I asked AI technology about cancer...

[TranceWax]

I have limited access to some AI technology that has the ability to read and analyse thousands of studies within seconds and give me a response based on what it has learnt. I'm not an expert in biology or anything and I'm mainly here to learn how I can help treat my dog with transitional cell carcinoma through diet and re-purposed drugs like fenbendazole and cyproheptadine etc.

Anyway, I hear that Gelatine was something I should add to my dogs diet due to it having the ability to offer some protection to the liver and kidneys as well as offering some protection to the stomach lining from NSAIDs like Meloxicam or Aspirin for example. So I decided to ask the AI about the metabolic pathways of TCC and it came back with this...

''Transitional cell carcinoma, like other types of cancer, is characterized by metabolic reprogramming [1], including increased glycolysis, glutaminolysis, lipid metabolism, and the pentose phosphate pathway [2]. Additionally, research has shown that the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway (HBP) is altered in cancer cells and is heavily reliant on nutrients [3]. This pathway is important for cell signaling, and altered nutrient uptake is a hallmark of cancer. It is believed that the HBP plays a role in the development and progression of Transitional cell carcinoma.''

I have very basic understanding of what it's on about so I then ask the AI what nutrients does HBP rely on and can fenbendazole block the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway? (since I'm giving my dog fenbendazole I thought I'd see how and if it can help) and it said this...

''The hexosamine biosynthetic pathway (HBP) relies on a variety of nutrients and substrates for its activity, including glucose, glutamine, and glycine. Additionally, recent studies suggest that folate, fat, and sulfur-containing amino acids (methionine and cysteine) are important for HBP activity [4]. Fenbendazole has also been reported to block the activity of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway by inhibiting the activity of key enzymes involved in the pathway, such as glutamine:fructose-6-phosphate amidotransferase (GFAT) [5]. Fenbendazole works by binding to the active site of the enzyme, preventing it from catalyzing the reaction. In addition, fenbendazole has been reported to inhibit the activity of other enzymes involved in HBP, such as xylulose-5-phosphate phosphoketolase, ketoglutarate dehydrogenase, and glucosamine-6-phosphate synthase, further blocking the pathway and resulting in reduced glucose uptake in cancer cells [6].''

So the HBP pathway is an important pathway in transitional cell carcinoma and one of the main fuel sources it mentions is glycine which is mentioned a lot of this forum for a number of different benefits including it's anti cancer properties. So I ask it about what to avoid with regards to the diet etc with this type of cancer and it said this...
''Transitional cell carcinoma needs specific nutrients in order to facilitate its growth and survival. Specifically, TCC needs glucose, glutamine, and glycine for its metabolic reprogramming [1]. Additionally, folate, fat, and sulfur-containing amino acids such as methionine and cysteine are important for the activity of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway, which is believed to play a role in the development and progression of TCC [2].

When it comes to reversing the cancer cells into healthy cells, the best course of action is to avoid the nutrients that fuel cancer cell growth. This includes glucose, glutamine, and glycine, as well as folate, fat, and sulfur-containing amino acids. Additionally, it is important to focus on consuming a healthy and balanced diet that is rich in antioxidants and other essential nutrients to support optimal health.''

I then asked it specifically about glycine and TCC and it said this...

''Glycine has been suggested as a potential method of preventing and treating cancer, as it has been shown to inhibit the activity of the vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF), which is a key driver of tumor growth. Additionally, glycine has been found to oppose the effects of pro-inflammatory polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFAs) and estrogen, two compounds that are central to tumor progression.

However, glycine is also believed to be beneficial for the growth of transitional cell carcinoma (TCC). Glycine is an important component of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway, which is involved in TCC metabolism and is heavily reliant on glycine for its activity. Additionally, glycine has been found to help increase the uptake of glucose in TCC cells, which is essential for their growth and survival. Finally, glycine has also been found to reduce the pro-inflammatory effects of lipopolysaccharide (LPS) in TCC cells, further promoting their survival and growth.

