If Against Dem Virtue Signalling And Wacko Ideas, Say Vote For Biden In Polls

[Geronimo]

"An unconscious people, an indoctrinated people, a people fed only partisan information and opinion that confirm their own bias, a people made morbidly obese in mind and spirit by the junk food of propaganda, is less inclined to put up a fight, ask questions and be skeptical. That kind of orthodoxy can kill a democracy - or worse." - Bill Moyers

Somehow the United States has managed to pick its two least self-aware, sensitive, erudite septuagenarians to run for president this cycle.
And the American people–by and large–are so dumbed down by a dumbed down culture and a dumbed down media that they cannot recognize these treacherous weasels for the traitors that they are.
Therefore, the upcoming November 3rd elections in the U.S. are almost irrelevant, since both of the candidates are about equally disgusting. America’s problems are deeper than just the two stooges that America’s aristocracy hires to front for it at the ballot-boxes.
A political system that is structurally incapable of acting for the common good, even when millions of lives are at stake, is not just failing to solve our problems. It is the problem. Hopefully, as we struggle to emerge from today’s tragic pandemic, more and more Americans are understanding that healing our sick, corrupt political system is the vital key to a healthy and peaceful future.

"You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete." - Buckminster Fuller

Exactly right. I always try to tell people both parties are total freaks who don't give a damn about the public. For the sake of the next 4 years, we do have to pick which one we think might not be worse. But at all times we must somehow push for an entirely better system. How? Uhhhh....no idea. I guess make people aware how both parties are crooked freaks, then go from there.

 

[Braveheart]

Exactly right. I always try to tell people both parties are total freaks who don't give a damn about the public. For the sake of the next 4 years, we do have to pick which one we think might not be worse. But at all times we must somehow push for an entirely better system. How? Uhhhh....no idea. I guess make people aware how both parties are crooked freaks, then go from there.

Follow the way of Gandhi.....

 

[managing]

Peat’s “left” and today’s Western “left” have little to do with each other. He practices actual science while today’s left worships a fake science that denies reality including basic biology. Helping people doesn’t mean being a braindead altruist.



It really is normalization of mental illness at this point.

I'd actually love to hear the differences between "Peat's Left" and your "Today's Right".

 

[managing]

The GOP and the donkey I agree are not much different, as you can see how when put under stress by the demands of both the right and the left, they lose all pretensions - as seen by Never-Trumpers in the GOP coalescing with Biden and centrist democrats. This is nothing but neoconservatives and neoliberals banding together against the populist demands from both the right and the left.

Trump is a populist. Biden is an elitist. Why you would support Biden is beyond me, unless you favor control by the elite.

Elites have a lot to skim off the fat off a state that has filled its coffers with heavy taxation. The elites can favor high taxation because they are primed to use loopholes to escape those taxes. Their lobbyists will ensure that the middle class, which has the least voice, will end up shouldering the burden of heavy taxation.

I don't fundamentally disagree with this. Except in place of "Populist" I would put "Demagogue". It is a horrible choice between two very poor choices. However, I think Trump fans have bought the demagogue's lie hook line and sinker: I do this for you and you will benefit. I will upend the system and make it fair to you. Trump, like any demagogue, doesn't see past the end of his nose and does nothing except for the greater glory of Trump. If it has good consequences for some and bad for others, those are mostly unintentional, or byproducts, or pandering for votes.

Biden on the other hand, like every other president we have had in the modern era, doesn't realize he serves a status quo. I don't think of it as elitist in the sense that (I think) you do. I think of it as elitist in that, even under heavier taxation, the status quo is perpetuated, which means ongoing transfer of wealth from many to few.

One path leads to chaos. There are those who think this is good because it can (might) lead to change. Well, maybe. But only after much violence, instability, etc. And, 99% of the time, it only leads to perpetuation of elite, just with a different cast of characters (see USSR/Russia).

The other path leads to a type of insidious stability. At its best, its a system that provides a higher floor--at the price of a lower ceiling. It can minimize poverty and suffering, but it perpetuates class barriers.

It is a shitty choice. But, imho, there is a clear and obvious lesser of two evils.

 

[Summer]

I'd actually love to hear the differences between "Peat's Left" and your "Today's Right".

Aw, I thought you had enough yesterday.

Today’s right doesn’t demonize dairy farms and cattle farms in general. The left describes them as unsustainable and a major contributor towards cLiMaTe cHaNgE.

Today’s right isn’t pushing veganism as the future of humanity. They aren’t telling you what you should be able to eat at all. Choices and consequences.

Today’s right isn’t pushing for forced urbanization. They aren’t telling you that your backyard is racist or telling you how much square footage is fair/“equitable” for you to live on.

