Mitolife Radio - Arthritis, Pregnancy And Acne With Morley Robbins

[Inaut]

Great information in this interview. I really like Morley's research

quick take aways not in any order

1. vitamin d supplementation is a bad due to its effect of storing iron in the liver (i think thats what Morley man said) (shout outs to @Amazoniac for poison D)
2. iron excess causes hairloss in men and women
3.women having a hard time getting pregnant are magnesium deficient
4.eat beef liver. retinol/copper is extremely important :)
5. no such thing as copper overload. it's really an iron issue
6. magnesium and copper are the main supplements we should focus on.
7. magnesium supplementation should be around 5mg/lb body weight
8. donate blood frequently for alzheimers/neurological issues. reduce iron overload and take mag/copper
9. milk of magnesia is a good topical for acne

Mitolife Radio: Arthritis, Pregnancy and Acne with Morley Robbins

that's it for now i guess

 

[lampofred]

RP said that cortisol increases iron storage in liver. Vitamin D increases glucocorticoid sensitivity. So maybe that's why it's increasing iron storage in liver.

Agree with the rest of the points that issues that seem like copper overload are actually due to iron excess. Probably associated with too much lactic acid and insufficient CO2 as well. Also agree that excess iron is a major cause of hair loss.

Beef liver always gives me bad effects whenever I try it though...

 

[Dave Clark]

RP said that cortisol increases iron storage in liver. Vitamin D increases glucocorticoid sensitivity. So maybe that's why it's increasing iron storage in liver.

Agree with the rest of the points that issues that seem like copper overload are actually due to iron excess. Probably associated with too much lactic acid and insufficient CO2 as well. Also agree that excess iron is a major cause of hair loss.

Beef liver always gives me bad effects whenever I try it though...

I had started beef liver a while ago, but could not ignore that I didn't quite feel right on it. I wanted the copper, retinol, etc. but I am just wondering if the high iron was doing it, not sure. Anyway, I stopped liver, and sought out other sources of retinol and copper, sources that are not high in iron. And, if I wanted to join the anti- A crew, I would only need a source for copper, which is easy to do.

 

[Tristan Loscha]

POISON D is physiologic.he is a scam artist,like lots and lots of other phony "healthartists" in the usa.
we should try to hit all macros and micros though,magnesium is important,but that is for dummies.
vitamin d is physiologic,whatever happens to iron under vitamin d is an ordered process.

 

[redsun]

8. donate blood frequently for alzheimers/neurological issues. reduce iron overload and take mag/copper

So, for the older people who are often the most affected by neurological and issues and memory problems, she wants them to drain themselves of life(blood) more, as if the elderly don't already have less vitality. That's ridiculously wrong and defies common sense. My mother had very problematic cognitive malfunction similar to alzheimers. I get her to eat more eggs and have been steering her to eat more animal foods for more amino acids(for neurotransmitters), cholesterol, saturated fat, choline, and bioavailable nutrients and just like that her cognition and memory is improving though she is not consistent and would see long-lasting healing with more consistency, which is the case with most people.

People having memory problems and feel like their brain is just literally failing them is indicative of an acetylcholine problem and possibly other neurotransmitters. Need lots of choline/cholesterol/protein and would likely benefit from some B1(which helps make acetylcholine), though a balanced B complex would do better as to not create B imbalances which is not a good idea for people already in bad health.

5. no such thing as copper overload. it's really an iron issue

More copper makes sense to properly use iron along with its other necessary cofactors. What doesnt make sense is to give copper and drain iron(via giving blood) unless ferritin was incredibly high. A balanced nutritionally dense eating plan works better, though it is boring to most and takes a lot more responsibility and in the long run will help utilize iron and utilize all minerals correctly so they don't cause problems. No one wants to eat a diet naturally high in absorbable B2, B6, B12, folate, ascorbate, copper, zinc to properly use their iron. I'm sure I am missing a nutrient, maybe B5 in there. Draining your blood out of your body makes more sense then adding life-giving food to it.

 

[lampofred]

So, for the older people who are often the most affected by neurological and issues and memory problems, she wants them to drain themselves of life(blood) more, as if the elderly don't already have less vitality. That's ridiculously wrong and defies common sense. My mother had very problematic cognitive malfunction similar to alzheimers. I get her to eat more eggs and have been steering her to eat more animal foods for more amino acids(for neurotransmitters), cholesterol, saturated fat, choline, and bioavailable nutrients and just like that her cognition and memory is improving though she is not consistent and would see long-lasting healing with more consistency, which is the case with most people.

People having memory problems and feel like their brain is just literally failing them is indicative of an acetylcholine problem and possibly other neurotransmitters. Need lots of choline/cholesterol/protein and would likely benefit from some B1(which helps make acetylcholine), though a balanced B complex would do better as to not create B imbalances which is not a good idea for people already in bad health.