Furthermore, one of the main effects of glycine is the depletion of glutamine, as well as the lowering of excessive glycolysis. This can have a positive impact on TCC cell metabolism, as glycine helps reduce high levels of glucose metabolism that can lead to oxidative stress and impaired cell cycle progression. Additionally, the depletion of glutamine can also help to reduce the levels of inflammation associated with TCC, which can further reduce tumor growth. Ultimately, these studies demonstrate the potential of glycine to support the growth of TCC cells, while also potentially reducing the growth of malignant tumors.''

I decided to throw in a copy of Ray Peats email response to glycine and cancer and this is how it responded...

''The studies referenced in the question provide evidence that glycine may be beneficial for the growth of transitional cell carcinoma (TCC). Glycine is an important component of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway, which is involved in TCC metabolism and is heavily reliant on glycine for its activity. Additionally, glycine has been found to help increase the uptake of glucose, a key nutrient for TCC cell survival and growth. Furthermore, glycine has also been found to reduce the pro-inflammatory effects of lipopolysaccharide (LPS), further promoting TCC cell survival and growth.


The question also raises the importance of considering the organism and the liver in regards to glycine’s potential benefits for TCC. Glycine is a glucogenic amino acid, meaning it can be used by the body as an energy source. Additionally, glycine has been found to activate the enzyme phosphofructokinase (PFKFB4), which is involved in the glycolysis process and is normally increased by oxygen deprivation and the hypoxia inducible factor (HIF). Furthermore, glycine has also been found to reduce the levels of inflammation associated with TCC, which can further reduce tumor growth. Finally, glycine can help to reduce high levels of glucose metabolism, which can lead to oxidative stress and impaired cell cycle progression.

In summary, the studies referenced in the question provide evidence that glycine can be beneficial for the growth of TCC, due to its role in promoting glucose uptake, reducing inflammation, and reducing excessive glucose metabolism. Additionally, glycine can also help to activate PFKFB4, a key enzyme involved in the glycolysis process, and reduce the levels of inflammation associated with TCC.''


What do you guys think to these responses, is the AI way off or is glycine actually useful when it comes to cancer?

 

[DonLore]

I am not really an expert but as glycine is important for immune function, liver protective, anti-viral, anti-inflammatory, etc etc it should have a broad protective effect on any disease anyway

 

[TranceWax]

I found it odd that it refers to Glycine as some sort of double edged sword (remember I'm not an expert, I'm just trying to find answers and I thought this would be an interesting way to see what AI would say) so I asked it this ''That's strange that you say Glycine can both reduce high levels of glucose metabolism as well increase the uptake of glucose? and it said this...

''
While it may seem strange that glycine can both reduce high levels of glucose metabolism as well as increase the uptake of glucose, the scientific evidence supports this conclusion. Studies have found that glycine can reduce the activity of glucose-6-phosphatase, an enzyme involved in the breakdown of glucose, resulting in lower levels of glucose metabolism. Additionally, glycine has also been found to increase the uptake of glucose by TCC cells, providing them with the energy they need to survive and grow.

Therefore, while it may seem strange that glycine can both reduce high levels of glucose metabolism as well as increase the uptake of glucose, scientific evidence supports this conclusion.''

 

[ThinPicking]

I have limited access to some AI technology that has the ability to read and analyse thousands of studies within seconds and give me a response based on what it has learnt.

Oncology is one of if not the most cooked areas of medicine. At both ends. I think you can write off its bull**** right there, assuming there's any legitimacy to the "AI technology" as described. Nothing but a human mind possessing adequate context and preferably one that suffered loss at the hands of an oncologist could cut through the literature.

That said, you can pick at a few of its lies using existing threads.

Cancer Is NOT Addicted To Glucose, As Previously Thought

Little by little, the lies about cancer told for over 100 years start to fall apart. One of the last strongholds of the "traditional" view on cancer is that it is "addicted" to glucose and eating a high-carb diet fuels tumor growth. Evidence to the contrary has actually been available for...

raypeatforum.com

 

[TranceWax]

Oncology is one of if not the most cooked areas of medicine. At both ends. I think you can write off its bull**** right there, assuming there's any legitimacy to the "AI technology" as described. Nothing but a human mind possessing adequate context and preferably one that suffered loss at the hands of an oncologist could cut through the literature.

That said, you can pick at a few of its lies using existing threads.

