The Western White Male Personality Is Maladaptive

[x-ray peat]

You conveniently (for your side) failed to mention he - not me - started the ad hominems, and I replied back, as I had a right to, in kind. I'm "always hurling insults at others," really? Who else? Are there many, as you imply? How many are there? Yes, to you I've done a number, but only after you start it. I rarely initiate it. When I do refute, you ignore it or call me names. When I bring in scholarship of others, you label it as anti-Semitic (even when written by Jews ) or other nonsense labels, and now you have a new one, I'm "ghosting." In another thread , BTW, I have not finished my reply, but will be responding, not done with that one. And you do cast aspersions on Catholics - who are you kidding? - when you say, as you did elsewhere, that Roman Catholicism is the continuation of pagan Babylonian mystery religion and you ridiculed the clothes Catholic bishops and cardinals wear, which you say came from those religions. I do not cast aspersions on "all" Jews, as I made extremely clear with much detail - I said much good about them - in another thread. Saying this about me alone obviously shows you lie, implying you have lied about other things. If so, why should anyone believe anything you say?

Who’s the liar? It’s been over a week since you bailed on our last thread, and now that you’ve been called out you lie and try to act like you’re still working on a response. Rofl… Sorry, but the statute of limitations is up. You ghosted. Though I'm not surprised as the info @Insaneacinamide and I posted is difficult to refute.

Rather then continuing our usual threadjacking of other people's threads, I suggest we contain our debate here Jesuits Vs Jews. Ill answer your other post there so people can get back to the sorry plight of the western white male if they like.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

I quote people who hate women and are borderline rapist? No I don't and you don't have any evidence for it. A mere assertion is not proof. If I quote anybody who says something true, no matter what club he is in, it's still true. I argue that at length in prior post, but you choose to ignore it (or lack the brains to understand it) and other things I said. If anybody is arguing in bad faith it is demonstrably you. You are either one or another or both: a troll or stupid. For these reasons, not to be taken seriously.

Redpillers are misogynists, that site calls refugees "rapefugees" and are pretty open white supremacists. Anyone can go to the site you cited and find that out. You are at least a misogynist, probably a massive racist too.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

One thing I've noticed in the south here is that a lot of women have peculiar body types. You'll often see women with very very long torsos, and men with very short ones. Often in couples together actually.

There are also women who look hyperfeminine, like the curviest photoshopped model from a rap photoshoot, but white (and real). And then of course there are a lot of general fat people. White southern women in general have large butts.

There are also a lot of women with extremely deep voices, and they always look heavily tanned, wrinkled, redneck, and in their 40s and up. I know menopause does things but this deep voice is something I've only observed in the south and rural areas of the north (which are pretty much like the south).

I suspect that this is just caused by bad health. Humans are naturally dimorphic, but very unhealthy people tend to become these shapeless blobs, with boobs, facial hair and hidden genitals regardless of gender. I'm not sure if "hyperfeminine" is feminine, it feels grotesque to me, like the men with frontbuts.

 

[Jon]

like the men with frontbuts.

Hahahaha oh man. You sir are funny.

 

[Broken man]

I would say youre on the nose with your assesments :)

I think (speaking as a man of 29yrs old with parents in their 60s) that the societal demasculinization of men and masculinization of women (in their behaviors) is more about my generations loss of actionable capability or willingness. We're more of a generation of armchair quarterbacks and vicarious thrill seekers. We can openly criticize anyone we like from the comfort of our own home and it's loud enough for the whole world to hear with the advent of the internet without ever having to risk people knowing who spoke the critisicm. We have made up digital worlds that the youth spend most of their young developmental lives in, we have marketing and advertisement bombardments telling us we're not worthy of good things until we buy and obtain good things that are materialistic and vain to prove we are better than others without.

I wish I could remember the forum users name who wrote "Testosterone is a phenomena seeking hormone" because no statement I have ever seen or heard has ever resonated more truth about the masculine hormone than this. This hormone is secreted most once a risk is rewarded, once a goal is accomplished, once effort is exerted, and once confidence is established.

