Can scrotal varicoceles recover on its own after its root cause being treated? (Special case)

[Cooper]

Hello guys, i will keep this very short although it is a bit of a complicated case.

I have grade 2 varicoceles on left and right side. It is painless and never caused any problems thus far. However, the reason why they occured is probably due to my Post Accutane Syndrome. I have pelvic floor, prostate and lack of bloodflow to genital area issues.

The reason is unknown currently, it can be a silent a very rare type of hernia pressing on nerves on my spine or auto immune reaction inside my gut after taking Accutane. I have methane dominant SIBO and probably leaky gut. These issues can affect the pelvic floor and prostate. Those are connected. Which one is causing which, not sure, but there is a domino effect happening there.

I heard once, from a guy who had same exact sexual symptoms and he was a Post Finasteride Syndrome case, this guy had windows of complete recovery and eventually recovered from the disease. We talked on Whatsapp. This guy claims that, his similar varicoceles on his scrotum DISAPPEARED on their own once he recovered from the root cause. He swears that they went away on its own and that he claims he feels completely recovered from genital numbness and lack of bloodflow to that area. (My main symptoms.)

I also have read a post HERE, in this forum, where a guy claimed that once he fixed his Pelvic Floor problems, his varicose veins finally could ''breathe'' again and that they recovered and went away!

My theory is that, maybe my VALVES inside my veins are not genetically, inherently damaged or corrupted like the most cases, rather they are just malfunctioning due to pressure and compression on my vein network. If i fix the root cause of compression on my veins, can my valves recover on their own once the root problem is found; and function normal after years of suffering? Or i will def. need to get the surgery done?

On other cases, there are genetic factors and other things causing varicocele on people. But in my case, i strongly believe if i never took Accutane, i would never get varicoceles at this early age of 25. (I have them since 18 or so i think.)

I think i would get them as my father also has it, but at the age of 40, not 18. I think Accutane caused an early effect for them to appear. And the reason for it is the tight Pelvic Floor, squeezing my veins there. So if i fix my root issue and eliminate the domino effect that is causing the tightness inside my pelvic floor, can my valves reverse back to functioning normally and can i heal from it without surgery?

Thanks, happy new years.

 

[Cooper]

https://www.reddit.com/r/varicocele/s/KjxczMqnQI Here is an another, third example data of this situation.

 

[Korven]

Hello @Cooper,

I had a scrotal varicocele on the left side, diagnosed by ultrasound in 2017. It was very painful and I went to the doctor because I thought I had testicular cancer or something. This has completely disappeared after I changed my diet, cut out offending foods like gluten and worked on improving gut health. My experience is that varicocele (and generally most vascular issues) is caused by estrogen from gut irritation/endotoxin, so I would potentially investigate that angle. Do you notice the varicocele getting worse when eating certain foods? Maybe your situation is a little more complex with the accutane-induced pelvic floor dysfunction, but I don't know much about how to fix that.

Happy holidays!

 

[Cooper]

Hello @Cooper,

I had a scrotal varicocele on the left side, diagnosed by ultrasound in 2017. It was very painful and I went to the doctor because I thought I had testicular cancer or something. This has completely disappeared after I changed my diet, cut out offending foods like gluten and worked on improving gut health. My experience is that varicocele (and generally most vascular issues) is caused by estrogen from gut irritation/endotoxin, so I would potentially investigate that angle. Do you notice the varicocele getting worse when eating certain foods? Maybe your situation is a little more complex with the accutane-induced pelvic floor dysfunction, but I don't know much about how to fix that.

Happy holidays!

Damn! Thanks for your response, made my day honestly!

So let me get this straight, you had painful varicocele and that you can touch it, feel it yourself right? I can even count mines with my fingertips. Anyways, and then your varicoceles disappeared and now it feels empty with no hardened veins when you touch it there?

I need to be sure that you checked it manually yourself and not concluding it solely due to the disappearence of the pain itself. Thanks.

Do you notice the varicocele getting worse when eating certain foods?

