An Almost Fat Free, Starch Free Experiment

[Such_Saturation]

Put butter in coffee.

 

[SQu]

This week this list stopped working for me. The reason quite simply is a big jump in stress as I get back into my so-called 'normal' life. Within 4 days I found myself unsatisfied, restless, climbing the walls. Belly fat up a little before I even started experimenting further. Depressed, overwhelmed.

I found myself wandering the supermarket thinking " what??? What is it?" I tried to be intuitive and chose the following: salty potato chips (which I quickly tired of) ; a hard cheese which satisfied me, but which in the past I know I tire of within days; a few tbs honey which did not satisfy me,; and nougat ,which did. I think I needed a bit more salt. But the nougat im still having days later.

Nougat:
I think the glucose/ fructose thing comes in here. the main ingredient listed is glucose syrup. More than 33%. After that macadamia nuts then cane sugar then honey. Then wafer paper (egg white potato starch and palm oil,) then vanilla flavouring.

I wanted intense sweetness but not honey. This is glucose but not starch. I know it relies on the accompanying cane sugar and honey for sweetness. I dont think it's fat I'm going for as my usual favourite, butter, leaves me cold right now. I dont specially want the nuts.

I couldn't understand why I still wanted sweetness when I'd had lots of fruit, fructose, honey. Glucose not as starch may explain it. Maybe. Today I'm going to get glucose powder and continue experimenting.

Thyroid started to give me adrenalin resorts too so I'm slowing down on that too.

 

[SQu]

I dont have exact figures but going by what I have it seems the sugar in this nougat may be about 43g glucose out of 52g total. If the glucose syrup is just glucose! Big if...

 

[tara]

Syrups that are mainly glucose taste pretty sweet to me = like rice syrup, etc.

 

[SQu]

Nearly a week later and I'm still eating nougat and hard cheese which obviously means I'm not eating low fat anymore. The rest of the list is still there generally. I'm choosing by what feels good. Still avoiding starch and extra fat. And I do feel good. In stressful times. And seem to have held onto the improvements I got - less breathless and bloated. So that's great. Contributing to this is the addition of k2, the reintroduction of B3 and 1, methyl B12, taurine, mittir's slaked lime and vinegar. Progesterone cream.
.
Short note: my husband has been ' semi-peating' with good results. More low fat milk, less starch and beer, less exercise. For about 4 months. Easily lost 8 kg. No loss of muscle or strength, if anything, gain.
P.S. he wasn't drinking much beer. A couple a month. But a guaranteed weight gain every time. Also added aspirin. And his skin is looking better - tauter ( face lift look) and even-toned, a little pinker.

 

[SQu]

So to update on this topic: this way of eating combined with the demands of a very hectic life made me feel overly stressed. So I stopped and tried to eat intuitively. I'm still doing that and funnily enough I'm still eating the same foods just in different proportions; with the major addition of hard cheese and condensed milk in the Vietnamese coffee so the fat is obviously now no longer low by anyone's standards.

For a while I had a lot of nougat too - really intense sweetness. The Vietnamese coffee and condensed milk trip I think comes down to minimizing the liquids while still hopefully getting most of the benefits of milk (and hopefully also not too oxidized ...) I also want fizzy drinks but not sweet ones - tonic water, ginger beer, soda water. Loving the magnesium bicarb water right now and having a glass a day or a bit more. A taste for bitter/sour rather than sweet carbonated liquids. Still cold milk in the evening, still love that.

I'm not counting on crono because of the intuitive thing (though I do make sure to get 80g protein at least) plus I just had a nauseous/ headachey spell for 5 days which I now think was a virus as my whole family had some variation on it, and during that time I ate what I could face which was ... condensed milk mostly. Fruit. And lots of gelatin, (6tbs a day) with medlemon (aspirin, caffeine, sugar, lemon flavour) in hot water. Mag bicarb water.

I'm still avoiding starch because while I like nice bread and potatoes, and feel initially great, within hours I feel bad from it (dull, slow, fuzzy, sluggish and fatter next day. worse sleep. classic cortisol symptoms I think). I get a bit sometimes when I go out but I'm not fretting about that.

So to summarize: less liquid, stronger sweeter coffee, condensed milk, more intense sweetness, more hard cheese, more CO, still almost no starch, some chicken liver and eggs, a bit of meat/chicken at night (with tea/milk, vit e, coconut oil and then gelatin to follow), more fizz, more caffeine in concentrated coffee and sometimes a red bull.

Supps: just for now taking taurine, k2, more B1 with sugar, B3, B12, mag bicarb water, sometimes slaked lime and vinegar, pau d'arco, the usual aspirin, thyroid. Some of these temporarily to get the liver in better shape, so far so good. Oh and the *&^% carrot! (Don't love it but can't deny it helps!)

I'm feeling well, can feel muscles (such as they are) still there in spite of no exercise and loads of stress, feel a bit leaner, less puffy, less bloated, sleeping improving a bit. Pretty good.