If you think of it this way, no wonder people are more estrogen dominant than ever! There was a time in the world where the only way to experience something was to go OUT and live it! The generations before us were doers because they really had no choice but to be if they wanted to see and experience the world and meet people and make connections. It's not surprising then that generations prior to present had generally better health; men had more testosterone, and women's bodies weren't trying to downregulate their own production of estrogen. Are these things that were catalyzed by endocrine disruption through toxic food sources and unconducive lifestyles? Yes most likely, but is it the only cause? HELL NO!

I recently told another member of the forum that I adopted the mindset of a man that has high androgen output before I actually changed my health for the better. I feel that this paved the way and nudged my body towards health for the better, and I've realized that mindset is truly the foundation of good health, and the beauty of it is that your mindset can be the product of choice, not the byproduct of its environment both exogenous and endogenous. Most in this generation are not taught that happiness and a healthy mindset is a choice, just like any other action we humans are capable of.

I feel that if people chose to practice Patience, Confidence, and Fortitude we would see a healthier society of adaptive human beings; man and woman alike. But we're not taught that any part of our lives are a choice for the most part.

Yes!!! This is reason why I am watching anime Baki and others from 90s when I have relax day. The men are building themselves and solving problems, its inspiring.

 

[AJC]

I recently told another member of the forum that I adopted the mindset of a man that has high androgen output before I actually changed my health for the better. I feel that this paved the way and nudged my body towards health for the better, and I've realized that mindset is truly the foundation of good health, and the beauty of it is that your mindset can be the product of choice, not the byproduct of its environment both exogenous and endogenous. Most in this generation are not taught that happiness and a healthy mindset is a choice, just like any other action we humans are capable of.

Can you elaborate on that mindset you're referring to? Specifics and how it manifested in your behavior?

 

[Jon]

Yes!!! This is reason why I am watching anime Baki and others from 90s when I have relax day. The men are building themselves and solving problems, its inspiring.

I too look to anime for such motivation!! You really want to challenge your psyche? Try reading Berserk lol. It's uber f*c k e d up lol but if you can get through the depravity lol it's an awesome tale of human endurance and tenacity.

Can you elaborate on that mindset you're referring to? Specifics and how it manifested in your behavior?

Sure, I suppose it started with first the acceptance of my current state of being. I chose to be brutally honest with myself and admit that I was in a poor state of health.

Next, was I chose to identify other truths of my health; yes I wasn't doing well but I'm not terminally I'll which meant something in me was still working right, and with the proper nudge, could start trending everything in the right direction. This gave me a goal.

After that I asked myself if I could figure this out? Bottoms line was that I had to, but not right away. I don't think I'm a brilliant person, but I think I am mentally competent and I had confidence I COULD figure things out for myself especially since I had identified I had time to do so since I wasn't dying or dead yet.

From there I identified past weaknesses that prevented me from accomplishing goals in the past. I realized that I let emotions creep into results too much. I'd be devastated if something didn't work the way I wanted it too instead of assessing WHY it didn't work. I chose to approach things logically, and be unbothered by failure and instead take it in stride and learn what I could from it to help me accomplish my goal.

Last but maybe first was my unyielding desire to not just be healthy but attain exceptional health. I'm a very competitive person, mediocrity doesn't sit well with me (for myself that is) and I want to "win" at everything I do. What more could I want than health that would assure me a lifetime of winning?! Haha (que Charlie sheen sound bite) so that was motivation enough for me.

So to summarize; Acceptance, Confidence, Logic, Perseverance, Motive; Reward.

If you look up studies dopamine and test are increased when someone "wins" or has their risk rewarded. Winners tend to have higher androgen than their loser counterparts (I think there's a study in monkeys fighting for alpha status that shows this) and so the more you win, the more likely you are to win. You have to be willing to compete and albeit fail from time to time. But see even failiure is a feat if you learn something from it. Obtaining knowledge can be viewed as a triumph so if you choose to persevere then you never really lose :) it seemed to work for me.

