HELP! Can't Stop Bleeding!

[June]

I'm truly at my wits end. Can someone please help me figure out what is happening? I'm going to put this mostly in point form for brevity sake.

-Healing from brain dysfunction after benzo withdrawal in 2014. Healing for over 4.5 yrs. Still had residual mental/cognitive issues so naturopath gave glutathione for liver on JUNE 2018 following genetics testing.

-glutathione had a powerful mental effect on me (brain fog lifted instantly which was with me for 4.5 years) but delayed menstrual period for 45 days. Stopped it and period came next day gushing nonstop for 3 months

-went to ER. No help. Went to gyno, gave me high dose birth control that made me go mentally crazy, developed hot flashes, sudden sinus/throat congestion to the MAX, acne, set me back and anxiety felt worse than the benzo withdrawal symptoms.

-acupuncture was enlisted to stop my monthly bleeds. But each month period comes it bleeds heavily nonstop and filling up big long pads within hours. I have to go back to acupuncture each month for at least a week.

-Tested estradiol and progesterone during random point of cycle and ratio of estrogen is extremely high compared to progesterone

-Used 50mg DIM and had horrible reaction where it would activate headaches, hot flashes and anxiety. Why would I want to continue something that is worsening what I want to cure?? Seems it does the opposite for me. So DIM is not an option for me.

-Used 125mg of Calcium d glucarate to undo those effects but causes exhaustion beyond belief. Cannot keep eyes open. I tried half that dose. Less fatigue but not sure how effective it is at such a low dose. Still...fatigue is no fun.

-Period is here today and very heavy but the duration of when I can change a pad has improved where I can go at least an hour or two more. So there is improvement but there's no telling whether my period will actually stop on its own in coming days or it will continue for months at this volume. I am extremely anemic to begin with and feel I don't have much more blood to lose.

I suppose I can continue on with this low dose calcium d glucarate since it is lessening the chemical hot flashes and sinus congestion, which is telling alot since those wouldn't go no matter what I did since the birth control pills. But there is no way that it will cause a dent in this bleeding situation. I think high estrogen plays a huge factor but I worry that something in my brain was stimulated by glutathione months ago. Now I have to undo what Glutathione did to me PLUS what the subsequent birth control pills did to my estrogen and gut. Sigh.

After that birth control stint, I test with slightly elevated prolactin and then a second test showed it normalized so I didn't need the macroprolactin test. My theory is that my bleeding is either caused by the hypothalamlus(which I had issues with from benzo withdrawals) or the pituitary gland. What tests do I need to get to the bottom of this? Why is it that the volume of blood is improving but the duration of bleeds keep going? Actually I'm not even 100% sure that the volume has improved cause come next 2 days the volume of blood can increase since my period gradually showed up with sporadic spotting since Dec 30th, then bumped up to heavy bleeding on Jan 12th and today is Jan 16th and still going. Please can anyone help direct me in the right direction or direct me to someone on this board who is very knowledgeable on female endocrine system. Thank you.

 

[Blossom]

Sorry to hear about your difficulties June.
I'm curious if your naturopath or any other doctor has tested your thyroid or considered if bio-identical progesterone might help?

Tested estradiol and progesterone during random point of cycle and ratio of estrogen is extremely high compared to progeste

 

[June]

Hi Blossom, my thyroid levels appear normal but I have slightly elevated thyroid antibodies. So that is indicative of Hashimotos? Thing is, this issue didn't start till I took that glutathione. I'm almost reluctant to try a hormone to mask something that wasn't an issue to begin with. I have tried bio-identical hormones in the past and they never worked out well for me. At that time when it was given, I was deep in withdrawal and believed my HPA axis needed to heal and balance itself. I did start feeling better after months of taking Allicin, berberine, magnesium to clear SIBO. But at this point, I'm not sure I have months to test that out either. I can implement it but because I won't see results right away, not sure if it will do the cycles any good. Whilst I didn't have any negative effects from berberine, I'm not sure if it would be solution for my liver and estrogen levels at this given time? Read somewhere it may be androgenic.

 

[charlie]

Not Peaty:

For me or any family member, friend, etc who is in a crisis situation I would suggest they go immediately on all fruits, berries and melons. I would also consider a 40 day grape fast if they are really in a pickle.

