Morning Depression

[Dopamine]

I am severly depressed and tired in the morning- it takes me at least an hour to work up the strength to crawl out of bed. I don't want to do anything in the morning. I have no appetite... I don't want to talk to anybody... I feel cold and rundown.

By the afternoon I am usually feeling pretty good. My appetite and temperature are much higher in the afternoon and I generally feel OK.

Anyone know what could be causing these fluctuations and how to fix it?

Should I try supplementing thyroid?

 

[Blossom]

I wonder if @Such_Saturation's experience in this post is similar to yours?
For Those That Have Groggy Mornings

 

[snowboard111]

It could be a bunch of biological things (obviously ) hormones (serotonin & cortisol) & such... but it could also be just your everyday life. I know it's not much of help/insight but it's a big part that is often brush aside and might be the hardest part of life to change but the one with the biggest impact on it as well... Anyway, I think Pboy had quite a good point of view about morning grumpiness and depression (it's the italic part) but the full post was good imo

--
Pboy on serotonin behaviours
I think that kind of business is more estrogen, adrenaline, and NO than it is, cortisol also, than it is serotonin. Serotonin is more like...a give up vibe...a be numbed but not in pain, just no dope or drive...just a kind of float with the wind state. The kind of thing that makes people do inhumane and harsh aggressive things is the more estrogen cortisol adrenaline side of things. Basically its a feel threatened vibe or most of the time, literally, well being is threatened..its just the kind of society that's been made, and any dietary thing that irritates intestines also promotes that part of the brain, even caffeine which is why...ultimately stimulants aren't ideal. They can be seemingly useful for survival and staying afloat in this society that's been made and collective conscious being carried by the people, but ultimately for human well being and potential we'd create something where adrenaline was never necessary.

Dopamine has to do with action that has to do with fun, exploration, expansiveness, learning, curiosity, happiness, sharing, all together enjoyment and captivation...it happens only when there isn't threats, and dopamine is also responsible for imagination, creativity, meditation, and healing to a large extent. Theres a huge albeit difficult to notice for most, but really not, difference between dopamine and adrenaline...dopamine quickly degrades into adrenaline if the situation is not a self love, fun thing, and more of a battle thing...that's how life has been set up for us since school, parents, and into the work place and college.

The part of brain that deals with love and creativity and insight, is basically all but shut off in such states...so its no wonder most people are dumb (not dumb..just major, major ignorant..and therefore destructive) and only living in concepts and no joy and little love, outside of their close family and friends to a small extent, even there lotta drama. Serotonin actually protects from the cortisol adrenaline estrogen aspects to an extent, but it doesn't bring joy, energy, motivation, like dopamine does. It happens when you're in a situation of with which dopamine outlets are stunted, and adrenal outlets are futile...basically the days will go by, you can go through them simply and gracefully, but with a sad melancholic tone to it, not really grow, energy is a slight drain in feel, and not outgoing or uplifting. If serotonin state goes on too long you're heart and digestive function will weaken and desire to even be alive, but in short term its protective, rather than bang head against wall and get no where and hurt yourself or burn bridges

The problem in our society is by far adrenalin cortisol, and its all because dopamine inevitably degrades immediately for most people, soon after they wake up, based on the forecast of the day and how much time and space they have. Your body senses a threat to deal with before the happy fun insightful mind, loving, inspiration...think kids, excited ton of energy but not like in a battle, so for most dopamine degrades into adrenaline, you go meet the threat of the day...but unfortunately, you get home at night, body knows whats gon happen tomorrow, and doesn't really let it down until sleep, then cycle repeats. Its the mind prison that's been referred to....this is why vacation or like...that's dopamine, when actually can live basically instead of fight...and if people around you are cool and/or you're more alone, it can greatly increase the chance of that

The sad thing is humans when in a dopamine free state, naturally harmonize, don't pollute, care more about others and the environment, its a loving vibe cause you're so happy you naturally want to stay that way and increase it, people are better at their jobs, more creativity, more teamwork, and everything that needs to be done in life can happen joyfully, in fact, also, more efficiently and effectively than it is now.

Some butt hurt people long ago got in power and forced their s*** onto the world, basically...lol

 

[Dopamine]

I wonder if @Such_Saturation's experience in this post is similar to yours?
For Those That Have Groggy Mornings

Yep I definitely relate to that post- it didn't look like they figured anything out though... I am wondering if it is a sleep issue like sleep apnea or something. I will take some diamox before bed tonight and see how I feel. One thing is for certain- the supplements I am taking are making things worse so I am going to drop everything and just try to get good food and sunlight in the morning and hope my body finds some balance.

It could be a bunch of biological things (obviously ) hormones (serotonin & cortisol) & such... but it could also be just your everyday life. I know it's not much of help/insight but it's a big part that is often brush aside and might be the hardest part of life to change but the one with the biggest impact on it as well... Anyway, I think Pboy had quite a good point of view about morning grumpiness and depression (it's the italic part) but the full post was good imo

--
Pboy on serotonin behaviours
I think that kind of business is more estrogen, adrenaline, and NO than it is, cortisol also, than it is serotonin. Serotonin is more like...a give up vibe...a be numbed but not in pain, just no dope or drive...just a kind of float with the wind state. The kind of thing that makes people do inhumane and harsh aggressive things is the more estrogen cortisol adrenaline side of things. Basically its a feel threatened vibe or most of the time, literally, well being is threatened..its just the kind of society that's been made, and any dietary thing that irritates intestines also promotes that part of the brain, even caffeine which is why...ultimately stimulants aren't ideal. They can be seemingly useful for survival and staying afloat in this society that's been made and collective conscious being carried by the people, but ultimately for human well being and potential we'd create something where adrenaline was never necessary.