 

[Jon]

I too look to anime for such motivation!! You really want to challenge your psyche? Try reading Berserk lol. It's uber f*c k e d up lol but if you can get through the depravity lol it's an awesome tale of human endurance and tenacity.



Sure, I suppose it started with first the acceptance of my current state of being. I chose to be brutally honest with myself and admit that I was in a poor state of health.

Next, was I chose to identify other truths of my health; yes I wasn't doing well but I'm not terminally I'll which meant something in me was still working right, and with the proper nudge, could start trending everything in the right direction. This gave me a goal.

After that I asked myself if I could figure this out? Bottoms line was that I had to, but not right away. I don't think I'm a brilliant person, but I think I am mentally competent and I had confidence I COULD figure things out for myself especially since I had identified I had time to do so since I wasn't dying or dead yet.

From there I identified past weaknesses that prevented me from accomplishing goals in the past. I realized that I let emotions creep into results too much. I'd be devastated if something didn't work the way I wanted it too instead of assessing WHY it didn't work. I chose to approach things logically, and be unbothered by failure and instead take it in stride and learn what I could from it to help me accomplish my goal.

Last but maybe first was my unyielding desire to not just be healthy but attain exceptional health. I'm a very competitive person, mediocrity doesn't sit well with me (for myself that is) and I want to "win" at everything I do. What more could I want than health that would assure me a lifetime of winning?! Haha (que Charlie sheen sound bite) so that was motivation enough for me.

So to summarize; Acceptance, Confidence, Logic, Perseverance, Motive; Reward.

If you look up studies dopamine and test are increased when someone "wins" or has their risk rewarded. Winners tend to have higher androgen than their loser counterparts (I think there's a study in monkeys fighting for alpha status that shows this) and so the more you win, the more likely you are too win. You have to be willing to compete and albeit fail from time to time. But see even failiure is a feat if you learn something from it. Obtaining knowledge can be viewed as a triumph so if you choose to persevere then you never really lose :) it seemed to work for me.

Edit: @AJC I guess I should also add that this is my natural mode now. It's not that I don't feel an inclination to get upset at something or angry, it's just that I've proven to myself not going about things like that yields the results I'm looking for. I now tend to patiently analyze things, deduce the most logical response, and then make sure I see it through till completion. Simple enough.

 

[General Orange]

Huh? What does he mean by vital abilities?

Empathy?

Self-reflection?

Do you have a link to the original essay?

Abstract. Personality has been described as being an individual's characteristic patterns of thinking, feeling and acting across a wide range of situations, the consistent features of the way they behave. It affects how we make decisions, solve problems, handle conflicts, deal with politics and cope with stress.

Abstract reasoning refers to the ability to analyze information, detect patterns and relationships, and solve problems on a complex, intangible level. Abstract reasoning skills include:

• Being able to formulate theories about the nature of objects and ideas.

• Being able to understand the multiple meanings that underlie an event, statement, or object.
  
• Being able to identify the relationship between verbal and nonverbal ideas.

https://www.123test.com/abstract-reasoning-test/

 

[Waynish]

I'm not so sure of that. In the past women tended to balance men out. We were the peace keepers, comforters ( here we have some social/emotional qualities). If one would observe the general aggressiveness of many of today's young girls and women, one might fear for the future of the human race. Alot of teachers tell me the girl's are worse than the boys....so it's not just me noticing it.

Is it from hormones or culture? Or both?

And yes, I think feminists can throw the baby out w/ the bathwater. I grew up a tomboy w/ 5 brothers, very athletic and comfortable hangin' with the guys. My first major job, I climbed smoke stacks and tested the effluent, used tools and built/repaired equipment with ease....I'm 60 and women just didn't do those jobs then.

