OK We So Know Prostaglandin D2 Is The Main Driver Behind Baldness. What Can We Do About It?

[ddjd]

Aromasin + DHT will murder your hair

We both know you haven't done aromasin or dht. You're bullshitting

 

[nbznj]

arimidex isn't any worse than aromasin, it has to be gauged on a case by case basis. Aromasin can be too powerful as a suicide inhibitor, leaving you with low e2. Arimidex is very user friendly. Most studies on Arimidex causing side effects use doses that are way too high.

I've done both anyway, and if anything they stabilize my hair very well, so the AI+hair loss thing is a myth. The issue is users typically ingest an IIFYM type of diet full of trash, don't really pay attention to a potentially leaky gut and/or overwhelmed liver, forget that DHT is nothing but a mediator of the inflammation, believe that more T will balance out more cortisol, believe that artificially getting a number in range through the use of a drug will solve the cause behind the elevation of said number (that's western medicine in a nutshell).

Just like more omegas 3 won't balance out more omegas 6, stress/cortisol has to be reduced. If that doesn't happen, you can blame whatever hormone or aromatase inhibitor....

 

[MyUsernameHere]

We both know you haven't done aromasin or dht. You're bullshitting

I've done letrozole which is even worse. Hey, I was smart too back when I was a NW2. Thinking you've got it all figured out.

I'll come back to these threads when the RPF actually grows some hair. Until then, good luck.

 

[Travis]

Anything that's going on your skin is going in your body.

Not if it's a 2‧kilodalton cyclic peptide; perhaps you should read these:

Rothbard, Jonathan B. "Conjugation of arginine oligomers to cyclosporin A facilitates topical delivery and inhibition of inflammation." Nature medicine (2000)
Lauerma, Antti I. "Absorption of topical tacrolimus (FK506) in vitro through human skin: comparison with cyclosporin A." Skin Pharmacology and Physiology (1997)​

'As inadequate skin absorption has been proposed as the reason for inefficacy of topical CsA, factors contributing to percutaneous absorption of FK506 and CsA were studied. Partitioning of FK506 and CsA between octanol and water, stratum corneum and water, and stratum corneum and isopropyl myristate was determined. Absorption of FK506 and CsA through dermatomed human cadaver skin was determined with in vitro flowthrough cells. In partitioning experiments, CsA was more lipophilic than FK506.'​

The molecule is so large, and so notorious for low skin penetrance, that studies are aimed solely for making chemical modifications to improve this. So really, there is every indication that it's not absorbed systemically in the slightest.. . ..Oh wait . . . what have we here:

​

Oh I'm sorry. It looks like .024% is actually absorbed: less than one quarter of one tenth of one percent. I'll give you that, but will also let you know that this is completely negligible and you'd have a hard time convincing anyone that this would measurably impact circulating cytokine levels.

 

[Hairfedup]

Anything that's going on your skin is going in your body.

Are you suggesting that a topical application =/= digestive system.

 

[ddjd]

I've done letrozole which is even worse. Hey, I was smart too back when I was a NW2. Thinking you've got it all figured out.

I'll come back to these threads when the RPF actually grows some hair. Until then, good luck.

Yeah worse. Aromasin is the only one worth taking. The others are terrible for you

 

[nbznj]

@Joeyd arimidex is very fine, I can't understand where you're coming from with your claim

 

[dq139]

The better my thyroid function and the more T & DHT and libido I get, the more hair I shed and it never comes back. When I was even more hypothyroid and using estrogen on my scalp I had a whole norwood more hair than I do now.

I love contrarian endocrinology as much as the next guy, but I'm afraid the other side has way more evidence in their favor. If hair loss was caused by deficiency in androgens then I'd already be on roids now and regrowing hair - but the unfortunate fact is that hair that is prone to balding is at complete odds with general health in the male body, and that's my observation as someone who has been battling hair loss for 5 years and still somewhere between a NW2 and 2.5. I started losing my hair at 19, for what it's worth, now 25, and I've used so many things from antiandrogens and progesterone and estradiol, so I have a very good idea of what works and what doesn't.

