Why Is Nutella Considered Bad By Peatarians?

[Riesensackteil]

125g Butter
3 tbsp oil-reduced cocoa powder
400g condensed and maybe sweetened milk
60g milk chocolate bar

Depending on your room temperature, you could replace some butter with coconut oil to allow a creamy consistency like Nutella. You could replace some of the butter with olive oil too if room temperature is low but I think that would bomb the taste

 

[Matestube]

125g Butter
3 tbsp oil-reduced cocoa powder
400g condensed and maybe sweetened milk
60g milk chocolate bar

?

 

[Donttreadonme]

Also, nuts are not recommended. Neither is whey.

I know people, myself included, who consume large amounts of whey and were in better health than 90% of the rest of the world.

A lot of Pete's ideas are just ideas with no clinical studies

Whey
Nuts

Good stuff for the body

 

[Birdie]

I know people, myself included, who consume large amounts of whey and were in better health than 90% of the rest of the world.

A lot of Pete's ideas are just ideas with no clinical studies

Whey
Nuts

Good stuff for the body

I don't know about examples on these two, but one thing Ray does provide is many studies when he makes a statement or writes an article.

He does agree that there are great numbers of people doing fine eating stuff he doesn't call optimal. As he says, people have to deal with what's available and make their best choices from that.

That's one of the things I like about Ray. He doesn't make "you must" statements.

For sure you must be healthier than the McDonalds crowd. The fake food...

 

[Veritas IV]

Ummmm palm oil is bad, hazelnuts are full of PUFA, soy is bad, lecithin is bad and artificial is bad. Unless you just discovered Ray Peat I don’t understand why this is even a question..

Rinse it get's worse, here's a copy and paste from another forum. I dug up this info a few months after discovering Ray Peat, who of course has given me tons of material to follow-up research.

The following info applies more to palm oil in North America and less so to Europe. Am not sure about Asia, Africa, Australia & NZ:

And since we brought up Palm oil, both the organic and refined stuff may seem decent on paper and with much potential, but the final processing taints the product, both heat oxidation and contamination. Palm oil supposedly isn't safe and doesn't have as much research backing it up compared to coconut oil. Being an ecological disaster is just icing on the cake.

Edit: Red Palm oil contamination links:
1) Heavy Metal contamination from west african sourced products: (PDF) Evaluation of the Concentration of Some Toxic Metals in Dietary Red Palm Oil

2) "Sudan Red Azo Dyes" are used to make product more marketable and it's added at the factory or by the distributors (!). It's a proven carcinogen and never divulged nor listed on the label. It's the same stuff that caused "Spanish Toxic Oil Syndrome": Should Men Be Using Red Palm Oil? | Daily Medical Discoveries Should Men Be Using Red Palm Oil?

These contaminants are both tested for and outlawed in the EU, which means European red palm oil is more likely to be pure, but not in the United States. North Americans should not purchase nor eat it unless the company can provide certification that it has been tested, i've seen no claims nor certifications yet. Remember these contaminants are an addition to the poor processing and extraction methods used to get the oil out (oxidation etc etc).

But Europe recently sent out word that contaminated product had entered their supply line, I think it was far western EU and Great Britain in particular, 2021 i believe, @Pina . I don't recall if testing caught it initially or if citizens started coming down with "toxic oil syndrome". Europe requires and occasionally tests for purity, the US does not.

One thing i need to research more is the differences between palm oil (fruit) and palm kernel oil (seed). Meaning, is one product safer than the other, their composition, extraction methods & possible oxidation, contaminants, quality of final product, etc etc.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

Rinse it get's worse, here's a copy and paste from another forum. I dug up this info a few months after discovering Ray Peat, who of course has given me tons of material to follow-up research.

The following info applies more to palm oil in North America and less so to Europe. Am not sure about Asia, Africa, Australia & NZ:




But Europe recently sent out word that contaminated product had entered their supply line, I think it was far western EU and Great Britain in particular, 2021 i believe, @Pina . I don't recall if testing caught it initially or if citizens started coming down with "toxic oil syndrome". Europe requires and occasionally tests for purity, the US does not.

One thing i need to research more is the differences between palm oil (fruit) and palm kernel oil (seed). Meaning, is one product safer than the other, their composition, extraction methods & possible oxidation, contaminants, quality of final product, etc etc.

Good info Veritas IV. I am anxious to hear what you come up with on PUFA amounts in in the three palm type oils. Here is what Ray Peat just said about the different palm type oils….

I wondered if you can clear a bit of confusion about the different oils from the palm tree. I know there is palm “fruit” oil and you said to me that “palm oil” is from the husks, so is palm ”seed” oil a third oil?

"Palm kernel oil is the lowest in PUFA." -Ray Peat

EDIT:

ME
So “palm kernel” is just “palm oil", not the palm seed oil?