Today’s right hasn’t adopted racially discriminatory hiring/application legislation like Kamala Harris is backing in California (Prop 16).

Today’s right is pushing back against globalization. Surely you don’t think the world should subscribe to policy written by elitists in the UN & WEF.

Let me know if you want me to continue.

 

[pepzorpdorp]

Aw, I thought you had enough yesterday.

Today’s right doesn’t demonize dairy farms and cattle farms in general. The left describes them as unsustainable and a major contributor towards cLiMaTe cHaNgE.

Today’s right isn’t pushing veganism as the future of humanity. They aren’t telling you what you should be able to eat at all. Choices and consequences.

Today’s right isn’t pushing for forced urbanization. They aren’t telling you that your backyard is racist or telling you how much square footage is fair/“equitable” for you to live on.

Today’s right hasn’t adopted racially discriminatory hiring/application legislation like Kamala Harris is backing in California (Prop 16).

Today’s right is pushing back against globalization. Surely you don’t think the world should subscribe to policy written by elitists in the UN & WEF.

Let me know if you want me to continue.

I want you to continue

 

[Summer]

I want you to continue

Gonna have to wait to see if that was enough for Mr. “I don’t have a manbun but act like I do”.

 

[pepzorpdorp]

Gonna have to wait to see if that was enough for Mr. “I don’t have a manbun but act like I do”.

What?

 

[Summer]

What?

Don’t worry about it. The guy who my post was addressed to will get it. He’s not your average Liberal.

 

[Recoen]

Do you think JFK would be considered “conservative” today?

 

[yerrag]

Except in place of "Populist" I would put "Demagogue".

On what grounds?

Because he's popular with the deplorables but not with the "very well-educated?"

Because he makes great theater in rallies and Biden doesn't?

Because he is against illegal immigration only because he wants to get the vote of the working classes?

Because he rails against China's trade practices?

Because he doesn't buy into man-made climate change because he believes it to be a false use of science?

Because he doesn't buy into the virtue-signaling holier-than-thou posturing of the Hillary and Obama and Biden with regard to race-baiting?

Because he's against the idea of general lockdowns as a way of dealing with the false pandemic and instead he favors a rational approach to it? Despite how badly he is being made out to be by mainstream and big tech media?

Why does standing one's ground and being well-grounded and holding on to what one believes is true considered to be demagoguery?

 

[managing]

Aw, I thought you had enough yesterday.

Today’s right doesn’t demonize dairy farms and cattle farms in general. The left describes them as unsustainable and a major contributor towards cLiMaTe cHaNgE.

Today’s right isn’t pushing veganism as the future of humanity. They aren’t telling you what you should be able to eat at all. Choices and consequences.

Today’s right isn’t pushing for forced urbanization. They aren’t telling you that your backyard is racist or telling you how much square footage is fair/“equitable” for you to live on.

Today’s right hasn’t adopted racially discriminatory hiring/application legislation like Kamala Harris is backing in California (Prop 16).

Today’s right is pushing back against globalization. Surely you don’t think the world should subscribe to policy written by elitists in the UN & WEF.

Let me know if you want me to continue.

That isn't the question I asked. You distinguished between "Peat's left" and "Modern left". I asked you to compare "Peat's left" to "today's right". Which is not what you did.

So, like yesterday, when trying to engage you on substance what I got was woefully inadequate. Never mind though. You've reminded me that you are not worth the effort it takes to extract sense. I'll go now to @yerrag , who, although I often very much disagree, always gives substance and intellect.

 

[managing]

Don’t worry about it. The guy who my post was addressed to will get it. He’s not your average Liberal.

LOL. You accidentally got something right! I am not any kind of liberal. But that is very inconvenient. You don't have a sound bite for that.

 

[managing]

On what grounds?

Because he's popular with the deplorables but not with the "very well-educated?"

Because he makes great theater in rallies and Biden doesn't?

Because he is against illegal immigration only because he wants to get the vote of the working classes?

Because he rails against China's trade practices?

Because he doesn't buy into man-made climate change because he believes it to be a false use of science?

Because he doesn't buy into the virtue-signaling holier-than-thou posturing of the Hillary and Obama and Biden with regard to race-baiting?

Because he's against the idea of general lockdowns as a way of dealing with the false pandemic and instead he favors a rational approach to it? Despite how badly he is being made out to be by mainstream and big tech media?

Why does standing one's ground and being well-grounded and holding on to what one believes is true considered to be demagoguery?

"a political leader who seeks support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of people rather than by using rational argument."

Some of what you wrote speaks very much to that. And much that you didn't write does as well. But why did you seize on that? I thought the rest of the post was much more interesting. I didn't mean to push a button (honestly).

