Raising Serum Androgens Using DHEA, Pregnenolone, And Vitamin K

[Texon]

@haidut

Do you have any ideas about any of your IDL supps that would help attenuate excess glial activation?

 

[equusvult]

You mentioned this being a game changer. What changes have you noticed in the test subject specifically?

Improved libido, skin appearance, leaned out and firmed up to what rat was like in his 20s without working him out, which is outstanding physically and psychologically, do to the fact rat can not work out hard without crashing his metabolism. This removes a couple layers of B.S. From his life, keeps him motivated, and gives him time to figure out his metabolic mess... Has not changed thinning hair one way or another though..

 

[haidut]

@haidut

Do you have any ideas about any of your IDL supps that would help attenuate excess glial activation?

Take a look at this:
Missing and Possible Link between Neuroendocrine Factors, Neuropsychiatric Disorders, and Microglia
"...Neurosteroids such as pregnenolone, progesterone, and dehydroepiandrosterone (DHEA) have been suggested to have positive links to neuropsychiatric disorders. For example, the CSF level of pregnenolone is lower in patients with MDD than healthy controls (George et al., 1994). The saliva and serum level alterations of DHEA during depressive episodes have revealed divergent results (Eser et al., 2006), but recently Kurita et al. (2013) have reported elevated levels of serum DHEA in male and female patients with MDD. Both pregnenolone and DHEA probably have therapeutic effects for patients with MDD (Wolkowitz et al., 1999; Schmidt et al., 2005; Osuji et al., 2010). Considering the binding abilities of pregnenolone, DHEA/DHEA-sulfate (DHEA-S), progesterone, and testosterone to sigma-1 receptors, and of DHEA-S and progesterone to GABAA receptors, these receptors may be a possible link between neurosteroids and neuropsychiatric disorders (Hashimoto, 2013)."

 

[Stryker]

@haidut i did a quick search but to no avail , sorry if i missed what has already been stated..

when you refer to MK4 being applied directly to the testes and saying you will need less if caffeine is being used.. is this a systemic effect of oral caffeine ingestion or is it viable for me to apply caffeine directly to the scrotum aswell , i have some pure caffeine powder dissolved in DMSO (500mg in 10ml) and was interested if this would be a viable approach.

Thanks.

 

[DaveFoster]

@haidut i did a quick search but to no avail , sorry if i missed what has already been stated..

when you refer to MK4 being applied directly to the testes and saying you will need less if caffeine is being used.. is this a systemic effect of oral caffeine ingestion or is it viable for me to apply caffeine directly to the scrotum aswell , i have some pure caffeine powder dissolved in DMSO (500mg in 10ml) and was interested if this would be a viable approach.

Thanks.

He answered this; he's referring to coffee consumption (oral) for your first question. 1 mg if you drink coffee, 3 if not.

He's also said that topical caffeine should work like T3 if applied to the testes.

 

[Stryker]

He answered this; he's referring to coffee consumption (oral) for your first question. 1 mg if you drink coffee, 3 if not.

He's also said that topical caffeine should work like T3 if applied to the testes.

Thanks alot , i will experiment in comparing t3 with caffeine and also using both and write back.

 

[Regina]

Yay moss! I can't wait for updates from both of you.

Okay. Maybe it is not a fluke.
I have been feeling like I would get my period in the last week. (but thinking 'oh those days are over'). Bloated; difficulty sleeping; decreased heart rate; feeling more emotional/self-pity. Also, I felt deranged from things that have been working for me. For example, 100mg pregnenolone did not make me feel good and I was suffering insomnia. Yesterday, I started spotting and today the same but more volume. So, I think Haidut's posted article re biphasic U-shaped curve on pregnenolone is at play here with the female cycling confounding things. So, yup. It is 28 days later.
Not over till the fat lady sings.

 

[chispas]

This is by far my favourite effect of androsterone (i also experience it from k-dht) i work in the construction industry (bricklayer , we are known for extremly foul language , taboo conversations and seemingly aggressive demeanor) and because at times the work can be quite monotonous resorting to ***t stirring each other with the goal of making the receiver agitated.

Androsterone and k-dht have made me almost completely immune to even the most spiteful of insults . i actually find pleasure in going to work to find out what they can come up with next to break this iron will


yeah its almost like the laws of attraction have been reduced to the principles of magnets

In another thread you mentioned consuming upwards of 5g of calcium a day. Has Kuinone had a noticeable influence on your body's metabolism of calcium? I notice that once I pass 3g of calcium, constipation starts, and I was wondering if Kuinone would minimise this to enable greater consumption of calcium?

