What Type Of Copper Supplement To Take ?

[Andman]

I have to stuff myself with beef and shrimp all day long to counter the copper from a couple of fruits and I'm still zinc defficient while you people are trying to supplement...tf

why would you need to counter copper? is it a blood type A thing?

 

[ursidae]

why would you need to counter copper? is it a blood type A thing?

I've been getting white spots on my nails and other indicators of zinc defficiency all my life, at this point I probably need to go carnivore+supplement zinc for them to go away. Maybe you're right though and I should go vegan and swap the beef for a kilo of pumpkin seeds/day

 

[orewashin]

Many years ago, I supplemented with 60 mg of copper a day and some zinc without any issues. It was copper sebacate in a tablet form and they were blue. It was Source Naturals and I took 20 tablets a day, split up into 4 portions.

 

[redsun]

Many years ago, I supplemented with 60 mg of copper a day and some zinc without any issues. It was copper sebacate in a tablet form and they were blue. It was Source Naturals and I took 20 tablets a day, split up into 4 portions.

You know its so strange I was reading your other posts on the RP waste energy thread the other day and I honestly thought surely you had some kind of heavy metal toxicity issue. And it seems you do, and likely your psychological issues and CFS are caused by the same thing. For how many days did you take 60mg of copper?

 

[orewashin]

You know its so strange I was reading your other posts on the RP waste energy thread the other day and I honestly thought surely you had some kind of heavy metal toxicity issue. And it seems you do, and likely your psychological issues and CFS are caused by the same thing. For how many days did you take 60mg of copper?

Oh no, I had fatigue and psychological issues way before that. My TSH was on the high side when I was a preteen, but not high enough that a doc would consult an endo, but RP would likely disagree. Again, I had no issues taking that much copper for a few months. Copper only builds up and causes toxicity in Wilson's Disease because they can't eliminate it. Copper is tightly regulated in normal people.

 

[redsun]

Oh no, I had fatigue and psychological issues way before that. My TSH was on the high side when I was a preteen, but not high enough that a doc would consult an endo, but RP would likely disagree. Again, I had no issues taking that much copper for a few months. Copper only builds up and causes toxicity in Wilson's Disease because they can't eliminate it. Copper is tightly regulated in normal people.

Yes I believe you that you already had this problems beforehand. You can only eliminate so much copper every day though. And even if you were correct and you are currently not toxic in copper anymore (doubt it but Ill roll with it), you took half of the human body content of copper (humans have about 120mg at most of copper) for months.

This absolutely annihilates histamine levels, which play a significant role in keeping you motivated and having motivation for life as a whole. Histamine is an integral neurotransmitter for being involved in life and helping you achieve real-world goals.

 

[orewashin]

Yes I believe you that you already had this problems beforehand. You can only eliminate so much copper every day though. And even if you were correct and you are currently not toxic in copper anymore (doubt it but Ill roll with it), you took half of the human body content of copper (humans have about 120mg at most of copper) for months.

This absolutely annihilates histamine levels, which play a significant role in keeping you motivated and having motivation for life as a whole. Histamine is an integral neurotransmitter for being involved in life and helping you achieve real-world goals.

Okay, some notes about that theory:

1. Cyproheptadine makes me really weak, even the next day if I take it at night for sleep, so I stopped taking it a long time ago. My prescribed dosage was three tablets per day, but even one tablet has this strong effect on me. It seemed like both an excessive amount and dosage. So this would make sense based on what you're saying about histamine.

2. RP places histamine in the same category as serotonin because they are both released in response to stress and in a similar manner, serotonin from platelets and histamine from mast cells. Are you saying histamine is a type of stress hormone that plays an important role, much like cortisol?

3. My allergic reactions are normal, I get watery eyes and sneezing from dust like my other family members.

4. It's doubtful that an artificially-induced histamine-methyl balance would persist for almost a decade unless someone has genetic issues, like an inability to eliminate copper.

 

[noodle]

Many years ago, I supplemented with 60 mg of copper a day and some zinc without any issues. It was copper sebacate in a tablet form and they were blue. It was Source Naturals and I took 20 tablets a day, split up into 4 portions.

Did your hair quality / quantity change while on the copper or the years after? Hows it now ?

 

[redsun]

Okay, some notes about that theory:

1. Cyproheptadine makes me really weak, even the next day if I take it at night for sleep, so I stopped taking it a long time ago. My prescribed dosage was three tablets per day, but even one tablet has this strong effect on me. It seemed like both an excessive amount and dosage. So this would make sense based on what you're saying about histamine.

2. RP places histamine in the same category as serotonin because they are both released in response to stress and in a similar manner, serotonin from platelets and histamine from mast cells. Are you saying histamine is a type of stress hormone that plays an important role, much like cortisol?

