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Strongbad
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halken said:
very very interesting....
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How To Cure Insulin Resistance Ray Peat-way?
- Thread starter Strongbad
- Start date
very very interesting....
CarbAppreciator
Member
A lot of my problems with this diet were solved by switching from potatoes to white bread. I know it's not optimal, but if you can't get enough calories from fruit and milk, starch consumption is more or less required. When I read your list of foods, potatoes stand out to me as a likely source of the abdominal discomfort. Wheat has been widely cultivated for thousands of years, while by comparison, potatoes were only known to select cultures before the Columbian Exchange. I suspect, due to epigenetics, wheat is more suitable than potatoes for the majority of European and Asian populations.
A lot of my problems with this diet were solved by switching from potatoes to white bread. I know it's not optimal, but if you can't get enough calories from fruit and milk, starch consumption is more or less required. When I read your list of foods, potatoes stand out to me as a likely source of the abdominal discomfort. Wheat has been widely cultivated for thousands of years, while by comparison, potatoes were only known to select cultures before the Columbian Exchange. I suspect, due to epigenetics, wheat is more suitable than potatoes for the majority of European and Asian populations.
well...i just introduced wheat again and somewhat my belly is happier with it than potatoes or even rice. in the past i imagine gluten like some kind of radiated poison. That fearmonguering ruined for good my health avoiding bread and sugars. i just had to avoid Oils and everything would be better...i think never is too late to fix anything.
extremecheddar
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Wheat is how most of us are here today since our ancestors relied heavily on it to survive. To stop eating it all of a sudden seems silly. I too found bread easier on digestion and more satisfying than rice and potatoes. Quality does matter however, I stick with sprouted or traditional sourdough.
michael94
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Some people do have very bad problems with wheat mainly because they lack gut bacteria or enzymes to help break it down. It's really not fearmongering to say to avoid large amounts of processed grains because the context most people eat them in provides **** all for nutrition and is usually accompanied by reduced iron and soybean/canola/etc oil. I suspect large amounts of flour products in a person with low stomach acid/poor digestion ( low amylase ) contributes to dysbiosis in the intestines. Populations that had high wheat consumption they preferred to ferment it beforehand. Wheat also has a lot of selenium that potatoes and rice lack IIRC.
Last edited:
mayweatherking
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just casually searching through old posts... wanted to mention my blood sugar skyrocketed drinking milk.. dairy could be a huge, massive no no for insulin resistance
lvysaur
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Starch is bad in my experience, but white wheat and white rice don't give me endotoxin symptoms.
Potentially by eating fermented wheat, you're avoiding gluten. Which is allegedly one of the key problems of wheat. So, from my point of view you're potentially not eating "wheat" people commonly eat and could suffer from, you're eating a less problematic starch. Note that there are other things earlier populations might have done that protected them from gluten, the rest of the diet can either protect or precipitate damage from gluten. Do I think it is safe to eat unfermented wheat if the rest of the diet is a low fat Peat inspired diet? Hum no (but then even the safe starches seem to be problematic when I read the forum).
I like a little starch from buckwheat. No gluten, but who knows if it has other nasties of a different name...
Last edited:
DaveFoster
Member
True. Context. Ray talks a bit about the protective effects of insulin IIRC, but not in excess of course.
Bahaa El wazzan
Member
Biotin?
DaveFoster
Member
Xisca
Member
I also have insuline resistance. Just strange that I never put on weight....
Here is what I had just found, just on Wikipedia....
Seems that high sugar is the same as high fat, if we eat that much as to put on weight!
Also, when we tolerate it, I think that some raw veggies are good for transit. I definitely benefit from it, and especially with bitter herbs. It stimultates acid stomac juices, which in turn will stimulate pancreas and liver the right way. Also, fiber makes digestión and thus avaibility of glucose and more, more balanced and regular in time.
If not, then you have a high pitch of glucose in the blood, and you put on weight. Arrival of glucose has to be regular, and you need fibers for this. But you need to be able to stand those fibers. For this, it is necessary that they do not ferment in the upward part of the digestive track but only in the colon. There, probiotics are needed, and the problema is when we do not have them anymore...
When a food is not ok, this food is not bad in itself, but it indicates that WE have a problem.
That is why we react so differently and do not need the same exact approach.
My experience is bad with yogurt, and I think cow milk in general. And for me gluten is a no.
I also was high fat and better than now for many things. Balance looks better for me, and high sugar is not better than high fat, I would prefer a medium of the 2!
Fruits are ok for me, and they have fiber. Sugar is not ok for me, I feel bad because the passing of glucose to blood is not regular enough.
Starches are ok for me in small amount, and they are not ok if I do not eat veggies with them! We need a slow regular supply of glucose, and not those ups and downs!
Not, what I had just found on wiki... I put in bold what strucked me.
