Generative Energy #23: Q&A - Weight Loss, Dating, Red Light, Authorities, And Starch (With Haidut)

[milk_lover]

Why? Because Haidut says so? He says a lot of things. Hormones change literally every minute and there are many things that affect them. Haidut's answer to Roddy on starch was very unscientific and he ignores evidence to the contrary.

I experimented with starch a lot and most of the experiments yielded negative results. One of these negative results is water retention and prolactin could increase water retention. I can't control my weight with starch. In my n=1 experiments, almost always starch makes me irritated and I lose my libido. BTW haidut mentioned in the video not to believe what he/Danny/Peat are saying without testing those ideas ourselves.

 

[Ulla]

He said until you hit the 400 to 500 grams per day of carbohydrates

Thanks.
That is easily reached :)

 

[dd99]

Thanks, haidut and Danny - that was a great interview. I like the Q&A format. Any chance of a transcript?

 

[superhuman]

I experimented with starch a lot and most of the experiments yielded negative results. One of these negative results is water retention and prolactin could increase water retention. I can't control my weight with starch. In my n=1 experiments, almost always starch makes me irritated and I lose my libido. BTW haidut mentioned in the video not to believe what he/Danny/Peat are saying without testing those ideas ourselves.

In your experience was the calories the same with the starch vs sugar experiment? usually when people eat starch they also eat alot of fat alongside it

 

[milk_lover]

In your experience was the calories the same with the starch vs sugar experiment? usually when people eat starch they also eat alot of fat alongside it

I tend to overeat when I eat starch, it's like a loop to shut off any stress from starch, but my appetite is more controlled in sugar-based diet.

 

[Ulla]

I can't control my weight with starch. In my n=1 experiments, almost always starch makes me irritated and I lose my libido.

Actually I am noticing quite similar in my case.
I had mostly sugars in my diet and starches only occasionally.
In last two weeks I have switched more to starches (the same calories and same amount of fat; 20-30 grams) and I am noticing more water retention. My skin got finally clear but last days some little pimples occurred (not from period). My digestion is worse. From two regular bowel movement to one daily that is also less comfortable. Libido is not that strong too.
I was eating potatoes, home made white bread (only flour, salt, yeast, water), masa harina, oatmeal. I was eating all these things before but not in the same quantities as these past two weeks.
I will try to cut back on starches and incorporate more fruits again. My triglycerides has arisen with more fruit in diet and that is the reason I tried with more starches.

 

[tobieagle]

I was wondering what the target audience for these podcasts is?
For people who are reading Peats work for years, it's nice to listen to and grab a few new ideas here and there.
But for the lay person who is interested in alternative medicine/health this is far too advanced and confusing.

In this line of thinking I have to say that I feel a bit uncomfortable with the strong anti-starch recommendations given in this episode.
I don't disagree from a theoretical standpoint but you have to take into consideration the people you are talking to and the practical reality at the moment.
Unless people live in the tropics, are extremely rich, or have absolutely top notch health they will have problems getting most of their calories from sugars (which has been confirmed from new forum members over and over again).
The reasons for that beeing high water content, high cost, allergic reactions to fruit juices (pulp and questionable processing), unripe supermarket fruits... etc.
Here in Germany you can't even buy oranges in the supermarket and make your own juice, because they are not really ripe and the juice will irritate the ***t out of your guts.

 

[Rrr]

It's the same here in Finland, you're probably better off drinking canola oil than eating fruits. /jk

 

[haidut]

Why? Because Haidut says so? He says a lot of things. Hormones change literally every minute and there are many things that affect them. Haidut's answer to Roddy on starch was very unscientific and he ignores evidence to the contrary.

Which part was unscientific?

 

[supernature]

Hey, I know starch from potatoes can feed gut bacteria, and this can be an issue for some, and I know some people find more stable blood sugars with fruit sugars etc, but I really don't think I've seen anything to show that starch from potatoes that are well-cooked in sufficient water are a particular persorption risk. All the evidence I've seen that's been brought to threads here, or that I've read from Peat so far (I've not read all his newsletters and books yet) has been about the persorption risk from raw and/or dry starch.

Its good to be pointed which gut bacteria is meant. I've heard that starch from potatoes that's hot feeds the bad bacteria and the one that's cooled actually feed the good gut bacteria. So same thing used in diff condition has bad as well as health properties- as a remedy.

 

[supernature]

Actually I am noticing quite similar in my case.
I had mostly sugars in my diet and starches only occasionally.
In last two weeks I have switched more to starches (the same calories and same amount of fat; 20-30 grams) and I am noticing more water retention. My skin got finally clear but last days some little pimples occurred (not from period). My digestion is worse. From two regular bowel movement to one daily that is also less comfortable. Libido is not that strong too.
I was eating potatoes, home made white bread (only flour, salt, yeast, water), masa harina, oatmeal. I was eating all these things before but not in the same quantities as these past two weeks.
I will try to cut back on starches and incorporate more fruits again. My triglycerides has arisen with more fruit in diet and that is the reason I tried with more starches.

So it seems more fructose is rising your triglycerides then. They are type of fat, so maybe increase in healthy dietary fat could make a difference !?

 

[Drareg]

Why? Because Haidut says so? He says a lot of things. Hormones change literally every minute and there are many things that affect them. Haidut's answer to Roddy on starch was very unscientific and he ignores evidence to the contrary.

Sugar is construed in general as glucose and fructose, is starch not just glucose,it also has the obvious other additions ? Your tag line makes no sense IMO.

"Very unscientific" , you post something like that with no evidence, your in the same category of what you criticise unless you excercise reasonable judgement and see it for what the talk was,general discourse.