3. My allergic reactions are normal, I get watery eyes and sneezing from dust like my other family members.

4. It's doubtful that an artificially-induced histamine-methyl balance would persist for almost a decade unless someone has genetic issues, like an inability to eliminate copper.

Cypro does this to most people, some even worse since it kills brain histamine action so effectively.

RP is wrong about putting histamine in the exact same category as serotonin and cortisol. Excess histamine can be stressful, but most people have it low or barely normal. Brain histamine is a very necessary part for proper cognitive function, motivation, actualization, libido, energy (especially mental energy). But histamine itself (especially in the brain) is hardly a stress hormone, in excess it can be problematic but even excess has many pro's but also many cons.

Do you have seasonal allergies and how often do you get colds/flus/fever type stuff?

As for persisting low histamine states... Yes it is very possible to have a persistent low histamine state because you are deactivating the histamine you do make(which is probably very little) too quickly.

Also T3 (active thyroid) also promotes histamine action. So if you have low T3, that alone may leave you will less histamine action.

 

[orewashin]

Did your hair quality / quantity change while on the copper or the years after? Hows it now ?

My hair didn't seem to change at all the whole time. I didn't pay attention to my hair, so I wouldn't have noticed anything. I was also an adolescent, so I doubt there would be any changes. Lately, my hair seems to come out in greater quantity. It may be because I haven't been washing it, which would get rid of loose or weak hair. If I don't comb it, there's hair on my pillow and sheets. My hair looks bad unwashed because it's oily, washed it looks much better. There doesn't seem to be a problem with thinning.

 

[orewashin]

Cypro does this to most people, some even worse since it kills brain histamine action so effectively.

RP is wrong about putting histamine in the exact same category as serotonin and cortisol. Excess histamine can be stressful, but most people have it low or barely normal. Brain histamine is a very necessary part for proper cognitive function, motivation, actualization, libido, energy (especially mental energy). But histamine itself (especially in the brain) is hardly a stress hormone, in excess it can be problematic but even excess has many pro's but also many cons.

Do you have seasonal allergies and how often do you get colds/flus/fever type stuff?

As for persisting low histamine states... Yes it is very possible to have a persistent low histamine state because you are deactivating the histamine you do make(which is probably very little) too quickly.

Also T3 (active thyroid) also promotes histamine action. So if you have low T3, that alone may leave you will less histamine action.

So I take it you have a positive opinion of Modafinil?

I think mast cell histamine is bad, whereas brain histamine is more "neutral".

Where did you read about T3 promoting histamine? It could be a good anti-RP topic.

Back when I had a non-prescribed stash of T3, too much would cause me to catch a viral infection. I figured it was stimulating cortisol too much, causing reduced immunity.

I don't have allergies to pollen, but I develop hypersexuality during a certain time in the spring each year, which I speculate is from androgens in airborne pollen.

I don't get sick a lot, and it's not severe for me.

I hate air fresheners and perfumes, and for some reason get a headache from the air inside cars. Something common in people with low histamine, but I'm not sure if it's related.

 

[noodle]

My hair didn't seem to change at all the whole time. I didn't pay attention to my hair, so I wouldn't have noticed anything. I was also an adolescent, so I doubt there would be any changes. Lately, my hair seems to come out in greater quantity. It may be because I haven't been washing it, which would get rid of loose or weak hair. If I don't comb it, there's hair on my pillow and sheets. My hair looks bad unwashed because it's oily, washed it looks much better. There doesn't seem to be a problem with thinning.

If I interpret that right, there is no recession or graying on your side then?

 

[redsun]

So I take it you have a positive opinion of Modafinil?

I think mast cell histamine is bad, whereas brain histamine is more "neutral".

Where did you read about T3 promoting histamine? It could be a good anti-RP topic.

Back when I had a non-prescribed stash of T3, too much would cause me to catch a viral infection. I figured it was stimulating cortisol too much, causing reduced immunity.

I don't have allergies to pollen, but I develop hypersexuality during a certain time in the spring each year, which I speculate is from androgens in airborne pollen.

I don't get sick a lot, and it's not severe for me.

I hate air fresheners and perfumes, and for some reason get a headache from the air inside cars. Something common in people with low histamine, but I'm not sure if it's related.

Well you can try modafinil, as it is pro-histamine and see how it affects you.

Many chemical sensitivities and food intolerances are common in low histamine but no seasonal (often pollen) allergies. Very rarely getting sick also indicates.

Thyroid Hormone, Thyroid Hormone Metabolites And Mast Cells: A Less Explored Issue

 

[orewashin]

Well you can try modafinil, as it is pro-histamine and see how it affects you.

