Why Doesn't Coffee Affect Me Normally?

[Ellie18]

They have meters you can buy at somewhere like Walmart. @whodathunkit made a post about it recently and what meter is good to buy.

There is also h1ba1c meters, which work a bit differently but are supposed to give a longer view of what is going on with your blood sugar.

I know blood sugar is important, but I've never thought of it as important enough to be tested, but it does make sense so I'm definitely going to find one, thank you.

 

[Luann]

@Ellie18 yes, Peat says that serotonin caused by a mother's nutrient-poor diet can stick around for life if you don't intervene and change your own diet, so SSRI's could probably have a similar long-lasting effect. Also, other things besides SSRI can cause too much serotonin. Like PUFA, or protein deficiency, or trauma.

 

[Ellie18]

@Ellie18 yes, Peat says that serotonin caused by a mother's nutrient-poor diet can stick around for life if you don't intervene and change your own diet, so SSRI's could probably have a similar long-lasting effect. Also, other things besides SSRI can cause too much serotonin. Like PUFA, or protein deficiency, or trauma.

Good to know, My mother ate fairly healthy when pregnant (lots of tropical fruits in hawaii) But she was also a vegetarian who ate lots of beans, wheat, and soy. so thats also what I grew up eating, and ate until about 2 years ago. (I'm 20 now) She also had a stroke before I was born, so I dont know if the hormones from that could have affected me in some way (the doctors believed it to be from taking birth control for a straight 10 years)
I think because of the long term vegetarianism I have some degree of protein deficiency which I'm trying to figure out how to fix..
I heard cyproheptadine or something could lower serotonin? Do you know of any other way?

 

[Luann]

Yeah. And this post wasn't meant to disrespect anyones mom. For a lot of us, we come from health-conscious parents who were following current knowledge in how to raise a healthy family and eat right. Stuff like South Beach.
Cypro is what wiki recommends and some people here have tried it, to lower serotonin through food you ought to lower estrogen which contributes to making serotonin. Basic Peat ideals, like low PUFA, low iron, plenty of protein, will help with the serotonin : )

 

[Ellie18]

@Liubo Exactly, I know my mom did the best with her knowledge at the time. We are so lucky to have the internet nowadays to find people like Ray Peat that spread invaluable wisdom. I will try to get more protein in, and keep avoiding pufas. Thank you!

 

[Luann]

Of course. And yes it's weird because, like, people still give "nutrition" their full 100%, eating lots of salad and grilled chicken, and still sort of come up empty. It's not the effort, it's choosing the right path.

 

[Ellie18]

Of course. And yes it's weird because, like, people still give "nutrition" their full 100%, eating lots of salad and grilled chicken, and still sort of come up empty. It's not the effort, it's choosing the right path.

Totally agree!

 

[WestCoaster]

Good to know, My mother ate fairly healthy when pregnant (lots of tropical fruits in hawaii) But she was also a vegetarian who ate lots of beans, wheat, and soy. so thats also what I grew up eating, and ate until about 2 years ago. (I'm 20 now) She also had a stroke before I was born, so I dont know if the hormones from that could have affected me in some way (the doctors believed it to be from taking birth control for a straight 10 years)
I think because of the long term vegetarianism I have some degree of protein deficiency which I'm trying to figure out how to fix..
I heard cyproheptadine or something could lower serotonin? Do you know of any other way?

I believe salt is either supposed to lower Serotonin or Serotonin rises in the presence of low sodium. Either or, it looks like when one goes up the other goes down. Pete mentions it in his article here: Salt, energy, metabolic rate, and longevity

 

[Mittir]

Back pain is a common hypothyroid symptom. Is your back pain due to injury?
Gut irritation and endotoxin causes joint and back pain by increasing serotonin
and decreasing thyroid function. Easily digestible foods can make a big difference.

Based on your temperature, you are more likely to be hypothyroid.
Are you measuring oral temperature 1-2 hours after breakfast?
Oral temp is not reliable. It is better to use armpit or ear temp.

