Potatoes Aren't Peaty

[Elysium]

what is your point other than to point out Ray isn't a fan of potatoes? (sincere and serious question)

Constant, persistent, desperate need to justify one's dietary choices to others and a desire to have them validated by peers in spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

 

[sladerunner69]

Not true. He did nutritional consultations for years all the way up until 2012 when Roddy/Stone blew him up and he started receiving too many emails which is why he removed the contact form from his website. I emailed him in 2011 before that happened and he said it was $60 for a half hour nutrition consultation. Again.....nutrition.....consultation. Those words have meaning. He did house calls in Oregon for years, specifically for nutrition and hormone advice.

Yes there is that one quote "My recommendation is to eat to increase the metabolic rate (usually temperature and heart rate), rather than any particular foods.." but I think that quote was a gaffe. That quote is the only reason you make that argument but it's clear that most people would disagree.

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Okay, why don't you send him an email and ask him if you can eat potatoes. Explain to him that you eat the standard western diet with plenty of pufa, grains, muscle meat, and like to be health concious by avoiding sugar and eating a big raw salad fairly often. Tell him you have been considerring adding potatoes and butter for lunch instead of whatever fried crap most people have. Ask him if he thinks that will help raise your metabolism.

See what I'm saying? I think youre losing touch with your base, the primary goal is to increase the metabolism and 99.9999% of people will benefit from potatoes. Yeah you could excise potatoes from your diet if you are trying to avoid starch and endotoxin, but let's not play the "Im more peaty than you are" game. We have guys eating gummy worms and milkshakes, guys drinking nothing but orange juice and milk, guys eating cheesecake, girls drinking 20cups of coffee a day for progessterone, etc etc etc

I see what you mean about the starch but I dont think Peat would approve of placing labels on foods as "peat approved"

 

[X3CyO]

Fruit is best, everything else is in context.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

Constant, persistent, desperate need to justify one's dietary choices to others and a desire to have them validated by peers in spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Umm, you must not know me. I see that you're new here. That doesn't make sense because I eat potatoes and have been talking about them on here for years. To the contrary, me posting this email shows just the opposite. I couldn't care less if people whom I'll never meet in person validate the food I ingest. You've got it all wrong. This is simply discussion for those who share a similar interest. I don't need anyones approval. I just enjoy the topic of nutritional philosophies.

Okay, why don't you send him an email and ask him if you can eat potatoes. Explain to him that you eat the standard western diet with plenty of pufa, grains, muscle meat, and like to be health concious by avoiding sugar and eating a big raw salad fairly often. Tell him you have been considerring adding potatoes and butter for lunch instead of whatever fried crap most people have. Ask him if he thinks that will help raise your metabolism.

See what I'm saying? I think youre losing touch with your base, the primary goal is to increase the metabolism and 99.9999% of people will benefit from potatoes. Yeah you could excise potatoes from your diet if you are trying to avoid starch and endotoxin, but let's not play the "Im more peaty than you are" game. We have guys eating gummy worms and milkshakes, guys drinking nothing but orange juice and milk, guys eating cheesecake, girls drinking 20cups of coffee a day for progessterone, etc etc etc

I see what you mean about the starch but I dont think Peat would approve of placing labels on foods as "peat approved"

I completely disagree.

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[Such_Saturation]

The self redpilling is intense

 

[Milena]

Here's what you can't grasp:

Search this forum for the term "potato" and/or "potatoes."

You will find hundreds of people with their introduction posts saying "Hi All! I've been lurking here for a while and now I want to say hi and tell you about myself." And in their diet they will mention that they eat potatoes. And then they will go on to mention some problem(s). Well, I just provided proof that the person who this forum is named after and is the whole purpose of this forum existing does not consume potatoes. Therefore, the person who is eating potatoes and is saying that they still have problems after "Peating" is not really Peating. And what are they coming here for other than to learn how to Peat? Now, with this thread, they will know that they should eliminate potatoes and all starch if they are here on "The Ray Peat Forum" and they are looking for help and dietary advice.

Ray Peat doesn't eat potatoes, or potato juice.

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So, my take is, get rid of your problems eating the Peat promoted TYPES of foods. Then add in anything you wish that doesn't bring you down aligning with Peat's recommendations as to the metabolic effect of them.

 

[Elysium]

Umm, you must not know me. I see that you're new here. That doesn't make sense because I eat potatoes and have been talking about them on here for years. To the contrary, me posting this email shows just the opposite. I couldn't care less if people whom I'll never meet in person validate the food I ingest. You've got it all wrong. This is simply discussion for those who share a similar interest. I don't need anyones approval. I just enjoy the topic of nutritional philosophies.