 

[Stryker]

In another thread you mentioned consuming upwards of 5g of calcium a day. Has Kuinone had a noticeable influence on your body's metabolism of calcium? I notice that once I pass 3g of calcium, constipation starts, and I was wondering if Kuinone would minimise this to enable greater consumption of calcium?

honestly i have never really noticed any specific negative effects of high calcium but for what its worth after i started using k2 (still consuming 2g+ calcium per day , but i have only recently increased that to 5g) urinating felt better and more complete , my jaw felt very strong and locked forward but not like experiencing jaw clenching , my teeth were much smoother like i had them sanded back and lubricated and the small amount of translucent spots on my teeth vanished and i think i noticed a postive effect on skin . Actually sometimes after a shower i will put 6-7 drops of kuinone in my hands and massage it in all over my face..it seems very lifting and clarifying.

id recommend everyone use kuinone regardless of how high their calcium intake is

 

[Blossom]

It is 28 days later.

That's really awesome Regina.

 

[chispas]

honestly i have never really noticed any specific negative effects of high calcium but for what its worth after i started using k2 (still consuming 2g+ calcium per day , but i have only recently increased that to 5g) urinating felt better and more complete , my jaw felt very strong and locked forward but not like experiencing jaw clenching , my teeth were much smoother like i had them sanded back and lubricated and the small amount of translucent spots on my teeth vanished and i think i noticed a postive effect on skin . Actually sometimes after a shower i will put 6-7 drops of kuinone in my hands and massage it in all over my face..it seems very lifting and clarifying.

id recommend everyone use kuinone regardless of how high their calcium intake is

This is cool, great anecdote thanks! Does it do much for your gums as well?

 

[moss]

ay

Yay moss! I can't wait for updates from both of you.

Okay. Maybe it is not a fluke.
I have been feeling like I would get my period in the last week. (but thinking 'oh those days are over'). Bloated; difficulty sleeping; decreased heart rate; feeling more emotional/self-pity. Also, I felt deranged from things that have been working for me. For example, 100mg pregnenolone did not make me feel good and I was suffering insomnia. Yesterday, I started spotting and today the same but more volume. So, I think Haidut's posted article re biphasic U-shaped curve on pregnenolone is at play here with the female cycling confounding things. So, yup. It is 28 days later.
Not over till the fat lady sings.

That is interesting Regina thanks for updating.

For me, theoretically, I am at day 26 and I will update in a couple of weeks hopefully with another bleed!
I was going along fine at 40mg pregnenolone (taken in evenings before bed) and doing well. Then I upped to 70mg pregnenolone and after a couple of weeks I started a period and posted on this thread around Nov 16th. A couple of days into that bleed, and I was thrilled and like you Regina, I had a feeling I was getting my period and a couple of days beforehand and experienced the whole PMS shebang - a huge energy spurt the day before (just like old times) with some bloating, annoyingly impatient, sore breasts and slightly fatigued for a couple of days after, it was extremely hot couple of days here (Summer).
Despite that, I was very excited given I thought I had the last bleed in April this year. But then I continued to bleed and quite heavily in last few days of that period. At day 7 I stopped pregnenolone and started on progesterone at 5 drops at a time and increasing to around 100mg over the day for 4 days - on day 11 the bleed stopped.
I believe (for me), the jump from 40 to 70mg pregnenolone was too much too quickly (despite upping food and protein intake). I have since ditched Progest E and started back on 40mg pregnenolone and in a couple of weeks, I may titrate according to response. I found taking pregnenolone in a single dose in the evening works best and I sleep really well. I know it has been raised to space dose in smaller doses over the course of the day - truly that would do my head in. I can manage twice a day even tds but beyond that, I will forget and skip dosages except when taking progesterone to stop a bleed which will be the only time I will do that.

@Regina look forward to hearing how things continue for you.

 

[Regina]

ay




That is interesting Regina thanks for updating.

