Why Is Consuming Lot Of Milk Result To Fat Gain By Lot Of People?

[cyclops]

Because they use pasteurized homogenized milk, which is dead food and causes a host of issues including weight gain.

On a gallon of organic raw milk a day, I do have a slightly upset bowel but I gain only muscle, no fat at all

I wonder if a large component of you doing so much better on the raw milk is that it is organic and (possibly/probably) grass-fed. The cows of the raw milk are probably fed a much better diet. Ray has said that pasteurization and homogenization are not that big of a deal, so I wonder if your success with the raw milk is not because it is raw, but because the milk itself is of much higher quality because of what the cows eat, how they're treated, and everything they are given. It would be an interesting experiment if you could pasteurize and homogenize your organic raw milk and see if that produces in difference in how you look and feel.

 

[berk]

...

 

[Pdohlen]

Supplement Guide — **** Portion Control

Homogenization destroys lactoferrin (Iron binding protein) according to Natedog. How significant it may be, I don't know.

 

[TheBeard]

I wonder if a large component of you doing so much better on the raw milk is that it is organic and (possibly/probably) grass-fed. The cows of the raw milk are probably fed a much better diet. Ray has said that pasteurization and homogenization are not that big of a deal, so I wonder if your success with the raw milk is not because it is raw, but because the milk itself is of much higher quality because of what the cows eat, how they're treated, and everything they are given. It would be an interesting experiment if you could pasteurize and homogenize your organic raw milk and see if that produces in difference in how you look and feel.

Yes it is organic and grass fed.
You're right, maybe it's the reason why it's easier on my system.

I still think nutrients and vitamins are altered with heat.

 

[baccheion]

I wonder if a large component of you doing so much better on the raw milk is that it is organic and (possibly/probably) grass-fed. The cows of the raw milk are probably fed a much better diet. Ray has said that pasteurization and homogenization are not that big of a deal, so I wonder if your success with the raw milk is not because it is raw, but because the milk itself is of much higher quality because of what the cows eat, how they're treated, and everything they are given. It would be an interesting experiment if you could pasteurize and homogenize your organic raw milk and see if that produces in difference in how you look and feel.

Doesn't such processing result in milk leaving acidic versus alkaline residue? Raw milk is neutral/alkalizing.

Milk being from 100% grass-fed/grass-finished organic A2 cows is much more important. Even better if also not homogenized, as the process is said to make it harder to absorb certain nutrients? Lowers calcium amount due to insoluble soaps with fat? I suppose it doesn't matter with skim milk.

 

[cyclops]

Milk being from 100% grass-fed/grass-finished organic A2 cows is much more important. Even better if also not homogenized, as the process is said to make it harder to absorb certain nutrients? Lowers calcium amount due to insoluble soaps with fat? I suppose it doesn't matter with skim milk.

I recently listened to an interview where someone asked Ray about homogenization and he said something along the lines of it doesn't matter too much because it all gets homogenized in your stomach anyway - and he likes homogenized for the convenience of not having to mix. I've heard him say in the past pasteurization is not too big a deal and some people do better on ultra pasteurized brands. He has said being grass-fed is much more important. Lastly, in this latest interview he said right now he just buys regular supermarket milk because its most convenient for him.

 

[Forsythia]

Cyclops did Peat say what the fat content of his milk is? Is he still drinking 1% milk?

 

[CLASH]

Do you have any studies which support a refutation Ray's position on the Randle cycle? I would be interested to look at one.

I don't disagree with Ray's perspective of the Randle cycle, I very much believe the Randle cycle is real phenomenon. I disagree with many of the interpretations I see on the forum in regards to the Randle cycle. As far as I understand, Ray is a fan of lower fat diets specifically because of the accumulation of PUFA, not neccesarily because of the Randle cycle. Cells in culture may have metabolic switches that are directly effected by the type of substrate presented to them in the form of fat or carbs for the production of energy, but on the macro level of the body I don't think its that simple.

 

[baccheion]

I don't disagree with Ray's perspective of the Randle cycle, I very much believe the Randle cycle is real phenomenon. I disagree with many of the interpretations I see on the forum in regards to the Randle cycle. As far as I understand, Ray is a fan of lower fat diets specifically because of the accumulation of PUFA, not neccesarily because of the Randle cycle. Cells in culture may have metabolic switches that are directly effected by the type of substrate presented to them in the form of fat or carbs for the production of energy, but on the macro level of the body I don't think its that simple.

Has anyone done low fat (milk + OJ, for example) with before/after labs to see what was affected? Links?

 

[berk]

Ray is a fan of lower fat diets

no he is not, his advise is follow a macrosplit 25/50/25 P/C/F or 25/25/50 P/C/F.
Thats not low fat, actually moderate to high (but not keto high)
Lower than that cause hormone imbalance, increase stress hormones.

i have never read/heard ray advice is to follow a low fat diet.
only that it is a handy tool for fat loss / get rid of PUFA, but not for long periods of time.
Context matters. (but correct me if i wrong)

 

[CLASH]

Has anyone done low fat (milk + OJ, for example) with before/after labs to see what was affected? Links?