Actually I've been reading this forum regularly for the past two years. So not that new. One thing I do recall periodically is anyone in any way badmouthing starch is a like a dog whistle to you, running in instantly and pulling out the same set of out-of-context Peat quotes to prove the opposite. There's nothing wrong with being passionate about starch or just eating whatever works for you, it is the militant condescending preaching style and the above mentioned need for validation that's a bit off putting. This particular thread here is a weird new angle on the same old thing, and frankly I don't understand it that I'll admit.

But that "you're not a Peatarian" bit..what the hell is that? Peat is not a cult, the term Peatarian is merely a lighthearted descriptive for people who are interested in what Peat has to say. There's no definition, and there are certainly no rules. Chill, eat your starch, live, and let live.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

running in instantly and pulling out the same set of out-of-context Peat quotes to prove the opposite.

Please provide one quote that I used that was out of context. Any one of the quotes I used were in fact quotes. Peat is human and is allowed to contradict himself, and/or change his mind at any time, meaning some of those quotes contradict the one in this thread. Why say something is a perfect food and then say this? Because he's free to change his mind just as he did with mushrooms. For example, in this one, he says the word starch. That's not my voice. That's his voice. Don't then take me out of context and claim that I'm taking him to of context.

it is the militant condescending preaching style

Militant. Ha. Funny you say that when you just said "It is stupid. Extremely stupid. You are harming yourself. And it should in no way be associated with Ray Peat." - Elysium

and the above mentioned need for validation that's a bit off putting.

This again, don't need it, never will. It's just a discussion. If we were sitting in a coffee shop instead of typing on a forum, there would be no misconceptions of tone.

Peatarian is merely a lighthearted descriptive for people who are interested in what Peat has to say.

I disagree. People are free to do and say as they wish and I'm free to call them weird because they contradict themselves and/or they are misinformed.

There's no definition, and there are certainly no rules.

I disagree.

Chill, eat your starch, live, and let live.

I'm having a discussion on a public forum. Don't tell me what to do. Contribute to the actual topic or don't comment. Well, you're free to comment, but it's just disappointing when people derail the thread from it's actual topic.

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[Elysium]

Well, I'm glad we've got that settled.

 

[schultz]

Potatoes are still healthy, they are just not optimal. Fruit is better than starch, as Ray has always said. Ray always mentions you should eat starch with fat.

Taste is an important individual factor for people. If you're eating things you don't enjoy, that is not optimal. Ray likes turnips, so they are now a better food for him than for someone who doesn't like turnips.

Potatoes have a lot going for them. Low PUFA, high in vitamins and minerals, good quality protein. Ray himself is trying to be optimal, possibly because he is old and doesn't want to die, so he doesn't eat potatoes because he can get better things like fruit. Potatoes might be the perfect food for a poor 20 year old who has no allergy problems with potatoes and can't access good fruit.

Fruit is best

+1

Why say something is a perfect food and then say this?

He actually said almost a perfect food.

If we were sitting in a coffee shop instead of typing on a forum, there would be no misconceptions of tone.

Fair point. It can be hard sometimes speaking to people on the internet. I probably come across as rigid and formal (maybe) but I am actually very easy going and fun (I'd like to think ) Who am I kidding I'm not fun

 

[Sunny Jack]

There isn't anything new or shocking in that Ray Peat quote, though. He has always said that starch, including potatoes, was an inferior source of carbohydrate to fructose. And we knew Ray did not eat potatoes because he never mentioned them in any of his responses to 'what do you eat on a day?' questions. The quote itself is from 2015.

So is this post more of a philosophical shift in your definition of what styles of eating count as 'Peating', based on a reconsideration on your part rather than any new evidence?

 

[Westside PUFAs]

He actually said almost a perfect food.

The word was "nearly" and it was used in the same sentence for milk as well.

Also:

"Hasn’t there been in the past or is some kind of anti-cancer therapy in Europe where they juice potatoes? Did I read that somewhere?"-Patrick Timpone

"I haven’t heard of it, but it’s an amazing food."-RP in response to Patrick

There isn't anything new or shocking in that Ray Peat quote, though.

Many people don't know though, from what I see on social media and here. To claim that potatoes are Peaty is just factually not true. It's almost like claiming that canola oil is Peaty. He consumes neither.

So is this post more of a philosophical shift in your definition of what styles of eating count as 'Peating', based on a reconsideration on your part rather than any new evidence?