Many chemical sensitivities and food intolerances are common in low histamine but no seasonal (often pollen) allergies. Very rarely getting sick also indicates.

Thyroid Hormone, Thyroid Hormone Metabolites And Mast Cells: A Less Explored Issue

I would have to find a good pharmacy over the border. I previously used mymexicandrugstore, I think, but it went down. I looked at T3 on farmaciadelnino and another site. One site required bitcoin, which I tried to get in the past but a seller denied my request to buy their btc for some reason, like that I was risky based on an algorithm or something. Maybe because I had no credit score. The other had very expensive T3, and required prescriptions, and I'm not sure if I can send them a prescription for something I'm already buying in a local pharmacy. Obviously, if a prescription is required, I couldn't get modafinil from that one.

If I do have low histamine, T3 increasing neuronal histamine would explain my positive reaction to it. In the thread you provided, the person said she has histaminergic symptoms from T3. If I have a T4 conversion issue, and levothyroxine reduces T3, which would reduce histamine according to this theory, it would explain why I have a similar reaction of weakness from T4 and cypro. My mind automatically puts these in the same category because they put me in kind of a hazy, weak state.

The study that states histamine effects TSH doesn't say how, however. It says a histamine antagonist reduces T4, so I guess histamine increases TSH.

 

[redsun]

I would have to find a good pharmacy over the border. I previously used mymexicandrugstore, I think, but it went down. I looked at T3 on farmaciadelnino and another site. One site required bitcoin, which I tried to get in the past but a seller denied my request to buy their btc for some reason, like that I was risky based on an algorithm or something. Maybe because I had no credit score. The other had very expensive T3, and required prescriptions, and I'm not sure if I can send them a prescription for something I'm already buying in a local pharmacy. Obviously, if a prescription is required, I couldn't get modafinil from that one.

If I do have low histamine, T3 increasing neuronal histamine would explain my positive reaction to it. In the thread you provided, the person said she has histaminergic symptoms from T3. If I have a T4 conversion issue, and levothyroxine reduces T3, which would reduce histamine according to this theory, it would explain why I have a similar reaction of weakness from T4 and cypro. My mind automatically puts these in the same category because they put me in kind of a hazy, weak state.

The study that states histamine effects TSH doesn't say how, however. It says a histamine antagonist reduces T4, so I guess histamine increases TSH.

I dont agree much with haidut, but his tyronene (T3) product works well for me for the few times I have used it (do not currently use). I also get increased histamine reactions from T3 as well as increased energy/motivation, etc... so my own personal experience confirms T3's histamine increasing effects as well. Just keep in mind T3 is pro-histamine, but it also raises the catecholamines including dopamine and is overall like taking a stimulant for the brain, except that it is a "natural" stimulant instead of something like caffeine or ADHD drugs.

Yeh T4 can actually worsen T3 levels, it depends on the person but many get that issue so I would say it makes sense partly why T4 and cypro can give you similar negative effects.

The science is scarce in relationship to histamine and thyroid, but I think its pretty clear that T3 itself is necessary at least for "normal" histamine levels, so low T3 syndrome also as consequence probably means low brain histamine as well.

There is also betahistine and other H3 antagonists. I do not utilize drugs for raising histamine personally but testing them can help make sense of where you stand. H3 antagonists increase not only histamine but also dopamine, norepinephrine, etc...

 

[orewashin]

I dont agree much with haidut, but his tyronene (T3) product works well for me for the few times I have used it (do not currently use). I also get increased histamine reactions from T3 as well as increased energy/motivation, etc... so my own personal experience confirms T3's histamine increasing effects as well. Just keep in mind T3 is pro-histamine, but it also raises the catecholamines including dopamine and is overall like taking a stimulant for the brain, except that it is a "natural" stimulant instead of something like caffeine or ADHD drugs.

Yeh T4 can actually worsen T3 levels, it depends on the person but many get that issue so I would say it makes sense partly why T4 and cypro can give you similar negative effects.

The science is scarce in relationship to histamine and thyroid, but I think its pretty clear that T3 itself is necessary at least for "normal" histamine levels, so low T3 syndrome also as consequence probably means low brain histamine as well.

I wonder how he's able to sell prescription-only chemicals here in the US. Maybe it's because of being sold for lab use.

What are your thoughts about assessing histamine level with niacinamide?

 

[redsun]

I wonder how he's able to sell prescription-only chemicals here in the US. Maybe it's because of being sold for lab use.

What are your thoughts about assessing histamine level with niacinamide?

Yes it is labeled as lab use.

