Origin Of AIDS

[Waynish]

In the 1990's, they supposedly refined the ELISA to not be so prone to false positives. For the record, I love Duesberg, I'm not saying the official narrative is definitive. I like opening these discussions up to get feedback from informed people who question what we're forced to believe by powerful entities.

Simply stated, if you study the progression of this thread's issue over time, then I'm confident that you'll see it is an origin of definitions. CDC, WHO, etc even have different definitions of AIDS to this day - after all these years of refining definitions such that the thresholds for specificity are on the side of diagnosis, an AIDS patient can still go to another country to free themselves from so-called "AIDS." They will simply have one of the many "AIDS defining illnesses" and a below threshold reading on the HIV tests...

 

[haidut]

I always deliver lol

It is actually much worse that what the video describes. The polio vaccines were contaminated with SV40 and even though the Wikipedia page says the contamination in the US stopped in 1963, in fact it probably continued in the US up until 2000s, and is still ongoing today in some countries. In addition, Soviet Union was supplied with contaminated vaccines used up until the 1980s and the Soviets distributed contaminated versions to more than a 100 other countries. It makes me sick just reading this...

Vaccine scandal revives cancer fear
SV40 - Wikipedia
"...SV40 is an abbreviation for simian vacuolating virus 40 or simian virus 40, a polyomavirus that is found in both monkeys and humans. It was named for the effect it produced on infected green monkey cells, which developed an unusual number of vacuoles. Like other polyomaviruses, SV40 is a DNA virus that has the potential to cause tumors in animals, but most often persists as a latent infection. The discovery of SV40 revealed that between 1955 and 1963 around 90% of children and 60% of adults in the U.S.were inoculated with SV40-contaminated polio vaccines.[1]


"... Soon after its discovery, SV40 was identified in the oral form of the polio vaccine produced between 1955 and 1961 by American Home Products (dba Lederle). This is believed to be due to two sources: 1) SV40 contamination of the original seed strain (coded SOM); 2) contamination of the substrate—primary kidney cells from infected monkeys used to grow the vaccine virus during production. Both the Sabin vaccine (oral, live virus) and the Salk vaccine (injectable, killed virus) were affected; the technique used to inactivate the polio virus in the Salk vaccine, by means of formaldehyde, did not reliably kill SV40. The contaminated vaccine continued to be distributed to the public through 1963."
"... An analysis presented at the Vaccine Cell Substrate Conference in 2004[30][medical citation needed] suggested that vaccines used in the former Soviet bloc countries, China, Japan, and Africa, could have been contaminated up to 1980, meaning that hundreds of millions more could have been exposed to the virus unknowingly."

Vaccine scandal revives cancer fear
"...The contamination of the Soviet vaccine highlights the need for safer methods of growing viruses for vaccines, Koprowski says, something he is trying to tackle by using plant cells. The US stopped using fresh monkey kidneys for polio vaccine in 2000. But the vaccine is still made in this way in several other countries."

"...Chumakov, whose father was director of the Soviet Institute of Poliomyelitis Research during the time of the contamination, says he was told that at one point the Soviet Union was supplying more than 100 countries with its vaccine."

 

[haidut]

Wtf? Is this true?

It is actually much worse than you imagine.
Origin Of AIDS

 

[Kartoffel]

Let's remember Ray is not exactly eager to put his neck on the line regarding hot political topics (911, communist infiltration, cancer, A2 milk, etc.)
He likes his tranquility.

What? If he is not putting his neck on the line regarding hot social and political topics, then I don't know anyone who is. He got fired several times for speaking his mind on controversial issues. Except for the A2 "issue", his opinions on the topics you mentioned would be described as at least very controversial by most people.

 

[Wagner83]

It is actually much worse that what the video describes. The polio vaccines were contaminated with SV40 and even though the Wikipedia page says the contamination in the US stopped in 1963, in fact it probably continued in the US up until 2000s, and is still ongoing today in some countries. In addition, Soviet Union was supplied with contaminated vaccines used up until the 1980s and the Soviets distributed contaminated versions to more than a 100 other countries. It makes me sick just reading this...

Is there any vaccines you think are worth it or should be done?