More copper makes sense to properly use iron along with its other necessary cofactors. What doesnt make sense is to give copper and drain iron(via giving blood) unless ferritin was incredibly high. A balanced nutritionally dense eating plan works better, though it is boring to most and takes a lot more responsibility and in the long run will help utilize iron and utilize all minerals correctly so they don't cause problems. No one wants to eat a diet naturally high in absorbable B2, B6, B12, folate, ascorbate, copper, zinc to properly use their iron. I'm sure I am missing a nutrient, maybe B5 in there. Draining your blood out of your body makes more sense then adding life-giving food to it.

RP has an article about how people who donate blood are healthier than people who don't. I'm sure TCM is right that blood does have "life essence" but TCM wasn't developed at a time when everything was fortified with literal metal shavings, and the benefits of reducing excess iron probably outweigh the loss in life force.

 

[_lppaiva]

iron excess causes hairloss in men and women

Can attest this. I was an avid black bean/meat consumer my whole childhood/teenage years due to cultural reason. I am 18 and balding a lot. Plus in my late teen's I started eating lentils on the whole vegan vibes

My grandpa has a full set of hair. He drinks coffee after every lunch, and only eats the liquid from cooking beans (feijoada where I live) which I think is lower in iron and higher in phytates. Would explain a lot.

I am not sure if it has any correlation, just theorizing here

 

[_lppaiva]

hat doesnt make sense is to give copper and drain iron(via giving blood) unless ferritin was incredibly high

Ferritin isn't a good marker for iron status, if it's high then you are really screwed, but even low ferritin occurs in iron overload. I think copper will help draw iron from the tissues to be utilized, while donating blood will get rid of the excess. Maybe up to 4 times a year if you're older and have high ferritin (then it's really bad) and up to two if your a "healthy adult".

 

[_lppaiva]

magnesium supplementation should be around 5mg/lb body weight

FINALLY SOME NUMBERS TO WORK WITH. I am close to 800-1000mg daily, with a lot coming from food (banana, potatoes, coconut water) so I think I am fine.

 

[Inaut]

Can attest this. I was an avid black bean/meat consumer my whole childhood/teenage years due to cultural reason. I am 18 and balding a lot. Plus in my late teen's I started eating lentils on the whole vegan vibes

My grandpa has a full set of hair. He drinks coffee after every lunch, and only eats the liquid from cooking beans (feijoada where I live) which I think is lower in iron and higher in phytates. Would explain a lot.

I am not sure if it has any correlation, just theorizing here

Maybe this is another factor as to why women tend to maintain their hair much longer than men (menstruation and the shedding of blood/excess iron)?

 

[redsun]

RP has an article about how people who donate blood are healthier than people who don't. I'm sure TCM is right that blood does have "life essence" but TCM wasn't developed at a time when everything was fortified with literal metal shavings, and the benefits of reducing excess iron probably outweigh the loss in life force.

The major threat of iron shavings isn't that it gets absorbed, in fact the absorption of it is very low especially because eating iron shavings is like eating rock as is the case everytime you supplement most minerals especially the cheap versions. It disturbs the gut microbiome by providing lots of iron for the bacteria to grow and cause problems. You know this of course, I am saying that the disturbance of the gut is actually the major issue, not the absorption.

That's why the traditional dose for treating iron deficiency is 325mg of ferrous sulfate orally three times a day. You would never get that close eating fortified food. Disclaimer that I am not justifying the treatment, as it will cause significant gut issues at least temporarily while you take it and there are better ways to treat it.

 

[lampofred]

The major threat of iron shavings isn't that it gets absorbed, in fact the absorption of it is very low especially because eating iron shavings is like eating rock as is the case everytime you supplement most minerals especially the cheap versions. It disturbs the gut microbiome by providing lots of iron for the bacteria to grow and cause problems. You know this of course, I am saying that the disturbance of the gut is actually the major issue, not the absorption.

That's why the traditional dose for treating iron deficiency is 325mg of ferrous sulfate orally three times a day. You would never get that close eating fortified food. Disclaimer that I am not justifying the treatment, as it will cause significant gut issues at least temporarily while you take it and there are better ways to treat it.

I thought it did get absorbed. RP said estrogen/hypoxia increases iron absorption to 9x normal, so a high estrogen person can absorb even small amounts, and he said real iron deficiency anemia is very rare and that iron supplements increase blood cells by causing injury (blood cells increase in response to injury by arsenic as well).

The real solution to anemia is probably increasing gelatin intake and reducing cortisol because gelatin increases iron uptake (and also lowers cortisol), and cortisol takes iron out of blood and puts it in the liver/brain.