It is well known that insulin resistance commonly coexists with obesity.[11] Dietary fat has long been implicated as a driver of insulin resistance. Studies on animals have observed significant insulin resistance in rats after just 3 weeks on a high-fat diet (59% fat, 20% carb.)[12] Large quantities of saturated, monounsaturated, and polyunsaturated (omega-6) fats all appear to be harmful to rats to some degree, compared to large amounts of starch, but saturated fat appears to be the most effective at producing IR.[13] This is partly caused by direct effects of a high-fat diet on blood markers, but, more significantly, ad libitum high-fat diet has the tendency to result in caloric intake that's far in excess of animals' energy needs, resulting in rapid weight gain. In humans, statistical evidence is more equivocal. Being insensitive to insulin is still positively correlated with fat intake, and negatively correlated with dietary fiber intake,[14] but both these factors are also correlated with excess body weight.
Elevated levels of free fatty acids and triglycerides in the blood stream and tissues have been found in many studies to contribute to diminished insulin sensitivity.[13][23][24][25] Triglyceride levels are driven by a variety of dietary factors. They are correlated with excess body weight.[26] They tend to rise due to overeating and fall during fat loss.[27] At constant energy intake, triglyceride levels are correlated positively with trans fat intake and strongly inversely correlated with omega-3 intake. High-carbohydrate, low-fat diets were found by many studies to result in elevated triglycerides,[28] in part due to higher production of VLDL from fructose and sucrose, and in part because increased carbohydrate intake tends to displace some omega-3 fatty acids from the diet.
Several recent authors suggested that the intake of simple sugars, and particularly fructose, is also a factor that contributes to insulin resistance.[29][30] Fructose is metabolized by the liver into triglycerides, and, as mentioned above, tends to raise their levels in the blood stream. Therefore, it may contribute to insulin resistance through the same mechanisms as the dietary fat. Just like fat, high levels of fructose and/or sucrose induce insulin resistance in rats,[31][32] and, just as with fat, this insulin resistance is ameliorated by fish oil supplementation.[33] One study observed that a low-fat diet high in simple sugars (but not in complex carbohydrates and starches) significantly stimulates fatty acid synthesis, primarily of the saturated fatty acid palmitate, therefore, paradoxically, resulting in the plasma fatty acid pattern that is similar to that produced by a high-saturated-fat diet.[34] It should be pointed out that virtually all evidence of deleterious effects of simple sugars so far is limited to their concentrated formulations and sweetened beverages. In particular, very little is known about effects of simple sugars in whole fruit and vegetables. If anything, epidemiological studies suggest that their high consumption is associated with somewhat lower risk of IR and/or metabolic syndrome.
And anyway, if you put on weight with any diet, there is something wrong that shows a modification is needed.
Ho, and I also loose hair, and I guess this is due to a lack of progesterone, and I think it is possible for men to supplement as well, though in a less quantity than for women.
Last, I have also read that a lack of vitD is also responsable of IR.
Here is what I had just found, just on Wikipedia....
Seems that high sugar is the same as high fat, if we eat that much as to put on weight!
Also, when we tolerate it, I think that some raw veggies are good for transit. I definitely benefit from it, and especially with bitter herbs. It stimultates acid stomac juices, which in turn will stimulate pancreas and liver the right way. Also, fiber makes digestión and thus avaibility of glucose and more, more balanced and regular in time.
If not, then you have a high pitch of glucose in the blood, and you put on weight. Arrival of glucose has to be regular, and you need fibers for this. But you need to be able to stand those fibers. For this, it is necessary that they do not ferment in the upward part of the digestive track but only in the colon. There, probiotics are needed, and the problema is when we do not have them anymore...
When a food is not ok, this food is not bad in itself, but it indicates that WE have a problem.
That is why we react so differently and do not need the same exact approach.
My experience is bad with yogurt, and I think cow milk in general. And for me gluten is a no.
I also was high fat and better than now for many things. Balance looks better for me, and high sugar is not better than high fat, I would prefer a medium of the 2!
Fruits are ok for me, and they have fiber. Sugar is not ok for me, I feel bad because the passing of glucose to blood is not regular enough.
Starches are ok for me in small amount, and they are not ok if I do not eat veggies with them! We need a slow regular supply of glucose, and not those ups and downs!
Not, what I had just found on wiki... I put in bold what strucked me.
It is well known that insulin resistance commonly coexists with obesity.[11] Dietary fat has long been implicated as a driver of insulin resistance. Studies on animals have observed significant insulin resistance in rats after just 3 weeks on a high-fat diet (59% fat, 20% carb.)[12] Large quantities of saturated, monounsaturated, and polyunsaturated (omega-6) fats all appear to be harmful to rats to some degree, compared to large amounts of starch, but saturated fat appears to be the most effective at producing IR.[13] This is partly caused by direct effects of a high-fat diet on blood markers, but, more significantly, ad libitum high-fat diet has the tendency to result in caloric intake that's far in excess of animals' energy needs, resulting in rapid weight gain. In humans, statistical evidence is more equivocal. Being insensitive to insulin is still positively correlated with fat intake, and negatively correlated with dietary fiber intake,[14] but both these factors are also correlated with excess body weight.
