Why It Might Be Better To Temporarily Gain Weight After Diet Improvement

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Yeah, it looks like the average price is around $2k a day for an in-patient treatment center. The typical stay is around a month or so. The stories that I've read indicate that treatment is rarely successful the first go around so it's easy to see how costs can reach over $100k. In light of that, I have newfound respect for Gwyneth's mission.
 
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Do not Overfeed on Junkfood,it will destroy your Nervous System.There are several members of this
Board who reported typical Symptoms of B-Vitamin Deficiency like altered mentation,disorientation,
loss of musclestrength(innervation) etc,in association with Ad-Libitum Sugarfeeding.Over and Underweight People need to eat clean.There is no other Mission
that should be advocated.Junkfood is bad for everyone.Do not advise for ArtificalFood consumption pls.
 
Joined
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Messages
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Location
The Lone Star State
Do not Overfeed on Junkfood,it will destroy your Nervous System.There are several members of this
Board who reported typical Symptoms of B-Vitamin Deficiency like altered mentation,disorientation,
loss of musclestrength(innervation) etc,in association with Ad-Libitum Sugarfeeding.Over and Underweight People need to eat clean.There is no other Mission
that should be advocated.Junkfood is bad for everyone.Do not advise for ArtificalFood consumption pls.

Fair enough, though I never have nor ever will advocate junk food consumption. I promote eating natural, whole foods when possible. Organically grown is preferable. I make exceptions for traditionally processed foods like white flour, pasta, butter, and so on though. I love to cook so I never eat out of a package. My point was that I agree with Gwyneth in that people who have been restricting calories for a while need to eat a certain amount of calories in order to heal. You can definitely do that without modern, highly-processed garbage food.
 

YamnayaMommy

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@sweetpeat
In some cases, yes I do think people will gain some weight to start depending on thier context, but I dont think its going to be 40-50-100lbs of EXCESS weight (by excess weight I mean added fat, if someone is emaciated or underweight and they start to eat, I think gaining a large amount of bodyweight is neccesary, but this isnt just fat) and I dont think the excess weight should be there for years or even a year.

I think the group most likely to deal with an increase fat gain that is difficult to get off is older women. However, with a solid diet, in many cases, I think that can be largely mitigated. I have helped a few women that I was close to (I'm not a health coach or a medical practitioner so it was purely through off hand comments and suggestions when they asked me), recover from absurd and restrictive diets (usually some form of vegetarianism or veganism) and in most of the cases they actually lost weight initially, particularly from thier abdomen. They did this while increasing food and calories in general. To be fair these women were all on the younger side. The few older women I have offered my point of view to (when asked), often dismiss it on the basis that "they will get fat" or they agree but just continue thier old habits regardless.

As for how I got these people to lose weight while they ate more, all i did was:
1) replace starch with sugar but the sugar came entirely from fruit and 100% juice that was low in fodmaps, had a good fructose to glucose ratio and agreed with thier digestion (as per thier assessment)
2) made sure they ate enough protein from meat, seafood, eggs and very lean fowl
3) made sure they ate enough fat from tallow, coconut oil, butter, chocolate and/ or cocoa butter. Some had issues with coconut oil irritating thier intestine, so they dropped it. Some had issue with butter causing acne or dandruff or hairloss if eaten in large quantities so they dropped it or reduced it to a manageable level.
4) made sure they ate enough fiber from carrots and whole fruit. Mushrooms, if they agreed with them.
5) later once they stabilized, if they wanted to they added in tubers, white rice and dairy as experiments to see how they felt with these foods. If they felt good with the foods then they kept them, if not then they dropped them
6) added in some junk food for thier periods, once they stabilized. The junk food was high quality chocolate, high quality ice cream, high quality chips, high quality cookies. By high quality I mean the ingredients where pure ingredients such as for the chips: potatoes, coconut oil and salt. The cookies: rice flour, butter, eggs, sugar, chocolate. The ice cream: vanilla, cream, eggs, sugar, salt, milk. The chocolate: sugar, chocolate liquor, cocoa powder. Simple ingredients, no fillers, no problematic foods (based on thier assessment of thier reaction to said foods) and no PUFA or other garbage ingredients. These foods are how "junk food" used to be made.