 

[mbachiu]

I thought it did get absorbed. RP said estrogen/hypoxia increases iron absorption to 9x normal, so a high estrogen person can absorb even small amounts, and he said real iron deficiency anemia is very rare and that iron supplements increase blood cells by causing injury (blood cells increase in response to injury by arsenic as well).

The real solution to anemia is probably increasing gelatin intake and reducing cortisol because gelatin increases iron uptake (and also lowers cortisol), and cortisol takes iron out of blood and puts it in the liver/brain.

This is my understanding as well

 

[ExCarniv]

Can attest this. I was an avid black bean/meat consumer my whole childhood/teenage years due to cultural reason. I am 18 and balding a lot. Plus in my late teen's I started eating lentils on the whole vegan vibes

My grandpa has a full set of hair. He drinks coffee after every lunch, and only eats the liquid from cooking beans (feijoada where I live) which I think is lower in iron and higher in phytates. Would explain a lot.

I am not sure if it has any correlation, just theorizing here

I lost mine on a vegan diet, with a heavy intake of bread (fortified iron) soy (strogen), seed oils (pufa) and lentils. Smh

 

[CLASH]

In peats most recent interview with patrick timpone on one radio network (oct. 15th), he discussed heme iron, in which he implies that it is actually a safer form of iron than non-heme and supplements because the iron atom is surrounded by peptides and other components in the heme molecule that inhibit it from reacting with PUFA and other agents in the tissues and blood. He also implies, from my understanding that because of the form its in it is also easier to put into red blood cells use and other uses.

As @redsun has pointed out the main issues with iron are supplemental, both in the form of a supplement and as added to food. Besides thier promotion of bacterial growth I think the free iron and the fact that some of it is in the form of shavings, may actually be damaging to the intestine directly through oxidation and perhaps mechanical injury. The other forms of iron that seem to be an issue as implied by peat are non-heme sources which often come from grains, beans, nuts, some vegetables and seeds. With these non-heme sources the iron, along with other minerals is often bound up in mineral inhibitors and binders like phytic acid or oxalic acid. Much of the non-heme iron besides being bound up is also relatively non-absorbable unless vit C is taken concurrently to oxidize this iron into a more absorbable form.

Overall I dont think iron from meat and animal sources is so dangerous. At the same time I dont think having a huge tissue store of iron is a good idea either; its a balance. I think the best way to balance is to eat meat and seafood (great source of copper and other minerals, especially shellfish; these can balance out the iron). Avoid the supplemental, fortified and non-heme sources, and donate blood periodically while using some aspirin, and perhaps drinking some pomegranate juice, and some cranberry juice (both have iron chelation properties). Also, the partner in crime with iron is PUFA so limiting PUFA is the second side of this coin. So using some vit E, again using some aspirin, focusing on saturated fats and avoiding the PUFA would go a long way overall.

Something else to consider is that inflammation or infection effects the bodies use of iron such that excess of either induces the sequestration of iron in ferritin to product the bodies tissue. This keeping inflammation low and getting rid of/ avoiding infection should help to optimize the bodies handling of iron.

 

[ExCarniv]

In peats most recent interview with patrick timpone on one radio network (oct. 15th), he discussed heme iron, in which he implies that it is actually a safer form of iron than non-heme and supplements because the iron atom is surrounded by peptides and other components in the heme molecule that inhibit it from reacting with PUFA and other agents in the tissues and blood. He also implies, from my understanding that because of the form its in it is also easier to put into red blood cells use and other uses.

As @redsun has pointed out the main issues with iron are supplemental, both in the form of a supplement and as added to food. Besides thier promotion of bacterial growth I think the free iron and the fact that some of it is in the form of shavings, may actually be damaging to the intestine directly through oxidation and perhaps mechanical injury. The other forms of iron that seem to be an issue as implied by peat are non-heme sources which often come from grains, beans, nuts, some vegetables and seeds. With these non-heme sources the iron, along with other minerals is often bound up in mineral inhibitors and binders like phytic acid or oxalic acid. Much of the non-heme iron besides being bound up is also relatively non-absorbable unless vit C is taken concurrently to oxidize this iron into a more absorbable form.

Overall I dont think iron from meat and animal sources is so dangerous. At the same time I dont think having a huge tissue store of iron is a good idea either; its a balance. I think the best way to balance is to eat meat and seafood (great source of copper and other minerals, especially shellfish; these can balance out the iron). Avoid the supplemental, fortified and non-heme sources, and donate blood periodically while using some aspirin, and perhaps drinking some pomegranate juice, and some cranberry juice (both have iron chelation properties). Also, the partner in crime with iron is PUFA so limiting PUFA is the second side of this coin. So using some vit E, again using some aspirin, focusing on saturated fats and avoiding the PUFA would go a long way overall.

Something else to consider is that inflammation or infection effects the bodies use of iron such that excess of either induces the sequestration of iron in ferritin to product the bodies tissue. This keeping inflammation low and getting rid of/ avoiding infection should help to optimize the bodies handling of iron.