Cancer Is NOT Addicted To Glucose, As Previously Thought

Little by little, the lies about cancer told for over 100 years start to fall apart. One of the last strongholds of the "traditional" view on cancer is that it is "addicted" to glucose and eating a high-carb diet fuels tumor growth. Evidence to the contrary has actually been available for...

raypeatforum.com

I'm not saying it's accurate and I'm not saying it's the final polished product, I just got an invitation to use it for a few hours and I thought I'd ask it some questions to see how useful it was when it comes to solving problems with health, in this case I thought I'd ask it about TCC.

I can make out the basics but it mentions some stuff that goes over my head but I thought it would be interesting to see the responses here from you guys who are all pretty clued up about these things anyway and you could call out any BS it was spitting out. All I know is that it's been programmed in India and it's going to rival chat GBT and google's versions of AI. I'm not entirely sure if it's even properly analysing the data or if it's just really good at putting words and sentences together based on what it's seen online without fully understanding it.

Hope you guys found it interesting non the least, I have around 30 minutes left on it so I'm happy to throw in a question about things related to this forum if anyone has any?

 

[ThinPicking]

I'm not entirely sure if it's even properly analysing the data or if it's just really good at putting words and sentences together based on what it's seen online without fully understanding it.

"properly analysing", "the data" ("data" is meaningless without context), "fully understanding it". These things are fundamentally impossible problems for any kind of generalised statistical inferencing to solve. However a sperg technocrat will put a lot of effort in to obfuscating that fact.

I have around 30 minutes left on it so I'm happy to throw in a question about things related to this forum if anyone has any?

Ask it how the profession and its foot soldiers should be punished for their crimes.

 

[TranceWax]

"properly analysing", "the data" ("data" is meaningless without context), "fully understanding it". These things are fundamentally impossible problems for any kind of generalised statistical inferencing to solve. However a sperg technocrat will put a lot of effort in to obfuscating that fact.


Ask it how to the profession and its foot soldiers should be punished for their crimes.

I'm in 100% agreement, but at least we know we're along way away before any sort of advancement with AI been able to fix our problems even though they'll probably try to sell it to us that way. I lost my faith in most of the pharmaceutical industry after a close relative of mine was hospitalised after taking a certain medical procedure within 48 hours of taking it, they sadly passed away 4 weeks later, but as you know it's forbidden to even talk about such things these days but yes it would be interesting to know their karma

 

[Blaze]

I have limited access to some AI technology that has the ability to read and analyse thousands of studies within seconds and give me a response based on what it has learnt. I'm not an expert in biology or anything and I'm mainly here to learn how I can help treat my dog with transitional cell carcinoma through diet and re-purposed drugs like fenbendazole and cyproheptadine etc.

Anyway, I hear that Gelatine was something I should add to my dogs diet due to it having the ability to offer some protection to the liver and kidneys as well as offering some protection to the stomach lining from NSAIDs like Meloxicam or Aspirin for example. So I decided to ask the AI about the metabolic pathways of TCC and it came back with this...

''Transitional cell carcinoma, like other types of cancer, is characterized by metabolic reprogramming [1], including increased glycolysis, glutaminolysis, lipid metabolism, and the pentose phosphate pathway [2]. Additionally, research has shown that the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway (HBP) is altered in cancer cells and is heavily reliant on nutrients [3]. This pathway is important for cell signaling, and altered nutrient uptake is a hallmark of cancer. It is believed that the HBP plays a role in the development and progression of Transitional cell carcinoma.''

I have very basic understanding of what it's on about so I then ask the AI what nutrients does HBP rely on and can fenbendazole block the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway? (since I'm giving my dog fenbendazole I thought I'd see how and if it can help) and it said this...

''The hexosamine biosynthetic pathway (HBP) relies on a variety of nutrients and substrates for its activity, including glucose, glutamine, and glycine. Additionally, recent studies suggest that folate, fat, and sulfur-containing amino acids (methionine and cysteine) are important for HBP activity [4]. Fenbendazole has also been reported to block the activity of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway by inhibiting the activity of key enzymes involved in the pathway, such as glutamine:fructose-6-phosphate amidotransferase (GFAT) [5]. Fenbendazole works by binding to the active site of the enzyme, preventing it from catalyzing the reaction. In addition, fenbendazole has been reported to inhibit the activity of other enzymes involved in HBP, such as xylulose-5-phosphate phosphoketolase, ketoglutarate dehydrogenase, and glucosamine-6-phosphate synthase, further blocking the pathway and resulting in reduced glucose uptake in cancer cells [6].''

