Hello from a new member

Bruv

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A hello and an introduction and then I will go find a forum to ask a question or two.

I'm a Brit and aged 52. I am fairly fit and carry no excess body fat. My work in the construction industry is very physical. I had been coping ok with it but recently I have had a few ups and downs. I have been doing what would be described as a "Paleo diet" but I never chose the diet. I ended up eating that way after having to eliminate a lot of problem foods in my late 30's and early 40's. I had been eating that way for about 6-12 months before I even knew what the paleo diet was. :lol: I ended up on a very low carb version. Virtually no fruit and hardly any vegetables. I don't like vegetables anyway but my wife would put the very few that I could tolerate, on my plate.
I tried zero carbing recently. I didn't feel any worse and my digestion seemed a little better without the veg but I still didn't feel great.
I had heard about Ray Peat some time ago but didn't take much notice. About a week ago I stumbled on a mention of Ray Peat again while looking for info on homemade electroyte drinks. I went to his site and started reading a few articles. I upped my intake of sodium bicarbonate and a salt substiute (for the potassium) and I almost immediately felt a little better. I upped it more and felt better still. I thought that maybe this Peat guy knows what he's talking about so I added some honey to my diet for a few days. It didn't seem to be causing me any problems and I don't know if it was in my mind but I thought that I felt a little better. After a few days of eating only honey and meat, I tried an apple. It gave me a belly ache. The next day I had a mandarin. Delicious and no problem with my digestion or with elimination. For the past few days most of my meals have been drinking honey in hot water, followed by meat> I have also had one mandarin per day. I imagine this is still fairly low carb but I am trying to watch out for any problems. Mind you, yesterday I also had some melon (let's not rush into this! :lol: ). I have every intention of adding more fruit and maybe more honey. I know it looks a bit basic but my digestion has been problematic in the past so I need to take it slowyl and I think I have much to learn about a Peat way of eating anyway.
 

charlie

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Bruv, :welcome

Nothing wrong with taking it slow and seeing what works for you. Best fruit overall is oranges made into juice with all the pulp strained. Honey can be problematic to some people due to allergens. This can change from batch to batch on honey to so its good to keep an eye out on that.

It seems like you are already good at watching how different foods react with you, so you already have a great set of tools to work with. I think it should be a breeze for you to introduce each new metabolically enhancing food and seeing the results.

See you around! :hattip
 

Bruv

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Thanks mate.
I have mostly been ok with the honey so far. I use about two heavily laden teaspoons of honey per serving at the moment. The other evening I had twice as much honey in one serving and it didn't seem to sit very well so I have gone back to my usual serving and will increase the serving more gradually another time time and see how that goes. I used to use a lot of honey many years ago to help with my hayfever. The year after I started doing it, my hay fever was not so bad. I got out of the habit of honey though when I started going more low carb. Maybe my digestion just needs to get used to having more carbs again?
Oh btw, I live on the Spainish island, Ibiza. Today I was given the contact details of a lady here that keeps bees (among other things) on a self-sufficient farm not far from me. I hope to go and see her in the next few days. Maybe she can sell me fruit as well? I really disliked most of the fruit sold back in England but the fruit sold here tastes so much better.
 

Beebop

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Hi Bruv, honey suits me well too, especially a particular brand (local honey), I just go by taste.
Apple has pectin, and needs to be very ripe or well-cooked or both, to be properly digested.

Good luck with your progress!
 

Bruv

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Bruv said:
I have been doing what would be described as a "Paleo diet" but I never chose the diet. I ended up eating that way after having to eliminate a lot of problem foods in my late 30's and early 40's. I had been eating that way for about 6-12 months before I even knew what the paleo diet was. :lol:
The funny thing is, when I stopped eating grains and other starches, I was eating mostly meat, fruit and honey but switched to less fruit and more fat because of the low carb influence in paleo and my fear of candida coming back, which had been a big problem for me when eating grains. It now looks like I'm back to eating the meat, fruit and honey version of a stone age diet I was originally doing about 7 years ago before I even knew what paleo and stone age diets were. :lol:
 

4peatssake

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Bruv said:
Bruv said:
I have been doing what would be described as a "Paleo diet" but I never chose the diet. I ended up eating that way after having to eliminate a lot of problem foods in my late 30's and early 40's. I had been eating that way for about 6-12 months before I even knew what the paleo diet was. :lol:
The funny thing is, when I stopped eating grains and other starches, I was eating mostly meat, fruit and honey but switched to less fruit and more fat because of the low carb influence in paleo and my fear of candida coming back, which had been a big problem for me when eating grains. It now looks like I'm back to eating the meat, fruit and honey version of a stone age diet I was originally doing about 7 years ago before I even knew what paleo and stone age diets were. :lol:
I cringe when I hear Peat's nutritional ideas compared to paleo and lc diets, especially when it is optimal to get between 35 and 50% of our calories from carbs.