 

[burtlancast]

What? If he is not putting his neck on the line regarding hot social and political topics, then I don't know anyone who is. He got fired several times for speaking his mind on controversial issues. Except for the A2 "issue", his opinions on the topics you mentioned would be described as at least very controversial by most people.

Feel free to point me to any commentary by Ray where he openly criticizes communism.

He only mentioned 911 once because a caller asked him.

This doesn't diminish his other contributions; but people should keep in mind no one holds the absolute truth and keep looking to other sources for answers regarding controversial topics.

PS: I'm also adding the iodine issue to my list.

 

[haidut]

Is there any vaccines you think are worth it or should be done?

Tetanus and maybe smallpox (if the disease is still around). Bacterial/fungal/tuberculous meningitis are pretty bad, so if vaccines can be developed for them and proven to work then I'd consider them.
Btw, my post was not meant to sound against the idea of vaccines. I just pointed out that the vaccines given to billions of people have been admittedly contaminated with a cancer-causing virus. This goes beyond any timerosal issue, autism or side effects we see in the debates today. As usual, the real horrifying issue is kept out of the news. If the public realizes this in a more organized fashion they may be serious social upheaval worldwide. It is one thing to debate whether an adjuvant is good or bad and in what amount. There is no possible argument to defend the presence of SV40 in vaccines or refute that it is bad and causes cancer. If it has been given to billions of people as part of a vaccine and if production of contaminated vaccines continues to this day, then it explains why no vaccine would ever be trusted any more. The fraud/incompetence of such level invalidates anything good this field may have done or continue to do. People usually distrust for a reason even if the distrust is not always directed at the real villain.
Would you trust a vaccine now knowing it probably contains a cancer-causing virus, and this is a proven fact and not the isolated complaints of a small group of angry parents??

 

[Wagner83]

Tetanus and maybe smallpox (if the disease is still around). Bacterial/fungal/tuberculous meningitis are pretty bad, so if vaccines can be developed for them and proven to work then I'd consider them.

Ok tganks, do you think vaccines like tetanus need to be done a few times in a lifetime or is once enough?

 

[haidut]

Ok tganks, do you think vaccines like tetanus need to be done a few times in a lifetime or is once enough?

Recent studies found that the tetanus booster can be given every 30 years and not every 10 as was originally claimed. So, basically twice a lifetime is probably enough. And for somebody with a strong immune system and thyroid, even once is probably enough.
Adults Do Not Need Tetanus Vaccine Every Decade

 

[Kartoffel]

Feel free to point me to any commentary by Ray where he openly criticizes communism.

He only mentioned 911 once because a caller asked him.

This doesn't diminish his other contributions; but people should keep in mind no one holds the absolute truth and keep looking to other sources for answers regarding controversial topics.

PS: I'm also adding the iodine issue to my list.

Well, he hasn't criticized communism, but rather endorsed it (in some particular form at least), which would be the more controversial position in America. Regarding 9/11, he sent me this email a few years ago.

"Thanks, I'll watch it. I saw an early version. P.C. Roberts had a good short summary of the situation for the recent anniversary, it's below. The morning it happened, I suggested it was our Reichstag fire. That's the way US history works, a mixture of lies and violence. It's been happening right from the beginning, with George Washington maneuvering to get Tom Paine killed in France. FDR maneuvered the Japanese into starting the war he wanted; Hitler's sympathizers in the Democratic party imposed Harry Truman as vice president, over FDR's choice Henry Wallace, knowing their different post-war preferences. The Dulles brothers were close to the Nazis, and Allen Dulles was in Europe conspiring with friends in the German army in the winter of 1945, when Stalin learned what he was doing and wired FDR. FDR didn't believe the wire, thinking that Dulles couldn't be crazy enough to do something so openly treasonous. Before he had a chance to learn the truth, he was dead. FDR's family and Stalin believed the Churchill-Dulles faction had assassinated him, and demanded an autopsy and investigation of the scene of his death, which didn't happen. Since his death, everything the government does has been primarily criminally motivated. Truman's use of the atomic bomb was intended to start the cold war; the US started the Korean war; the Soviets developed the bombs sooner than expected, causing the US military to postpone planned attacks repeatedly; right up to Kennedy's death, the military was trying to get into position for a preventive nuclear attack on the Soviets. James Douglas' book JFK and the Unspeakable describes that time. Douglas also wrote about the murder of M.L. King, which was another government action." RP

 

[burtlancast]

Well, he hasn't criticized communism, but rather endorsed it (in some particular form at least), which would be the more controversial position in America. Regarding 9/11, he sent me this email a few years ago.