Dopamine has to do with action that has to do with fun, exploration, expansiveness, learning, curiosity, happiness, sharing, all together enjoyment and captivation...it happens only when there isn't threats, and dopamine is also responsible for imagination, creativity, meditation, and healing to a large extent. Theres a huge albeit difficult to notice for most, but really not, difference between dopamine and adrenaline...dopamine quickly degrades into adrenaline if the situation is not a self love, fun thing, and more of a battle thing...that's how life has been set up for us since school, parents, and into the work place and college.

The part of brain that deals with love and creativity and insight, is basically all but shut off in such states...so its no wonder most people are dumb (not dumb..just major, major ignorant..and therefore destructive) and only living in concepts and no joy and little love, outside of their close family and friends to a small extent, even there lotta drama. Serotonin actually protects from the cortisol adrenaline estrogen aspects to an extent, but it doesn't bring joy, energy, motivation, like dopamine does. It happens when you're in a situation of with which dopamine outlets are stunted, and adrenal outlets are futile...basically the days will go by, you can go through them simply and gracefully, but with a sad melancholic tone to it, not really grow, energy is a slight drain in feel, and not outgoing or uplifting. If serotonin state goes on too long you're heart and digestive function will weaken and desire to even be alive, but in short term its protective, rather than bang head against wall and get no where and hurt yourself or burn bridges

The problem in our society is by far adrenalin cortisol, and its all because dopamine inevitably degrades immediately for most people, soon after they wake up, based on the forecast of the day and how much time and space they have. Your body senses a threat to deal with before the happy fun insightful mind, loving, inspiration...think kids, excited ton of energy but not like in a battle, so for most dopamine degrades into adrenaline, you go meet the threat of the day...but unfortunately, you get home at night, body knows whats gon happen tomorrow, and doesn't really let it down until sleep, then cycle repeats. Its the mind prison that's been referred to....this is why vacation or like...that's dopamine, when actually can live basically instead of fight...and if people around you are cool and/or you're more alone, it can greatly increase the chance of that

The sad thing is humans when in a dopamine free state, naturally harmonize, don't pollute, care more about others and the environment, its a loving vibe cause you're so happy you naturally want to stay that way and increase it, people are better at their jobs, more creativity, more teamwork, and everything that needs to be done in life can happen joyfully, in fact, also, more efficiently and effectively than it is now.

Some butt hurt people long ago got in power and forced their s*** onto the world, basically...lol

That is an interesting read, thanks for the input

 

[Blossom]

One thing is for certain- the supplements I am taking are making things worse so I am going to drop everything and just try to get good food and sunlight in the morning and hope my body finds some balance.

I've done that before for several weeks and found it helpful. It seems good to get back to baseline and then add back supplements one at a time to better judge what is needed. Hope that works out for you.

 

[Rafe]

Morning is the time of day when the organism has the most accumulation of stress after hours of darkness. The morning is the most vulnerable time, metabolically. It takes some hours for the metabolism to peak. For me, supplements and high energy food are most critical in the morning (and before bed to face the dark hours). My metabolism isn't good enough yet to get out of bed and eat a big breakfast, so I start with high sugar and salt. I take more supplements than I can recommend to others, but to me they compensate the accumulated stress of night.

 

[Rafe]

Sorry , I didn't see this last post. Yes, there is a state in the morning, the way I see it, in which the metabolism could be so compromised that a very careful supplement strategy would be needed. You have seen it before--you have to find the sweet spot for pushing the body to metabolize. Maybe just sugar & salt in some easy-to-digest food.

 

[Dopamine]

Sorry , I didn't see this last post. Yes, there is a state in the morning, the way I see it, in which the metabolism could be so compromised that a very careful supplement strategy would be needed. You have seen it before--you have to find the sweet spot for pushing the body to metabolize. Maybe just sugar & salt in some easy-to-digest food.

I'm thinking that i'm not converting t4 into t3 in the morning. Cortisol inhibits this conversion and cortisol is highest in the morning hence my morning hypothyroidism. I know sugar helps this conversion so maybe I will have juice or coke on my bedside table for when I wake up. Also coconut oil and salt before bed and when I wake up is worth a try I think.

 

[Such_Saturation]

I wonder if @Such_Saturation's experience in this post is similar to yours?
For Those That Have Groggy Mornings

Well I don't feel depression but still I think it comes down to sleeping not too much and not too little. So if your alarm is fixed, go to bed earlier and dont eat before bed (not a Ray Peat piece of advice).

 

[tara]

I am severly depressed and tired in the morning- it takes me at least an hour to work up the strength to crawl out of bed.

Tried putting half a glass of OJ by the bed to drink as soon as you wake up?

I am wondering if it is a sleep issue like sleep apnea or something.

Are you sleeping with mouth open or shut? If open, closing it might make a difference.