Ray Peat said:
A daily diet that includes two quarts of milk and a quart of orange juice provides enough fructose and other sugars for general resistance to stress, but larger amounts of fruit juice, honey, or other sugars can protect against increased stress, and can reverse some of the established degenerative conditions. Refined granulated sugar is extremely pure, but it lacks all of the essential nutrients, so it should be considered as a temporary therapeutic material, or as an occasional substitute when good fruit isn't available, or when available honey is allergenic.

I sometimes have more than [400 G OF CARBOHYDRATE], including the sugar in milk and orange juice (and I'm about your size, and very sedentary). The fructose component of ordinary sugar (sucrose) helps to increase the metabolic rate. I think a person of average size should have at least 180 grams per day, maybe an average of about 250 grams.

What about dairy? Can you tolerate it?
The basics of Peat eating is milk (or cheese), eggs, gelatin, and gelatinous cuts of meat (muscle meat is problematic), liver and oysters once a week for protein, oj, grapes and ripe watermelon for sugar/carbs, and fats from coconut oil and butter.

Potatoes and white rice are OK if tolerated but are not optimal. Honey and table sugar are both OK. Honey can be allergenic but you seem to tolerate it well. Best to get sugar from oj, fruit and milk however.

Milk, cheese, and fruits provide a very good balance of nutrients. Fruits provide a significant amount of protein. Plain sugar is o.k. when the other nutrients are adequate. Roots, shoots, and tubers are, next to the fruits, a good carbohydrate source; potatoes are a source of good protein. Meat as the main protein can provide too much phosphorus in relation to calcium.
 

Bruv

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4peatssake said:
What about dairy? Can you tolerate it?
The basics of Peat eating is milk (or cheese), eggs, gelatin, and gelatinous cuts of meat (muscle meat is problematic), liver and oysters once a week for protein, oj, grapes and ripe watermelon for sugar/carbs, and fats from coconut oil and butter.

Potatoes and white rice are OK if tolerated but are not optimal. Honey and table sugar are both OK. Honey can be allergenic but you seem to tolerate it well. Best to get sugar from oj, fruit and milk however.

Milk, cheese, and fruits provide a very good balance of nutrients. Fruits provide a significant amount of protein. Plain sugar is o.k. when the other nutrients are adequate. Roots, shoots, and tubers are, next to the fruits, a good carbohydrate source; potatoes are a source of good protein. Meat as the main protein can provide too much phosphorus in relation to calcium.
I certainly don't compare Peats ideas to low carb or paleo but the only Peat recommended foods that I can tolerate are foods that I was eating when I first started on a stone age diet.

I am allergic to dairy.
I have homemade bone stock every day and have done so for a year or so.
I eat liver or kidneys about once per week.
Started eating more fruit just recently.
I tried coconut oil a while ago. I had a couple of tablespoons of it and it had me running to the toilet to evacuate my bowels within 30 minutes. Maybe it was too much coconut oil for a first go?
I'm ok with honey. I used to eat loads of it.
I don't get on well with anything starchy so I avoid it.
I suspect I am allergic to shellfish. I used to eat them many years ago but they became a suspect food during my 40's but nearly all foods were suspect at the time because I was having problems with just about everything.
What I am left with are the same foods I was eating when I found out I was on a stone age diet. Eggs, meat, fish, fruit and honey. This may not be text book Peat diet but it's all I can manage.

I am still sticking to my plan of increasing the fruit slowly. A couple of nights ago I had about a dessert spoonful of a curry my wife made for herself. I think it gave me a bit of grief that evening and the next morning on the toilet (TMI!). I couldn't be sure if it was that or because I had increased the fruit though, so I ate the same quantity of fruit again yesterday and I was fine in the evening and fine again today so I'm pretty sure it was something in the curry. Today I have increased the fruit a little more.
I know that I am eating high fat and protein at the moment but I am gradually decreasing them as I increase the fruit and honey. I just can't go charging into making big changes quickly because it usually goes wrong if I do.
When I feel sure that the carbs are going ok, I will start experimenting with just a little coconut oil.
I have read that ghee can sometimes be ok for people that are allergic to milk so I plan on experimenting with that eventually too.
I shall also try a little seafood soon.
How I eat this week will be slightly different to next week and will continue to change over the coming weeks and months and maybe longer.
 

charlie

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Adding in coconut oil slowly works better for some people. I don't have any trouble piling it on, others do.
 

Bruv

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I thought that I would have been ok with it because I was having coconut milk every day.
 

4peatssake

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You are very wise. Going slow is smart!
The very best way to recognize intolerances is by introducing things one at a time.
And as we recover our health and raise our metabolism, very often previous reactions fade away.
My intolerances now are mostly to bad food!

And thanks for clarifying about the lc comparison. I wanted to make that point clear, especially for new people.
Have you tried goat milk or lactose free milk? Sometimes other brands can make a difference. I have heard people report that after being introduced very slowly, they were able to tolerate milk and dairy products.

Ray Peat said:
When a group of lactase deficient people have been given some milk every day for a few weeks, they have adapted, for example with tests showing that much less hydrogen gas was produced from lactose by intestinal bacteria after they had adapted (Pribila, et al., 2000).

