Ruiz et al., 1999), which makes it an excellent frying oil, a primary important application for this new fat (Tab. 2). Furthermore, this oil has a great potential as a source of confectionery fats, which are based on stearic and oleic fatty acids."

High stearic sunflower oil: Latest advances and applications | OCL - Oilseeds and fats, Crops and Lipids

OCL, Oilseeds and fats, Crops and Lipids

www.ocl-journal.org

 

[RealNeat]

It seems that every seed oil will be subject to this following process in different ways and methods. I wonder if there are any disadvantages to such a process besides the obvious labor and increased handling of product. I would argue that whether high oleic/ stearic or not this process likely makes high % unsaturated fats less saturated as one step is "winterizing" which removes waxes which in my understanding are protective and saturated. I can see this step lowering vitamin E content but it may actually remove some unfavorable compounds too.

"We are often asked for a more in-depth explanation of the production process of our organic high oleic sunflower oil. To carry the certified USDA Organic seal, firstly the seed must be grown using organic farming methods. These methods prohibit the use of herbicides, fertilizers with pesticides and other growing aids. Once the organic seed is received to the certified organic expelling facility, they are expeller pressed resulting in a crude organic sunflower oil. The crude sunflower oil contains hydratable and non-hydratable gums, free fatty acids, coloring pigments like carotenoids, waxes and other impurities. The oil is then shipped to a refining facility to remove the impurities. Unlike conventional refining, which uses chemicals in the refining process, our certified organic sunflower oil is refined, bleached, deodorized, and winterized with the help of natural processing aides allowed by the USDA and EU Organic regulations. The processing aids used in the refining process are active carbon, diatomaceous earth (aka bleaching earth), and citric acid.
Bleaching
The purpose of bleaching is to remove the levels of pigment such as carotenoids and chlorophyll, as well as traces of metals and oxidation products. The bleaching process consists of the absorption of these substances using bleaching earth under vacuum at temperatures around 100°C. The bleaching earth now containing all these substances is separated from the oil by filtration.
Deodorizing
The purpose of deodorization is to reduce the level of free fatty acids and to remove flavors and odors. Careful execution of this process will also improve the stability and the color of the oil while preserving the nutritional value. Deodorization involves steaming the oil. Citric acid is used in the steaming process resulting in vaporizing the unwanted components and separating them from the desired material.
Winterizing
Winterization is the removal of wax content from the sunflower oil. In this process the oil is heated at first to ensure that all of the waxes are completely melted. The oil is then chilled under controlled cooling rate. This separates the waxes from the oil, which is then separated from the rest of the oil through filtration.
Refined sunflower oil is the most versatile oil that you can use in culinary and cosmetic applications. This oil maintains a light color, palatable taste and neutral aroma. Refined sunflower oil also has a high smoke point. This property makes it suitable for frying, stir frying, grilling, baking and sauteing."

 

[mostlylurking]

honestly i didnt even pay attention to that claim, im not concerned with their theories, im just glad they are saturating an unsaturated fat with high vitamin E regardless of lipid implications. Its hybridized, which im much less inclined to avoid than GMO, hybridization happens all the time in nature depending on many natural factors, many of the foods you eat are highly hybridized. And though you may disagree with him too, Ray frequently sought out and recommended fully hydrogenated coconut oil, which is also "unnatural."

Well, yes, that's true about hydrogenated coconut oil. But at least it doesn't have 4% "other" (mystery) ingredients. The 4% "other" ingredients + the patented status of it is somewhat concerning to me. Do you remember Olestra?