RAY PEAT
“No, “palm oil” is usually palm fruit oil, with a considerable amount of PUFA.”

RAY PEAT
“Fruit oil” is what marketers call husk oil.”

 

[Lollipop2]

125g Butter
3 tbsp oil-reduced cocoa powder
400g condensed and maybe sweetened milk
60g milk chocolate bar

Yum. Melted and cooled?

 

[Riesensackteil]

Yum. Melted and cooled?

I have not tried it yet, just an idea.

I would have melted the chocolate and butter, add bit of salt
mix in the cocoa powder, stir, then add the condensed milk. You can add other things and even sugar
Would warm this mixture again while stirring and then let it cool in the fridge

 

[Lollipop2]

I have not tried it yet, just an idea.

I would have melted the chocolate and butter, add bit of salt
mix the cocoa powder, stir, then add the condensed milk. You can add other things and even sugar
Would warm this mixture again while stirring and then let it cool in the fridge

Interesting thanks!

 

[Veritas IV]

Good info Veritas IV. I am anxious to hear what you come up with on PUFA amounts in in the three palm type oils. Here is what Ray Peat just said about the different palm type oils….




"Palm kernel oil is the lowest in PUFA." -Ray Peat

EDIT:

ME
So “palm kernel” is just “palm oil", not the palm seed oil?

RAY PEAT
“No, “palm oil” is usually palm fruit oil, with a considerable amount of PUFA.”

RAY PEAT
“Fruit oil” is what marketers call husk oil.”

If i'm reading Ray right, it's almost like he's saying there's two types of oil, not 3, and that the Fruit oil is nicknamed "Husk oil" by industry marketers. The "husk" seems to be referring to what surrounds the seed kernel, and in this case it's fruit flesh. I think "Husk" equals "fruit" in this case.

It Intrigued me enough to research, 4 or 5 different websites seem to be using the words husk and fruit interchangeably, including one research article. Personally i think there's only two types of palm oil, but who knows...

That being said, the kernel oil has less PUFA than the fruit oil. But the fruit oil is still way better than canola-vegetable-corn oils.

The biggest problem is in my quote above, all palm oil in the US has to be considered contaminated with Azo dyes. There is nothing outlawing it here, the practice is rampant, it is never tested for, nor do producers offer any certifications that it's been tested for these toxic dyes. I see fancy labeling like "non-gmo" and "organic" and "sustainably harvested" but no word on Azo dyes.

I wasted money on two jars of this brand, still have them, but i'm hesitant to even use them as a Vitamin E oil on my skin. My guess is the Azo dyes would be absorbed too.

 

[Rinse & rePeat]

If i'm reading Ray right, it's almost like he's saying there's two types of oil, not 3, and that the Fruit oil is nicknamed "Husk oil" by industry marketers. The "husk" seems to be referring to what surrounds the seed kernel, and in this case it's fruit flesh. I think "Husk" equals "fruit" in this case.

It Intrigued me enough to research, 4 or 5 different websites seem to be using the words husk and fruit interchangeably, including one research article. Personally i think there's only two types of palm oil, but who knows...

That being said, the kernel oil has less PUFA than the fruit oil. But the fruit oil is still way better than canola-vegetable-corn oils.

The biggest problem is in my quote above, all palm oil in the US has to be considered contaminated with Azo dyes. There is nothing outlawing it here, the practice is rampant, it is never tested for, nor do producers offer any certifications that it's been tested for these toxic dyes. I see fancy labeling like "non-gmo" and "organic" and "sustainably harvested" but no word on Azo dyes.

I wasted money on two jars of this brand, still have them, but i'm hesitant to even use them as a Vitamin E oil on my skin. My guess is the Azo dyes would be absorbed too.

View attachment 34727

Yeah I was confused thinking there were three, but now that he clarified that there are only two. For a long time I thought the Palm oil was ok, but never was sure which one. I am still trying to keep it all straight in my head.

 

[schultz]

Palm oil doesn't seem that high in PUFA to me, unless there is tremendous variation that I don't know about or the data I am looking at is incorrect. Cronometer says 9.3g per 100g of oil, which is less than olive oil. A couple teaspoons of the refined stuff here and there isn't a problem IMO, at least in regards to PUFA.

DEfatted might have no fat but peanuts have other issues with their protein and more, they have phytoestrogens and are a fungus or mold
Iirc

Yeah, this is likely true.

 

[Dr. B]

Why would you have such a rude and belligerent tone in all your contributions?
Palm oil is not all that bad given it's SFA/MUFA/PUFA ratio, that's coming from Peat himself.
Unless you can explain what makes it that bad, in a calm and argumented way.

I sometimes have the impression that you are a teenage male trolling, I have never seen that level of agressivity in a female, let alone a female your age.

Palm oil has a good ratio, isnt it 6 to 8% PUFA? Basically same as beef tallow, dairy... the main concern with it is the tocotrienols?