Does anyone have experience with supplemental manganese?

[mostlylurking]

Thank you @TheSir.

@mostlylurking, thanks for the info. I have tried quite a few things; among those discussed on this forum frequently has been high-dose aspirin, high-dose niacinamide + taurine, and a few of the different forms of thiamine + supporting B vitamins as well. None of them have really made a dent. Prior to that, I went for years low-carb + strenuous exercise to keep BG "under control". That probably damaged my glucose metabolism even more in the long-run, especially given my ancestry and the problems they've had with the issue.

I'm now moving toward the RP style of eating as it just makes too much sense, and am trying to avoid going low-carb again in order to control BG w/o drugs.

I believe that besides PUFA poisoning I may be missing some X-Factor(s) that have been depleted thru years of the SAD diet + years of low-carb. I have not given mineral supplementation a fair shot, and haven't tried Manganese at all, so am looking for an effective manganese supplement to take along with a "multi-mineral" type supplement.

I did many years of low-carb dieting. I also was raised on PUFA and did not get it out of my diet until 2015 (at age 65) when I found Ray Peat's website.

Are you taking any biotin? I've found biotin to be very helpful. Here's some info on biotin:

Protective effect of supplementation with biotin against high-fructose-induced metabolic syndrome in rats - PubMed

Several reports have demonstrated that pharmacological concentrations of biotin reduce hyperglycemia, hypertriglyceridemia, and hypertension. We hypothesized that biotin could exert a protective effect on some illness-associated metabolic syndrome. To test this hypothesis, male Wistar rats were...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Chromium picolinate and biotin combination improves glucose metabolism in treated, uncontrolled overweight to obese patients with type 2 diabetes - PubMed

These results suggest that the chromium picolinate/biotin combination, administered as an adjuvant to current prescription anti-diabetic medication, can improve glycaemic control in overweight to obese individuals with type 2 diabetes; especially those patients with poor glycaemic control on...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Biotin supplementation improves glucose and insulin tolerances in genetically diabetic KK mice - PubMed

Because biotin treatment may lower blood glucose in insulin-dependent diabetes, we chose to study such an effect in non-insulin dependent diabetes. Twenty-six diabetic KK mice, moderately hyperglycemic and insulin resistant, were treated for 10 weeks: 9 animals with 2 mg of biotin/Kg, 8 with 4...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

[Effects of biotin on blood glucose regulation in type 2 diabetes rat model] - PubMed

The possible mechanism of the decreasing biotin blood sugar in diabetic rats may by promoting the synthesis of glycogenand reducing gluconeogenesis.

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Biotin

I take a tiny little pinch of biotin each morning (about 1/64th (?) of a teaspoon). I have not experimented with taking more; this small amount seems to be helpful for me.

I'm taking high dose thiamine hcl; 1 gram 2Xday. It lowers my blood sugar to the point that I'm really hungry within an hour of taking it. I know that 2 grams/day sounds like a lot but thiamine hcl does not absorb very well in the small intestine. 2 grams/day for 7 days is said to equal a single 100mg injection of thiamine hcl per week (see Dr. Costantini's information here).

 

[mostlylurking]

I have not given mineral supplementation a fair shot, and haven't tried Manganese at all, so am looking for an effective manganese supplement to take along with a "multi-mineral" type supplement.

Ray Peat cautions about supplementing with minerals because you can get yourself into trouble pretty easily. He advises eating some shellfish (cooked oysters, shrimp, crab, lobster) each week as the safest way to get the minerals that you need.

 

[artist]

I’m in favor of moderate supplementation (doing this myself) but it’s worth noting that some of the reviews for the 50mg Solaray pills are horror stories (just look at the 1 stars, supposedly some sustained neurological damage). Of course most reviewers handle even that dosage fine, but I wouldn’t risk it. It definitely is annoying to conflate toxicity from inhaling it with supplementation, but the idea that oral toxicity is impossible is something I wouldn’t want anyone to run too far with…

 

[Krigeren]

@mostlylurking, I have tried biotin, but not doses that high of Thiamin HCL. Should be easy to test if it has that same effect for me w/ the glucose monitor, plus it's cheap and safe. I used fairly high (100mg/day) doses of Thiamax and am pretty sure I absorbed the supplement ok based on the sulphur related side-effects, but IIRC I've seen some others mention that Thiamin HCL was the only form that eventually gave them results; maybe that's me also.

@artist, @mostlylurking : I don't plan on taking large amounts of any mineral for an extended period of time. I will start w/ 10mg/day of manganese and see how it treats me. Basically I'm experimenting to figure out what if anything will make a difference and will then modify diet for the long term.

 

[mostlylurking]

@mostlylurking, I have tried biotin, but not doses that high of Thiamin HCL. Should be easy to test if it has that same effect for me w/ the glucose monitor, plus it's cheap and safe. I used fairly high (100mg/day) doses of Thiamax and am pretty sure I absorbed the supplement ok based on the sulphur related side-effects, but IIRC I've seen some others mention that Thiamin HCL was the only form that eventually gave them results; maybe that's me also.

@artist, @mostlylurking : I don't plan on taking large amounts of any mineral for an extended period of time. I will start w/ 10mg/day of manganese and see how it treats me. Basically I'm experimenting to figure out what if anything will make a difference and will then modify diet for the long term.

I suspect that the effect of the biotin can be pretty subtle. I really didn't notice a response to it.

I've settled on the 2 grams of thiamine hcl/day plus the little pinch of biotin 1Xday, also 90mg of niacinamide 4Xday, 90mg of riboflavin 4Xday, about 12mg B6 1Xday, around a gram of magnesium glycinate/day, and 2.5 grams/day of calcium. In the past two years I've lost 30 pounds and my energy level is good; I'm 72. My fasting blood glucose was right at 100 two years ago, now it measures 93. I'm hypothyroid and take prescription desiccated thyroid medication.

 

[Inabruzzo]

Still on my quest to fix my libido. Second day taking 3-5mg manganese supplements and I currently have a semi-functioning libido for once. I think mineral supplementation could go wrong so I’m being cautious.. but I’ve never taken anything that brought back my libido like this. Been gone for 3+ years after I took testosterone and came off. It also made my sleep very deep, something I’m also unfamiliar with.

Is it possible they manganese raises estrogen? I know that spikes of estrogen can increase libido temporarily, and I doubt it’s raising androgens to any reasonable degree. Anyways, my testosterone levels are fine.

It’s effect is similar to how thiamine was when it worked. I’m burning carbs, feel like a furnace.

I get pretty irritable when I use too much maple syrup (more than a tablespoon) which is high in manganese. Other sucrose doesn’t bother me at all. Might be the other minerals, so I’m only guessing.