The sales pitch on the pdf is touting the longer term frying usage that this oil has over PUFAs. So they are, in a roundabout way, admitting that maybe the saturated fats are better. It will be interesting to watch them duke it out with the FDA and the regulatory goons in the US since the regulations restricting trans fats also say that saturated fat is dangerous. Apparently, this product is being made available all over the world. Coming to the fast food joints near you!

https://br.advantaseeds.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/Nutrisun-7.pdf

 

[RealNeat]

It seems that every seed oil will be subject to this following process in different ways and methods. I wonder if there are any disadvantages to such a process besides the obvious labor and increased handling of product. I would argue that whether high oleic/ stearic or not this process likely makes high % unsaturated fats less saturated as one step is "winterizing" which removes waxes which in my understanding are protective and saturated. I can see this step lowering vitamin E content but it may actually remove some unfavorable compounds too.

"We are often asked for a more in-depth explanation of the production process of our organic high oleic sunflower oil. To carry the certified USDA Organic seal, firstly the seed must be grown using organic farming methods. These methods prohibit the use of herbicides, fertilizers with pesticides and other growing aids. Once the organic seed is received to the certified organic expelling facility, they are expeller pressed resulting in a crude organic sunflower oil. The crude sunflower oil contains hydratable and non-hydratable gums, free fatty acids, coloring pigments like carotenoids, waxes and other impurities. The oil is then shipped to a refining facility to remove the impurities. Unlike conventional refining, which uses chemicals in the refining process, our certified organic sunflower oil is refined, bleached, deodorized, and winterized with the help of natural processing aides allowed by the USDA and EU Organic regulations. The processing aids used in the refining process are active carbon, diatomaceous earth (aka bleaching earth), and citric acid.
Bleaching
The purpose of bleaching is to remove the levels of pigment such as carotenoids and chlorophyll, as well as traces of metals and oxidation products. The bleaching process consists of the absorption of these substances using bleaching earth under vacuum at temperatures around 100°C. The bleaching earth now containing all these substances is separated from the oil by filtration.
Deodorizing
The purpose of deodorization is to reduce the level of free fatty acids and to remove flavors and odors. Careful execution of this process will also improve the stability and the color of the oil while preserving the nutritional value. Deodorization involves steaming the oil. Citric acid is used in the steaming process resulting in vaporizing the unwanted components and separating them from the desired material.
Winterizing
Winterization is the removal of wax content from the sunflower oil. In this process the oil is heated at first to ensure that all of the waxes are completely melted. The oil is then chilled under controlled cooling rate. This separates the waxes from the oil, which is then separated from the rest of the oil through filtration.
Refined sunflower oil is the most versatile oil that you can use in culinary and cosmetic applications. This oil maintains a light color, palatable taste and neutral aroma. Refined sunflower oil also has a high smoke point. This property makes it suitable for frying, stir frying, grilling, baking and sauteing."

This really well put together podcast episode by Chris Masterjohn really helps answer some of these questions and is relevant to this thread. It seems the greatest disadvantage of an oil like this would be the potential processing contaminants, but that may also be an issue with fully hydrogenated coconut oil that Ray was a fan of.

Beyond the rhetoric that often cited for the harms of PUFA i like the deep dive that Chris does on such topics, offers a lot of clarity for the more obscure questions, and he like Ray agrees that taking vitamin E is not grounds for cheating or freely consuming PUFA,

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cddk7DnBkDQ

 

[Momado965]

High stearic sunflower oil actually contains very little pufas. Similar to butter and high oleic sunflower oil; around 5-6% linoliec acid. I always fry or sautée root vegetables and vegetables with HO sunflower oil. The taste is impeccable and HOSO hasn’t the heavy flavor olive oil has. If you’d like to increase the saturation of said fried food just add a bit of tallow or any saturated fat of your choosing; around 8:2 or 7:30 sunflower oil:saturated fat. This also improves overall taste. Im a huge fan of french fries so I alternate my combination of of oils. Sunflower oil, olive oil; sunflower oil, tallow; sunflower oil, butter; sunflower oil, sheep/camel ghee. It depends. I also combine CO and SO when making asian dishes. Which is quite rare but I do enjoy chow mein and rice noodles every once in a while.