Fructose: Back To The Future?

[yerrag]

Me, for 2 months. Results: insomnia gone, liver function improved, eye bags gone.

Curious as to how no fructose intake would do that. Any idea?

 

[Cirion]

I am starting to think fructose is entirely unnecessary for optimal health.

The last time I was healthy I ate a very high carb, but zero fructose, diet. It was lots of maltodextrin powder and some starch. Again, no sugar no fructose. I'm not ready to say sugar is bad period, but with how much carbs are promoted around here, it makes it super easy to get too much of it. So seemingly then if fructose is indeed helpful, I'm gonna guess it's an an upside down U curve with the top of the U being a narrow band. But anecdotally, glucose in excess seems far less damaging to ones health than an excess of fructose.

 

[OceanSpray]

No fructose means no fruit. That’s as anti-Peat as you can get. Welcome to the Lustig world.

 

[yerrag]

In excess and in pure form fructose won't be good but in fruits, in cane sugar, in honey--it comes together with glucose and it helps facilitate intake of glucose by tissues.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

No fructose means no fruit. That’s as anti-Peat as you can get. Welcome to the Lustig world.

The true method of knowledge is experiment.
t. William Blake

 

[OceanSpray]

The true method of knowledge is experiment.
t. William Blake

That’s fairly overrated. Jordan Peterson is lovin’ it on his steaks-only diet (positive experimentation result) yet most people here think he’s killing himself. In spite of his self experiment.

 

[ddjd]

I am starting to think fructose is entirely unnecessary for optimal health.

The last time I was healthy I ate a very high carb, but zero fructose, diet. It was lots of maltodextrin powder and some starch. Again, no sugar no fructose. I'm not ready to say sugar is bad period, but with how much carbs are promoted around here, it makes it super easy to get too much of it. So seemingly then if fructose is indeed helpful, I'm gonna guess it's an an upside down U curve with the top of the U being a narrow band. But anecdotally, glucose in excess seems far less damaging to ones health than an excess of fructose.

very interesting. is maltodextrin in any way similar to maltose, or is it predominantly dextrose/glucose?

 

[Cirion]

@cinderella

I'm in a similar situation that you were in, I think. I am looking to fix my liver also. Could you expand slightly more on your macros, calories, and all of the foods in your diet including what you ate for proteins and fats in addition to the carb sources? Thanks

 

[lampofred]

I think thyroid might be necessary for handling high quantities of fructose... I didn't realize how much thyroid was actually helping me, so I didn't buy any more after I ran out, and I've stopped taking thyroid for the past several days. I'm starting to have problems with high doses of fructose and high doses of calcium which I could consume with no problem just a week ago. I also feel a lot slower and dumber...

Need to order my Cynoplus again... Going to be drinking 20 cups of coffee a day until I can restart thyroid.

 

[Cirion]

Going to be drinking 20 cups of coffee a day until I can restart thyroid.

This you bro?

 

[lampofred]

This you bro?

View attachment 14210

I would drink 10-15 cups a day with no issues when I was taking thyroid so I'm hoping I'll be able to drink 20 now with no issues. Although I wouldn't mind some psychedelic synesthesia...

One thing I just remembered is that my caffeine tolerance has been going up ever since I stopped using laundry detergent and started washing my clothes with baking soda + washing soda. I read on some website that all commercial laundry detergent has chemicals that are toxic to the liver.

 

[dreamcatcher]

@cinderella

I'm in a similar situation that you were in, I think. I am looking to fix my liver also. Could you expand slightly more on your macros, calories, and all of the foods in your diet including what you ate for proteins and fats in addition to the carb sources? Thanks

I'm sorry to hear that..do you also have yellow feet and some facial yellowish discoloration?
The over 10 years insomnia was a serious issue for me!
At that time I copied Chris Masterjohn's diet (minus the fruits) and slightly reduced my overall carbohydrate and fat intake.
https://chrismasterjohnphd.com/what-chrismasterjohn-does/2018/06/22/what-i-eat/

I would say that my carbohydrate intake is moderate to high. It comes mainly from organic basmati rice/ also overnight soaked brown rice, potatoes, occasional gluten free oats, some sprouted lentils and it also includes a good amount of vegetables but I pay attention not to eat too many cruciferous ones. (My job is physically exhausting and I perform better with a higher carb intake.) I eat at least 70g of protein but more towards 100g per day. My protein sources are mainly eggs, beef, lamb, some chicken, fish and seafood, liver and some organ meats and gelatin. (In practice, I would eat 6 oz protein per meal.)