What specific labs are you looking for?

Ray is a fan of lower fat diets specifically because of the accumulation of PUFA, not neccesarily because of the Randle cycle

@berk
This was my original statement. I did not say the Ray was a fan of low fat diets overall. I stated that the reason that Ray was a fan of low fat diets was because of PUFA accumulation.

I'm not sure where you have seen Ray make specific macro percentage recommendations?

 

[berk]

I'm not sure where you have seen Ray make specific macro percentage recommendations?

Someone on this forum had once told that Ray recommends these macro percentage, and I made a note of that.

 

[CLASH]

Someone on this forum had once told that Ray recommends these macro percentage, and I made a note of that.

I personally am careful about anything someone tells me on this forum in regards to what Ray says. I tend to go to the source directly with Ray, either in audio format or written format. Even then I tend to double check what Ray says with his sources and other sources, as well as filter it through my own mental framework.

 

[berk]

I personally am careful about anything someone tells me on this forum in regards to what Ray says. I tend to go to the source directly with Ray, either in audio format or written format. Even then I tend to double check what Ray says with his sources and other sources, as well as filter it through my own mental framework.

you are absolute right, but i don't think the ratio's are wrong.
Like i said, i never heard ray saying that low fat is the healthy way to go for permanent time.
Low dietary fat can absolute wreck havoc on your mood,hormones and sense of well being,

 

[berk]

I'm not sure where you have seen Ray make specific macro percentage recommendations?

I personally am careful about anything someone tells me on this forum in regards to what Ray says. I tend to go to the source directly with Ray, either in audio format or written format.

If the fat is mostly saturated, from milk, cheese, butter, beef, lamb or coconut oil, I think it's usually o.k. to get about 50% of the calories from fat, but since those natural fats typically contain around 2% polyunsaturated fats, I try to minimize my PUFA intake by having more fruit, and a little less fat, maybe 30 to 35%.
Ray Peat FAQ

 

[YourUniverse]

If the fat is mostly saturated, from milk, cheese, butter, beef, lamb or coconut oil, I think it's usually o.k. to get about 50% of the calories from fat, but since those natural fats typically contain around 2% polyunsaturated fats, I try to minimize my PUFA intake by having more fruit, and a little less fat, maybe 30 to 35%.
Ray Peat FAQ

Ok, but which makes you feel better?

 

[berk]

Ok, but which makes you feel better?

personal i like 20-30% fat. if i got higher than i must decrease starch = less glycogen in muscle = less energy/ power/recovery.
i said starch because i don't like high fruit/fructose diet for the same reasons. (= less glycogen in muscle = less energy/ power/recovery.
if i go lower dan 20% fat = more stress, more anxiety without reason, low libido, quicker injured, more belly fat)

 

[CLASH]

If the fat is mostly saturated, from milk, cheese, butter, beef, lamb or coconut oil, I think it's usually o.k. to get about 50% of the calories from fat, but since those natural fats typically contain around 2% polyunsaturated fats, I try to minimize my PUFA intake by having more fruit, and a little less fat, maybe 30 to 35%.
Ray Peat FAQ

This is not Ray's advise to other people. This is what Ray does himself in the current moment he was asked about the topic. There are numerous quotes from Ray that can be interpreted to be contradictory to each other. In my experience Ray does not give specific advice or prescriptions, he makes statements based on what he's found works for him. In my opinion this is why there is so much confusion as to what is a "Ray Peat" diet. The point is not to have a Ray Peat diet, the point is to use your own guidance system and research/ test out/ incorporate some of the principles and ideas Ray has discussed into your own life.

 

[schultz]

Doesn't such processing result in milk leaving acidic versus alkaline residue? Raw milk is neutral/alkalizing.

I think the freshness of the milk might be more important in regards to acidity. The same thing applies to meat. Aged meat is acid whereas fresh meat is not, as glycogen turns into lactic acid.

I'm not sure where you have seen Ray make specific macro percentage recommendations?

I've heard him mention macros when talking about digestion and he said a 3rd of each macro is apparently optimal. He was referring to a specific study. That doesn't mean he thinks everyone should eat 33/33/33 though, it's merely a piece of information to consider.

I disagree with many of the interpretations I see on the forum

I think this is an ongoing problem. People (including myself) sort of fill in the blanks themselves. Ray isn't the greatest at clarifying context (or we aren't, because we don't understand the context) in the audio interviews or on a short e-mail reply. His newsletters are where he really lays out his ideas but even then there can be information missing. Sometimes the information is in a different newsletter and he has already touched on it in the past.

As you said though, the main problem Ray has with a higher fat diet is the PUFA and he has said as much. It seems he personally limits his fat intake for this very reason. A good question to ask him would be how much fat he would consume if he could keep his PUFA at zero.

 

[Rafael Lao Wai]

A good question to ask him would be how much fat he would consume if he could keep his PUFA at zero.

That would be a great question!