 

[Summer]

That isn't the question I asked. You distinguished between "Peat's left" and "Modern left". I asked you to compare "Peat's left" to "today's right". Which is not what you did.

So, like yesterday, when trying to engage you on substance what I got was woefully inadequate. Never mind though. You've reminded me that you are not worth the effort it takes to extract sense. I'll go now to @yerrag , who, although I often very much disagree, always gives substance and intellect.

The comparisons are right there. You, being the manchild you are, just refuse to address them.

But I don't look the part of "a liberal". No manbun, earrings, BLM t-shirts, etc. I've never been much of a joiner or cared much for affectations and jewelry.

Here’s your “sound bite”, Phantom Manbun

 

[yerrag]

"a political leader who seeks support by appealing to the desires and prejudices of people rather than by using rational argument."

Some of what you wrote speaks very much to that. And much that you didn't write does as well. But why did you seize on that? I thought the rest of the post was much more interesting. I didn't mean to push a button (honestly).

Sorry, I wasn't just going to focus on that but turned out long. Will get back on the rest, which I really haven't thoroughly read.

I didn't think Trump was appealing to the prejudices, given how that could be a minefield these days.

But it can't be helped that he would be misinterpreted and miscast. But the main draw about Trump is that he can appeal to people on a kindergarten level. That's when people start to form their values, when lessons are fables and parables. Life-long lessons of virtues. The most poignant of which to me are the Emperor with No Clothes and The Pied Piper of Hamlin.

Not everyone gets to get a college degree, but everyone gets to kindergarten. No one is a deplorable but getting to college these days gets one to be closer to being one.

Knowledge cannot replace wisdom, especially the kind that is manufactured to suit narratives based on deception.

 

[yerrag]

I don't fundamentally disagree with this. Except in place of "Populist" I would put "Demagogue". It is a horrible choice between two very poor choices. However, I think Trump fans have bought the demagogue's lie hook line and sinker: I do this for you and you will benefit. I will upend the system and make it fair to you. Trump, like any demagogue, doesn't see past the end of his nose and does nothing except for the greater glory of Trump. If it has good consequences for some and bad for others, those are mostly unintentional, or byproducts, or pandering for votes.

Biden on the other hand, like every other president we have had in the modern era, doesn't realize he serves a status quo. I don't think of it as elitist in the sense that (I think) you do. I think of it as elitist in that, even under heavier taxation, the status quo is perpetuated, which means ongoing transfer of wealth from many to few.

One path leads to chaos. There are those who think this is good because it can (might) lead to change. Well, maybe. But only after much violence, instability, etc. And, 99% of the time, it only leads to perpetuation of elite, just with a different cast of characters (see USSR/Russia).

The other path leads to a type of insidious stability. At its best, its a system that provides a higher floor--at the price of a lower ceiling. It can minimize poverty and suffering, but it perpetuates class barriers.

It is a shitty choice. But, imho, there is a clear and obvious lesser of two evils.

I wish we had better choices in the way of Popeye vs. Brutus. Still, other than being thin and senile, it's without question which is Brutus. On the other hand, what isn't Popeye with Trump?

If he weren't considered as Popeye by the establishment,

• Why would the GOP RINOs and Never-Trumpers jump ship and be aligned with Biden and his corrupt gang, if they were not just as corrupt and only have been masquerading as another opposition party to the Democrats?
• 
  
• Why would Trump be the target of a 4-yr long conspiracy (this started before his assuming the presidency) to overthrow him, involving the entire establishment?
• 
  
• Why would the entire media complex (except Fox, grudgingly) and the entire tech sector (Apple, Microsoft, Google, Facebook, Twitter) be so aligned against him in censoring him as well as to miscast him as in the worst ways imaginable?
• 
  
• Why would the entire Ivy League university system be aligned against him?
• 
  
• Why was Trump having a hard finding career appointees in the FBI that would do their job?

Still, some of his actions make me suspicious of his true motives. Despite being hounded by the security state and by media, he would not pardon Julian Assange and Edward Smowden. Is he afraid of threatening the JFK-assassinating deep state, or as you say, he is just a part of the system?

Another aspect of his administration is his being very, very pro-Israel. He is a proven "yes man" to Israel. He hasn't added another theater of war in the Middle East, but he hasn't truly withdrawn troops enough and in a truly convincing manner.

But he may just be a realist and knows his limits. I'd like him to try to emulate JFK and RFK, but I would understand it if he were to decline to go that far. After all, what has their martyrdom achieved?