Bacterial overgrowth in the small intestine can be caused by hypothyroidism (Lauritano, et al., 2007), and the substances produced by these bacteria can damage the lining of the small intestine, causing the loss of lactase enzymes (Walshe, et al., 1990).
Milk in context: allergies, ecology, and some myths
 

Bruv

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4peatssake said:
Have you tried goat milk or lactose free milk? Sometimes other brands can make a difference. I have heard people report that after being introduced very slowly, they were able to tolerate milk and dairy products.
I am allergic to cow milk but I don't think I am lactose intollerant. I didn't know I was allergic to dairy until my late 30's when I was watching some tv doctor describing milk allergy symptoms (sinusitis and mucous in the throat). I had those symptoms so I gave up all dairy and within 3 days I noticed a massive improvement. A few years later I tried yogurt but the symptoms came back and within 3 days were as bad as they had been in the past. It was the same when I tried whey and also cottage cheese. Some time later I tried a teaspoon of butter per day for 3 days but by the 3rd day the symptoms of milk allergy were well and truly back. A year or two after that I tried goat milk yogurt for a few days but it was giving me stomach aches. I had never had stomach aches from cow dairy but by that time of my life I was getting various digestion problems from foods that didn't used to be a problem so maybe cow milk would have also given me a stomach ache by that then?
I'll give the ghee a test run and take it from there.
 

Bruv

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4peatssake said:
Have you tried goat milk or lactose free milk? Sometimes other brands can make a difference. I have heard people report that after being introduced very slowly, they were able to tolerate milk and dairy products.
Aha! I'm just listening to a Ray Peat interview where a caller asked him about cows milk causing mucus (milk allergy). Nearly all the info on milk problems that I find seems to relate to lactose intollerance but not milk allergy. Peat is saying that if starches are cut out (the caller was eating corn) and carrot is eaten, that the symptoms can be reduced. He says that some people report that they were able to tolerate UHT milk the best. Maybe I will be able to drink milk eventually? We shall see.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/eastwe...ray-peat-glycemia-starch-and-sugar-in-context
 

4peatssake

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Bruv said:
4peatssake said:
Have you tried goat milk or lactose free milk? Sometimes other brands can make a difference. I have heard people report that after being introduced very slowly, they were able to tolerate milk and dairy products.
Aha! I'm just listening to a Ray Peat interview where a caller asked him about cows milk causing mucus (milk allergy). Nearly all the info on milk problems that I find seems to relate to lactose intollerance but not milk allergy. Peat is saying that if starches are cut out (the caller was eating corn) and carrot is eaten, that the symptoms can be reduced. He says that some people report that they were able to tolerate UHT milk the best. Maybe I will be able to drink milk eventually? We shall see.
http://www.blogtalkradio.com/eastwe...ray-peat-glycemia-starch-and-sugar-in-context
:woo What a happy circumstance that you would listen to this particular interview.
This is exactly what Peat does - turns so-called "conventional wisdom" on its head!
It's like what HDD said in another thread talking about how she views MS - in a much broader context now, as a symptom of being hypothyroid. She's completely reframed how she see her experience and is doing fantastic.
It's like he provides a much wider lens, from the perspective of the whole organism not just specific parts.
Instead of "I am allergic to milk" it can be "hmmm, what is this reaction I am having really about."
Nonetheless, slow and steady is definitely the way to go, being sure to eliminate PUFAs and foods known to have allergens and choosing those which give us the biggest bang for our metabolic buck.
Good luck Bruv!
 

Bruv

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4peatssake said:
Bruv said:
What a happy circumstance that you would listen to this particular interview.
Indeed. I started listening to it last night but had to go to bed before it ended. I came here this morning and read and responded to your post and then carried on listening to the show when he talked about milk allergy. I thought "What a coincidence!" :D

I am also trying to get my wife interested in Ray Peat. She is hypothroid. She did a little reading up of Peat the other day and I told her that I would find a link to one of his podcasts. I think that show would be a good one to start with.

BTW, my wife says I am "Looking healthier".
 

Bruv

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I have increased the fruit quite a bit more. I have also been having raw carrot and today I had a teaspoon of coconut oil twice (pathetic I know. :lol: ). Nothing has given me any problems so far.
The protein, fat and carb ratios are starting to get nearer to Peats recomendations.
Source Calories Quantity
Protein 32% ..... 82g
Fat .... 31% ..... 35g
Carbs . 37% ..... 93g
This is from just two meals so far today and I will have probably have more meals later which will at least double those figures I imagine.
 

Bruv

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My experient with coconut oil didn't go well but I might try it again in future.

I mentioned before that I seem to be allergic to dairy but today I decided to try a teaspoon of butterfat. I have not had any dairy in about ten years or more. The last thing I had was one teaspoon of butter per day for 3 days but stopped because the milk allergy symptoms came back. So I'm going to be having a teaspoon per day with one of my meals to see what happens.
Unfortunately it was not as tasty as I imagined it would be. :lol:
 

Bruv

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Bruv said:
I mentioned before that I seem to be allergic to dairy but today I decided to try a teaspoon of butterfat.
I abandoned this experiment after a few days when the same old milk allergy symptoms came back.
 
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