What's Wrong With Sugar And Starch Combining

[EIRE24]

A dash of black pepper can arrest insulin spike and it can also act as a digestive enzyme..

And also makes food tastier

 

[Xisca]

What do you mean by combining? At the same meal? Do you mean a digestion problem?
Or do you mean that we have to choose our carb source?

My experience years ago was to "cure" my boyfreind acnea by suppressing sugar and dairies and eating more veggies. Worked in 3 months, skin cleared from a big acnea.

I did notice I also had pimples, but with SUGAR, not with other carbs....
Just very clear, I had a growing pimple after eating anything with sugar. Within hours, so it was very easy to check.
Then I discovered that I had no pimple after eating sugar if I did not eat starch....

Looked as if it was necessary to chose either, but no mix!

 

[Xisca]

Then, fructose....
Depends on people and tolerance.
I have read that it also depends on the % of glucose and fructose.
Thus problems with apples or pear that are very rich in fructose, with less glucose. Sugar and honey are about 50-50, better thann some fruits.

So we have to heal the gut 1st of all....
On one side you have persorbtion with starch, on the other, you have fermenting of fructose.... Seems to ferment more than glucose....?
Might depend on the person and digestive track?

 

[Mito]

I have measured acute inflammatory biomarkers like CRP and TNFa 2 hours after a PUFA rich meal. The rise is uncomparable to anything else I have consumed, including alcohol. Some people will say alcohol suppresses inflammation but that's only for the first 24 hours. After that it bounces back with a vengeance. So, based on my N=1 tests PUFA is way more inflammatory than alcohol, which is also a TLR4 agonist so it is nothing to laugh at.

Did you try the same experiment with any monounsaturated or saturated fats? Do you think the rise in inflammatory biomarkers was the result of PUFA lipid peroxidation byproducts, beta-oxidation byproducts, or some other PUFA effects?

 

[Xisca]

In Winter I have guavas during 3 months.
Very rich in fructose and pectine.
I cook the outside and make juice with the part that has the seeds.
The result for me with that much fructose does not seem very good, and I also have my own oranges, and not so good either.

Then, how is the glucose and the fructose in the fruit?
Free, or in form of sucrose?

Nobody seems to mention that the sucrose form has to be digested and separated by the body!

I do not do so good with sugar, and nearly suppressed it.
....And I do good with honey, where fructose and glucose are already "separated".

 

[Xisca]

I have read that some people get a better digestion when they reduce fructose containing food and increase glucose containing food, including starch.

RP mention that fructose is protective, but it seems that also glucose is protective!

We really lack informations about fructose....
As @haidut mentionned, this is contradictory in what doctors say about diabetes for example!

 

[Xisca]

I see only problem in what RP says, generally: he does not mention a lot of DIFFERENCES between people, and his advices are the SAME for everybody. But our way to handle any sugar depends on our intestine and all living being thriving in this universe... We are as big as a Galaxy!

And also, even if it is evident for him when he speaks about gut, he does not mention which one, so it can be confusing. I think he talks about small gut, and we interprete sometimes by colon! Colon cannot be sterile, so he speaks about the small intestine.

I think any problem with any sugar comes from the bad bugs, and also from the good ones at the bad place. Sugar is a good food, and all bugs love it too.

If we did not eat that much starch, or badly prepared starch, we could handle resistant starch perfectly and benefit from the short chain fatty acids that our colon would make with it! But if it is fermented before its time, in the small gut instead of waiting for the big colon.... ay!

 

[Xisca]

In the winter in the US, I use a lot of frozen orange juice concentrate, because good fruit is scarce. When you use refined sugar it’s important to avoid the starchy foods, emphasizing milk, cheese, eggs, fruits, and occasional liver and seafood. Cooked leafy greens and mushrooms should substitute for starchy vegetables.

When eating starch, I remember him say that eating also some fructose containing food is protective.

But he is not precise about saying if this sentence is general, or about avoiding the MIX at the same meal!

All fruits are acidic, and starch prefers a less acidic stomach, so that ptyaline action is not blocked so quick if one does not eat fruits or even too much protein at the same meal... Protein triggers more acidity production in the stomach....

That is why I wanted more precision from @ecstatichamster about the meaning of "combining" in the title of the post.

