Why You Shouldn't Supplement Vitamin D

Collden

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Do you have any sources for this? I'd like to read about it.
Nutritional rickets: deficiency of vitamin D, calcium, or both?
Vitamin D deficiency among northern Native Peoples: a real or apparent problem?

The second article is about the "paradox" that people living at northern latitudes with the least sunlight exposure have comparatively low prevalence of Rickets. The highest incidence of Rickets is in the sunniest parts of the world like Africa and Middle East.
 

schultz

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I am posting this once again, because it is true.

African People Aren't Vitamin D Deficient

Interesting, thanks.

Fish oil studies show anti-inflammatory benefit which is supposed to be good, right?
Except it's not, lol. Often the defensive reaction of the body supercedes the sensation of degradation, but this is only acute relief. Thank God the feeling of pain is minimal shortly after suffering a traumatic wound.

Yes but we understand why fish oil is helpful and why it is problematic. Also, studies a lot of the time done on fish oil are comparing it to another oil whereas vitamin D studies are just comparing vitamin D to nothing, or lower doses.

It was 32 ng/mL when I got it checked last year October 25th. I only used the lamp occasionally for a few months after that and then I started using it religiously for 5 mins a day for about 4 months before I got it checked again at which time it measured 49 ng/mL. I emailed the company asking how much time I needed to use the lamp daily before retesting, they said at least three months.

Good to know. Thanks for sharing.
 
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Who is Charnathan?

By the way, ceruloplasmin is an acute phase reactant/protein, just like CRP or ferritin (it occurs in an inflammatory state). I don't remember Morley ever discussing that. I would like to know how he explains that. Is ceruloplasmin just "better ferritin" like how copper is "better iron"?

I like Retinoid Dysregulation or Retinoid Hyperreactive Syndrome. The hypomobilization is good, but too suggestive of a solution. We should avoid naming conditions such that they have the "answer" in the name.

Charnathan should be Nathan Hatch, author of F#ck Portion Control, and the addition of the prefix char- to his first name is likely intended to remind the reader of the word charlatan.

I used to think Amazoniac had been dropped on his head as an infant a few too many times. I still think this; nevertheless, over the years my ability to decipher his codswallop has improved. Currently, I'd estimate my fluency in Amazoniac-ish at a B1 level according to the Common European Framework of Reference for Languages: Cadre européen commun de référence pour les langues.
 

Maljam

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Charnathan should be Nathan Hatch, author of F#ck Portion Control, and the addition of the prefix char- to his first name is likely intended to remind the reader of the word charlatan.

I used to think Amazoniac had been dropped on his head as an infant a few too many times. I still think this; nevertheless, over the years my ability to decipher his codswallop has improved. Currently, I'd estimate my fluency in Amazoniac-ish at a B1 level according to the Common European Framework of Reference for Languages: Cadre européen commun de référence pour les langues.

Amazoniac is the James Joyce of the Peat world.
 

Dave Clark

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What is high dose for vitamin D? Different people get different results on a wide range of dosages. Some people experience differences on doses as low as 2,500iu. Others can take upwards of 50,000iu and barely notice any changes on serum level. That low end (2,500iu) of the spectrum is similar to the amount of vit D you'd typically find in a tbsp of CLO, depending on brand.
My opinion is that a high dose may be more than you would find in a food source, and CLO is not a primary food source, it is an extract, per se. However, people may not need high doses of D, simply because it may be misunderstood what our needs are. Is D low in storage form, yet high in active form, are the VDRs blocked and causing problems, is low D a cause or effect (from inflammation or illness)? Jim discusses some of that on his FB group (maybe on the video I didn't get through it yet), and if nothing else, it gives you another perspective on whether we need to orally consume doses of a secosteroid not found naturally in our food supply at that level (sans polar bear liver, or whatever, I know someone will want to mention that). And, eating cod livers or extracting the oil for consumption is not a primary food on most areas of the planet.
Additionally, I think whether anyone agrees with alternate views of vitamin/hormone D, it is worth listening to or reading them. I personally appreciate when someone posts these videos and info links, I am not too lazy to peruse them and judge for myself the content.
 

Mellow

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I've been over 50,000 IU for 2+ years and serum calcium is always in range. Near the top, but still in range.

That's a part of Morley Robbins point - serum calcium will never be low, as you have a lovely pool of calcium to draw from - your bones. So serum calcium may be fine, but bone health may suffer, and calcium will be deposited where you don't want it.

I'm not advocating one way or the other, but I listened to the Mitolife Radio interview (below), and was so intrigued I've parked it to read in detail and make analysis on when I have time.

Why You Shouldn't Supplement Vitamin D with Jim Stephenson Jr and Morley Robbins from Mitolife Radio
 

JacquelineNZ

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jesus christ. if you don't want to invest the two hours, don't watch it. ignore it. move on.

more than happy to get admin just to delete the post altogether rather than listen to people asking to be spoonfed information
Great info and I think its important for ppl to watch, its a common suppliment these days and so dangerous!
 