I agree, non hene iron from fortified foods and pufas are major culprits of several diseases and metabolic malfunction.

All my uncles and dad got (stomach, pancreas and colon) cancers and were several bread (fortified iron) and pufa (fried foods) eaters.

Since I dropped both I lost 25kg and all my health markets improved.

 

[CLASH]

I agree, non hene iron from fortified foods and pufas are major culprits of several diseases and metabolic malfunction.

All my uncles and dad got (stomach, pancreas and colon) cancers and were several bread (fortified iron) and pufa (fried foods) eaters.

Since I dropped both I lost 25kg and all my health markets improved.

Besides containing iron shavings, many of the breads contain folic acid which can be an issue for some people in regards to conversion to active folate, many of the flours are or where brominated which interferes with iodine metabolism, the grains themselves, particularly wheat, have opiate peptides that raise prolactin, lower dopamine, induce constipation, effect brain function and lower the beneficial steroid hormones, the grains can contain components like phytic acid that can bind up minerals and make the foods essentially nutrient less on a net-net basis, many of the breads contain fillers, binders, emulsifiers and gums that can further wreck the intestine, and as you mentioned already these breads are also high in PUFA. This is not to mention the issue of starch persorption from baked starches, the issue of bacterial/ fungal overgrowth from indigestible amylose starches, high amounts of glutamine and other components of the grains storage protein structure, the lack of a complete and digestible protein, the high amounts of phosphate, the gmo/ industrial fertilizer/ monoculture production of these crops and the subsequent destruction of ecosystems, soil and land, and the fact that the human body isnt geared towards optimal digestion of grains like it is for fruit, tubers, meat, and dairy in certain populations.

Overall these processed breads and other packaged foods are a phyiologic nightmare, with very little benefit besides the vast profits they serve the pharma, agribusiness, genetic sciences and industrial chemical corporations.

 

[_lppaiva]

In peats most recent interview with patrick timpone on one radio network (oct. 15th), he discussed heme iron, in which he implies that it is actually a safer form of iron than non-heme and supplements because the iron atom is surrounded by peptides and other components in the heme molecule that inhibit it from reacting with PUFA and other agents in the tissues and blood. He also implies, from my understanding that because of the form its in it is also easier to put into red blood cells use and other uses.

As @redsun has pointed out the main issues with iron are supplemental, both in the form of a supplement and as added to food. Besides thier promotion of bacterial growth I think the free iron and the fact that some of it is in the form of shavings, may actually be damaging to the intestine directly through oxidation and perhaps mechanical injury. The other forms of iron that seem to be an issue as implied by peat are non-heme sources which often come from grains, beans, nuts, some vegetables and seeds. With these non-heme sources the iron, along with other minerals is often bound up in mineral inhibitors and binders like phytic acid or oxalic acid. Much of the non-heme iron besides being bound up is also relatively non-absorbable unless vit C is taken concurrently to oxidize this iron into a more absorbable form.

Overall I dont think iron from meat and animal sources is so dangerous. At the same time I dont think having a huge tissue store of iron is a good idea either; its a balance. I think the best way to balance is to eat meat and seafood (great source of copper and other minerals, especially shellfish; these can balance out the iron). Avoid the supplemental, fortified and non-heme sources, and donate blood periodically while using some aspirin, and perhaps drinking some pomegranate juice, and some cranberry juice (both have iron chelation properties). Also, the partner in crime with iron is PUFA so limiting PUFA is the second side of this coin. So using some vit E, again using some aspirin, focusing on saturated fats and avoiding the PUFA would go a long way overall.

Something else to consider is that inflammation or infection effects the bodies use of iron such that excess of either induces the sequestration of iron in ferritin to product the bodies tissue. This keeping inflammation low and getting rid of/ avoiding infection should help to optimize the bodies handling of iron.

Dude, I honestly have a hard time keeping up with all of Peat's work.do you know anywhere where I kinda find which interviews he's done? I don't even need the link, but mostly which podcasts he's been in

 

[_lppaiva]

I wanted the copper, retinol, etc. but I am just wondering if the high iron was doing it, not sure

If you can get your hands on some good bee pollen it might be good source. Plus the B vitamins.

 

[CLASH]

@_lppaiva
1) one radio network (you'll have to do a little searching on the site to find Dr. Peat's interviews, the interviews are good)
2) jodelle fit (she has some good interviews because she lets peat talk)
3) ask your herb doctor (this is a podcast series you can find on itunes podcasts, its not so great though because the interviewer talk mostly and rambles on about nothing)
4) danny roddy has some interviews
5) ray peat clips on youtube
6) random videos on youtube
7) HOME | Functional Performance Systems, Simi Valley, CA