But I still enjoyed my femininity and its perks from the dance betw/ men and women.

Are guys becoming more effeminate, on the other hand? If you talk with many, they would say yes.

A balance of typical gender qualities is a good thing in both sexes but I believe something else is going on that's not natural.

Any ideas?

Yes - and how could it be any other way! This modern propaganda of "anything goes" is short for "anything should go" not "anything can go..." How could the masses of men not need to be more effeminate in order to be chosen by these more aggressive women? Furthermore, aren't estrogenic compounds like contraceptives more aggression inducing than the medical establishment is admitting? Aggression from men on large doses of testosterone may be partly coming from its conversion into estrogen!

I'm more interested in whether the fact that the genders are becoming destabilized - or perhaps "flipping" - is more an uncontrollable natural pattern, or more a natural effect of very deliberate and propagandized causes. I can only see evidence for the latter.

The most effective way to attack the genders would be to start with the females. If we start with the males - for example by making them more feminine first - then the females would not put up with it (threat of rejection would be immediately obvious)! But starting with yin to attack yang - and destabilize both - is straight out of the Art of War. Once both genders are somewhat destabilized, then there's enough confusion to ripple through society for years.

 

[Badger]

I've explained my rationale for going to un-PC sites, you can ignore that as you please. I'm not any of the things you imply about or accuse me of - surprised you didn't add more to the list. Bad as those things are, however, yet equally bad and maybe worse, is to be a sanctimonious prig, such as you. I can so easily imagine you delivering your baseless judgments about others, when speaking, with a facial expression that is both smug-faced and sniveling.

Redpillers are misogynists, that site calls refugees "rapefugees" and are pretty open white supremacists. Anyone can go to the site you cited and find that out. You are at least a misogynist, probably a massive racist too.

 

[AJC]

Edit: @AJC I guess I should also add that this is my natural mode now. It's not that I don't feel an inclination to get upset at something or angry, it's just that I've proven to myself not going about things like that yields the results I'm looking for. I now tend to patiently analyze things, deduce the most logical response, and then make sure I see it through till completion. Simple enough.

Makes sense, I've also found the conscious choosing of a different, more positive (in the sense of "alright, challenge accepted, let's go") has been the most pivotal difference maker in my own experience of life and my own development of "masculinity". I was also interested if any of the mindset you were mentioning had to do with the "phenomenon seeking" behavior you mentioned--as that's a new concept for me and one I'd like to hear more about.

 

[Hugh Johnson]

I've explained my rationale for going to un-PC sites, you can ignore that as you please. I'm not any of the things you imply about or accuse me of - surprised you didn't add more to the list. Bad as those things are, however, yet equally bad and maybe worse, is to be a sanctimonious prig, such as you. I can so easily imagine you delivering your baseless judgments about others, when speaking, with a facial expression that is both smug-faced and sniveling.

See, I'm not actually arguing for your behalf, since I do not believe truth can penetrate the walls of your mind. I am arguing for the benefit of others, who can simply go to the sort of sites you link to and see who you consider an authority.

 

[General Orange]

Sooo, anybody take that abstract reasoning test yet? Or y'all too busy dissing each other

 

[Badger]

As I said in prior posts, the sites I cite contain some items worth looking at. It does not mean I'm giving a blanking Good Housekeeping Seal of Approval over every thing they post. I encourage others to look at the sites and see and decide for themselves what is worthwhile and what isn't. As Unz says (my emphasis):

The handful of columnists and bloggers whose work I am herein providing represent merely the smallest slice of the enormous range of unconventional ideas that lie just a mouse-click or a Google search away from each of us, and my particular selection is certainly not intended to be comprehensive. But over the years I have regularly read the writings of all these individuals and found their ideas stimulating and useful, and I believe that many others might have the same reaction.

