Unpopular Fiber Question

[Dutchie]

I know this forum isn't crazy about fiber(supplements), but I seem to be in need of one.

Lately I'd been eating a boiled carrot along with my carnivorish diet,bc only meat/no fiber is building up hydrogen sulfide gasses/severe sulfur issues.
It's working for my bm's, but the oxalates are causing me issues.
I tried some PHGG, bc it's sibo approved and supposed to feed good gut bacteria.
It did make me feel better, but the problem's that soluble fiber-only doesn't move out my bowels in the last part of the intestine/colon/rectum.
That's where the insoluble fiber/cellulose comes in...

Due to many intolerances/plant toxin issues, getting it from any plantsource currently is not an option for me.
(Psyllium doesn't work for me either).
Cellulose is the only insoluble fiber,which doesn't ferment in the gut either/'sibo safe'.
That's why I've been thinking if I could 'recreate' the carrot (which is mostly pectin and cellulose) by adding some cellulose powder to the PHGG...

I'm not sure which one to choose though. Which one would be the least harmful (I need to built up a good micriobiome)?



View: Amazon product ASIN B07DNBRC3VView: https://www.amazon.de/Canina-Cellulose-Powder-Pack-400/dp/B07DNBRC3V/ref=mp_s_a_1_3?crid=9UZTC65T2K4B&keywords=zellulosepulver&qid=1675167924&sprefix=zellilose%2Caps%2C149&sr=8-3



www.allergyresearchgroup.com
Cellulose Powder 250 grams (8.8 oz.)
www.allergyresearchgroup.com www.allergyresearchgroup.com

METHOCEL™ LV
www.colorcon.com www.colorcon.com

The last one is actually methylcellulose, used as a thickener in cooking.
I had read various methane dominant sibo /constipation sufferers like this product called Citrucel, which is made out of methylcellulose.
FWIW....I don't plan on taking crazy high amounts, like what's generally advised.

 

[Perry Staltic]

Fiber fermentation in the colon is not a bad thing, and is, in fact, essential. The concern is that it can produce endotoxin (LPS), but for some reason it's ignored that it also produces butyrate, which makes for a healthy colon that doesn't allow LPS to leak into the system, and flushes it out of the body where it can't do any harm.

 

[Dutchie]

Fiber fermentation in the colon is not a bad thing, and is, in fact, essential. The concern is that it can produce endotoxin (LPS), but for some reason it's ignored that it also produces butyrate, which makes for a healthy colon that doesn't allow LPS to leak into the system, and flushes it out of the body where it can't do any harm.

Thanks....I've come across that message often too, but for now I don't need a lot of fermentation and gas built up in there. :)

 

[LadyRae]

Thanks....I've come across that message often too, but for now I don't need a lot of fermentation and gas built up in there. :)

Do you take any cascara sagrada before bed? Activated charcoal?

 

[sunny]

Thanks for asking the question. Ray in an interview talked about a Cellulose product in the past, maybe the 80's, that he thought was good. I have Been looking for an acceptable one.

 

[Dolomite]

Nutricology Dietary Fiber Cellulose Powder - Insoluble Fiber, Colon Health - 250 Grams (8.8 oz)Nutricology Dietary Fiber Cellulose Powder - Insoluble Fiber, Colon Health - 250 Grams (8.8 oz) -amazon link.

I use a teaspoon of this product everyday. It seems to help but nothing is entirely consistent for me.

 

[Dutchie]

Do you take any cascara sagrada before bed? Activated charcoal?

Nope, AC massively constipates (as did all powdery binders) and cascara didn't work for me either.

 

[Dutchie]

Nutricology Dietary Fiber Cellulose Powder - Insoluble Fiber, Colon Health - 250 Grams (8.8 oz)Nutricology Dietary Fiber Cellulose Powder - Insoluble Fiber, Colon Health - 250 Grams (8.8 oz) -amazon link.

I use a teaspoon of this product everyday. It seems to help but nothing is entirely consistent for me.

Thanks! They don't sell that brand here, but from the looks of it, it's similar to the 2nd one/Allergy Research Group. :)

I think it's key,at least for me,to also get in soluble fiber with it.

