Geneticist Links Chronic Fatigue To Mitochondria Dysfunction

[Parsifal]

My chronic fatigue sorted itself out from eating more calories, lowering estrogen with vitamin E, and cypro. Inflammation and morning nausea can be helped by moderate dosages of aspirin.

How much vitamin E are you talking about?

 

[Texon]

@whodathunkit @tara...bump... This thread has been quiet for awhile so hopefully this won't get missed. Since b12 is mentioned here, I want to pass this on, and based on the content, I hope this gets a lot of distribution. I personally just started a regimen of self-injected hydroxocobalamine because I have to be very careful with methyl vitamins, donors, etc., if I don't want to be really miserable. Thus, injecting mB12 would be counterproductive for me. The whole thing mainly seems to center around bad combos of COMT and MTRR snps. Reasons for starting included some very troubling neurological symptoms that made me think the next 20 years (if I make it that long) would not be any fun at all. So here's something that I hope can help a lot of folks. It was a real eye opener for me.

B12 Deficiency Support Group | Vitamin B12 deficiency Charity Support Group

 

[Rad]

@whodathunkit @tara...bump... This thread has been quiet for awhile so hopefully this won't get missed. Since b12 is mentioned here, I want to pass this on, and based on the content, I hope this gets a lot of distribution. I personally just started a regimen of self-injected hydroxocobalamine because I have to be very careful with methyl vitamins, donors, etc., if I don't want to be really miserable. Thus, injecting mB12 would be counterproductive for me. The whole thing mainly seems to center around bad combos of COMT and MTRR snps. Reasons for starting included some very troubling neurological symptoms that made me think the next 20 years (if I make it that long) would not be any fun at all. So here's something that I hope can help a lot of folks. It was a real eye opener for me.

B12 Deficiency Support Group | Vitamin B12 deficiency Charity Support Group

What do you mean the whole thing centering around COMT and MTHFR? Chronic fatigue syndrome/M.E (not chronic fatigue that some confuse it with) or your personal issues? I'm in a heavy fog at the moment and can't work it out. Just asking because I don't have any COMT or MTHFR with my CFS.

 

[Texon]

What do you mean the whole thing centering around COMT and MTHFR? Chronic fatigue syndrome/M.E (not chronic fatigue that some confuse it with) or your personal issues? I'm in a heavy fog at the moment and can't work it out. Just asking because I don't have any COMT or MTHFR with my CFS.

Sorry the reference to the snps was purely my individual situation. Actually I do have MTHFR issues, but the major one is MTRR which is critical to b12 processing. I also don't have a gallbladder which complicates matters even more I think in terms of absorption of b12 well. However I did notice a profound warm sensation as well as relief of muscle tension (I sit at a computer all day at work) after the 1cc shot of hydroxo b12. I also slept better...not great but better, and cognition was better in terms of more fluid word selection and name recall. I am hoping and praying all this is not just a temporary blip. Check out the web site and attached doc...if you see anything helpful I would love to hear about it. I think this is a bigger deal than most people realize. This doc in the UK who specializes in this therapy is pretty dogmatic about how widespread the deficiency problem is. Either way I hope you find solid answers asap.

 

[Texon]

@Rad @thegiantess @Such_Saturation ...apart from the b12 discussion above, what do you think about haidut's panquinone in the context of this thread...cfs/md? Seems like it could be helpful.

 

[Such_Saturation]

@Rad @thegiantess @Such_Saturation ...apart from the b12 discussion above, what do you think about haidut's panquinone in the context of this thread...cfs/md? Seems like it could be helpful.

It's probably useful in a lot more than just that... but such claims attract unwanted attention...

 

[Amazoniac]

It's probably useful in a lot more than just that... but such claims attract unwanted attention...

CoPeterugh..?

 

[Texon]

@Rad p.s. I also have homocysteine which is consistently in the 11-14 range which I hope the injectable b12 will help. I should also add, I have never noticed the subjective benefits noted above with any of the oral/sublingual forms of the vitamin.

 

[Such_Saturation]

CoPeterugh..?

CoP

 

[Texon]

@Such_Saturation 10-4.

 

[Amazoniac]

CoP

@Black Ops?

 

[Such_Saturation]

@Black Ops?

We've been infiltrated

 

[HLP]

"Chronic Fatigue Syndrome" = hypothyroidism. Fix cellular energy per the recommendations of Ray Peat and CFS goes away. The flu experienced by some in the beginning was enough to knock down their metabolism so that "Chronic Fatigue Syndrome" could set it. A huge stress like moving, or death in family can do the same thing.

Once again, just another case of all things hypothyroidism.

Exactly what happened to me. I existed from my late teen until my early fifties like this, despite doctoring in the orthodox medical system continuously asking for help. Now that I'm on the other side I guard against looking back too much with blame. Yes, for me it was hypothyroidism despite "normal" labs. I'm glad I never gave up looking outside the box and found Lita Lee and Ray Peat. I spent my life in bed for the most part or when I needed to be up and about, all I could think of was when I could return to bed for more rest. Interestingly each time I was pregnant (four times, my husband knew where to find me!) I felt somewhat better, but the doctors could never explain why.