Nah, even if it did, i think it would be impossible to tell. But as i said, i have no pain right now. Maybe it is because my genitals are numb due to my condition? Idk, i do get pain rarely, so that means i can still feel pain there when something happens.
As for the rest, what kind of gut protocols did you follow? And nah, i tested my E2, it was normal.

Lastly, did you ever hear varicoceles disappearing without surgery from someone else too? Or what did your Dr. said about this situation? Do every doc. believes it is a permanent valve damage?

 

[Korven]

Damn! Thanks for your response, made my day honestly!

So let me get this straight, you had painful varicocele and that you can touch it, feel it yourself right? I can even count mines with my fingertips. Anyways, and then your varicoceles disappeared and now it feels empty with no hardened veins when you touch it there?

I need to be sure that you checked it manually yourself and not concluding it solely due to the disappearence of the pain itself. Thanks.

Yes, I have checked it manually and there is no "tangled mess" anymore on the left side - and the pain is gone. No difference in testicle size either; before my left testicle was noticeably smaller.

Nah, even if it did, i think it would be impossible to tell. But as i said, i have no pain right now. Maybe it is because my genitals are numb due to my condition? Idk, i do get pain rarely, so that means i can still feel pain there when something happens.
As for the rest, what kind of gut protocols did you follow? And nah, i tested my E2, it was normal.

Lastly, did you ever hear varicoceles disappearing without surgery from someone else too? Or what did your Dr. said about this situation? Do every doc. believes it is a permanent valve damage?

Okay thanks for your answer!

I was thinking more if you have noticed a pattern of certain fibers or gut irritants (e.g. gluten) giving you gas or bloating, or making the varicocele more swollen/painful? Anything that causes gut irritation, gas and bloating seems to be bad for varicoceles. I have tried a lot of different approaches for gut health but the most helpful things were: taking lactoferrin, eating a specific diet (cutting out oatmeal and wheat), reducing fiber intake, L.reuteri yoghurt, drinking hot water. I probably forgot some things that were also helpful (I have a list of 100+ different supplements that I tried), but I would say diet was the most important for me.

I don't know of anyone else having their varicocele disappearing, but that is probably because I haven't researched it that much. I feel like it disappeared as a "side effect" of me trying to fix my health. I stopped going to my doctor so not sure what he thinks about it

 

[Glacier_Sama]

I developed a serious varicocele during my time dealing with Post Finasteride Symptoms. I truly believe (and there are some other posts here that point to this) that varicocele is caused by excess estrogen.

I healed my varicocele in a week by taking Alpha Tocopherol Vitamin E 800IU per day for a few days. It is a potent aromatase inhibitor and Estrogen Receptor Antagonist.

Varicocele went from extremely painful burning with visible and palpable inflammation along with testicular atrophy, to completely healed and reversed status in just a few days.

This was over a year ago and it hasn't come back.

 

[Bozidar]

Wau! Really?? It can just disappear like this, by taking vitamin E?
That would be miraculous.
I also have it on my left side with left testicle shrunken. No pain though. Since I was 18.
At that time I was experiencing large amounts of stress.
I started taking vit E regularly, but under 100mg. If I take more, I wake up in the night in some kind of delirium.
Maybe I can take more with time, but that would be awesome if it can disappear only from Vit E.
Thanks

 

[Glacier_Sama]

Wau! Really?? It can just disappear like this, by taking vitamin E?
That would be miraculous.
I also have it on my left side with left testicle shrunken. No pain though. Since I was 18.
At that time I was experiencing large amounts of stress.
I started taking vit E regularly, but under 100mg. If I take more, I wake up in the night in some kind of delirium.
Maybe I can take more with time, but that would be awesome if it can disappear only from Vit E.
Thanks

You could try it. I believe Alpha Tocopherol is the only form with anti-estrogen effects.

When I take it, I use 800mg for just a few days.

You might also look into the negative effects of Vitamin E supplementation. I've never had any, but there are some things to know about it, such as it's depletion of Vitamin K which could cause a blood thinning effect.

I haven't had an issue with this, but it's good to know.

 

[peter88]

I’ve tried everything I’ve seen recommended on this forum to heal my varicocele and nothing has completely removed it. Avoiding irritating foods has made the biggest difference but the swollen veins never completely go away.