 

[Vinero]

In my honest experience, I feel best on including both starch (potatoes and white rice) and sugars. Excluding either starch or sugar completely gives me massive cravings for it. I know that in theory sugars are better. But I can't figure out why my body seems to need at least one starch meal a day to keep stress down. A meal of well cooked potatoes with cheese literally makes me feel blissful and relaxed afterward, whereas just eating fruit and cheese would keep me too energetic and unable to relax and chill. It feels like starch increases GABA levels or some other relaxing hormone. I also have trouble falling asleep at night when I haven't eaten starch that day. I just find starch delicious (together with saturated fat, protein, salt, and sugar). Who doesn't like baked potatoes with tons of salt? To be honest I have been eating a very low PUFA diet for 5 years now and can eat as much starch as I want and I don't gain any weight from it. Although I can't overeat saturated fats to the same degree without some weight gain. I experimented with eating tons of Brie cheese and that ended badly (increased weight gain and puffy face). Eating high starch, high,-sugar, moderate fat and protein seems the way to go.

 

[Mr Rossi]

Here in Germany you can't even buy oranges in the supermarket and make your own juice, because they are not really ripe and the juice will irritate the **** out of your guts.

I'm from germany too. Same problem with unripe fruits!!!!

 

[milk_lover]

I'm from germany too. Same problem with unripe fruits!!!!

If Germany, the green land with wonderful weather has no ripe fruits, can you imagine my life in the UAE when it comes to fruits? It's very tough!

One day I went to the cinema with my friends and I ordered a "fresh" orange juice at the counter. I couldn't enjoy the movie at all because my stomach was turning like never before and my eyes became so red that they looked like vampire eyes. We went to a restaurant afterwards and I couldn't stomach my friends' conversations (pun semi-intended). Just miserable situation to be in! Now I just stick with store bought orange juice like Florida Natural's and I seem to tolerate it just fine. Sometimes when I feel like I need more sugar, I make sure my daily b vitamins and magnesium are covered and I put a lot of sucrose in my milk/coffee latte or drink a coke or two. But to be realistic, it's very very hard for me to give up on starch yet. If anybody has a formula to stop craving starch, please share :)

 

[Drareg]

I was wondering what the target audience for these podcasts is?
For people who are reading Peats work for years, it's nice to listen to and grab a few new ideas here and there.
But for the lay person who is interested in alternative medicine/health this is far too advanced and confusing.

In this line of thinking I have to say that I feel a bit uncomfortable with the strong anti-starch recommendations given in this episode.
I don't disagree from a theoretical standpoint but you have to take into consideration the people you are talking to and the practical reality at the moment.
Unless people live in the tropics, are extremely rich, or have absolutely top notch health they will have problems getting most of their calories from sugars (which has been confirmed from new forum members over and over again).
The reasons for that beeing high water content, high cost, allergic reactions to fruit juices (pulp and questionable processing), unripe supermarket fruits... etc.
Here in Germany you can't even buy oranges in the supermarket and make your own juice, because they are not really ripe and the juice will irritate the **** out of your guts.

The lay person should take time to read Ray Peats articles ,this show also clearly stated it was answering questions for people who follow Danny roddy!

They were not "strong anti starch recommendations" ,come on ,this is clear.

Ray Peats dietary advice was a for any economic status, this is why he recommends ,TINNED FRUITS or fruits in glass preferably , exotic fruits preferably ,in Germany you can absolutely get access to quality products like oranges ,they also sell pure orange juice.

Read the dietary advice on this forum ,in the specially created thread for dietary advice based on Peats guidelines, people took the time to create it.

 

[Drareg]

Nowhere in this talk do they say you have to give up starch, it's in relation to an ideal diet that can increase function in the organism.
Danny Roddy has often posted images of crisps/chips he buys fried in coconut oil.
Haidut requires his brain to be spot on for the line of work he is in therefore chooses to avoid starch in any form.

People who are using their brains a lot in high stress jobs,studying difficult topics ,creative endeavours ,will probably notice better brain function with starch replacement ,calories must still be maintained, eating the fruit requires more discipline and eating more often ,many people also don't eat enough fruit with the protein therefore may get an adrenalin response from the protein,like eggs, 1 quart of orange juice is a lot to consume for 1 egg!

What is a starch craving exactly???? Your probably requiring more calories.

 

[milk_lover]

What is a starch craving exactly???? Your probably requiring more calories.

When I eat protein like grilled meat, I fancy rice or bread with it. I can drink many cokes but still I feel there is something missing. Maybe it's the calories or the salt or the texture of carb that goes so well with protein chunks.

But I agree with you on starch having bad effect on brain function.

 

[Drareg]

When I eat protein like grilled meat, I fancy rice or bread with it. I can drink many cokes but still I feel there is something missing. Maybe it's the calories or the salt or the texture of carb that goes so well with protein chunks.

But I agree with you on starch having bad effect on brain function.

I'll start a thread on amylase.......

 

[Ulla]

So it seems more fructose is rising your triglycerides then. They are type of fat, so maybe increase in healthy dietary fat could make a difference !?

Hey
Thanks for comment because I was really confused about all that fructose thing and arise in triglycerides. I never thought of this like that...Hm.

In summer 2015 I ate so much fruit and my lipid blood panel seemed just fine. I didn't gain weight etc...all fine I guess. In fall the weather got cold and somehow I craved for more starchy food. I still had more simple sugars in diet comparing to starches. I also kept some moderate fat intake from coconut oil.
Then I cut on fat, ate more fruit (I needed calories) and then that arise happened. Never though of it as a sign of not enough fat in diet. I was actually afraid of mixing fats and simple sugars together despite knowing that MCT are different kind of fats. I will post my blood panel in another thread
Feel free to comment.