Overall its not rocket science (well atleast not now, when i was figuring it out for myself over the past 5 years, it was lol). Eat enough food, of the least irritating, most easily digestible, most nutrient dense to start. Stabilize on this template for a while. Then add in different foods one at a time to see how you react, keep what works, discard what doesnt. Gradually increase calories overtime as you feel you need (many people have issues eating enough to start, also once people start eating real foods instead of garbage they find that the ravenous hunger dissipates. Also when people start eating enough fat, enough sugar, enough salt and enough protein thier cravings go away. If you eat sugar all day long from fruit, salt your food to taste, add as much fats as you want, theres no reason to crave).

This resonates with me. I used to crave sweet baked goods, but that craving went away completely when I started drinking juice and, in fact, adding sugar to morning coffee. I have always felt great eating sugar but always avoided it it’s “empty calories.”

I’ve gone from like a 22BMI to 20BMI since following a diet similar to what you describe above. In last two months.

What’s your take on alcohol and body comp for women?
 
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This resonates with me. I used to crave sweet baked goods, but that craving went away completely when I started drinking juice and, in fact, adding sugar to morning coffee. I have always felt great eating sugar but always avoided it it’s “empty calories.”

I’ve gone from like a 22BMI to 20BMI since following a diet similar to what you describe above. In last two months.

What’s your take on alcohol and body comp for women?


..You will become a lazy bum in no time if you slurp down too much sugar.B-deficiency deep-fries your nervous system.

:smoking::rage
 
OP
Kelj

Kelj

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You absolutely do need more B vitamins with a higher carbohydrate diet. Of course, the higher calorie your diet is, the more likely you are to hit your B vitamin requirements. The lower calorie you are eating, the more careful you need to be about every bite you put in your mouth. Of course, if you are eating primarily foods devoid of certain nutrients, you will become deficient in those nutrients no matter how high calorie you are eating. If you are deficient in some B vitamins, B1 (thiamine), for example, that alone, can make you lose appetite and trigger anorexia. In spite of the words sometimes put in my mouth by others, I have never said you should eat a diet devoid of nutrients. I have said, in the context of filling an energy deficit, processed foods are useful and may contain more nutrients than you think. The balance I would like to make clear is, 1. you need to be concerned with energy, ie: no matter how nutrient dense spinach is, you get 20 calories when you eat two cups raw. You can fill your stomach with its fiber, but you cannot get the 2500 to 3500 daily calories you need to fuel your body's systems and most especially, you cannot renourish from a deficit eating primarily these kinds of foods. 2. You need to be concerned with nutrition, but not so rigid in your instance on eating liver, that when liver is not available, you don't eat. You can eat very high calorie foods and eat the many thousands of calories needed to address the energy deficit of anorexia, but if you are eating Twix and drinking Coke every day to do this, you will develop some deficiencies of vitamins and minerals that may even make it difficult for you to continue to eat enough.

Chris Masterjohn has some balanced information on nutrition in his Chris Masterjohn Lite videos that talk about how different kinds of diets impact your need for various nutrients.

It has definitely been my experience that my body knows what it needs, but if you've gotten into trouble applying intellectual rules to your diet, some deficiencies might need to be addressed with care about food choice or supplementation, especially to overcome problems of lack of appetite, while always eating enough food for energy. Of course, energy processes are affected by whether you are deficient in a nutrient or not. Anorexics and under eaters are more likely to be deficient in nutrients. Anorexia is statistically more likely to be present in "normal" weight and "overweight" individuals.
 

CLASH

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..You will become a lazy bum in no time if you slurp down too much sugar.B-deficiency deep-fries your nervous system.

:smoking::rage

Fruit sugar doesnt have this effect, as it comes with a decent helping of vitamins, minerals, and polyphenols. I think the lazy bum aspect is due to pure granulated sugar interacting with dopamine signaling. Eventually bacterial issues in the intestine can develop from overuse of granulated sugar as well, in conjunction with the nutrient depletion.

This resonates with me. I used to crave sweet baked goods, but that craving went away completely when I started drinking juice and, in fact, adding sugar to morning coffee. I have always felt great eating sugar but always avoided it it’s “empty calories.”

