Why I Think Many People Have Issues With Supplemental Vitamin D

[lampofred]

Vitamin D puts iron in storage, so if you are already saturated with iron, vitamin D will increase iron toxicity.

With sunlight it's different because the light acts as a heavy metal detoxifying agent because it stimulates your metabolism, so you don't get iron toxicity.

But without sufficient vitamin D, you will overproduce lactic acid and run on fat instead of oxidizing sugar into CO2. There will be too much neurotransmitter activity and not enough GABA which will eventually lead to schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, OCD, etc. if the deficiency becomes too pronounced. The low vitamin D state is inherently unstable.

Coffee has the same iron-detoxifying effect as light, so does OJ, aspirin, blood donation, and I am starting to think small amounts of nicotine gum (without bad fillers) might have this effect too.

In short my guess is that the real issue is iron toxicity and lowering iron should increase the ability to handle vitamin D, which in turn will improve sugar use and raise GABA (and also will likely help a lot to lower weight @Cirion ).

 

[Homo Consumericus]

Vitamin D puts iron in storage, so if you are already saturated with iron, vitamin D will increase iron toxicity.

With sunlight it's different because the light acts as a heavy metal detoxifying agent because it stimulates your metabolism, so you don't get iron toxicity.

But without sufficient vitamin D, you will overproduce lactic acid and run on fat instead of oxidizing sugar into CO2. There will be too much neurotransmitter activity and not enough GABA which will eventually lead to schizophrenia, bipolar disorder, OCD, etc. if the deficiency becomes too pronounced. The low vitamin D state is inherently unstable.

Coffee has the same iron-detoxifying effect as light, so does OJ, aspirin, blood donation, and I am starting to think small amounts of nicotine gum (without bad fillers) might have this effect too.

In short my guess is that the real issue is iron toxicity and lowering iron should increase the ability to handle vitamin D, which in turn will improve sugar use and raise GABA (and also will likely help a lot to lower weight @Cirion ).

Is this a Morley Robbins hypothesis?

 

[somuch4food]

But without sufficient vitamin D, you will overproduce lactic acid and run on fat instead of oxidizing sugar into CO2.

That's the first time I encounter a connection between lactic acid and vitamin D. Can you explain it a bit more or provide some links?

 

[milk_lover]

So maybe put some vitamin D drops in my coffee?

 

[postman]

Interesring theory. The more I read about iron the worse it seems.

 

[Evgenij]

Is this a Morley Robbins hypothesis?

Probably yes. Because vitamin D antagonises our retinol and retinol is essential for ceruloplasmin production. Why hypothesis?

 

[Homo Consumericus]

Probably yes. Because vitamin D antagonises our retinol and retinol is essential for ceruloplasmin production. Why hypothesis?

The hypothesis is an idea, specifically worded in null and alternative versions, which the researcher sets out to verify. After testing, one can be accepted and the other rejected.

I'm not sure how many of Morley Robbins' ideas have been tested. One idea, his magnesium supplementation obsession, seems likely to cause a manganese deficiency, particularly since magnesium is often easier to obtain from diet.

 

[Dave Clark]

Morley's ideas sound good on paper, but some times it doesn't pan out. He wants people to stop oral D and get it from sun, however older people have shown in studies to not produce sufficient amounts from sun exposure (and that's saying you even have the opportunity to sun bathe), plus, he says don't take oral D, but tells you to consume cod liver oil, which first of all is straight up PUFAs, plus it 'is' oral D, it gets metabolized just like a vitamin D supplement. I have an older friend who quit taking oral D, did sun exposure, ended up with a case of urticaria, went back on the oral D, and everything cleared up. I am still on the fence about his ideas. I do believe imbalancing of these fat soluble vitamins could be a problem, so making sure you get ample A,K,E, and not too much D is important. I feel too high of ascorbic acid and zinc may create copper problems, so keeping them in balance is important as well.

 

[Lollipop2]

And then there is this:


New light shed on role iron biology plays in disease

New light shed on role iron biology plays in disease

 

[lampofred]

Is this a Morley Robbins hypothesis?

No, never heard of him until now. It was just a personal hypothesis but I'm definitely not saying it's brand new. I'm sure there are people who are already talking about it.

 

[Homo Consumericus]

No, never heard of him until now. It was just a personal hypothesis but I'm definitely not saying it's brand new. I'm sure there are people who are already talking about it.

You've worded it well. I've screenshot it to ponder over the next few days.

 

[Evgenij]

...however older people have shown in studies to not produce sufficient amounts from sun exposure...

What is "sufficient amounts"? I read more and more often that the 25-OH-D levels does not give any information about the vitamin D state in our organism. You can have a high d-level, but a reduced d-activity. A more meaningful diagnosis includes 1,25-(OH)2, 25-OH-D, free vitamin D3 (fD3) and VDBP.