Aromasin + DHT will murder your hair. Don't say I didn't warn you. I didn't believe the mainstream either when I first started balding. Thought I could hack it with diet. But the worse it gets, the more desperate you become and start using the same things that the mainstream. Or just flat out admit that nothing that you do works, and give up. That's my experience, and I've yet to see someone prove me wrong with a success story based on alternate hair loss theories.

The only alternative treatment I found useful that the mainstream typically discards is red light (particularly 830 & 760 nm like the Infrared Light Mini). It helps eliminate some of the inflammation when shined at the scalp and helped me regrow some hair. But it only works up to a point where it's overcome by DHT again.

I have somewhat of a success story. I had a varicocele that lowered my testosterone alot stressed me out almost gave me man boobs and slightly receded my nw1 hairline at 21. Im 26 now and I've been raising my t & DHT and lowering estrogen and I stopped shedding and receding...for me estrogen prolactin stress makes me loose hair. High testosterone DHT low cortisol low estrogen & prolactin grows my hair thick and healthy....I believe DHT only kills hair when it gets way too high because of elevated estrogen. If testosterone is higher than the level of DHT in your body and estrogen is lower and dopamine is normal or high you won't loose your hair....loosing ur hair is a sign of low youth hormones.

 

[ddjd]

I have somewhat of a success story. I had a varicocele that lowered my testosterone alot stressed me out almost gave me man boobs and slightly receded my nw1 hairline at 21. Im 26 now and I've been raising my t & DHT and lowering estrogen and I stopped shedding and receding...for me estrogen prolactin stress makes me loose hair. High testosterone DHT low cortisol low estrogen & prolactin grows my hair thick and healthy....I believe DHT only kills hair when it gets way too high because of elevated estrogen. If testosterone is higher than the level of DHT in your body and estrogen is lower and dopamine is normal or high you won't loose your hair....loosing ur hair is a sign of low youth hormones.

This is exactly my opinion also. Keep estrogen and Cortisol low. Keep dht high.

Dq139 what are you using to keep your dht and T high, and Estrogen low?

 

[ddjd]

I've done both anyway, and if anything they stabilize my hair very well, so the AI+hair loss thing is a myth.

@MyUsernameHere hope you took note of this

 

[ddjd]

Im 26 now and I've been raising my t & DHT and lowering estrogen

Can you tell me what your regime is...

 

[ddjd]

@Joeyd arimidex is very fine, I can't understand where you're coming from with your claim

So you've used both and prefer arimidex? Everything I've read says aromasin is by far the better of the two. Maybe you had some crap stuff?

 

[ddjd]

@Joeyd arimidex is very fine, I can't understand where you're coming from with your claim

@nbznj you need to read through this
Aromatase inhibitors other than arimidex?

 

[eddiem991]

I have somewhat of a success story. I had a varicocele that lowered my testosterone alot stressed me out almost gave me man boobs and slightly receded my nw1 hairline at 21. Im 26 now and I've been raising my t & DHT and lowering estrogen and I stopped shedding and receding...for me estrogen prolactin stress makes me loose hair. High testosterone DHT low cortisol low estrogen & prolactin grows my hair thick and healthy....I believe DHT only kills hair when it gets way too high because of elevated estrogen. If testosterone is higher than the level of DHT in your body and estrogen is lower and dopamine is normal or high you won't loose your hair....loosing ur hair is a sign of low youth hormones.

same for me. testo and DHT should be kept high

 

[CLASH]

@Travis
Thank you for the info. So compiling the information you have presented on hairloss a practical treatment plan would include:
1) avoiding PUFA, with a focus specifically on linoleic acid to limit prostaglandin production specifically prostaglandin D2
2) replacing said PUFA with SAFA from coconut, beef, dairy and cocoa based fats
3) avoiding immunogenic proteins such as most grains, A1 dairy or all dairy depending on sensitivity to casomorphins as well as any food protein that the body has an immune reaction to (whether IgE mediated or perhaps delayed hypersensitivity???)
4) optimizing vit D3 levels
5) eating adequate, easily digested carbs to lower cortisol levels. What specifically would your recommendation be in regards to the aldosterone aspect?
6) applying topical cyclosporine for regrowth in an olive oil carrier as previously mentioned
7) applying either ramotriban or setipiprant topically to stop hairloss via antagoniziation of prostaglandin D2, atleast until body PUFA is depleted