This is not to say that I personally agree with all or even most of what these writers believe or claim. However, sometimes the most valuable insights are obtained by reading opinions sharply divergent from one’s own. Facing a sharp intellectual or ideological challenge forces us to more effectively frame our arguments and buttress the weaknesses in our logic and evidence that had previously remained unnoticed. Taking the measure of an effective critic is always more valuable than listening to a mindless echo. And I would always prefer reading something disturbing than something dull.

Who appointed you apparatchik of the Ray Peat Forum Ministry of Truth or Echo Chamber?

See, I'm not actually arguing for your behalf, since I do not believe truth can penetrate the walls of your mind. I am arguing for the benefit of others, who can simply go to the sort of sites you link to and see who you consider an authority.

 

[Jon]

Makes sense, I've also found the conscious choosing of a different, more positive (in the sense of "alright, challenge accepted, let's go") has been the most pivotal difference maker in my own experience of life and my own development of "masculinity". I was also interested if any of the mindset you were mentioning had to do with the "phenomenon seeking" behavior you mentioned--as that's a new concept for me and one I'd like to hear more about.

TBH phenomena is a very subjective term, but in this context I'd define it as any event or moment outside of the norm; acute, illiciting immediate action. These things are not always pleasant experiences at first, sometimes it's a stressor which you overcome and adapt to (weightlifting, winning a fight) other times it is a good experience (telling a joke that people laugh at, laughing at a joke, making something you approve of, romance, making money)). Because these things are not within the flow of the mundane, and usually call total attention, I consider them phenomena.

 

[Jon]

@AJC this study shows what I'm talking about somewhat:

Correlation Between Personality Traits and Testosterone Concentrations in Healthy Population

The fact that they found males with high T more likely to abuse drugs shows that they're always seeking that dopamine release, the reward (phenomena) seeking behavior. Though, this isn't necessarily good, when you understand why you can instead seek other things more conducive to a healthy life that are rewarding. Probably also the reason young men tend to develop porn addictions.

 

[Jon]

Sooo, anybody take that abstract reasoning test yet? Or y'all too busy dissing each other

B(80%) is that good? Lol

 

[Risingfire]

When discussing handwriting analysis, Mike Mandel once mentioned that girls around 13 or so often get the felon's claw. It's a handwriting marker showing guilt, it shows up in criminals, psychopaths and such. It goes away with most girls soon enough. It may just be puberty messing with their empathy. OTOH, "bad" behaviour might be a positive sign that a person has not had their spirit crushed by the school system. (See John Taylor Gatto's work on that if you are interested)

I don't think women are superior to men, that is a quote from Peat who comes from a specific perspective. Men and women have different traits and tendencies, but if I were facing Pinkerton agents or a foreign military, I would much rather have men with me. Women have their strengths, but I don't think we should discount the ability to put up a fight or take action, two things men are better at. I also find most primates terrifyingly violent.

Personally I believe you just become authentic, and follow your natural tendencies. Don't listen to the lies media and authorities tell you. We are messed up because the hormones are all over due to toxins, our social environment is pathological, and we face endless propaganda meant to control us, starting from a very young age. There is very little gendered things that need to be done, since healthy people are naturally sexualized and authentic expression should therefore lead to expression of those gendered traits in healthy ways. Forcing things seems like a bad idea, OTOH I also don't thinks transsexuality should primarily be treated by transition, but as a metabolic issue.

Authentic expression all around, and giving others space to express themselves seems like the answer. The difficulty for men is that you need to figure out a game that makes women like you. Women have a simple, if sometimes difficult, way of being attractive to men, since male sexuality is pretty simple. I was at a Radical Honesty meeting and it was almost all women. Men I actually see as often cowardly, we can't handle intimacy and being truly seen by others.

Hugh, I think you're viewing being "vulnerable" as honest. Men aren't naturally vulnerable. They were designed to be a protector

 

[SuperiorFatties]

Asked him for elaboration.

All the upper class asians described their manner of thinking and solving problems in ways that only one US native, a graduate student in painting, had—a high degree of awareness of internal sensory processes. ​