Tonics I would recommend to a family member in the situation you are in:
Bleeding
Female Reproductive Tincture
Kidney - Bladder 1 Tincture - Cleanser
Lymphatic System 1 Tincture

I would also consider the Heal all tea, and you can also douche with it. You can get the same tea here but it has added nettle leaf to bring the kidneys in a bit more.

 

[Blossom]

Hi Blossom, my thyroid levels appear normal but I have slightly elevated thyroid antibodies. So that is indicative of Hashimotos? Thing is, this issue didn't start till I took that glutathione. I'm almost reluctant to try a hormone to mask something that wasn't an issue to begin with. I have tried bio-identical hormones in the past and they never worked out well for me. At that time when it was given, I was deep in withdrawal and believed my HPA axis needed to heal and balance itself. I did start feeling better after months of taking Allicin, berberine, magnesium to clear SIBO. But at this point, I'm not sure I have months to test that out either. I can implement it but because I won't see results right away, not sure if it will do the cycles any good. Whilst I didn't have any negative effects from berberine, I'm not sure if it would be solution for my liver and estrogen levels at this given time? Read somewhere it may be androgenic.

I understand not wanting to use hormones. I know Dr. Peat has written extensively on the importance of both progesterone and thyroid so that's why I mentioned it. It does sound like you don't have months to leisurely experiment though. I hope you are able to get some helpful suggestions from others on the forum.

 

[Dolomite]

Any women I have known with excessive periods ended up getting a hysterectomy. I don’t have any good advice. I think surgery is a drastic step. Eating lots of sugar can’t hurt. That seems like a lame comment but sugar really helps counter estrogen and cortisol for me.

 

[Blossom]

Any women I have known with excessive periods ended up getting a hysterectomy. I don’t have any good advice. I think surgery is a drastic step. Eating lots of sugar can’t hurt. That seems like a lame comment but sugar really helps counter estrogen and cortisol for me.

I’m glad you chimed in! Let’s call on all the women (or men) we can think of that might have something to add!
@tara, @Jennifer, @Ella @alywest
@Sheila @Rosie @Regina @HDD @moss @Kehaar @Pompadour @Lilly @SQu @Milena @somuch4food @Peatful @Peata

 

[ecstatichamster]

I would be using thyroid and progesterone. Lots of progesterone.

 

[Dolomite]

“Women with a chronic menstrual problem resulting from progesterone deficiency often continue to bleed each month even when they are pregnant, and these women tend to develop toxemia, and to have a high incidence of pregnancy complications, and to deliver premature, poorly developed babies.“ Ray Peat article , Bleeding, clotting, cancer.

So Blossum and estatichamster are correct that progesterone and thyroid should help. I don’t take either so as not to upset the apple cart but your cart is already upset.
Lots of fruit should be good, too, like Charlie suggests.

 

[InChristAlone]

Have you ruled out any serious problems with your reproductive organs? My sister had really heavy periods for years and turns out after getting pregnant they found a large fibroid.

I know someone who used vitamin E and aspirin for heavy bleeding. I'd be nervous about using aspirin for bleeding but it is anti-estrogen. I am not sure I'd take the advice to go all fruit after such serious bleeding as that would contain very little iron. I'd more so recommend red meat. And plenty of vitamin C to go with it.

 

[June]

Thanks everyone for chiming in!! This has been a very lonely and frightening process. I will take each individual advice here and either implement it or do more research into it. I hope the advice keeps coming as I'm all eyes and ears for any suggestions. I will incorporate more fruits but yes would need to keep my proteins as I am losing too much too fast. Sugar can help me in that it causes a sense of calm and euphoria especially since I crave it during my menses. Last time I used a natural progesterone I woke up covered in sweat experiencing the biggest panic attack. It didn't seem to agree with me.

My ultrasounds were clear before this whole incident started in June 2018 but after the glutathione and heavy bleeding for a month afterwards, a big uterine polyp appeared. Indicating that too much estrogen was coursing through my blood at that time. Acupuncture was able to cause it to expel itself out. Yeah I know..gnarly and I was shocked cause it came with painful contractions.

I am curious about Vitamin E. Are there any side effects to taking it just like how too much Vitamin A can be toxic? Currently the Calcium D glucarate seems to be helping the estrogen dominance symptoms. I just wish it didn't cause the major exhaustion and slight anxiety. This is at only 1/8 of a pill. I don't know if I'm sensitive because of the overload of estrogen. Thanks for contributing and reading.