B3 will probably raise histamine levels acutely. It does not make it though, just increases release of what you have already for the most part. I did get increased histamine from it sometimes, but overdoing it probably reduces histamine levels overtime. This is what hoffer claimed anyways and he was probably right. It can be hit and miss for some people, B3 I mean. A more clear way would be to take zinc + P5P with histidine. Zinc activates B6 and this active B6 will then make histamine via HDC.

You can take just Zinc and P5P with a protein meal. Just that supplemental histidine increases effectiveness and help you better understand how you respond to increased histamine.

Selenium by possibly increasing T3 levels indirectly raises histamine.

 

[orewashin]

Yes it is labeled as lab use.

B3 will probably raise histamine levels acutely. It does not make it though, just increases release of what you have already for the most part. I did get increased histamine from it sometimes, but overdoing it probably reduces histamine levels overtime. This is what hoffer claimed anyways and he was probably right. It can be hit and miss for some people, B3 I mean. A more clear way would be to take zinc + P5P with histidine. Zinc activates B6 and this active B6 will then make histamine via HDC.

You can take just Zinc and P5P with a protein meal. Just that supplemental histidine increases effectiveness and help you better understand how you respond to increased histamine.

Selenium by possibly increasing T3 levels indirectly raises histamine.

I've been using healthnatura's B complex to help me recover from my burnout situation. It has both B3 and P5P.

I don't know about zinc. Whenever I took zinc without copper, I would go into a weakened state, later on I found out it was because zinc displaces copper. RP recommended against zinc, except small doses, IIRC he said it would be wise to open up capsules and take a smaller dose than the standard ones. However, I did notice that zinc increases libido. Maybe that's why oysters are known to be aphrodisiacs. I haven't had them in a long time because my grocery store only sells raw shrimp and scallops. The canned oysters don't taste that good. What are your thoughts about getting zinc from food vs supplements?

I took histidine a long time ago and it induced an alert, but hot and bothered state, from what I remember. It's probably not something good to take on a regular basis.

 

[Dave Clark]

I've been using healthnatura's B complex to help me recover from my burnout situation. It has both B3 and P5P.

I don't know about zinc. Whenever I took zinc without copper, I would go into a weakened state, later on I found out it was because zinc displaces copper. RP recommended against zinc, except small doses, IIRC he said it would be wise to open up capsules and take a smaller dose than the standard ones. However, I did notice that zinc increases libido. Maybe that's why oysters are known to be aphrodisiacs. I haven't had them in a long time because my grocery store only sells raw shrimp and scallops. The canned oysters don't taste that good. What are your thoughts about getting zinc from food vs supplements?

I took histidine a long time ago and it induced an alert, but hot and bothered state, from what I remember. It's probably not something good to take on a regular basis.

Try this and have a supplement that is from whole food source. The capsules are 15 mg, you can open up the capsule and sprinkle a smaller amount on your food if you want a smaller dose. Zinc Gold

 

[redsun]

I've been using healthnatura's B complex to help me recover from my burnout situation. It has both B3 and P5P.

I don't know about zinc. Whenever I took zinc without copper, I would go into a weakened state, later on I found out it was because zinc displaces copper. RP recommended against zinc, except small doses, IIRC he said it would be wise to open up capsules and take a smaller dose than the standard ones. However, I did notice that zinc increases libido. Maybe that's why oysters are known to be aphrodisiacs. I haven't had them in a long time because my grocery store only sells raw shrimp and scallops. The canned oysters don't taste that good. What are your thoughts about getting zinc from food vs supplements?

I took histidine a long time ago and it induced an alert, but hot and bothered state, from what I remember. It's probably not something good to take on a regular basis.

Keep in mind zinc is a mineral with multiple functions in the body and is needed for stimulatory and inhibitory neurotransmitters. So it can make you more chill or more stimulated and more energy (via increased dopamine/histamine) depending on you and also what you take with it (thats why I was saying to take B6 and histidine with it, also dopamine precursors or dopamine boosting stacks can be good). Some people just get increased adrenaline from dopamine boosting stacks though so you have to see how they can affect you but because it is pro-adrenaline as well as raises dopamine (so raises all catecholamines) it can help with energy and motivation a lot.

Yeh oysters are considered aphrodisiacs partly because of zinc, but selenium and iron content as well.

I took histidine a long time ago and it induced an alert, but hot and bothered state, from what I remember. It's probably not something good to take on a regular basis.

Of course its going to make you alert! Histamine is in big part the awareness/wakefulness neurotransmitter, that literally makes you more awake and aware of the world around you. Every time you raise or lower neurotransmitters it can feel uncomfortable especially something like histamine which histidine will raise. When you are so used to wanting to do little and little alertness, all of sudden having it can feel off.