Obviously this is all in the context of eating enough cals, and other lifestyle factors. The main focus of clarification was in the hairloss arena specifically. As always thanks for your time and knowledge, I enjoy reading your posts.

 

[Hairfedup]

@Travis
Thank you for the info. So compiling the information you have presented on hairloss a practical treatment plan would include:
1) avoiding PUFA, with a focus specifically on linoleic acid to limit prostaglandin production specifically prostaglandin D2
2) replacing said PUFA with SAFA from coconut, beef, dairy and cocoa based fats
3) avoiding immunogenic proteins such as most grains, A1 dairy or all dairy depending on sensitivity to casomorphins as well as any food protein that the body has an immune reaction to (whether IgE mediated or perhaps delayed hypersensitivity???)
4) optimizing vit D3 levels
5) eating adequate, easily digested carbs to lower cortisol levels. What specifically would your recommendation be in regards to the aldosterone aspect?
6) applying topical cyclosporine for regrowth in an olive oil carrier as previously mentioned
7) applying either ramotriban or setipiprant topically to stop hairloss via antagoniziation of prostaglandin D2, atleast until body PUFA is depleted

Obviously this is all in the context of eating enough cals, and other lifestyle factors. The main focus of clarification was in the hairloss arena specifically. As always thanks for your time and knowledge, I enjoy reading your posts.

Yeah pretty much. I have no idea if its just olive oil + cyclosporine or some ethanol added.

 

[dq139]

Can you tell me what your regime is...

Ive tried almost every natural supplement under the sun bro lol

But mostly alot of zinc b6 taurine, lift weights, tongkat Ali and ashwagandha. 3 espressos perday. Alot of sun exposure when its not winter. And alot of saturated fat and carbs. Also try not to jerk off too much lol.

I have just started using haiduts estroban a week ago also, so maybe that will help.

 

[dq139]

same for me. testo and DHT should be kept high

Makes sense doesn't it...if balding is a indicator of aging in old men. U need to keep youth and sex hormones high right, as close to teenage levels as u can. Even though its a loosing battle as u age.

 

[Hairfedup]

Ive tried almost every natural supplement under the sun bro lol

But mostly alot of zinc b6 taurine, lift weights, tongkat Ali and ashwagandha. 3 espressos perday. Alot of sun exposure when its not winter. And alot of saturated fat and carbs. Also try not to jerk off too much lol.

I have just started using haiduts estroban a week ago also, so maybe that will help.

Lool how critical are B6 and Taurine do you think? I've got a bag of Tongkat in root form to make tea out of but never tried it. Ashwagandha increases serotonin though right? I can see it being beneficial in stress relief/anxiety and lowering cortisol though I guess. I need to up my coffee intake.

 

[dq139]

Lool how critical are B6 and Taurine do you think? I've got a bag of Tongkat in root form to make tea out of but never tried it. Ashwagandha increases serotonin though right? I can see it being beneficial in stress relief/anxiety and lowering cortisol though I guess. I need to up my coffee intake.

I don't know how much of a role they play, I know zinc & b6 r good prolactin & aromatase inhibitor. I see people saying 6gs of taurine is Better than finasteride for hairloss. Cause its anti cortisol pro dopamine and lowers calcification....I think ashwagandha maybe term long term raises serotonin. Otherwise its ok for relaxation and its anti prolactin, it Raises dhea & ups thyroid.....tongkat Ali is supposed to be anti estrogen, but I don't know cause a few people say it can raise prolactin. So maybe take it with a AI like Estroban or zinc & b6 just to be safe.