 

[sunny]

Ray peat on microcrystalline Cellulose:


"Its presence in food, like that of the polyester imitation fat, microcrystalline cellulose, and many other polymers used to stabilize emulsions or to increase smoothness, is often justified by the doctrine that these molecules are too large to be absorbed. There are two points that are deliberately ignored by the food-safety regulators, 1) these materials can interact dangerously with intestinal bacteria, and 2) they can be absorbed, in the process called "persorption."" - Ray Peat, PhD

 

[Dutchie]

Ray peat on microcrystalline Cellulose:


"Its presence in food, like that of the polyester imitation fat, microcrystalline cellulose, and many other polymers used to stabilize emulsions or to increase smoothness, is often justified by the doctrine that these molecules are too large to be absorbed. There are two points that are deliberately ignored by the food-safety regulators, 1) these materials can interact dangerously with intestinal bacteria, and 2) they can be absorbed, in the process called "persorption."" - Ray Peat, PhD

Thanks for the quote. That's why I put unpopular in the threadtitle,bc I know it's questionable.
If you've got a good alternative, I'd love to hear it. :)

When foods aren't an option anymore, I'll have to resort to some more 'artificial' help for a while, to hopefully get things going in the right direction.

 

[Peatress]

Dr Peat was asked about cellulose in an interview by haidut and he said it was ok. I can't find that interview but I found these. I think it depends on the kind of cellulose


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZObPeBRiqo&t=1547s



View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2JyyakbtGk&t=2018s

 

[sunny]

Thanks for the quote. That's why I put unpopular in the threadtitle,bc I know it's questionable.
If you've got a good alternative, I'd love to hear it. :)

When foods aren't an option anymore, I'll have to resort to some more 'artificial' help for a while, to hopefully get things going in the right direction.

Yes, I have been trying to find a Cellulose that is not the microcrystalline kind that Peat was speaking about. @Peatress , I was thinking of the haidut interview also.

 

[Cloudhands]

its too bad u cant have any plant foods, id reccomend maybe popcorn

 

[dogtrainer]

Thanks....I've come across that message often too, but for now I don't need a lot of fermentation and gas built up in there. :)

If your gut cells begin to work properly again (yes butyrate can help with this) you will not have buildup of gas. You will have happy, energetic little colon cells that make the gas out of you quickly. In fact the whole colonic milieu can change with the right fibers and, to an extent, bacteria. That’s what happened to me! And yes, fibers definitely helped. I used PHGG and am now having good results with psyllium as well.

 

[Dutchie]

Yes, I have been trying to find a Cellulose that is not the microcrystalline kind that Peat was speaking about. @Peatress , I was thinking of the haidut interview also.

I've seen a fiber powder for cats&dogs, which just says cellulose powder fwiw

 

[Dutchie]

its too bad u cant have any plant foods, id reccomend maybe popcorn

Thanks but I've never tolerated corn foods well. (for other reasons)

 

[Dutchie]

If your gut cells begin to work properly again (yes butyrate can help with this) you will not have buildup of gas. You will have happy, energetic little colon cells that make the gas out of you quickly. In fact the whole colonic milieu can change with the right fibers and, to an extent, bacteria. That’s what happened to me! And yes, fibers definitely helped. I used PHGG and am now having good results with psyllium as well.

Thanks, it's what I mentioned in the beginning of the post.
PHGG did make me feel good and I'd like to use it some more, but it hardly moves out without at least a small amount of insol.fiber.

 

[Peatress]

Yes, I have been trying to find a Cellulose that is not the microcrystalline kind that Peat was speaking about. @Peatress , I was thinking of the haidut interview also.

What about this one?

 

[sunny]

What about this one?

Cellulose (as Microcrystalline Cellulose)
2 g

 

[Dutchie]

What about this one?

That's the one from the second link, I pasted.
It says microcrystalline cellulose.
The first (pets) one is the only one which speaks of cellulose derived from plant walls (which could be anything I guess).
The third one is methylcellulose, not a supplement but used in (fusion) cooking.

From what I read,cellulose powder gets the name microcrystalline cellulose when it's approved for human consumption