Work + Skills are Money - Not Gold, Silver, Crypto

michael94

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We have been dragged into an Abyss by a gang of International Usurers who have taught us that Money is something that is hard to quantify. The truth is that the Complication of Money only serves to maintain this diabolical system where Usury, Rent-Seeking, and Psychological Manipulation are more fruitful than honest work - whether that Work be Physical or Intellectual.

Only when Work is championed as the basis of Money will this monstrous system begin to change - and end the Slavery to Money Interest -to Usury- and Financial Parasites in general.






 

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Crypto is a symptom of a bigger problem. It is popular because the current financial system is so bad and corrupt that the average person can no longer afford their own car, place to live, vacation, without spending half of their life in credit. Due to the inflation and the depreciating dollar, with salaries lagging far behind, people are YOLO-ing their life savings into crypto, because their "work" can no longer afford the same things in 30 years that their parents could buy in 5 years.

In a post-apocalyptic society work and skills would be the real currency, that's true, but right now - your boss makes far more money off of your work than you ever will.
 

gaze

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how would work be valued without money? by productivity? and then what's being produced gets bartered? money is just a way to value commodities. work as a currency makes no sense really, in that people would be valued mainly by their ability to produce something , which is just the first step towards what we have now with people selling their labor for money. at its core, work as a currency would look similar to serfdom
 
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Perry Staltic

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Money's not the problem. Usury is. Money's just a medium of exchange, but usury is a cancer
 
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michael94

michael94

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how would work be valued without money? by productivity? and then what's being produced gets bartered? money is just a way to value commodities. work as a currency makes no sense really, in that people would be valued mainly by their ability to produce something , which is just the first step towards what we have now with people selling their labor for money. at its core, work as a currency would look similar to serfdom
Nothing I said was about getting rid of Money. Yes Money is just a medium of exchange, but work and skills are what give the Money value.

There are many ways to have work as the basis for the currency without some medieval serf scenario you are imagining ( nevermind the technological and land ownership differences in that situation.

For example, spend Money into the economy for productive projects instead of depend on Usury for new Money.

That together with cancelling crippling debt in productive sectors of the economy like farming, manufacturing could shift the tide overnight.

It's a spectrum, and you want to shift the balance towards productivity being rewarded with rent-seeking being punished, instead of the reverse.
 
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michael94

michael94

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Money's not the problem. Usury is. Money's just a medium of exchange, but usury is a cancer
Usury is the source of most new Money. The Banks create Deposits when they create loans. The issues are tied in to each other
 
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Lord Cola

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People are going to find ways to make their work more "valued" than other people's work, and some people will find ways to do almost no work for lots of money. The result is likely to be a convoluted system of obfuscations and abstractions like what we have now. Such modifications of concepts revolving around money will not bring fundamental changes.
 
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michael94

michael94

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So real money is the answer, not fake, debt-based money like we have now.
You don't need Gold to have Money that isn't based on debt. Money has to be more or less tied to productivity - otherwise you get a continuation of the Mammonism we have today.

This is not just an abstract idea. Here is a brief example of some changes that could be made which change the relationship between Worker and Capital.

1. Place a steep graduated tax on unearned incomes
2. Lower taxes on working incomes
3. End the Bank creation of Deposits which are not going towards productive projects ( i.e. Banks can't loan to speculate and inflate Real Estate/Rent prices ). Real Estate Loans account for 70% of Money loaned out give or take
4. Spend Money into the economy directly completely bypassing the Usurers
5. Widespread cancellation of debts
6. National Debt - refuse to pay it

The ideal solution depends of the specifics but these are some examples to put an end to Usury and power back in the hands of honest Work.

Basically you want to re-teach the citizens that Money is not something that magically grows upon itself (as in Usury). Money is something that is given value by honest Labor and ingenuity - and National policies should reflect that.
 

Perry Staltic

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You don't need Gold to have Money that isn't based on debt. Money has to be more or less tied to productivity - otherwise you get a continuation of the Mammonism we have today.

This is not just an abstract idea. Here is a brief example of some changes that could be made which change the relationship between Worker and Capital.

1. Place a steep graduated tax on unearned incomes
2. Lower taxes on working incomes
3. End the Bank creation of Deposits which are not going towards productive projects ( i.e. Banks can't loan to speculate and inflate Real Estate/Rent prices ). Real Estate Loans account for 70% of Money loaned out give or take
4. Spend Money into the economy directly completely bypassing the Usurers
5. Widespread cancellation of debts
6. National Debt - refuse to pay it

The ideal solution depends of the specifics but these are some examples to put an end to Usury and power back in the hands of honest Work.

Basically you want to re-teach the citizens that Money is not something that magically grows upon itself (as in Usury). Money is something that is given value by honest Labor and ingenuity - and National policies should reflect that.

Money needs to be based on a stable standard of value that isn't easily manipulated like a productivity-based standard would be, as @Lord Cola said above.
 