I also consumed dairy products-some raw cheeses and milk in moderation at that time. (After this 2 months period, I excluded all dairy products for 2 months- after reading the book called 'The Calcium Lie'- but now am back on it, although I'm careful.

I try not to add fats when I'm cooking but sometimes I do. I eat raw butter with my bread though. Occasionally I would have avocados too and some soaked nuts/sesame seeds.

So overall, my diet atm is not Peat inspired but I strictly followed his principles for 5 years. I also experienced a major hair thinning during this time. I can't say for 100% why it has occurred but most probably due to liver and thyroid issues and as a consequence, I started to experiment with different foods in hope of improvement.

I didn't drink coffee during the time when I excluded fruits and added cane sugar but now I do; sometimes with added coconut milk or milk.
Currently I also eat a small amount of fruits, mainly berries and some bananas.
I consume at least 3000+ kcal and am thin, 5'1 and 43kg.

 

[aquaman]

Me, for 2 months. Results: insomnia gone, liver function improved, eye bags gone.

What did you eat?

 

[Hans]

This you bro?

View attachment 14210

LOL.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

That’s fairly overrated. Jordan Peterson is lovin’ it on his steaks-only diet (positive experimentation result) yet most people here think he’s killing himself. In spite of his self experiment.

It could still be an improvement over what he was doing before. Getting something 50% is still better than 20% right.

 

[Cirion]

I'm sorry to hear that..do you also have yellow feet and some facial yellowish discoloration?
The over 10 years insomnia was a serious issue for me!

I didn't really get yellow but..

Ever since I started Peating I made some improvements like my depression is mostly gone but I got many other symptoms, many of them are fatty liver symptoms such as

--Chronic fatigue, un restful sleep, bloating, digestion problems, excessive weight gain (especially in the gut), inability to maintain stable blood sugar levels, brain fog, and more.

My diet included all of the things that cause a fatty liver - tons of fructose, tons of fats (even "safe" saturated fats), etc... so that's why I think I need to incorporate some liver friendly protocols.

 

[Cirion]

Thanks for the link. I don't really match many of those symptoms. This morning I gained 2 more lb of bloat, worst waking body temp in months (97.6F), etc etc. This is despite taking a large dose of choline, getting some choline from eggs last night, vitamin K2, etc, seemingly doing everything I need to be for my liver. It's one of those days where I feel like giving up, sigh. When you're as severely overweight as me, it seems impossible to get your head out from underweater...

 

[OceanSpray]

Didn't post it because of the fish oil but the symptoms of excess calcium

Are you joking? This ‘doctor Berg’ is not a doctor, he’s a non-practising chiropractor. Almost all of what he says is laughable, you can really tell that he genuinely doesn’t understand basic biochemistry at all. Some of the sentences where he clearly can’t grasp the complexity of what he’s describing are totally entertaining.

 

[OceanSpray]

Thanks for the link. I don't really match many of those symptoms. This morning I gained 2 more lb of bloat, worst waking body temp in months (97.6F), etc etc. This is despite taking a large dose of choline, getting some choline from eggs last night, vitamin K2, etc, seemingly doing everything I need to be for my liver. It's one of those days where I feel like giving up, sigh. When you're as severely overweight as me, it seems impossible to get your head out from underweater...

Cirion i’ve been watching you for a long time and you seem to be doing something very wrong. I can’t help you, but just as a tip - since you seem to have tried a lot and are probably running out of options - try mono meals. It’s worked for me. Eat sugars by themselves, eat protein by itself - though do prime yourself with sugar before protein just as Peat recommends. Just give it enough time so that the protein and sugar don’t meet in your stomach.

I’m talking something along the lines of Hay diet. It’s worked for me, I lost 5 kilos in a month. With zero reduction in calories.

When I say sugar i mean fruits and juices.

And yeah, keep fat low. Even though, perhaps even higher fat is perfectly doable as long as its consumed mono, or with protein at most.

This is just a tip. It works for me. Went from a slight belly to a slim stomach. That’s all.

 

[dreamcatcher]

Thanks for the link. I don't really match many of those symptoms. This morning I gained 2 more lb of bloat, worst waking body temp in months (97.6F), etc etc. This is despite taking a large dose of choline, getting some choline from eggs last night, vitamin K2, etc, seemingly doing everything I need to be for my liver. It's one of those days where I feel like giving up, sigh. When you're as severely overweight as me, it seems impossible to get your head out from underweater...

It sucks. Have you tried taurine? 6g+ daily causes weight loss. I became skin and bone on it in 2 weeks. Have you tried eating only a few types of foods which don't cause bloating and adding back one food at a time to find out what you're sensitive to?