 

[md_a]

... If this hypothesis is true, people will likely increase their intake of vitamin K, both as vitamin K1 and vitamin K2. People will experience the side benefits of higher intakes of vitamin K, including fewer bone fractures [24,25], less arterial calcification [26,15], fewer cancer and cardiovascular deaths [27], and, for women, fewer cases of pelvic congestion syndrome [28]. Also, as more varicoceles are prevented more men will experience normal serum testosterone concentrations as they age, preventing early onset of a wide variety of diseases. ...

Vitamin K: The Missing Link to Prostate Health


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View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXPlFGadf70


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Vitamin K: the missing link to prostate health​

Abstract​

Though age-related prostate enlargement is very common in Western societies, and the causes of benign prostate hyperplasia, BPH, have been diligently sought after, there is no biological, mechanistic explanation dealing with the root causes and progression of this very common disorder among men. All treatments to date are based on symptomatic relief, not a fundamental understanding of the cause of the disease. However, recent advances have shown that even subclinical varicoceles, which are more common than generally realized, cause retrograde blood flow from the testes past the prostate gland causing over a 130-fold increase in free testosterone in the veins near the prostate. By treating the varicoceles via embolization of the internal spermatic vein and its communicating and connected vessels the prostate enlargement can be reversed with corresponding symptomatic relief. So, varicose veins in the pampiniform venous plexus, varicoceles, are the direct cause of BPH. But what causes varicoceles? Recent research has uncovered the role of vitamin K in the calcification of varicose veins as well as a role in the proliferation of smooth muscle cells in the media layer of the vein wall. Vitamin K is intimately involved in the formation of varicose veins. The hypothesis is that poor prostate health is essentially a vitamin K insufficiency disorder. By providing vitamin K in the right form and quantity, along with other supporting nutrients and phytochemicals, it is likely that excellent prostate health can be extended much longer, and perhaps poor prostate health can be reversed. A protective role for vitamin K with respect to advanced prostate cancer was already found in the Heidelberg cohort of the EPIC study. This hypothesis can be further evaluated in studies examining the connection between vitamin K and varicoceles, and also by examining the connection between varicoceles and benign prostate hyperplasia. If this hypothesis is found to be true, management of prostate health will be radically altered. Rather than focusing on prostate health as a hormonal imbalance, prostate enlargement will be seen as a result of poor health of the veins in general and the internal spermatic veins in particular. Factors which promote the health of the veins will become a greater focus of research, including the role of vitamin K. Finally, the emerging understanding of the cause of BPH will empower men to take care of their bodies so they can enjoy much better health through their entire lifespan.

Vitamin K: the missing link to prostate health - PubMed

Though age-related prostate enlargement is very common in Western societies, and the causes of benign prostate hyperplasia, BPH, have been diligently sought after, there is no biological, mechanistic explanation dealing with the root causes and progression of this very common disorder among men...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

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The Deficiency That Leads to Vein Problems​

The researchers compared samples of healthy human veins and to varicose veins. They wanted to identify any differences between the smooth muscle cells in the walls of varicose veins and those of healthy veins. Veins become distended and varicose when the smooth muscle cells of healthy veins fail.

What the researchers found involved a protein known as matrix GLA protein, or MGP for short. MGP prevents the smooth muscle cells from soaking up too many minerals, especially calcium.

This is important, because excessive mineralization of the smooth muscle cells is one of the factors that causes them to fail. The researchers found that MGP is much less active in varicose veins than in normal veins.

And here’s where the vitamin deficiency comes in.

Vitamin K is necessary to activate MGP. When veins don’t have enough vitamin K, the MGP in them becomes less active. As a result, the smooth muscle cells in those veins become saturated in minerals. The result is varicose veins.

Are Varicose Veins Caused by a Vitamin Deficiency

“What can you do to stop my varicose veins?” I’ve heard this question repeatedly over the years. And I have never liked hearing it.

www.secondopinionnewsletter.com

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What might BPH have to do with varicose veins?​

Recent work by Gat et al. takes a fresh look at BPH. They found in one study that BPH does not occur without a varicocele. What is a varicocele? While a varicose vein is a swollen, twisted leg vein, a varicocele is a swollen, twisted vein in the scrotum.