Plain water can worsen hypothyroid symptoms. Hypo people have
weak kidney function to process excess fluid. RP recommends to
drink when you are thirsty and it is better to avoid plain water
on it's own. Here is RP's article on water Water: swelling, tension, pain, fatigue, aging

In traditional diet people used to get half a grain of thyroid from foods like
chicken and fish stew. Chicken neck and fish head have good amount of thyroid.
It is worth trying small amount of thyroid supplement or fish head or chicken
neck soup to see how it feels. Your diet has a lot of foods that can cause gut
irritation and endotoxin problems.

 

[Pet Peeve]

Ouch, don't take Tramadol, it's an SSRI. Tianeptine is very similar but lowers serotonin instead.

Have you tried Ritanserin for energy?

 

[tara]

Some people make magnesium carbonate from milk of magnesia and sparkling water (you can find the method on youtube)

Magnesium carbonate powder is one possible way to take Mg (that's what I'm using at the moment). But I think what milk_lover is suggesting is magnesium bicarbonate, which you can't get in dry form. Mg bicarbonate is reported to be more easily absorbed (I've used that too at times).

Is there anything besides coffee that you can recommend for energy?

Adequate fuel and micronutrients and a strong metabolism.:)

Thats super interesting, I drink a ton of water, probably close to a gallon a day, among other liquid (juices, coffee, sometimes soda) And my pee is generally always clear. I am thirsty often too, though. I alway thought that it was a good thing to be clear, not over hydration! Thanks for the input!

Being over-hydrated can perversely sometimes increase thirst- which makes it tricky to just drink to thirst. I'd recommend experimenting with reducing water consumption till there is at least some colour in your pee, and see if that improves anything. Hopefully once you get out of any overhydration habit, your normal thirst will kick in to tell you what you need.
Personally, I've been in trouble with both under and over drinking.
Unless you are very active or in a climate where you sweat a lot, 2-3 l may be a more normal fluid amount, but sometime people with low metabolism do better with less. It is also probably easier for the system to handle smaller more frequent drinks than large amounts in one go.

Have you mentioned your diet before?

+1

I react in non-standard ways to coffee too. Never drink much at all, small amounts occasionally seem to make me sleep deeper and longer, and I always (so far) seem to get into trouble if I drink even small amounts regularly.

 

[dbh25]

I react in non-standard ways to coffee too.

Me too. Coffee can mess with my digestion, even only a cup after a meal. I don't really like other beverages with caffeine. I started to not drink it every day, to see how I feel. So don't assume coffee works for each person.

 

[Luann]

@tara, on large gulps of liquid: it's almost nauseating, isn't it, to take a huge quanity of water at once. seriously, gag reflex would kick in.

 

[Ellie18]

Back pain is a common hypothyroid symptom. Is your back pain due to injury?
Gut irritation and endotoxin causes joint and back pain by increasing serotonin
and decreasing thyroid function. Easily digestible foods can make a big difference.

Based on your temperature, you are more likely to be hypothyroid.
Are you measuring oral temperature 1-2 hours after breakfast?
Oral temp is not reliable. It is better to use armpit or ear temp.

Plain water can worsen hypothyroid symptoms. Hypo people have
weak kidney function to process excess fluid. RP recommends to
drink when you are thirsty and it is better to avoid plain water
on it's own. Here is RP's article on water Water: swelling, tension, pain, fatigue, aging

In traditional diet people used to get half a grain of thyroid from foods like
chicken and fish stew. Chicken neck and fish head have good amount of thyroid.
It is worth trying small amount of thyroid supplement or fish head or chicken
neck soup to see how it feels. Your diet has a lot of foods that can cause gut
irritation and endotoxin problems.

My back pain is due to a car accident that happened almost 2 years ago. I don't even know if things like that can heal. I am just using a normal digital thermometer, I got a geratherm oral one but I can't figure out how to use it. I'll look into a ear one. Sometimes after eating my temp will be 97. something which is a bit better. I'll try to avoid the overconsumption of plain water, and see if I can find any fish heads or chicken necks around. Thank you



@Pet Peeve I think the reason I like it so much is because it raises dopamine, and makes me feel normal, perhaps I'm dopamine deficient? And no, is it a prescription drug?