My husband continues to lose weight by semi-peating and exercising less

 

[SQu]

Just for context - my husband has a highly stressful job and was doing quite a lot of exercise a week. So in his case he's lowering stress by resting more and exercising less, and it's lowering his weight too.

 

[SQu]

Summary of what I think has got me to this point:
Sluggish liver + not using glucose + damaged digestion = fat gain, endotoxin, serotonin and estrogen when I added back sugar and calories.

I've given this much thought. Pufas could not have been too bad except that with lots of fat in the diet, even saturated, the pufa is going to add up anyway. Iron would have been high. I put on on a ton and I felt awful. Bloating, aching, aging, worse insomnia, worse constipation, worse pms.

I haven't lost more than a few ( welcome) pounds but I have improved how I feel - less aching, bloating , less pms, feel younger, better digestion, energy etc and while I thank everyone on the forum I think haidut's info on the b vits, caffeine, k2, aspirin , protein, plus recent logs on glycogen and liver have done wonders.

Low fat + stress made me anxious so for now it's no starch plus aiming to feel and digest and sleep well that I'm continuing to work on, then I can try to drop fat a little and I have a feeling that's when I'll get weight loss results. I think you need to fix health first and while it is a chicken and egg thing with fat cells producing estrogen, if the fat won't budge yet then focusing on lowering inflammation is the next best thing. A while ago I asked about fat cells producing estrogen and I think the answer given was that without pufa they don't.

 

[SQu]

I'm trying again and aiming for 2000 calories and getting roughly 10% fat, 35% protein and 55% carb split. Keeping fat as low as I can and this time not feeling anxious, probably because i'm also taking eggshell, cream of tartar, more salt, as well as the other vitamins I take.
Peat talks about the bowel being swollen I think he says, with constipation. So I think my estrogen reabsorption and endotoxin will not be good as a result. And I have estrogen problems that I am throwing everything I can think of and have access to, at. Still don't sleep well. Still don't shed more than a little weight. Still stuck. So I'm making the gut my first priority and the constipation is improving. Trying never to miss the tiresome but effective daily carrot is helping, and I can tolerate more coffee for example, also more B1,B3, etc. Less aching. I'm avoiding fat as much as possible now, it's usually about 10% of calories or less, usually less than 20g, and loading up on the minerals and the vitamins may be the reason that I'm calmer on this low fat attempt than last time. Much calmer.

 

[Jennifer]

I'm glad you're feeling calmer this time around and the constipation is improving, sueq. YAY! I would think the fact that you're calmer also helps with relaxing the bowels.

This may sound odd, but have you ever thought about getting regular massages to help with the constipation? My cousin is a massage therapist and I was getting regular massages from her back when I first fractured and had chronic constipation. I did it only for a short while because it was getting to be too costly, but therapists know exactly what pressure points on the body to hit to really speed things along. Even a few sessions might be just enough to get things moving on their own. Plus, you get the benefits of having all areas of your body relax and I imagine this helps reduce stress hormones, like that pesky estrogen.

I was lucky because my cousin would bring her massage table to my house and do my sessions there. This allowed me to soak in an Epsom salt bath right before having my massage which really helped with relaxing me. Anyhow, it was just a thought! I hope you continue to feel better and better. :)

 

[SQu]

Thanks Jennifer! I'll look into the massage idea. I'm also so glad that you're feeling better lately!
I haven't listed my daily intake on this log this time around (so far) but other things that might be helping are less liquids (I'm using condensed milk in the coffee and it really works - there is a reason for intuitive choices!) and less lactic acid - no cottage cheese or yoghurt - the difference is substantial in terms of less aching. I'm looking forward to orange season due soon, to add OJ back. And protein has crept higher.

 

[Jennifer]

You're welcome, sueq! And thank you! It's nice not feeling half dead. LOL

I'm glad to hear you're feeling less aching. That's great! I notice less liquids are helping me too and though not very Peaty, lots of shellfish everyday. My cravings for protein have been crazy these past months. I look at my diet and sometimes cringe because it comes off as so unhealthy with all the ice cream, milk shakes and protein I've been eating. If it weren't for it all being homemade, I'd feel it was one step away from the bacon diet. But I agree with honoring intuition so I get over it fast. Hehe!

 

[SQu]

Following intuitive choices is interesting. Usually the first bite tells you if you were right. Condensed milk has been an education. It's made from milk powder - not ideal - and has nearly 9g fat per 100. BUT it also has 54g sugar and 6.5g protein. And at 100g a day it'll make 2 Vietnamese coffees that I make small but strong - about 100 ml each - and even at 340 calories it fits easily into 2000 calories a day when you go on to have fat free protein and fruit. This works well in the morning and I'm not getting that ' awash' feeling in the stomach and I suspect that's quite important for me. Gets the day off to a less hypo start. So, to my surprise it was worth a second look.
And although your situation is very different, perhaps you need concentrated foods for a similar reason - imagine how much more liquid you'd be drowning in getting that much nutrition from less concentrated sources!