This swelling in the vein affects the one-way valves in these veins. The research has shown that this causes failure of the valves, resulting in backflow of blood back to the testes. Rather than the blood flowing up into the spermatic vein, the backflow blood is emptied through the prostatic vein. This means that the blood reaching the prostate has much higher testosterone levels than normal. In fact, with varicocele, testosterone levels in veins around the prostate are seen to be 130x higher than overall circulation levels.

These high testosterone levels can then lead to hyperplasia/enlargement in the prostate and thus BPH. And might also affect the risk of prostate cancer.

Take a look at the picture at the top of this blog post, which illustrates this. The left-hand side shows normal veins – no varicocele and blood flowing from the testes (T) up, so no backflow to the prostate. The right-hand side diagram illustrates varicocele and the valves from the testes not functioning. This leads to backflow to the prostate gland (P) and enlargement of the gland. (Diagram from Gat. et al., 2008).

So what causes varicocele and varicose veins?​

The role of vitamin K2 in vein/arterial health has been studied – as we saw with K2 deficiency associated with atherosclerosis. With K2 insufficiency, the artery and vein walls can become calcified, setting the stage for varicosities to form.

So is poor prostate health due to a vitamin K2 deficiency that ultimately leads to hyperplasia?

Evidence shows us that the protein MGP that we discussed in our first K2 blog post is seen to be over-expressed in varicose vein tissue, compared to normal vein samples. (As a reminder, Vitamin K2 acts in association with certain proteins that are calcification inhibitors. Three of these are called Osteocalcin, Matrix Gla Protein (MGP), and Gas6. MGP is the strongest inhibitor of soft tissue calcification presently known. But for these proteins to do their job and get the calcium into the correct parts of the body, they need Vitamin K2 to activate them.)

The form of MGP found in the varicose veins was the inactive form, i.e., it hadn’t been activated by K2. In contrast, MGP found in the normal veins was mainly the activated form. The level of varicosity seems to also be dose-dependent on vitamin K levels. This suggests that vitamin K2 deficiency might be associated with varicose veins and might also be a factor in varicocele.

Does this K2 involvement with prostate health extend beyond BPH to prostate cancer?​

Results from the large European epidemiology study (EPIC study) in 24,000 men and women between the ages of 35 and 64 found that independent of other cancer risk factors, people with the highest average intakes of vitamin K2 were ~30% less likely to develop cancer than people with the lowest intake. K2 intake was more strongly inversely associated with fatal cancer rather than with cancer incidence. What was interesting is that this association was stronger in men than in women. This led researchers to investigate the two most common cancers in men – prostate and lung cancer.

In the Heidelberg cohort of the EPIC study, researchers found that while men with the highest levels of K2 had an overall lower risk of getting prostate cancer (35% risk reduction), this effect was not statistically significant. But where K2 did seem to have a more powerful impact is on the risk of advanced stage and high-grade aggressive cancer (63% risk reduction with highest levels of K2). So K2 intake might make a difference for risk of aggressive prostate cancer.

One issue with the EPIC study – and many other epidemiology studies – is that food frequency questionnaires were used to determine vitamin K2 intake. This approach is fraught with inaccuracies – not just with people’s recall of what they eat, but also the amount eaten by a person doesn’t give us information on how much is absorbed by that person’s body.

However, one study looked at a blood marker of vitamin K2 levels to get around the food frequency questionnaire limitations. Their results showed the same trend as the EPIC study, namely that K2 deficiency (as measured by serum biomarkers) doesn’t affect overall risk of developing prostate cancer, but is significantly associated with advanced-stage prostate cancer.

Vitamin K2 for prostate health: the missing link?​

The research on K2 and prostate health is summarized in an interesting Medical Hypothesis article authored by Michael Donaldson.