PS. Any suggestions as to what blood tests I should get immediately. Should I be testing the SHBG, estradiol, aromatase, thyroid, dhea, testosterone, prolactin..anything else?

 

[Hugh Johnson]

-acupuncture was enlisted to stop my monthly bleeds. But each month period comes it bleeds heavily nonstop and filling up big long pads within hours. I have to go back to acupuncture each month for at least a week.

Diet and supplements aside, EFT could work. It's basically like self acupuncture.

 

[Ella]

Do you ovulate? Important to know.
In a normal cycle, the release of an egg from the ovaries stimulates the body's production of progesterone, the female hormone most responsible for keeping periods regular. When no egg is released, insufficient progesterone can cause heavy menstrual bleeding.

Have you checked Vitamin D levels? Vit. D crucial for maintaining healthy cycle and protecting your fertility. Remember, you start life in utero with all the eggs you will ever have and you lose thousands of them from the time you become fertile with each cycle. Many women are shocked to find they run out of eggs at a young age. Anti-Mullerian hormone is tested to determine how many eggs a female has left. Vitamin D regulates this hormone. It is becoming clear that Vitamin D is extremely important in safeguarding our fertility.

The following study did not specifically look at heavy bleeding but does highlight how important Vitamin D is in maintaining a healthy cycle. Are you overweight? Note how BMI increases, Vitamin D levels are decreasing.

Lower plasma 25-hydroxyvitamin D is associated with irregular menstrual cycles in a cross-sectional study

What is happening with your diet? Are you eating thyroid supporting foods and adhering to a lifestyle which reduces stress. Cortisol, estrogen and inflammation under control?? Sleep hygiene?? Exposing eyes to morning sun to reduce cortisol?? Spending minimum 15 minutes in the sun between 11am - 2pm for UV-B??

Read Katarina Dalton's work on progesterone. Eating every 3 - 4 hours, plenty of carbohydrates - rice & potatoes.

Glutathione deficiency is revealing. Instead of supplementing with glutathione, which btw is not Peat friendly, I would suggest increasing foods high in riboflavin. An early indicator of B2 deficiency is a reduction in glutathione. If you are deficient in B2, it brings into question the quality of your diet. Surprisingly, in wealthy countries like USA & UK, nutritional surveys have revealed riboflavin deficiency in nearly 50% of the elderly and shock/horror, 95% of adolescent girls!!!

This means as a teenage female, your health will be in a worse state than your grandmother.

The low glutathione level should have alerted your naturopath.

B2 is important for the proper utilisation and trafficking of iron, thus B2 deficiency is strongly evidenced by poor iron handling and hematologic status @tankasnowgod.

Heavy bleeding is associated with anemia. It becomes a vicious cycle.

Has your dr carried out iron studies including ferritin? Do you have healthy levels of hemoglobin?

Anemia is corrected by riboflavin and copper and not by supplementing iron. Flavin-dependant enzymes which mobilise iron from ferritin are sensitive to riboflavin depletion.

Riboflavin is important for protein folding and can rescue misfolded proteins. A misfolded protein is a non-functional protein. If you have a sub-clinical riboflavin deficiency you can be sure many other proteins and metabolic process will suffer and be compromised.

Riboflavin is required to activate many other molecules and processes including other B-vitamins such as thiamine. Think oxidative phosphorylation - FAD & FMN; both reduced under riboflavin deficiency. Also required for fatty acid beta-oxidation in which the medium chain acyl CoA dehydrogenase which catalyses the first step of mitochondrial fatty acid beta oxidation; reduced by riboflavin deficiency.

In respect to Vitamin again. It is required to convert inactive Vitamin D to active D. Dr Peat refers to Vitamin D as the progesterone receptor, so even if we supplement progesterone, active vitamin D is the limiting factor and the limiting factor for active vitamin D is riboflavin.

Riboflavin is required for estrogen detox pathways in liver.

Good sources of riboflavin are not high in many diets. Usually, diets low in dairy and meat diets will be low in riboflavin, unless you are eating b-fortified foods such as bread and boxed cereals. Cheese is a good source. The vilification of dairy and popularity of fad diets, many foods rich or fortified in riboflavin are not on the menu for many people. Liver is an incredible rich source as are hearts. I don't know many females who prize these foods. In fact, from my years of promoting the inclusion of these foods there appears to be a strong repulsion by those individuals that need riboflavin the most. I can understand that the taste of liver may be a strong for some but I have found the same when trying to supplement riboflavin. I have put this down to estrogen dominance. The flushing out of tissue bound estrogen is not a pleasant experience, however we can't neglect the role of gut bacteria. Using anti-microbial fibres should be included to aid the flushing out of estrogen; carrot salad, mushrooms, bamboo shoots and bran.