I would never eat rice + orange juice at the same meal, but canard à l'orange is a very famous French dish! I am also fine with OJ in a Green salad.

 

[Xisca]

Probably sugar+starch is not enough minerals so he says sugar+greens or starch+greens.

I agree!
This of the "empty calories" is half b***sh** if taken as a definite "no"for eating this type of calories! The problem comes if you are not hungry anymore for eating mineral rich food... So of course, if you eat food that is concentrated in nutrients, there is no problem, you get calories AND minerals.
I mean in a normal way of eating, just intuitive.
If you know what you do, then you can think about your mineral source. But honestly, when you eat sweet stuff, Green are not appealing! So you do not get your minerals.... And minerals from bottles are much more expensive, haha!
When I eat salted foods, then greens are REALLY appealing. I cannot eat meat without the consistency of some fiber, as it helps me to chew meat in a nice way. And I can vary taste mix! Even meat taste can be boring if you eat only meat. And veggs alone, not so good either. Try to eat salt alone, and you will understand that MIX is the key!

Would you eat a mouth-full of salt?

Salad with no good dressing is not very interesting, but the dressing alone is not taht good either....

I love alchemy!

 

[Jsaute21]

What's the consensus/opinion on this? @haidut @Westside PUFAs @Such_Saturation @tara

If one is to eat starch occasionally, would you advise them to include a fructose/sucrose option if available? Or just rely on the glucose for energy.

 

[Westside PUFAs]

What's the consensus/opinion on this? @haidut @Westside PUFAs @Such_Saturation @tara

If one is to eat starch occasionally, would you advise them to include a fructose/sucrose option if available? Or just rely on the glucose for energy.

Is Ray Peat Wrong On Starches Or I Am Missing Something?

 

[Jsaute21]

@Such_Saturation & @haidut were on the $. Here's Ray's response to me inquiring about combining sugars & starches.

"It’s just a matter of getting the essential nutrients, when lots of your calories are coming from pure sugar; it’s the same when a diet contains a lot of starches or fats, they have to be supplemented with rich sources of vitamins and minerals."

 

[Such_Saturation]

 

[Drareg]

This all should be obvious at this point no?
I've never seen a person mention the importance of context so much in articles and interviews be taken out of context so much.
Sometimes it's like I want to spray my pent up downloaded information so brain defaults to straws an against Peat.

Your context is your meaning.

 

[omnivoracious]

My $0.02 is that I seem more likely to wake up with a headache or foggy mind when I consume sugar and potato starch. I can't say the starch is 100% the cause. I've started cutting out the starch to good results thus far.

 

[ecstatichamster]

I find it very difficult to cut out starch. I am working on lowering fat again, and then I'll start lowering starch.

 

[Sapien]

In response to a question about using refined sugar when fruit quality is low:
Ray Peat said:
In the winter in the US, I use a lot of frozen orange juice concentrate, because good fruit is scarce. When you use refined sugar it’s important to avoid the starchy foods, emphasizing milk, cheese, eggs, fruits, and occasional liver and seafood. Cooked leafy greens and mushrooms should substitute for starchy vegetables.

anyone know why he uses concentrate instead of bottled oj? flouridated water in OJ? I assume that the concentrate has the same issues of flavor packs, no?

 

[ecstatichamster]

I’ve found starch a great blessing, and I minimize sugar. I eat fruit and drink a little juice, not that much, but most of my carbs and most calories come from wonderful starches such as rice and masa harina. I’m doing much, much better this way than I was when I was eating mostly sugar.

 

[charlie]

I’ve found starch a great blessing, and I minimize sugar. I eat fruit and drink a little juice, not that much, but most of my carbs and most calories come from wonderful starches such as rice and masa harina. I’m doing much, much better this way than I was when I was eating mostly sugar.

Same.

 

[Sitaruîm]

I’ve found starch a great blessing, and I minimize sugar. I eat fruit and drink a little juice, not that much, but most of my carbs and most calories come from wonderful starches such as rice and masa harina. I’m doing much, much better this way than I was when I was eating mostly sugar.

Same, I eat a couple of pieces of fruit, and squeeze anywhere from a cup to a quart of oj a day, but most of my carbs come from starch. If one doesn't feel that post-prandial fatigue, there should be no reason to worry about cortisol rising with insulin