Elevated levels of free fatty acids and triglycerides in the blood stream and tissues have been found in many studies to contribute to diminished insulin sensitivity.[13][23][24][25] Triglyceride levels are driven by a variety of dietary factors. They are correlated with excess body weight.[26] They tend to rise due to overeating and fall during fat loss.[27] At constant energy intake, triglyceride levels are correlated positively with trans fat intake and strongly inversely correlated with omega-3 intake. High-carbohydrate, low-fat diets were found by many studies to result in elevated triglycerides,[28] in part due to higher production of VLDL from fructose and sucrose, and in part because increased carbohydrate intake tends to displace some omega-3 fatty acids from the diet.
Several recent authors suggested that the intake of simple sugars, and particularly fructose, is also a factor that contributes to insulin resistance.[29][30] Fructose is metabolized by the liver into triglycerides, and, as mentioned above, tends to raise their levels in the blood stream. Therefore, it may contribute to insulin resistance through the same mechanisms as the dietary fat. Just like fat, high levels of fructose and/or sucrose induce insulin resistance in rats,[31][32] and, just as with fat, this insulin resistance is ameliorated by fish oil supplementation.[33] One study observed that a low-fat diet high in simple sugars (but not in complex carbohydrates and starches) significantly stimulates fatty acid synthesis, primarily of the saturated fatty acid palmitate, therefore, paradoxically, resulting in the plasma fatty acid pattern that is similar to that produced by a high-saturated-fat diet.[34] It should be pointed out that virtually all evidence of deleterious effects of simple sugars so far is limited to their concentrated formulations and sweetened beverages. In particular, very little is known about effects of simple sugars in whole fruit and vegetables. If anything, epidemiological studies suggest that their high consumption is associated with somewhat lower risk of IR and/or metabolic syndrome.
And anyway, if you put on weight with any diet, there is something wrong that shows a modification is needed.
Ho, and I also loose hair, and I guess this is due to a lack of progesterone, and I think it is possible for men to supplement as well, though in a less quantity than for women.
Last, I have also read that a lack of vitD is also responsable of IR.
Xisca
Member
Anyone has any idea?
I can only think about that this place is where the small gut connects to the colon, and that you might have some air or anything putting some pressure.
You can locate this part as being just below the gall bladder, and sometimes the 2 pains can be misinterpreted.
I would check the speed of transit...
Bahaa El wazzan
Member
@Strongbad
I dont know
But when i used to fat free milk or 2 % and 1%
I used to feel bloated
And pain all over the place
So i switched to whole milk
That replenishes all my body with strength and energy
Give it a try for one day
I dont know
But when i used to fat free milk or 2 % and 1%
I used to feel bloated
And pain all over the place
So i switched to whole milk
That replenishes all my body with strength and energy
Give it a try for one day
PeatThemAll
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- Oct 3, 2015
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- 280
Good point. Near the hipbone, more specifically the ICV region (IleoCecal Valve). This is the junction between the small and large intestines. It tends to be quite sensitive to fiber, has more and more problems opening / closing / keeping tight as we age, which can lead to bacteria from the large intestine to creep up to the small intestine. What's the link with carbs? In my case, I'm pretty sure that excess carbs/starch were the tipping point that led to my appendicitis (weakened ICV + enough food for the "bad guys" in the large intestine to switch sides). Could be a warning sign for the OP (Original Poster).
Elchapchapchapo
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- Jul 20, 2016
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Just a tip if you are reading this and are experiencing brain fog, the best supplements that assisted with my brain fog with NAC being #1 the ultimate, the absolute, the almighty . NAC, aspirin (higher doses i.e. 2 tablets 3x a day for 2 weeks), Metheleyne Blue, Thiamine, Gotu Kola.
Keep in mind I don't think NAC or Gotu is reccomended by Ray, but they help quite a bit.
. NAC, aspirin (higher doses i.e. 2 tablets 3x a day for 2 weeks), Metheleyne Blue, Thiamine, Gotu Kola. Keep in mind I don't think NAC or Gotu is reccomended by Ray, but they help quite a bit.
Samurai Drive
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- Jul 11, 2018
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I know this post was a while ago, but at last I think ifound someone with same symptoms. My worst is the about too pass out symptom, been peatin for 5 months.. Have u got an update? Im gonna swerve sugar other than fruit and drink milk and see how i go.._ my body is tellin me back off right now! Thks 4 the post
He moved on from here and I'm pretty sure he had no success with the "Peat diet" or high sucrose/fructose intake, he posted updates on the raypeatforums. org . He improved his health by following more of tyw's ideas from what I remember.
Samurai Drive
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- Jul 11, 2018
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- 79
Ah thks so much, ihave read her posts, may pm her tks
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