"Thanks, I'll watch it. I saw an early version. P.C. Roberts had a good short summary of the situation for the recent anniversary, it's below. The morning it happened, I suggested it was our Reichstag fire. That's the way US history works, a mixture of lies and violence. It's been happening right from the beginning, with George Washington maneuvering to get Tom Paine killed in France. FDR maneuvered the Japanese into starting the war he wanted; Hitler's sympathizers in the Democratic party imposed Harry Truman as vice president, over FDR's choice Henry Wallace, knowing their different post-war preferences. The Dulles brothers were close to the Nazis, and Allen Dulles was in Europe conspiring with friends in the German army in the winter of 1945, when Stalin learned what he was doing and wired FDR. FDR didn't believe the wire, thinking that Dulles couldn't be crazy enough to do something so openly treasonous. Before he had a chance to learn the truth, he was dead. FDR's family and Stalin believed the Churchill-Dulles faction had assassinated him, and demanded an autopsy and investigation of the scene of his death, which didn't happen. Since his death, everything the government does has been primarily criminally motivated. Truman's use of the atomic bomb was intended to start the cold war; the US started the Korean war; the Soviets developed the bombs sooner than expected, causing the US military to postpone planned attacks repeatedly; right up to Kennedy's death, the military was trying to get into position for a preventive nuclear attack on the Soviets. James Douglas' book JFK and the Unspeakable describes that time. Douglas also wrote about the murder of M.L. King, which was another government action." RP

Truth has many layers to it. Reading Ray's above post would have you believe Roosevelt, Martin Luther King and Kennedy were benevolent leaders; when the reality is they were just as corrupt as the rest, or even more.

But Ray will simply not go there since he has a fan base to cater for.

If you don't believe me, try asking him on his opinion about Sutton's book on FDR: i will almost predict you won't get an answer, or rather an evading one.

 

[Kartoffel]

Truth has many layers to it. Reading Ray's above post would have you believe Roosevelt, Martin Luther King and Kennedy were benevolent leaders; when the reality is they were just as corrupt as the rest, or even more.

But Ray will simply not go there since he has a fan base to cater for.

If you don't believe me, try asking him on his opinion about Sutton's book on FDR: i will almost predict you won't get an answer, or rather an evading one.

Where does he say any of those things? I have many more mails from him on different political issues, and I can assure you that he doesn't think in the same black and white categories you so desperately want to imply here. Even in this quoute he accuses "the benevolent leader" of provoking a war he wanted, which cost thousands of American lifes. I don't understand why you want to imply that Ray carefully chooses his statement so as to "cater for" his fanbase. If there is one guy out there that absolutely couldn't care less about what some people on a weird internet forum think about him, then it's Ray. He stated many times that he has never looked at any of the Ray Peat forums or facebook pages, and in interviews you can easily realize that the "fame" he has achieved seems to make him rather uncomfortable.

 

[x-ray peat]

Where does he say any of those things? I have many more mails from him on different political issues, and I can assure you that he doesn't think in the same black and white categories you so desperately want to imply here. Even in this quoute he accuses "the benevolent leader" of provoking a war he wanted, which cost thousands of American lifes. I don't understand why you want to imply that Ray carefully chooses his statement so as to "cater for" his fanbase. If there is one guy out there that absolutely couldn't care less about what some people on a weird internet forum think about him, then it's Ray. He stated many times that he has never looked at any of the Ray Peat forums or facebook pages, and in interviews you can easily realize that the "fame" he has achieved seems to make him rather uncomfortable.

can you post some of those?

 

[LeVere]

There really is nothing capital C conspiratorial about AIDS folks, it's not a bioweapon invented by the US government and the others don't exist either. It's really a scientific theoretical question regarding germ theory and prime cause. The way you take on the AIDS question is to look into whether viruses exist or not, THEY DON'T. There are only vesicles and their interplay with stress and toxicity. All these conspiracy types and their comic book narratives are actually holding back proper scientific debate. Conspiracies do happen but not to the structural reality level that some would have you believe. When you analyze any power dynamic you look at discourse and power structure of which conspiracies are a consequence-not a cause-here and there.