Kray

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My opinion is that a high dose may be more than you would find in a food source, and CLO is not a primary food source, it is an extract, per se. However, people may not need high doses of D, simply because it may be misunderstood what our needs are. Is D low in storage form, yet high in active form, are the VDRs blocked and causing problems, is low D a cause or effect (from inflammation or illness)? Jim discusses some of that on his FB group (maybe on the video I didn't get through it yet), and if nothing else, it gives you another perspective on whether we need to orally consume doses of a secosteroid not found naturally in our food supply at that level (sans polar bear liver, or whatever, I know someone will want to mention that). And, eating cod livers or extracting the oil for consumption is not a primary food on most areas of the planet.
Additionally, I think whether anyone agrees with alternate views of vitamin/hormone D, it is worth listening to or reading them. I personally appreciate when someone posts these videos and info links, I am not too lazy to peruse them and judge for myself the content.

This is a good discussion on basic supplementation needs v getting as much as we can from what we get from food and sunshine.
For those who will undoubtedly continue to supplement D and other fat-solubles, I wonder if a safe way to maintain that is to apply topically v orally, which is what Peat does. I have read his comments over time, and quick search brought up this link from Danny Roddy on Peat's comments: The Danny Roddy Weblog

I for one haven't ever had my VD status checked but have supplemented orally for many years with no apparent problem. However, I am leaning toward topical application after reading this discussion.

Thanks for sharing insights and concerns.
 

Zpol

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What distance did you use the lamp and did you move it around the body for the 5 minutes or stand in front of it? How did you use it?

I have it sitting on a desk so when I stand in front of it the light covers basically my whole torso (I'm short). I stand about 12-15 inches away (you'll know if you get stand too close because you'll get a slight sunburn or itchiness). Make sure to not get the UVB light into your eyes (some people use protective goggles). I alternate front side and back side daily and occasionally stand slightly sideways to get the sides of my torso as well. I do this 5 minutes a day, everyday, unless I can sunbathe at high noon that day (which is rare). I'm fair skinned, you may need to adjust the time based on your skin tone (the Sperti comes with a chart indicating suggested times based on skin tone). You can also email the company to get more individualized recommendations based on the data they have collected from other clients and their research.

I use the lamp after I take a shower not before and I don't use soap on my torso. Bathing and soap can disrupt your skin's natural oils, theoretically this can affect how much vit D you can get from UVB light. Technically Vit D is created within the cell so bathing shouldn't matter but I err on the side of caution and do it after I shower, plus it's just easier this way since I'm already in the nude.

I have recently started using my handheld red light simultaneously on my face and neck.
 

pauljacob

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3) some people grow up eating liver on regular occasion, turn vegan at 25 and are great until their 50 because of all of the stored B12 they accrued... But then they crash. Some people go vegan off the back of a standard American diet and hit the dirt within 3 months.
Same thing with carnivore dieters that can go for 10+ years. It's great for them until they're beyond the pale in deep waters... Because the consequences of fat storage toxicity are unknown until they become apparent all the time. Filling up this cup is probably a risky game. Take the typical visceral fat-laden individual who can't go 12 hours without food unless they feel like garbage because of the inordinate amounts of poison that their fat stores are releasing all at once. They quickly need food to stabilize their blood sugar and cease this energetic expenditure of fat.
Thanks for your post. I'd like to learn more about long-term visceral fat storage. Can you recommend any studies or books on the subject?
 

Sefton10

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What distance did you use the lamp and did you move it around the body for the 5 minutes or stand in front of it? How did you use it?
Take care, I foolishly gave my backside a nasty burn using my Sperti first time! They are much stronger than they feel.
 
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Thanks for your post. I'd like to learn more about long-term visceral fat storage. Can you recommend any studies or books on the subject?

There's no dedicated resources that come to mind, I'm sorry. I'm simply shooting from an observational hip here based on passing testimonies of people who have spoken about their experiences with these extreme diets on various 'health & wellness' platforms.

Maybe you'd find something of value in Khan Academy's "Fat and protein metabolism" lessons. Some of the video titles in this subsection are:
-introduction to energy storage
-digestion, mobilization, and transport of fats
-how does the body adapt to starvation?

https://www.khanacademy.org/test-pr...n-metabolism/v/introduction-to-energy-storage
 

R J

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jesus christ. if you don't want to invest the two hours, don't watch it. ignore it. move on.

more than happy to get admin just to delete the post altogether rather than listen to people asking to be spoonfed information
Are you Matt Blackburn? He has a history of jumping from health trend to health trend, I think he has neuroticism about it. If you go back to his early videos the things he reccomended are now what he recommends against. I don’t think he’s a researcher, has any sort of training, or is particularly smart.
I ignore and downvoted everything I see from him— a little time ago he made some very rude comments to someone about his wife and mother of their child. I don’t think he ever apologized.
 