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michael94

michael94

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Money needs to be based on a stable standard of value that isn't easily manipulated like a productivity-based standard would be, as @Lord Cola said above.
The Gold Standard did not stop Usurers from gaining control of the World, and even facilitated it.

There is no perfect solution, but the common sense says that Money should be more or less tied to Work/Productivity - and not dictated by the mandates of Capital. Saying that this could be done badly is not a good criticism and is more indicative of a learned helplessness. There are concrete measures that could be taken which will improve the situation.
 

Perry Staltic

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The Gold Standard did not stop Usurers from gaining control of the World, and even facilitated it.

Nor would a productivity-based standard. Corruption is endemic to the human soul. But keep in mind that the usurers got rid of the gold standard to give themselves more power.
 
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Bartering is the original money and everyone has to work in a barter system

But its inefficient, which gives rise to merchants

When merchants arise they create currency

Currency creates savings, savings create banks,

banks give out loans with interest <- this is what we need to prevent. Islamic Finance is a good place to start
 

Nfinkelstein

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So real money is the answer, not fake, debt-based money like we have now.
Agreed. The trouble is that fractional reserve banking (FRB) is legal, but it is arguably unethical and in a practical sense it affects the money supply resulting in a 'false weights and measures' situation for anyone using the currency since one can never know precisely what the intrinsic value is. FRB is a problem, regardless of what you use as a currency including gold. The other issue is central banking - it arguably is unnecessary. Instead you could have competing private currencies, which crypto vaguely is. Crypto has potential if it is just digital trading of a hard asset, and none of them to my knowledge are this yet. Even those which are gold 'backed' are not gold themselves. But crypto offers the tantalizing potential of providing the means for digital trading of metals themselves, essentially contracts. It could in theory be frictionless too.
 

gaze

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life wasn't exactly paradise with the gold standard, and bitcoin/crypto is primarily owned by big private institutions propped up by fraud stablecoins. I think FDR did a good thing getting rid of the gold standard in all honesty, america would have been much worse position if he didn't.

 

gaze

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1. Place a steep graduated tax on unearned incomes
2. Lower taxes on working incomes
3. End the Bank creation of Deposits which are not going towards productive projects ( i.e. Banks can't loan to speculate and inflate Real Estate/Rent prices ). Real Estate Loans account for 70% of Money loaned out give or take
4. Spend Money into the economy directly completely bypassing the Usurers
5. Widespread cancellation of debts
6. National Debt - refuse to pay it

I agree with all these. however it requires a strong, people-oriented government and fed which is the only entity strong enough to overcome private banks. the chances of the government/fed separating from bank/corporate owned is slim to none however, at least in america. FDR was able to go farther than any other president was able to because he came in during an all out crisis where the banks had the least amount of leverage they've ever had, but they still prevailed in the end, hence why he "saved capitalism", although he helped workers more than anyone else has been able to thus far
 
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life wasn't exactly paradise with the gold standard, and bitcoin/crypto is primarily owned by big private institutions propped up by fraud stablecoins. I think FDR did a good thing getting rid of the gold standard in all honesty, america would have been much worse position if he didn't.


But it was sure as ***t better than now. When did the gold standard get abandoned? 1971.

 

gaze

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But it was sure as ***t better than now. When did the gold standard get abandoned? 1971.

it ended under FDR, but nixon put the final nail in the coffin. i agree things got much worse in starting in 71, but not cause of the lack of the gold standard
 

blob69

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I said it before and I will say it again - I highly recommend this book on the subject: Homepage - Sacred Economics | Charles Eisenstein

You can read it for free online as the author is trying to live in the spirit of a gift (or buy a copy on Amazon).

This essay discusses cryptocurrencies and how they should be designed to serve a more beautiful world: The Next Step for Digital Currency

"This feature makes Freicoin quite different from gold, which unlike nearly any other metal or commodity does not decay with time. Indeed, gold-based currencies suffer many of the same problems that Bitcoin does, including hoarding, deflation, and concentration of wealth. Perhaps Bitcoin is too much like gold. One unintentional parallel is that Bitcoin (and Freicoin) is generated with great computational effort at a high cost to the environment, just as gold mining requires huge mechanical effort and is perhaps the most destructive form of mining on the planet. We don’t really need that gold: some two-thirds of all gold every produced is sitting in vaults. Another huge amount sits in jewelry boxes, worn on rare occasions or not at all. Yes, gold is useful for non-corroding electronics and other things, but at present only about 10% of gold production goes toward industrial uses. With great effort and pollution, we dig gold out of holes in the ground and bury it in other holes in the ground called vaults. Why would we want to model a currency on gold? In an age of climate change crisis, isn’t there a better use of electricity, computer power, and smart hackers than the computation of useless procedures, all to create digital currency that could be created much more easily by some other process?"
 
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