Riboflavin is rapidly lost via urine due to infection, exercise, restrictive eating and stress.

I agree with @Janelle525, be careful increasing sugar and fruit if you are in a depleted state. An attempt to increase metabolism will deplete you further, so the first step is a robust diet which is abundant in B2. Beef, lamb, liver, oysters, cheese, milk, wheat bran, mushrooms, nutritional yeast are all excellent sources and abundant in minerals which aid with the excretion of estrogen and support progesterone.

If you are overweight, then pufa elimination will be a rollercoaster ride and thyroid needs to be supported if estrogen and cortisol are high. Thyroid supplementation will help remove cortisol and sugar and fruit should not be too much of an issue if you titrate carefully.

Your naturopath can order an organic acid test to check riboflavin and other nutritional markers + vitamin C + more.

 

[tankasnowgod]

Glutathione deficiency is revealing. Instead of supplementing with glutathione, which btw is not Peat friendly, I would suggest increasing foods high in riboflavin. An early indicator of B2 deficiency is a reduction in glutathione. If you are deficient in B2, it brings into question the quality of your diet. Surprisingly, in wealthy countries like USA & UK, nutritional surveys have revealed riboflavin deficiency in nearly 50% of the elderly and shock/horror, 95% of adolescent girls!!!

This means as a teenage female, your health will be in a worse state than your grandmother.

The low glutathione level should have alerted your naturopath.

B2 is important for the proper utilisation and trafficking of iron, thus B2 deficiency is strongly evidenced by poor iron handling and hematologic status @tankasnowgod.

Heavy bleeding is associated with anemia. It becomes a vicious cycle.

Has your dr carried out iron studies including ferritin? Do you have healthy levels of hemoglobin?

Anemia is corrected by riboflavin and copper and not by supplementing iron. Flavin-dependant enzymes which mobilise iron from ferritin are sensitive to riboflavin depletion.

Adding on to what Ella said, many of the B vitamins are involved in making Hemoglobin. B6, B12 and Foltate are all very important. Deficiency of B12 even has an anemia named for it (pernicious anemia). If you have lost a lot of blood or suspect you are starting to get anemic, a B complex can be very helpful. Desiccated Liver may be an even better choice.

I saw the effects that B vitamins can have on Hemoglobin firsthand. I used to have high body iron stores, and did monthly blood donations to lower them. My ferritin was steadily declining, but by the fifth month, so was my Hemoglobin. It started off at 14.8 and was getting to 13.3. Around that time, I started using a B complex, and/or an Iron Free multivitamin (I used Two Per Day, by Life Extension). At the next month's donation, Hemoglobin was back up to 14.7, and ferritin continued to drop.

 

[Ella]

Fix the diet and lifestyle before looking to supplements. Naturopaths have a vested interest in selling supplements like drs have a vested interest in fixing every ailment with a drug. The body is not stupid - fertility is all about the quality of the foods it receives. If you want superior fertility then give your body superior foods, not supplements mascarading as food.

@tankasnowgod my concerns over about b-vitamin supps is that the doses are too high. For some people high levels will cause cancer. It depends on

If Vitamin D is low, then 2000 units/day should be fine. Recheck your levels every 6 weeks. I do not recommend taking higher levels unless under the guidance of your dr. and calcium serum levels are monitored. I have seen serum calcium levels rise on as little as 4000 units which should not have been a problem in a healthy individual. Unfortunately, the individual was deficient in riboflavin and lost significantly due to a severe infection.

 

[Sheila]

Dear Ella,

Your initial response was a superb post. Thanks also, you save me a job, and did it way better! I have found quite a few females who love liver (I live in the country) but wonder whether 'the anaemic' - who should crave it - don't, because of its high iron content. In a depleted B2 scenario that would make it harder to handle perhaps even when liver contains some B2, but maybe not enough. Might be simplistic reasoning, or the liver revulsion a societal/familial programming issue - I well remember 'shoe leather liver' and being kept at the table until I (with the help of the cat under the table) had finished it!