I’ve gone from like a 22BMI to 20BMI since following a diet similar to what you describe above. In last two months.

What’s your take on alcohol and body comp for women?

I think Alcohol is fine in moderation, in the context of a meal, and from a decent source, as long as no gut issues are present. A glass of quality red wine with a solid dinner (ex: some dragon fruit and soursop as an appetizer, followed by steak and mushrooms cooked in tallow and coconut oil) isnt going to make or break someone. But a bottle every friday night is a recipe for disaster.

Progesterone, magnesium, aspirin, taurine, vit C, soursop and chamomile are more relaxing than alcohol anyway, with only benefits so I dont even know why anyone would use alcohol (besides maybe social reasons). If your going to use drugs, might as well use the good ones....

I take a glass of concord grape juice, put 1g of taurine, 1g of vit c, and 100mg equivalent of magnesium of magnesium gluconate mix it up and drink. Deep relaxation usually follows, no hangover, no grogginess, and my liver still appreciates me if not more so.
 
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You absolutely do need more B vitamins with a higher carbohydrate diet. Of course, the higher calorie your diet is, the more likely you are to hit your B vitamin requirements. The lower calorie you are eating, the more careful you need to be about every bite you put in your mouth. Of course, if you are eating primarily foods devoid of certain nutrients, you will become deficient in those nutrients no matter how high calorie you are eating. If you are deficient in some B vitamins, B1 (thiamine), for example, that alone, can make you lose appetite and trigger anorexia. In spite of the words sometimes put in my mouth by others, I have never said you should eat a diet devoid of nutrients. I have said, in the context of filling an energy deficit, processed foods are useful and may contain more nutrients than you think. The balance I would like to make clear is, 1. you need to be concerned with energy, ie: no matter how nutrient dense spinach is, you get 20 calories when you eat two cups raw. You can fill your stomach with its fiber, but you cannot get the 2500 to 3500 daily calories you need to fuel your body's systems and most especially, you cannot renourish from a deficit eating primarily these kinds of foods. 2. You need to be concerned with nutrition, but not so rigid in your instance on eating liver, that when liver is not available, you don't eat. You can eat very high calorie foods and eat the many thousands of calories needed to address the energy deficit of anorexia, but if you are eating Twix and drinking Coke every day to do this, you will develop some deficiencies of vitamins and minerals that may even make it difficult for you to continue to eat enough.

Chris Masterjohn has some balanced information on nutrition in his Chris Masterjohn Lite videos that talk about how different kinds of diets impact your need for various nutrients.

It has definitely been my experience that my body knows what it needs, but if you've gotten into trouble applying intellectual rules to your diet, some deficiencies might need to be addressed with care about food choice or supplementation, especially to overcome problems of lack of appetite, while always eating enough food for energy. Of course, energy processes are affected by whether you are deficient in a nutrient or not. Anorexics and under eaters are more likely to be deficient in nutrients. Anorexia is statistically more likely to be present in "normal" weight and "overweight" individuals.



Chris Masterjohn is very firm against any kind of empty calories whatsoever.
 

accelerator

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Joined
Aug 13, 2018
Messages
175
Fruit sugar doesnt have this effect, as it comes with a decent helping of vitamins, minerals, and polyphenols. I think the lazy bum aspect is due to pure granulated sugar interacting with dopamine signaling. Eventually bacterial issues in the intestine can develop from overuse of granulated sugar as well, in conjunction with the nutrient depletion.

What do you mean by dopamine signaling?
 

CLASH

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Joined
Sep 15, 2017
Messages
1,219
What do you mean by dopamine signaling?

In my experience with eating large amounts of pure granulated sugar for about 6 months (2L of cane sugar soda a day or more), I often had little initiative to do things and my motivation was a bit shot. I think the combination of acutely and strongly lowering cortisol while also potently signaling a reward in the brain constantly, can lead to lowered motivation. In my experience the pure granulated sugar had a much more potent effect than fruit or 100% juice in regards to the effecrs mentioned above and was also a bit addictive. I think these may be related to dopamine pathways.

To be clear tho I'm not anti-sugar or anything like that, however I do believe fruit and fruit sugar is far superior to granulated sugar.
 

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