 

[Rad]

@Rad @thegiantess @Such_Saturation ...apart from the b12 discussion above, what do you think about haidut's panquinone in the context of this thread...cfs/md? Seems like it could be helpful.

The panquinone gives me blurred vision but not a lot else. I will experiment with it more but am doing the koch reagents from Germany first.

I wrote to cliff earlier to describe my experiences of I.M injection with the agents. I got the strange relaxation/happiness, almost giddiness after my first injection that has been mentioned as happening with those reagents. One of them made me feel decidedly awful within about two hours of administration. This happened again the second week on queue but took less time to recover from. Third week it was gone.

I'm don't see why the same dietary requirements expected by Koch to ensure his agents worked correctly, won't also be required by panquinone. See Cliff Myles threads on koch for more info.

I have to say that I am really suffering quite badly since starting the agents. I think the diet maybe to blame, possibly as the requirements for amino acids for fuel in CFS, may mean I am not getting sufficient on my vegetarian diet. There are alternative explanations but I can't think them through anymore. Too tired. Even typing makes me hoarse when I talk!

 

[Milena]

Dr Chandry in UK got temporarily banned for prescribing B12 against NHS 'NICE' guidelines, despite good evidence of the efficacy of his practice when he believed B12 deficiency was causing the problem. Despite 30 years of excellent records. There is not only ignorance in the medical profession but ingrained, well-defended bias and inertia, which results in actions tantamount to bullying those 'not in the gang'.

 

[Rad]

Dr Chandry in UK got temporarily banned for prescribing B12 against NHS 'NICE' guidelines, despite good evidence of the efficacy of his practice when he believed B12 deficiency was causing the problem. Despite 30 years of excellent records. There is not only ignorance in the medical profession but ingrained, well-defended bias and inertia, which results in actions tantamount to bullying those 'not in the gang'.

I have high b12 so it's not the cause of my CFS. I have heard of a fair few with high b12. I have No Idea what is going on.

 

[Milena]

I have high b12 so it's not the cause of my CFS. I have heard of a fair few with high b12. I have No Idea what is going on.

He makes a point of only treating people who exhibit deficiency. It is not a cure all. Neither should it be banned from being considered. From what I read, he really treats the patient, not the disease.

 

[whodathunkit]

It's probably useful in a lot more than just that... but such claims attract unwanted attention...

Seriously? So we don't discuss things because *they* might be watching?

Or not?

Can't always tell when you're being facetious, since as we both know I don't do mysterious and cryptic very well.

four times, my husband knew where to find me!

LMAO!!! He probably enjoyed the convenience.

Good CFS humor is always nice to find. :)

HLP, would you mind giving a little bit more in-depth about your journey? What helped you the most, stages you went through in recovery, whatever you want to share.

@Rad, @Texon, injectable B12 (methylcobalamin) helped me A LOT. I consider it a foundation of my recovery from CFS. I always had high B12 labs, though...luckily I found doctors that understood that lab values don't tell the whole story. My homocysteine went down after I started taking B12, but it's been a while so that's all I really remember about that. Homocysteine was never a concern of mine, but became a point of curiosity for a while. Now I'm back to non-concern. LOL

I have a lot of MTRR mutations but no MTHFR.

 

[Such_Saturation]

Seriously? So we don't discuss things because *they* might be watching?

Or not?

Can't always tell when you're being facetious, since as we both know I don't do mysterious and cryptic very well.

Well I'm no lawyer but I think if you advertise that "X cures Y" you will probably get legal problems from the government. But feel free to try I know that haidut doesn't, and he has lawyers...

 

[whodathunkit]

Well I'm no lawyer but I think if you advertise that "X cures Y" you will probably get legal problems from the government. But feel free to try I know that haidut doesn't, and he has lawyers...

Well, I think a question like @Texon asked might also be considered "entrapment" in any legal proceeding, since it could be seen as "soliciting" you for an answer, and is therefore more safe for offering a useful, informed opinion. Key word there being "opinion", like from one lay person to another: "X substance is supposed to help symptoms of Y disease according to studies, but you should read and decide for yourself", or similar.

I very, very seldom see anything that could be considered medical advice on this board, except by the most convoluted of logical stretching. People that actually give instructions on what to do and say unequivocally their advice will help or cure generally get told about it in short order.

But since you obviously really like mysterious and cryptic, you should take whatever opportunities you get to practice it, I guess.

In a similar vein, I have no experience with panquinone but know that kuinone has given a few of my online friends with CFS some improvement then problems. I guess it has to do with a ramping up of some bodily processes that other bodily processes can't cope with. My own experiences with kuinone have been pretty positive and I think it's helped me with stamina and energy, not to mention I think it's promoted some bone growth in my jaw...both times I've gone high dose for a couple of months my jaw has gotten subtly wider, which for me is a good thing. But there does seem to be a tipping point when it comes to helping with metabolism. More is not necessarily better over the long haul, and especially if your CFS symptoms are severe.