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R J

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Morley doesn't seem to want to concede that the cod liver oil is not a good recommendation due to the PUFAs. The amount of D in CLO is not that high, and I believe Morley feels that it is the high dose of vitamin D taken in supplements that is problematic. We do not have to yield to taking supplemental oral D, even if there is no sun, a proper lamp like the Sperti-D lamp will provide the UVB rays that produce vitamin d anytime of the year. The Sperti-D lamp has been proven and certified by the FDA to produce and raise vitamin D levels in test subjects. This company has been around and producing these type lamps since early last century, making them for nursing homes and hospital patients that cannot get sun exposure, so they are not new to the business. Interesting that this information has been suppressed since the pharma industry started selling vitamin D to the agricultural businesses, and telling people they can get all the D they need from drinking milk, etc.

Wouldn’t it be healthier to use a full spectrum bulb like an HPS? Do you get all the reds too
 

R J

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You should know that, according to Peat at least, UV and even blue light is quenched by the red part of the spectrum, so this might not be a healthy alternative since it's isolated UVB.
Oh shoot it’s an isolate uvb lamp?
Anyone have any comments about sitting under a 1kw HPS for growing plants?
 

R J

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:hilarious:


Indeed. Since it's an interview trashing venom D, the guest possibly has slow metabolism, so it could be normalizing the metabolic rate for the audience while shortening the torture. If you increase it further, it becomes an anti-attention-deficit measure because the faster it gets, the less distractions the person can afford. It's also a method for practicing skills: last saturday Diokine played Guitar Hero with a friend, masked James, at maximum speed and after returning to normal they mailed it; they perceived reality in slow motion, thought 'This is easy for me, I must be gifted.', and acted by later pressing the lever for more.

These regulatory compounds [such as poisonoids, venomoids, wateroids (Jammal, 2020)] are far more depleting than repleting, it's conceivable for them to promote intolerance in susceptible people, the dose has to match the condition to not make it worse. If there's no ample dietary support, there's still an opportunity to obtain what's missing by using it as modulator to shape the gut composition towards a cooperating profile (amounts would be small but the supply can be steady), also silencing immunity for resolution that minimizes inflammation (prevention of wastage).

The moments when the person has the least inflammation are appropriate for greater doses, whereas at inflammatory peaks the cautionary approach is preferable. For someone that's constantly on the edge, it requires fine-tuning because any dose can be excessive, there are the inflammatory signals that create a futile cycle. The optimal application times in these cases would be on every instance that safe fermentable carbs are consumed but things start derailing (the basic cofactors are probably needed), discontinuing as soon as the first adversity is detected (amplification of existing issues, drop in temperature, pains, tears, and so on). This should be more effective for weakened people than the occasional lethal doses.


These people's hysterical tones are a disservice:
- RoundUp (Glyphosate) Finally Proven Toxic - It Depletes Glycine

Garrett, Charnathan, Morley and Stephanie are more or less on the same boat. I think that the lack of ponderation in their words is reflected on their problem approach as well, but it's not harmless because on every foolish assertion they delegitimize cases who are struggling and could be examined for an accurate explanation. The situation is akin to false sexual assault accusations. For example, if you encountered someone claiming that's suffering from 'Poison A toxicity' after adopting the same speech as the proponents of the movement, how likely it is that the person is going to be taken seriously? If there's no discouragement right away from the term, after inspection and not detecting anything that was claimed, everything that follows is discredited. Something like 'Retinoid Hypomobilization/Dysregulation/Hyperreactive Syndrome' is much better.

Anyway, one of the justifications against its supplementation is that it's a poison A antagonist, which is needed for ceruloplasmin synthesis. There are those who have a functional 'insufficiency' of poison, perhaps the extra venom is enough to aggravate it, but to use it as justification against venom D supplementation seems one more precipitated conclusion. I've never came across reports of (actual) venom D toxicity where ceruloplasmin became critical. How pure the person has to be for ceruloplasmin to be affected? I don't know if something conclusive has been offered, but from the posts that I read there was nothing concrete, it was insane how dots were connected and the jump to the conclusion.

U wot m8?
 

R J

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@charlie can you please delete this entire thread that i started here. i can't believe instead of people saying thanks for starting an interesting conversation, offering information that a lot of people seem to find worthwhile, I'm getting criticised for not providing a good enough summary of the 2hr video and for being rude(??). i find this unbelievable. next time i just won't post anything in case i don't summarise the topic well enough first (??). i find it laughable!!

Are you actually worked up or are you doing some sort of meme here?
 

pauljacob

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There's no dedicated resources that come to mind, I'm sorry. I'm simply shooting from an observational hip here based on passing testimonies of people who have spoken about their experiences with these extreme diets on various 'health & wellness' platforms.

Maybe you'd find something of value in Khan Academy's "Fat and protein metabolism" lessons. Some of the video titles in this subsection are:
-introduction to energy storage
-digestion, mobilization, and transport of fats
-how does the body adapt to starvation?

Introduction to energy storage (video) | Khan Academy
Thank you Twohandsondeck for your reply and the link. Very kind of you. :thumbsup:
 

Dave Clark

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Wouldn’t it be healthier to use a full spectrum bulb like an HPS? Do you get all the reds too
I use a SOTA LightWorks, it has red, and every other color if you want it, plus the Nogiers frequencies, of which I do not have much knowledge of for use.
 
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