So the HBP pathway is an important pathway in transitional cell carcinoma and one of the main fuel sources it mentions is glycine which is mentioned a lot of this forum for a number of different benefits including it's anti cancer properties. So I ask it about what to avoid with regards to the diet etc with this type of cancer and it said this...
''Transitional cell carcinoma needs specific nutrients in order to facilitate its growth and survival. Specifically, TCC needs glucose, glutamine, and glycine for its metabolic reprogramming [1]. Additionally, folate, fat, and sulfur-containing amino acids such as methionine and cysteine are important for the activity of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway, which is believed to play a role in the development and progression of TCC [2].

When it comes to reversing the cancer cells into healthy cells, the best course of action is to avoid the nutrients that fuel cancer cell growth. This includes glucose, glutamine, and glycine, as well as folate, fat, and sulfur-containing amino acids. Additionally, it is important to focus on consuming a healthy and balanced diet that is rich in antioxidants and other essential nutrients to support optimal health.''

I then asked it specifically about glycine and TCC and it said this...

''Glycine has been suggested as a potential method of preventing and treating cancer, as it has been shown to inhibit the activity of the vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF), which is a key driver of tumor growth. Additionally, glycine has been found to oppose the effects of pro-inflammatory polyunsaturated fatty acids (PUFAs) and estrogen, two compounds that are central to tumor progression.

However, glycine is also believed to be beneficial for the growth of transitional cell carcinoma (TCC). Glycine is an important component of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway, which is involved in TCC metabolism and is heavily reliant on glycine for its activity. Additionally, glycine has been found to help increase the uptake of glucose in TCC cells, which is essential for their growth and survival. Finally, glycine has also been found to reduce the pro-inflammatory effects of lipopolysaccharide (LPS) in TCC cells, further promoting their survival and growth.

Furthermore, one of the main effects of glycine is the depletion of glutamine, as well as the lowering of excessive glycolysis. This can have a positive impact on TCC cell metabolism, as glycine helps reduce high levels of glucose metabolism that can lead to oxidative stress and impaired cell cycle progression. Additionally, the depletion of glutamine can also help to reduce the levels of inflammation associated with TCC, which can further reduce tumor growth. Ultimately, these studies demonstrate the potential of glycine to support the growth of TCC cells, while also potentially reducing the growth of malignant tumors.''

I decided to throw in a copy of Ray Peats email response to glycine and cancer and this is how it responded...

''The studies referenced in the question provide evidence that glycine may be beneficial for the growth of transitional cell carcinoma (TCC). Glycine is an important component of the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway, which is involved in TCC metabolism and is heavily reliant on glycine for its activity. Additionally, glycine has been found to help increase the uptake of glucose, a key nutrient for TCC cell survival and growth. Furthermore, glycine has also been found to reduce the pro-inflammatory effects of lipopolysaccharide (LPS), further promoting TCC cell survival and growth.


The question also raises the importance of considering the organism and the liver in regards to glycine’s potential benefits for TCC. Glycine is a glucogenic amino acid, meaning it can be used by the body as an energy source. Additionally, glycine has been found to activate the enzyme phosphofructokinase (PFKFB4), which is involved in the glycolysis process and is normally increased by oxygen deprivation and the hypoxia inducible factor (HIF). Furthermore, glycine has also been found to reduce the levels of inflammation associated with TCC, which can further reduce tumor growth. Finally, glycine can help to reduce high levels of glucose metabolism, which can lead to oxidative stress and impaired cell cycle progression.

In summary, the studies referenced in the question provide evidence that glycine can be beneficial for the growth of TCC, due to its role in promoting glucose uptake, reducing inflammation, and reducing excessive glucose metabolism. Additionally, glycine can also help to activate PFKFB4, a key enzyme involved in the glycolysis process, and reduce the levels of inflammation associated with TCC.''


What do you guys think to these responses, is the AI way off or is glycine actually useful when it comes to cancer?

Good post, interesting stuff.

 

[Ben.]