 

[Ellie18]

@tara I'm having a hard time finding milk of magnesia thats not full of other add ins, so I found magnesium hydroxide powder. Would that with seltzer water give the same effect?
Can you have a weak metabolism but not be overweight?
I think I drink a lot of water too, as an anxiety thing. I'll only drink when I'm thirsty. :)
I don't see coffee negatively impacting me, nor positively. It tastes good though so I think I'm okay still consuming it..

 

[Pet Peeve]

Tramadol raises serotonin and noradrenaline, you probably need to take something to lower it again, that's my experience with it. Tianeptine is a painkiller and lowers serotonin, it is not a prescription drug yet, you can buy it on the net cheaply. Ritanserin lowers serotonin and has a dopamine effect, you can buy it through idealabs.

 

[tara]

seriously, gag reflex would kick in.

I had a bit of practice drinking water because I thought it was good for me. Frequently half a litre at a time. . It's quite possible to wash oneself out too much and be peeing clear. Now I only drink it if it tastes good, and stop when it doesn't.

 

[tara]

@tara I'm having a hard time finding milk of magnesia thats not full of other add ins, so I found magnesium hydroxide powder. Would that with seltzer water give the same effect?

That's what I've used. Just make sure you have a little space in the top of the bottle of soda water, and be ready to get the cap back on really fast to keep the froth and pressure in.

Can you have a weak metabolism but not be overweight?

Yes. There are quite a lot of people here in such states. Apparently it's common for drs to have this prejudice installed so they don't consider possible hypothyroid function for thin people.
Chronic undereating can lower metabolism as a protective adaptation to survive the famine.
Also, some people can burn through a lot of calories with stress hormones compensating for low thyroid function. This was apparently Peat's personal experience for a while.

 

[natedawggh]

Thats super interesting, I drink a ton of water, probably close to a gallon a day, among other liquid (juices, coffee, sometimes soda) And my pee is generally always clear. I am thirsty often too, though. I alway thought that it was a good thing to be clear, not over hydration! Thanks for the input!

!!! That is way too much water, and yes you are totally diluting your electrolytes. Soda is fine because the carbonation counteracts the tendency of the water to cause swelling, same with coffee, just stop taking so much liquid, especially plain water unless you're actually thirsty.

When the body is hypothyroid (as yours is with temps like that) it soaks up water like a sponge, and that extra water slows down cells. Drinking coffee isn't going to reverse this. You need to consume more minerals—salt, calcium, magnesium. Not in high quantities just consistently.

Coffee also will only give you as much energy as your body can produce. Always take coffee with food. But it sounds like you need to cut out the high liquid consumption and increase your whole food consumption. I second @WestCoaster's advice.

 

[tara]

My back pain is due to a car accident that happened almost 2 years ago. I don't even know if things like that can heal.

I don't know what injury you had, but many things can heal or at least improve a lot if they get good conditions. No guarantees though.
Most spinal disc ruptures and prolapses can and do heal. Some don't. A lot of them resolve within two years.
Providing sufficient nutrition, including some gelatin or collagen may be useful for healing generally. Some people have used progesterone topically to help against some kinds of joint pain. Aspirin has a number of things going for it, and there are ways to mitigate the risks of aspirin (taking it with glycine, baking soda, having some vit-K). There are some tactics mentioned on the forum for tackling arthritis, and some for tackling scar tissue, in case these are at play. Some tactics too for helping to stabilise and calm nerves (eg attending to CO2 levels, magnesium, B-vits). And then whatever good physical therapy you can get access to, and posture and appropriate exercise/movement.

I think I drink a lot of water too, as an anxiety thing.

Could you switch some of the water out for juice and/or milk, and see what happens if you limit yourself to max 300ml liquid in any half hour, and max 3l in a day? (or maybe a bit less) And see if it helps? (Don't persist for too long if it does not seem helpful after trying it.)