Are Omega 3s Bad For The Skin?

[absolutelypure]

I'm making my own high sat/low PUFA skin care (for sale later on this year) and realise I'm going to be a lone voice in the wilderness because most natural skin care makers are touting the wonders of 'healthy plant oils' all over the place, so I've really got my work cut out for me.

Would anyone care to weigh in with their thoughts on the (mis?) information and opinions expressed in this article - and the comments too?
It's the only thing I could find on the subject, apart from the one referred to in the article which they more or less ridicule.

It's not a long read: Are Omega–3 Essential Fatty Acids bad for skin? Episode 41

 

[Lightbringer]

Probably best to emphasize the benefits of whichever oil you are using along with stuff like lack of additives etc. You can also research how other folks do their marketing, for example:
Pure Coconut Oil Soap

 

[PakPik]

Welcome, @absolutelypure !

I'd take that website with a grain of salt. They seem to have some strong ties to the cosmetics chemicals industry. Regarding the Polyunsaturated fats topic, the blogger didn't give any real argument to discredit the studies already done on the problematic properties of the them, specifically their high peroxidability. One of his arguments is that Peat doesn't have peer reviewed articles, another is that some of the studies that Peat references aren't recent. Those aren't real arguments.

The "best" argument he came up with is in reference to the following paper: -www.aak.com/global/cosmetic_emollients_nov06.pdf

He says in reference to it:

"These oils do oxidize and I did find some research addressing this problem. Not from a “ it’s bad for skin” perspective but just a “don’t let the oil go rancid.” I’ll put a link to that study in the show notes but essentially what it says by mixing the polyunsaturates with other types of oils (canola) and with antioxidants you can greatly reduce the amount that the polyunsaturate is oxidized."​

However, he completely missed specifying that the paper mixed the PUFAs with a partially hydrogenated canola oil, very far from normal canola oil. Quoting from the paper:

"This paper describes a study we conducted to demonstrate the antioxidant and photo-protecting effects of the natural tocopherols and phytosterols in a partially-hydrogenated and fractionated low-erucic rapeseed oil (fractionated canola oil, FCO; ...). The oil is characterized by a high content of monounsaturated fatty acids in combination with elevated levels of alpha- and gamma-tocopherols, and phytosterols. The minor lipid composition of FCO is given in Table 1. The typical low content of polyunsaturated fatty acids in combination with the tocopherols in FCO results in a liquid oil with high stability to oxidation (OSI >100 hours at 110°C ). Common vegetable oils rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids show typical OSI values of < 8 hours at 110°C."​

They clarified they had to keep the proportion of PUFAs very low for successfully protecting it from lipid peroxidation, proving again how fragile they are:

"Addition of FCO will provide sufficient tocopherols to prevent oxidation of PUFA as long as the proportion of PUFA in the mixture does not exceed 3–4%."
​

So, in a nutshell, they made a mixture of the highly peroxidable high PUFA oils with a low PUFA oil that was also high in natural vitamin E and phytosterols, and discovered that keeping the concentration of PUFA to less than 4% plus a decent amount of vitamin E acts as an antioxidant, in other words, renders less susceptibility to lipid peroxidation. But all of this is old news, dating decades back, and in fact this is exactly what Peat focus so much on: the proportion of PUFAs as a key determinant of how problematic they can get, and the importance of vitamin E for protecting them:

"It isn't the quantity of these polyunsaturated oils which governs the harm they do, but the relationship between them and the saturated fats. Obesity, free radical production, the formation of age pigment, blood clotting, inflammation, immunity, and energy production are all responsive to the ratio of unsaturated fats to saturated fats, and the higher this ratio is, the greater the probability of harm there is. " Unsaturated Vegetable Oils: Toxic​

"One of the perennial theories of aging that has remained viable is the metaplasm/lipofuscin/age pigment theory, the idea that a toxic material accumulates in tissues over time. The age pigment contains proteins, cross-linked PUFA, and metals. The inhibition of proteolytic enzymes is involved in its accumulation, and the ratio of PUFA to saturated fatty acids is an important factor in its formation." Suitable Fats, Unsuitable Fats: Issues in Nutrition
​

I'm no expert, but I can see that if anything the only true argument given by the blogger discredits his position and confirms what Peat says.