 

[Evgenij]

That's very interesting:

Skin Exposure to Narrow Band Ultraviolet (UVB) Light Modulates the Human Intestinal Microbiome

A skin-intestinal axis.

 

[Dave Clark]

What is "sufficient amounts"? I read more and more often that the 25-OH-D levels does not give any information about the vitamin D state in our organism. You can have a high d-level, but a reduced d-activity. A more meaningful diagnosis includes 1,25-(OH)2, 25-OH-D, free vitamin D3 (fD3) and VDBP.

'Sufficient amounts' are really not my words. but the so called experts. How does anybody really know what levels on vitamin D (storage) tests are optimal or sufficient or whatever, to me it is almost an arbitrary number they come up with. I am on the FB group Secosteroid hormone D, so I know what you are saying regarding the active form and all that. However, just like with the iodine thing, the people who are against using high dose iodine, and the people who are against using oral D somehow can't explain when good results come out of using it, or therapeutically it gets results treating a condition (Coimbra protocol?). So, having said all that, I think there is just too much mystery around vitamin D (and iodine for that matter) to come to any conclusions, that is just my take on it. I tend to lean towards what is natural from nature, re: sun exposure, iodine from food, BUT, we are living in an unnatural world of modern toxic technology, and those natural laws may not apply.

 

[Amazoniac]

That's very interesting:

Skin Exposure to Narrow Band Ultraviolet (UVB) Light Modulates the Human Intestinal Microbiome

A skin-intestinal axis.

It is, but the remarkable effect was normalization of diversity in the group that wasn't supplementing venom D. It's difficult to interpret for the group that was because specific changes that stood out could've been on someone who wasn't intoxicating enough (12.5 mcg/d, for example), so perhaps just increasing the dose would've led to similar results.

 

[Gone Peating]

'Sufficient amounts' are really not my words. but the so called experts. How does anybody really know what levels on vitamin D (storage) tests are optimal or sufficient or whatever, to me it is almost an arbitrary number they come up with. I am on the FB group Secosteroid hormone D, so I know what you are saying regarding the active form and all that. However, just like with the iodine thing, the people who are against using high dose iodine, and the people who are against using oral D somehow can't explain when good results come out of using it, or therapeutically it gets results treating a condition (Coimbra protocol?). So, having said all that, I think there is just too much mystery around vitamin D (and iodine for that matter) to come to any conclusions, that is just my take on it. I tend to lean towards what is natural from nature, re: sun exposure, iodine from food, BUT, we are living in an unnatural world of modern toxic technology, and those natural laws may not apply.

I think the danger with too much iodine is that iodine is said to suppress TSH. If you suppress TSH too much you can induce hypothyroidism

 

[Dave Clark]

I think the danger with too much iodine is that iodine is said to suppress TSH. If you suppress TSH too much you can induce hypothyroidism

Never heard that, in fact, TSH raises and stays high for up to six months before normalizing to proper levels, according to the iodine doctors, et.al. Please post any studies if you have them that shows TSH drops too low when iodine is dosed high. I find it hard to believe that based on thousands of people doing high-dose iodine therapy, showing no clinical diagnosis of hypothyroidism 'due' to iodine usage, as opposed to starting out with hypothyroidism when beginning iodine therapy. But I keep an open mind if the data is there.

 

[Gone Peating]

Never heard that, in fact, TSH raises and stays high for up to six months before normalizing to proper levels, according to the iodine doctors, et.al. Please post any studies if you have them that shows TSH drops too low when iodine is dosed high. I find it hard to believe that based on thousands of people doing high-dose iodine therapy, showing no clinical diagnosis of hypothyroidism 'due' to iodine usage, as opposed to starting out with hypothyroidism when beginning iodine therapy. But I keep an open mind if the data is there.

I did a search for high dose iodine once and someone quoted Peat saying that. So it made me not want to experiment.

I’ve also seen reports on here from people who did high dose iodine saying it had a very negative impact on their health.

 

[baccheion]

When I did the protocol, TSH went up slightly (to the low 2s). When I messed it up, it went to the 4s. I believe it eventually settles lower.

I've heard many reports of weight gain on megadose iodine. One trick to push through detox is to quickly jump to 100 mg Lugol's/LugoTabs/Iodoral and to take recommended cofactors. For some, the gain is due to detox (too much too fast) or slowed/impaired metabolism.

In a way, the protocol seems like an easy one to mess up. Especially so if not eating well (ie, getting all nutrients).

 

[Goobz]

Vitamin D puts iron in storage, so if you are already saturated with iron, vitamin D will increase iron toxicity.

Do you have a source for this? I ask just because I vaguely remember reading the opposite - that vitamin D takes iron from the intracellular compartment and deposits it outside.