 

[burtlancast]

If there is one guy out there that absolutely couldn't care less about what some people on a weird internet forum think about him, then it's Ray.

Again, Ray doesn't owe anything to anyone, and his political views are just an aside to me.

But it can shape a little better what kind of person he is; my offer about Sutton's book still stands.

 

[SOMO]

According to you, is the French hemophiliac tragedy part of the disinfo?

And by the way, it happened not just in France, but the whole world.: Canada, USA, UK, Japan, China, Switzerland, Iran, Iraq, Italy, Ireland, Portugal.
All produced court cases and awarded reparations to the victims.

In China, in the province of Henan, dirty needles during blood collection contaminated 1.2 millions people and decimated whole villages.

All this victimization of pharmaceutical firms and government officials for nothing: HIV doesn't cause AIDS...

1. You admit that hemophiliacs received medical treatment that damaged them, but you won't take it one step further to acknowledge that the original Factor 7/8 and other clotting proteins THEMSELVES are allergenic/immunogenic?
Occam's Razor would imply that the Hemophilia treatment itself is immune-suppressive, even before you introduce HIV into the picture: i.e. organ transplant rejection.
You're literally being injected with other people's blood. That WILL trigger an immune response (cytokines) and possibly an allergenic response (histamine.) the same way organ transplants are treated by the body. The original hemophilia treatments were immune-suppressive, and the current ones are also but to a lesser degree.

The same process is at work with dirty needles, but NO VIRUS IS NECESSARY to explain the immune suppression

2. Nobody is saying that dirty needles don't cause disease - they do. They just don't kill people via HIV. Lol, when a car hits someone and kills them do you blame the car or do you blame the driver?
Did you know that they find BABY POWDER in the organs (including eyes) of IV cocaine users?
Possible foreign body granuloma of the retina associated with intravenous cocaine addiction. - PubMed - NCBI

 

[crestind]

Probably some US military lab. Just like SARS.

Look at the sky. You think those are contrails? Wake up it's a sunny day, but noon it's cloudy? Pfft.

 

[burtlancast]

1. You admit that hemophiliacs received medical treatment that damaged them, but you won't take it one step further to acknowledge that the original Factor 7/8 and other clotting proteins THEMSELVES are allergenic/immunogenic?
Occam's Razor would imply that the Hemophilia treatment itself is immune-suppressive, even before you introduce HIV into the picture: i.e. organ transplant rejection.
You're literally being injected with other people's blood. That WILL trigger an immune response (cytokines) and possibly an allergenic response (histamine.) the same way organ transplants are treated by the body. The original hemophilia treatments were immune-suppressive, and the current ones are also but to a lesser degree.

The same process is at work with dirty needles, but NO VIRUS IS NECESSARY to explain the immune suppression

Very good.

Please book a plane ticket for France and inform the French judicial system there has been a terrible miscarriage of justice regarding the officials in charge of blood transfusion; it's the clotting factors themselves who caused all these mass hemophiliacs deaths, not the hypothetical AIDS virus.

Then inform all the French HIV contaminated people who have survived their disease thanks to the anti-virals of Mirko Beljanski that it was just a placebo effect.

Then comeback here and tell us how it all went.

 

[LeVere]

Very good.

Please book a plane ticket for France and inform the French judicial system there has been a terrible miscarriage of justice regarding the officials in charge of blood transfusion; it's the clotting factors themselves who caused all these mass hemophiliacs deaths, not the hypothetical AIDS virus.

Then inform all the French HIV contaminated people who have survived their disease thanks to the anti-virals of Mirko Beljanski that it was just a placebo effect.

Then comeback here and tell us how it all went.

Huh boy

Toxicological blood with unspecific agents can bring about the complications you speak of in French and other hemophiliacs. You do not need the existence of an exogenous viral agent.

The anti-virals that you speak of work for a broad range of reasons, not for any acute anti-hiv effect.

 

[burtlancast]

The anti-virals that you speak of work for a broad range of reasons, not for any acute anti-hiv effect.

What?

Are you suggesting you can live without white blood cells?