Now regarding the omega 3, there's so much conflicting information. What I am convinced up to this point is they probably are essential -though Peat claims they aren't-, but only need to be taken in minute amounts to cover those needs. A person goes overly beyond that required amount chronically, and may be in for trouble. One of the main reasons to that is that the O-3 are the most unstable, easy to peroxidize oils. Since the topic here is the skin, I'll just mention that an excessive quantity of omega 3 increases the risk of formation of lipofuscin (age spots), and will age prematurely the body's antioxidant defenses, starting with quick depletion of vitamin E, and then following other nutrients like selenium, etc, which of course will likely end up showing up in the skin. Check out the concept of "net vitamin E" and you'll see fish oil ranks the worse Vitamin E Requirements May Be Higher Than Ray Recommends

Just as anecdotal evidence, Fred Kummerow, a biochemist specializing in lipids who is 101 years old, has been avoiding unphysiological amount of PUFAs and industrial trans fats for over 60 years. His skin is wonderful, very smooth and doesn't have visible lipofuscin spots, which is unbelievable for such an old person! He explains his dietary choices here: http://wphna.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/WN-2015-06-01-02-72-78-Idea-Fred-Kummerow-My-diet-JF.pdf

I wonder if @schultz has any thoughts to share? :)

I hope this helps!

 

[lollipop]

Welcome, @absolutelypure !

I'd take that website with a grain of salt. They seem to have some strong ties to the cosmetics chemicals industry. Regarding the Polyunsaturated fats topic, the blogger didn't give any real argument to discredit the studies already done on the problematic properties of the them, specifically their high peroxidability. One of his arguments is that Peat doesn't have peer reviewed articles, another is that some of the studies that Peat references aren't recent. Those aren't real arguments.

The "best" argument he came up with is in reference to the following link : -http://www.aak.com/global/cosmetic_emollients_nov06.pdf

He says in reference to it:

"These oils do oxidize and I did find some research addressing this problem. Not from a “ it’s bad for skin” perspective but just a “don’t let the oil go rancid.” I’ll put a link to that study in the show notes but essentially what it says by mixing the polyunsaturates with other types of oils (canola) and with antioxidants you can greatly reduce the amount that the polyunsaturate is oxidized."​

However, he completely missed specifying that the paper mixed the PUFAs with a partially hydrogenated canola oil, very far from normal canola oil. Quoting from the paper:

"This paper describes a study we conducted to demonstrate the antioxidant and photo-protecting effects of the natural tocopherols and phytosterols in a partially-hydrogenated and fractionated low-erucic rapeseed oil (fractionated canola oil, FCO; ...). The oil is characterized by a high content of monounsaturated fatty acids in combination with elevated levels of alpha- and gamma-tocopherols, and phytosterols. The minor lipid composition of FCO is given in Table 1. The typical low content of polyunsaturated fatty acids in combination with the tocopherols in FCO results in a liquid oil with high stability to oxidation (OSI >100 hours at 110°C ). Common vegetable oils rich in polyunsaturated fatty acids show typical OSI values of < 8 hours at 110°C."​

They clarified they had to keep the proportion of PUFAs very low for successfully protecting it from lipid peroxidation, proving again how fragile they are:

"Addition of FCO will provide sufficient tocopherols to prevent oxidation of PUFA as long as the proportion of PUFA in the mixture does not exceed 3–4%."
​

So, in a nutshell, they made a mixture of the highly peroxidable high PUFA oils with a low PUFA oil that was also high in natural vitamin E and phytosterols, and discovered that keeping the concentration of PUFA to less than 4% plus a decent amount of vitamin E acts as an antioxidant, in other words, renders less susceptibility to lipid peroxidation. But all of this is old news, dating decades back, and in fact this is exactly what Peat focus so much on: the proportion of PUFAs as a key determinant of how problematic they can get, and the importance of vitamin E for protecting them:

"It isn't the quantity of these polyunsaturated oils which governs the harm they do, but the relationship between them and the saturated fats. Obesity, free radical production, the formation of age pigment, blood clotting, inflammation, immunity, and energy production are all responsive to the ratio of unsaturated fats to saturated fats, and the higher this ratio is, the greater the probability of harm there is. " Unsaturated Vegetable Oils: Toxic​

"One of the perennial theories of aging that has remained viable is the metaplasm/lipofuscin/age pigment theory, the idea that a toxic material accumulates in tissues over time. The age pigment contains proteins, cross-linked PUFA, and metals. The inhibition of proteolytic enzymes is involved in its accumulation, and the ratio of PUFA to saturated fatty acids is an important factor in its formation." Suitable Fats, Unsuitable Fats: Issues in Nutrition
​

So, if anything the only true argument given by the blogger discredits his position and confirms what Peat says.

Now regarding the omega 3, there's so much conflicting information. What I am convinced up to this point is they probably are essential -though Peat claims they aren't-, but only need to be taken in minute amounts to cover those needs. A person goes overly beyond that required amount chronically, and may be in for trouble. One of the main reasons to that is that the O-3 are the most unstable, easy to peroxidize oils. Since the topic here is the skin, I'll just mention that an excessive quantity of omega 3 increases the risk of formation of lipofuscin (age spots), and will age prematurely the body's antioxidant defenses, starting with quick depletion of vitamin E, and then following other nutrients like selenium, etc, which of course will likely end up showing up in the skin. Check out the concept of "net vitamin E" and you'll see fish oil ranks the worse Vitamin E Requirements May Be Higher Than Ray Recommends

Just as anecdotal evidence, Fred Kummerow, a biochemist specializing in lipids who is 101 years old, has been avoiding unphysiological amount of PUFAs and industrial trans fats for over 60 years. His skin is wonderful, very smooth and doesn't have visible lipofuscin spots, which is unbelievable for such an old person! He explains his dietary choices here: http://wphna.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/WN-2015-06-01-02-72-78-Idea-Fred-Kummerow-My-diet-JF.pdf

View attachment 3333 View attachment 3334

I wonder if @schultz has any thoughts to share? :)

I hope this helps!

WoW @PakPik this is quite a sophisticated reply! Fantastic.

 

[PakPik]

Thank you @lisaferraro :) . I guess being lied to as costumers and patients has just gotten very old.

 

[lollipop]

Thank you @lisaferraro :) . I guess being lied to as costumers and patients has just gotten very old.

Amen. And as way of contributing to the thread here is sad research about Omega 3 and problems with oxidation that I posted in the Ray Peat Reads group on Facebook:

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/07/160722104537.htm

 

[PakPik]

as way of contributing to the thread here is sad research about Omega 3 and problems with oxidation that I posted in the Ray Peat Reads group on Facebook:

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2016/07/160722104537.htm

I shouldn't be surprised, but ... ! Hopefully pregnant women will learn about the news.

 

[mangoes]

Just as anecdotal evidence, Fred Kummerow, a biochemist specializing in lipids who is 101 years old, has been avoiding unphysiological amount of PUFAs and industrial trans fats for over 60 years. His skin is wonderful, very smooth and doesn't have visible lipofuscin spots, which is unbelievable for such an old person! He explains his dietary choices here: http://wphna.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/WN-2015-06-01-02-72-78-Idea-Fred-Kummerow-My-diet-JF.pdf

View attachment 3333 View attachment 3334

Wow, that is actually amazing! His skin almost looks photoshopped!

 

[absolutelypure]

@PakPik Thanks for taking the time to respond, much appreciated.
Anyone else you know of, apart from Peat, Enig and Kummerow who have researched lipids?