For me, theoretically, I am at day 26 and I will update in a couple of weeks hopefully with another bleed!
I was going along fine at 40mg pregnenolone (taken in evenings before bed) and doing well. Then I upped to 70mg pregnenolone and after a couple of weeks I started a period and posted on this thread around Nov 16th. A couple of days into that bleed, and I was thrilled and like you Regina, I had a feeling I was getting my period and a couple of days beforehand and experienced the whole PMS shebang - a huge energy spurt the day before (just like old times) with some bloating, annoyingly impatient, sore breasts and slightly fatigued for a couple of days after, it was extremely hot couple of days here (Summer).
Despite that, I was very excited given I thought I had the last bleed in April this year. But then I continued to bleed and quite heavily in last few days of that period. At day 7 I stopped pregnenolone and started on progesterone at 5 drops at a time and increasing to around 100mg over the day for 4 days - on day 11 the bleed stopped.
I believe (for me), the jump from 40 to 70mg pregnenolone was too much too quickly (despite upping food and protein intake). I have since ditched Progest E and started back on 40mg pregnenolone and in a couple of weeks, I may titrate according to response. I found taking pregnenolone in a single dose in the evening works best and I sleep really well. I know it has been raised to space dose in smaller doses over the course of the day - truly that would do my head in. I can manage twice a day even tds but beyond that, I will forget and skip dosages except when taking progesterone to stop a bleed which will be the only time I will do that.

@Regina look forward to hearing how things continue for you.

Thanks for the update Moss.
I wish I knew more about all this. But, yeah, mine stopped after my March menses. But I started taking pregnenolone I think maybe in October. I upped my dose to 100mg morning and another 100mg if I trained (aikido). Maybe that's what brought it back last month. I just don't know what is desirable.

 

[Regina]

honestly i have never really noticed any specific negative effects of high calcium but for what its worth after i started using k2 (still consuming 2g+ calcium per day , but i have only recently increased that to 5g) urinating felt better and more complete , my jaw felt very strong and locked forward but not like experiencing jaw clenching , my teeth were much smoother like i had them sanded back and lubricated and the small amount of translucent spots on my teeth vanished and i think i noticed a postive effect on skin . Actually sometimes after a shower i will put 6-7 drops of kuinone in my hands and massage it in all over my face..it seems very lifting and clarifying.

id recommend everyone use kuinone regardless of how high their calcium intake is

Me too. My dairy/calcium intake is high and I love kuinone. I just came home from a long post-training holiday party. My teeth feel totally smooth after training hard, eating garbage party food and drinking (red bulls w vodka).

 

[Dan010101]

Pansterone has just arrived will be taking 4 drops on my scrotum everyday, just done my first dose. Will keep ya'll updated.

Also taking estroban @ 8 drops Orally Drinking at least 2 big costa cups of milky coffee a day too, let's see what happens!

 

[Constatine]

Pansterone has just arrived will be taking 4 drops on my scrotum everyday, just done my first dose. Will keep ya'll updated.

Also taking estroban @ 8 drops Orally Drinking at least 2 big costa cups of milky coffee a day too, let's see what happens!

Welcome fellow lab rat

 

[Koveras]

Thanks @Koveras.

Another FYI :)

A low dose (6.5 mg) of intravaginal DHEA permits a strictly local action while maintaining all serum estrogens or androgens as well as their metabo... - PubMed - NCBI

 

[Blossom]

Another FYI :)

A low dose (6.5 mg) of intravaginal DHEA permits a strictly local action while maintaining all serum estrogens or androgens as well as their metabo... - PubMed - NCBI

Thanks Koveras. :)

 

[amethyst]

Absolutely, yes. If a person is able to tolerate the application on the labia majora then by all means. In fact, the female studies for vaginal dryness and atrophy due to menopause used intravaginal application of DHEA dissolved in ethanol and propylene glycol, which was probably even more irritating then applying DMSO to the labia majora. And it can probably be done once every few days, which should reduce the risk of irritation even more.

So we lose DHEA after the 20's? Ok so, men can apply the liquid? DHEA to their scrotums? Can a woman apply the powder from a capsule to their labia? Or is it better to use a liquid version? Is it ok to use it if you are not in menopause but just for your health and libido?

 

[haidut]

So we lose DHEA after the 20's? Ok so, men can apply the liquid? DHEA to their scrotums? Can a woman apply the powder from a capsule to their labia? Or is it better to use a liquid version? Is it ok to use it if you are not in menopause but just for your health and libido?

Not sure how well it would absorb if it's just the powder. Ideally, it should be in some sort of carrier that enhances absorption and at least makes it a liquid solution. Tocopherols/oil, ethanol, DMSO, PG, PEG, etc are all options for solvents. Given that DHEA-S is the only steroid correlated with sexual desire in women then probably anybody who has low libido and/confirmed low DHEA-S could benefit. Unless DHEA-S are very low most people probably do not need more than 5mg - 10mg daily.
Applying to the scrotum for males is to give the gonads both the necessary steroid precursors and some stimulation needed to make the Leydig cells synthesize androgens again. Serum androgens are indicating of gonadal activity, which is inversely correlated with adrenal activity. So, a good way to calm the adrenals is to raise the gonadal output of androgens as they oppose stress and improve metabolism.