He hypothesizes that the evidence today suggests that poor prostate health is essentially a vitamin K2 insufficiency disorder. The insufficiency leads to calcification of the vein walls through the presence of inactivated MGP, leading to the formation of a varicocele. Blood then does not flow normally; rather it goes directly to the prostate resulting in high levels of testosterone in and around the prostate which can result in BPH and increase the risk of prostate cancer.

Sufficiency of vitamin K2 might be a key factor. Yes, further studies are needed to confirm these findings. But because supplementation with K2 is low risk with good potential benefits, supplementation with K2 might be warranted for you if you are suffering from prostate issues. Talk to your urologist or health care practitioner about it. Remember, K2 is just one factor…there’s also vitamin D, calcium, magnesium, vitamin A, a healthy diet, exercise…

Importance of Vitamin K2 for prostate health (and varicose veins) | CALMERme

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Found this on reddit:

Go to varicocele
r/varicocele•3 mo. ago
Educational-River-73

How I improved my varicocele​

I want to preface this by saying I am not a doctor, and what I’m going to share is solely anecdotal evidence and should be treated as such. Nonetheless, I think it’s worth sharing, and if anyone finds relief, then I will consider this post a success.
First, a bit about me: I have varicoceles on both my left and right side. It started on the left back in 2017 and increased to a grade 3 by 2021. My right side developed a varicocele around 2020.
By 2021 I had all the classic symptoms, dull ache, low sperm count and decreased sex drive. The left testicle also shrank, and became slightly soft. It was at this point that I decided I should get treatment for the left side, which was done in October, 2021. The right side was very small and not a concern.
Even though the treatment was a success, about a year later (2022), my varicocele on the left side started to come back. On top of this, my right side began to develop more, which was very disheartening.
During this time I had been exercising regularly, hydrating and wearing supportive underwear. Why tf are my varicoceles getting worse?!?
Fast forward to present day, and I’m seeing the light at the end of the tunnel. I came across an article that showed a correlation between varicoceles, and low levels of Vitamin K. I decided to try increasing my Vitamin K levels in hopes I would get some relief.
Now, I am following-up with my progress since I started taking Vitamin K, one month ago. And while my varicoceles are not completely gone, the improvement is not negligible:
• My varicoceles on both sides have decreased in swelling. I can especially notice the improvement when my body temperature is higher, and my testicles hang lower, since this is when the varicoceles are most prominent.
• My semen is noticeably thicker, even my girlfriend made a comment about it. I also produce more pre-cum.
• I get random erections again, and wake up with morning wood almost daily now.
• My sex drive is higher and I find myself wanting sex multiple times a day again.
For those who are interested, my regiment is 15mg (yes milligrams, not micrograms) Vitamin K2, every other day. I also take Vitamin D3, Magnesium, Zinc, and some herbal supplements, but I’ve been taking these for years and hadn’t noticed any changes until I started Vitamin K2.
Feel free to reach out with any questions!


View: https://www.reddit.com/r/varicocele/comments/16ywox3/how_i_improved_my_varicocele/?share_id=I5jsvnJhqeQQb8a_a1sWG&utm_content=1&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_source=share&utm_term=3

 

[Snarf]

You could try it. I believe Alpha Tocopherol is the only form with anti-estrogen effects.

When I take it, I use 800mg for just a few days.

You might also look into the negative effects of Vitamin E supplementation. I've never had any, but there are some things to know about it, such as it's depletion of Vitamin K which could cause a blood thinning effect.

I haven't had an issue with this, but it's good to know.

May I ask what brand you used? I can only find d-alpha, not sure if this is the same as alpha or not? Thanks

 

[Glacier_Sama]

May I ask what brand you used? I can only find d-alpha, not sure if this is the same as alpha or not? Thanks

I used Spring valley DL-Alpha Tocopherol

The difference between D and DL is that 'DL' is synthetic. Most people would recommend you go with the D-alpha Tocopherol, but I believe it is twice as potent as the DL so maybe start with a half dose.

 

[Snarf]

I used Spring valley DL-Alpha Tocopherol

The difference between D and DL is that 'DL' is synthetic. Most people would recommend you go with the D-alpha Tocopherol, but I believe it is twice as potent as the DL so maybe start with a half dose.

Ok thanks, Ill give that a go.