 

[Jennifer]

Yes, I think you're right, sueq. I can only take so much liquid, especially here in this cold climate. I find I need less fluids and more concentrated protein and fat to stay warm during the winter months. I freeze with too much fruit juice. Even veggie broths with lots of salt leave me cold. In the summer months, I can get away with way more fruit juice and milk.

I was thinking about making pudding using gelatin as the thickener and that will give me some concentrated calories. I feel like I'm turning into Betty Crocker. LOL

 

[SQu]

Low fat and no starch and less liquid has I think lowered aching, slightly improved liver (coffee tolerance) and slightly improved estrogen (less PMS). Overall I feel a bit better and have a bit more stamina. No weight loss. Seeing as I don't know how many calories will generate weight loss I tried dropping to approx. 1800 for a few days but so far it's just lowering temps. In spite of t3, b vits, coffee and caffeine . I'm also catching up on sleep in the day, and wondering if long term cypro heptadine at 3 mg at bedtime is making me groggy next day. Cutting down just worsens already terrible sleep.

 

[tara]

Does the cypro make you immediately dosey? I found once I had taken it a few times and caught up with sleep I could take 1-2mg during the day and not get drowsy, but still have it help sleep at night. If I took it last thing before bed, I sometimes had trouble waking up in the morning.

 

[SQu]

Hi Tara! When taken at bedtime it relaxes and unstuffs the nose and helps me get to sleep, but not stay that way sadly. The perfect dose for this is 3mg for me. If I have hayfever during the day I can take 1/2 to 1mg and not feel zonked. But the effect does not last into the night. Or maybe that one is worth trying again based on your experience, as it might solve the following problem:

When taken at night I can't tell whether it makes me sleepy later the next morning/afternoon - or whether this is just the result of such poor broken sleep. But sometimes I do feel quite dopy which is why I wondered. If so it's quite subtle. But I could do without the leaden feeling and the depression I wake from the nap with, and of course the general messed up sleep pattern. Again, impossible to tell what to blame.

Taking less (so far) is just making sleep worse. But maybe I'll gradually taper down in like 1/2 mg (1/8 tablet) increments. Just to try and see what it is. I'm reluctant though because I do find it helpful stuff and have no other problems with it.

So basically it's hard to tell because I just plain sleep so badly! (Sorry this reads blurrily, which is an accurate reflection of my mental state.)

 

[Peata]

Low fat and no starch and less liquid has I think lowered aching, slightly improved liver (coffee tolerance) and slightly improved estrogen (less PMS). Overall I feel a bit better and have a bit more stamina. No weight loss. Seeing as I don't know how many calories will generate weight loss I tried dropping to approx. 1800 for a few days but so far it's just lowering temps. In spite of t3, b vits, coffee and caffeine . I'm also catching up on sleep in the day, and wondering if long term cypro heptadine at 3 mg at bedtime is making me groggy next day. Cutting down just worsens already terrible sleep.

I'm pretty much in the same boat as you. Doing better on things like energy, pms, but still not able to lose weight AT ALL. I sleep well though. Especially if I have a little food before bedtime and no starch late.

I use 1 mg. cypro at night and take some during the day too (which doesn't make me sleepy now that I've worked up to the dose.)

I have trouble keeping real low fat though like you seem to be doing. Depending on the day, i get between 20 - 40 g. fat. And that's lower than I was trying for last year when I was aiming to keep it under 50 g.

So it looks like lower fat isn't helping with weight loss? That's kind of discouraging.

 

[SQu]

Well it does for others, just not me - or not yet! I'm pretty sure that when I sleep better, things will start happening. I'm also confident that with constant building up of my health it'll come in time. I've come a long way and learned that Ray is right about so much that I'm prepared to be patient. A lot needed fixing and still does!
To get below 20 means very low fat cheese - I found a feta with less than 1g per 100 ( will check that) fat free milk and very little meat. I can get ostrich streak which is i think about 1.5g per 100. Gelatin.
I do feel better with low fat though it is limiting. Now that the extra minerals and vitamins have taken care of the 'antsy' feeling I'm confident that it's not stressing me anymore which is another big obstacle removed.

 

[Peata]

Well it does for others, just not me - or not yet! I'm pretty sure that when I sleep better, things will start happening. I'm also confident that with constant building up of my health it'll come in time. I've come a long way and learned that Ray is right about so much that I'm prepared to be patient. A lot needed fixing and still does!
To get below 20 means very low fat cheese - I found a feta with less than 1g per 100 ( will check that) fat free milk and very little meat. I can get ostrich streak which is i think about 1.5g per 100. Gelatin.
I do feel better with low fat though it is limiting. Now that the extra minerals and vitamins have taken care of the 'antsy' feeling I'm confident that it's not stressing me anymore which is another big obstacle removed.

Sorry you're not sleeping well. How is the starch free part of your experiment going? I find I sleep better without it, but if I am going to eat starch, I have sugar with it and try to keep it several hours away from bedtime. Otherwise I either can't sleep due to adrenaline or wake up in the night with adrenaline.

I will work harder to keep fat around 20 g. or less.

How many g. protein do you get per day?