Nothing. The country went downhill in its vileness. It has become the Evil Empire. The people sat and watched NFL and MLB and NBA on their couch. Had nice Thanksgiving celebrations and Christmases. And they remain transfixed as China built a high-speed rail network while California, the "bellweather state" suffers rolling blackouts in implementing their own version of the Green New Deal. Meanwhile, they didn't lift a finger at all as its military destroyed the Middle East and forced happy peoples to become immigrants to the Western countries.

Why would you expect someone to sacrifice himself for a cause when you can hardly lift one finger to help?

 

[managing]

I wish we had better choices in the way of Popeye vs. Brutus. Still, other than being thin and senile, it's without question which is Brutus. On the other hand, what isn't Popeye with Trump?

If he weren't considered as Popeye by the establishment,

• Why would the GOP RINOs and Never-Trumpers jump ship and be aligned with Biden and his corrupt gang, if they were not just as corrupt and only have been masquerading as another opposition party to the Democrats?
• 
  
• Why would Trump be the target of a 4-yr long conspiracy (this started before his assuming the presidency) to overthrow him, involving the entire establishment?
• 
  
• Why would the entire media complex (except Fox, grudgingly) and the entire tech sector (Apple, Microsoft, Google, Facebook, Twitter) be so aligned against him in censoring him as well as to miscast him as in the worst ways imaginable?
• 
  
• Why would the entire Ivy League university system be aligned against him?
• 
  
• Why was Trump having a hard finding career appointees in the FBI that would do their job?

Still, some of his actions make me suspicious of his true motives. Despite being hounded by the security state and by media, he would not pardon Julian Assange and Edward Smowden. Is he afraid of threatening the JFK-assassinating deep state, or as you say, he is just a part of the system?

Another aspect of his administration is his being very, very pro-Israel. He is a proven "yes man" to Israel. He hasn't added another theater of war in the Middle East, but he hasn't truly withdrawn troops enough and in a truly convincing manner.

But he may just be a realist and knows his limits. I'd like him to try to emulate JFK and RFK, but I would understand it if he were to decline to go that far. After all, what has their martyrdom achieved?

Nothing. The country went downhill in its vileness. It has become the Evil Empire. The people sat and watched NFL and MLB and NBA on their couch. Had nice Thanksgiving celebrations and Christmases. And they remain transfixed as China built a high-speed rail network while California, the "bellweather state" suffers rolling blackouts in implementing their own version of the Green New Deal. Meanwhile, they didn't lift a finger at all as its military destroyed the Middle East and forced happy peoples to become immigrants to the Western countries.

Why would you expect someone to sacrifice himself for a cause when you can hardly lift one finger to help?

I don't understand your last sentence?

As for China, as a I try to search for something positive, I do think the attention he has brought to China was needed and will be persistent. Typical "diplomacy" doesn't work with China. I am not going to try to psychoanalyze a culture, but asking them to agree to things and then keep up their end of the bargain doesn't seem to happen. My father in law was writing contracts with them in the early 90's. One of the first westerners to do so. And he found they were basically meaningless. Typical diplomacy uses the carrot and defers the stick. I don't think you can defer the stick. They see it as a weakness to be taken advantage of.

That said, I concede most of your criticisms of biden, or, more appropriately, of the greater political theatre of which he is a part. But the "deep state" understood as a vast conspiracy (run by Soros, Rothschild, and satanists) is a silly notion (not that you've advanced it). Its a much more passive and pathetic thing than that.

But back to Trump. Just because he is not a part of that political theatre--I think many think he is some great antagonist of it, some kind of hero. But he isn't. He is 100% for Trump and nothing else. Anything good, or bad, that comes out of that is accidental and irrelevant (to him). That is much worse than the status quo, IMHO.

 

[yerrag]

don't understand your last sentence?

You can doubt Trump's sincerity, but in your armchair you can only prognosticate his motives.

And I don't think this country deserves another hero like JFK who stood up against the deep state, as his death was wasted on a people that cannot carry on his fight against the deep state and carry out our founders' vision.

But the "deep state" understood as a vast conspiracy (run by Soros, Rothschild, and satanists) is a silly notion (not that you've advanced it). Its a much more passive and pathetic thing than that.

I don't think a wise chicken will be credible to fellow chickens living a blissful life when she tells them she's certain they're headed for the rotisserie.

 

[bk_]

Peat is left leaning. It surprises me how many right wing Trump fans are on this forum, one which is based around a selfless man, willing to give his time and knowledge for free, it seems almost contradictory. Never understood that.

In Ray Peat’s own words:

My experience with people who attend my lectures over the last 50 years... the people with the superficial ideology of the far-right... they very often have contact with reality and life and are actually more pro-life than the so-called left who say they are pro-life

- Ray Peat, Danny Roddy Podcast #24, April 25th 2020