I have seen Braggs yeast useful in these scenarios, essentially as a low dose B vitamin supplement, either as an overnight water extraction or straight teaspoon. But nothing works as well as fixing the diet and listening to one's innate wisdom, as you pointed out.

Best regards to your for 2019,
Sheila

 

[Ella]

Sorry my last comments were sent prematurely. I edited - now all is lost. Damn those gremlins. Hopefully, I will be able to reconstruct when a bunch of time becomes available, either here or somewhere else @LeeLemonoil. Don't hold your breath as time is not abundant for me. It is important to understand why riboflavin is important especially when we see low glutathione and caution on high dose of b-vitamins. Dr Peat has already addressed this in KMUD episode. I was wanting to add more details which perhaps are not apparent to others. Hopefully, others have addressed them in other posts.

@tankasnowgod, I am glad you were able to resolve your iron problem and yes blood draws will leave you anemic. Remember, I had the gentleman with the high ferritin. His dr 's recommendation of blood draws left him in a worse state. I focused on those factors which facilitated proper iron utilisation and transportation. He was dealing with poisoning from supplemental B6 and zinc from previous alt MDs. He was convinced he would suicide if I took these away from him. No-one previously, had considered the role riboflavin played except me and believe me the daily level to turn everything around was nowhere near the maximal absorbable in a single dose of 27 mg which is 16 times the RDA. I was extremely conservative staying close to the RDA. Positive effects were rapid and his GP was left stumped and to this day can't work it out. This gentleman went through 15 drs in 5 years and spent thousands of dollars and every one of these alt drs focused on mercury toxicity, chelation, almalgum removal, high b6, methionine, magnesium and zinc supplementation, celiac and MHFTR protocols and each year he got sicker and sicker.

@June's situation is another example of a negligent practitioner who should have known better than the lay person. It is obvious they are not doing their own due diligence in keeping up with the research and relying on so-called gurus to educate them in order to support the pushing of supplements.

Why do you even need calcium d-glucarate where you can get it from oranges, fruit and vegetables. Carrot salad, mushrooms, bamboo shoots, regular bowel movements. Vegetarians excrete higher levels of glucaric acid than omnivores. I guess there is no financial incentive in increasing your fruit intake otherwise these naturopaths would have to become greengrocers to make living. I don't like being mean but it just does my head in.

My orchard is calling me. Perhaps, I'll

 

[Amazigh]

Progesterone will definitely help. It helped me with very heavy periods. The effect you experienced is also something I'm familiar with. You can do a search for more details, or maybe someone else here might be able to clarify--at first, the progesterone will essentially kick estrogen off the receptors so you might initially experience the effects of having the estrogen floating around. Taking a higher dose of progesterone will mitigate those effects. I ended up increasing my dose from 30 mg to upwards of around 200 for a while until I started taking 500 mg of pregnenolone, which is anti-estrogenic.

I went from having long, heavy periods that were closer together (fibroids), to a more normal monthly flow. It used to be so bad that I needed to use two ultra tampons at a time and change them every 1.5 hours. And I had to keep a change of clothes at my job at all times. My clothes, bed, and bathroom floor often looked like a murder scene.

I also resorted to taking 800mg of Advil here and there (eg. to attend a meeting etc.) which I Idon't normally take. I did so because it's been shown to lessen the flow. It actually did work to some degree, but your issue sounds like it's beyond something like that, and I wouldn't recommend regular use of ibuprofen.

I can relate to how much it sucks and how awful you feel. I ended up with really bad anemia and I could barely make it up a flight of stairs.

Hope this helps.

 

[Lilac]

The effect you experienced is also something I'm familiar with. You can do a search for more details, or maybe someone else here might be able to clarify--at first, the progesterone will essentially kick estrogen off the receptors so you might initially experience the effects of having the estrogen floating around. Taking a higher dose of progesterone will mitigate those effects.

Reading through this thread, I had the same thought. Perhaps you didn't take a big enough dose of progesterone to start.

Dr. Peat says progesterone has never been found to be toxic at any level, so I think you can experiment with the dose without worrying about it. Just keep in mind it's temporary anesthetic effect.

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

Not sure if this has been suggested, but maybe vitamin k can help? Vitamin k1 is probably the most effective for this, so beet greens and spinach( both cooked) can prove useful.