I think definitions are important. I don't like lumping things together. Things lose meaning. I highly disagree with the notion "there is no Peat diet." There's absolutely is. People should stop being so loose. They can do what they want but they sound retarded when they lump things together that shouldn't be lumped together and are clear contradictions and/or misinformation.

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[raypeatclips]

. It's almost like claiming that canola oil is Peaty. He consumes neither.

That would be true if he had praised canola oil on multiple occasions called it a nearly perfect food etc strange comparison.

What are you trying to achieve from this topic? Are you still eating lots of potatoes yourself?

 

[pimpnamedraypeat]

You remind me of me with this compulsive drive to tear down your idols.

I'm guessing high conflict childhood.

 

[lvysaur]

I wonder to what extent "potato intolerance" correlates with amylase levels.

Just like some people don't make enough lactase, some just don't produce enough amylase. They're not equipped to eat starch heavy foods.

From memory, northern Europeans tend to have more low amylase producers than the Japanese. I would expect this amount of "low amylasers" to increase as you went further to the north and east of Europe.

Low amylase producers also tend to be more obese, and I'm sure this forum has more obese/formerly obese people than the average population.

 

[Such_Saturation]

From my experience I think starch flora really doesn't get along with dairy flora.

 

[schultz]

The word was "nearly" and it was used in the same sentence for milk as well.

I was thinking of his quote from the Eluv interview

"Starch like potatoes, are almost a perfect food if they are very well cooked, because you want to break down the starch and the non-starch ingredients of a potato have almost a perfect balance of nutrients, B vitamins, the essential amino acids, carbohydrates in the right proportion and the only thing is lacking in a pure potato diet would be vitamin A and vitamin B12."

Also:

"Hasn’t there been in the past or is some kind of anti-cancer therapy in Europe where they juice potatoes? Did I read that somewhere?"-Patrick Timpone

"I haven’t heard of it, but it’s an amazing food."-RP in response to Patrick

I think two things can be true at the same time. Ray may not consume them, but he is still allowed to think they are an amazing food. It's true they are an amazing food. Apparently the starch combined with the allergy issue he has with potatoes is a deal breaker for him.

 

[Xisca]

There is a difference between what one eats and one can recommand.
Not all people have the same issues.
Nor the same money...

Potatoe is not perfect, but sugar is not either!
You should eat sugar only when you cannot get decent fruits...
And I am sure that many "lazy" people eat sugar and canned fruits or juice because it is easier, or also cheaper. Many of Peat's advices look for me as solutions that can fit people with little money that cannot get the best solutions. If you have money, you can buy expansive tropical fruits all the time!

Ho, and not the same gut. What if you have gut problem with fructose? Then eat potatoes.
What if you have problems with starch? Eat fruits honey and sugar.
So, I do not know if peaty means what he eats or what he recommends... He sure knows people have specificities of different type.
The best is to understand the global principles don't you think so? And then experiment. That's what Peat did for himself, may be peaty, if the word can be used, is just about experimenting and be able to see the results and experiment more, with some help of good science, because it can make experimenting shorter!
Peat brings good science, then we experiment and see what matches our body!

 

[DawN]

@Xisca: Very well stated!
@Such_Saturation: I find your statement very interesting. But could you try to explain your observations a bit? What kind/set of symptoms did you experience while ingesting starchy foods alongside with milky foods. And: What do you think about cutting out the Milk and Cheese (obviously both heavy loaden with cow-specific bacteria and/or precursors of it) but keeping up with butter as a mere "neutral" and less harmful source for fat? And just to clarify your tier at least at this thread: Do you "true peat" and keep it up with the milk, or are you a heretic (just like me ) and prefer the potatoes and rice more?

 

[Xisca]

Thanks!
I am just having some evening potatoes with butter and salt, and some leek.
I sadly try to eat less butter, to try a real low fat diet, as I think Denise Minger is right about choosing one as main source, and not the marsh between the 2.

Today earlier I had apples, a big papaya, several bananas, 1 egg, coffee, coconut oil, a carrot, and a big piece of liver with onions and zuchini, and honey.
I eat cheese because I cannot have the right good milk, any way I digest better the cheese. I would not live on OJ and milk... Even if some thrive on it.

BTW my stomach does not even like the idea of putting milk in starch, same as I would not mix meat and starch. Many diets separate those 2.

I finished my potatoes with some saur cream, so I did not open a new packet of butter...
The problem with eating starch is that I go up into eating real lots of butter!
The 250gr packet can be gone in 2 days...