Unless such intelligence can study and test for itself on subjects, gathering real time unaltered information .... until then it will spit information not in line with reality and be at the mercy that may or may not be faulty methodologies and a surplus of mainstream narratives created by scientism.

Glycine is a double edged sword. Many people get drowsy or an sedating effects from even low amounts. In excess ammonia from it could be problematic. Isolated amino acids poss potential issue risks. As with all things. personal experiments allow for good personal conclusions. With lab work it'd be even better.

 

[Eberhardt]

I have a serious question though. It might be true that it helps feed the cancer cells. The problem is that that feeds in to the wrong understanding of what cancer is. Its like the dont eat sugar, cancer uses it. All cells uses it so it only says that it increases metabolsim.


I cant tell exactly about the paradox but it says it downregulate some aspects while upregulating others. Thats pretty unparadoxical.


And lastly its sort of a gelatin commercial as its lower in sulphurus amino acids and higher in glycine and glutamine.

 

[Eberhardt]

Glycine As Prevention And Treatment For Cancer

Related to my recent post on PUFA carcinogenicity and its prevention by dietary glycine, this study makes a case for using glycine as a general method of preventing and potentially treating cancer. Glycine is one of the most potent inhibitors of VEGF and many of the current blockbuster drugs are...

raypeatforum.com

 

[TranceWax]

Unless such intelligence can study and test for itself on subjects, gathering real time unaltered information .... until then it will spit information not in line with reality and be at the mercy that may or may not be faulty methodologies and a surplus of mainstream narratives created by scientism.

Glycine is a double edged sword. Many people get drowsy or an sedating effects from even low amounts. In excess ammonia from it could be problematic. Isolated amino acids poss potential issue risks. As with all things. personal experiments allow for good personal conclusions. With lab work it'd be even better.

Thanks for the reply, I'm a novice when it comes to this stuff so I wasn't 100% sure how accurate this emerging AI actually is, hence why I posted it here to see what you guys thought who really understand this kind of stuff.

The reason I prompted the AI to talk more about the Glycine was because from the little understanding I have regarding metabiology and disease, the fantastic minds and knowledge on the forum recommended beef gelatine for a number of different benefits, mainly for the benefits as a protectant of the gastric and intestinal lining from the use of NSAIDs, as well as some of the anti cancer properties as well. So when it mentioned the hexosamine biosynthetic pathway (HBP) I was wondering in this particular case if the beef gelatine was doing more harm than good, but I'm still learning about this stuff and I thought it was interesting to see what the AI would think. I'm going to read over some of the links this evening that others have mentioned so I can fully understand the roles of glycine and cancer but if you have any more links or comments I'm happy to read them as every bit of information helps.

 

[TranceWax]

I have a serious question though. It might be true that it helps feed the cancer cells. The problem is that that feeds in to the wrong understanding of what cancer is. Its like the dont eat sugar, cancer uses it. All cells uses it so it only says that it increases metabolsim.


I cant tell exactly about the paradox but it says it downregulate some aspects while upregulating others. Thats pretty unparadoxical.


And lastly its sort of a gelatin commercial as its lower in sulphurus amino acids and higher in glycine and glutamine.

Do you mind sharing what your views are of what cancer actually is and how far off was the AI with the comments about cancer? Thanks for sharing that link you mentioned, I'll read over it this evening, maybe it will help my understanding further.

 

[Eberhardt]

Do you mind sharing what your views are of what cancer actually is and how far off was the AI with the comments about cancer? Thanks for sharing that link you mentioned, I'll read over it this evening, maybe it will help my understanding further.

I was sort of referrimg to the general bioenergetic view. Since this is both complicated and simple and might be one of the core points of Dr Peats ideas I think its better to read a lot of his articles. But he usallu refers to the Otto Warburg article who first made it famous almost 100 years ago: https://healthfully.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/warburg1956-ontheoriginofcancercells-science.pdf

 

[Fred]

It's not intelligence. It is fed particular information and then spits it back out. I guess it's like a lot of people in that regard.

 

[spanner]

People are impressed with the ability of the freely available chatty ai to spit out code, but I tested it with something I’m expert in and I could tell it put out incorrect results. I even told it it was incorrect, it apologized and tried again.