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What About Pumpernickel Bread? Terrible Idea?
- Thread starter I_am
- Start date
on paper from a peat perspective its kind of terrible but if somehow you feel better from it then maybe it supplying something you aren't getting elsewhere...so maybe watch it, see if its downing you at all, if so, findout maybe what its supplying and get a better source but to just remove something right out like that you might leave a hole, however that would also compel a quicker solution, but yea,...oats aren't so horrible, but rye isn't that great nor is yeast
I think grains for a lot of people supply selenium and aren't excessively high in protein and have carbs and depending aren't so acidic compared to potential other sources of nutrients, so its something that seems good and is a reliable 'buffer' thing so to speak, so again...its hard for me to say its bad remove it cause I know it might leave the person with a vacancy, though skillfully you could do better ultimately but I guess the person has to have the will and desire for that. Its hard to say it has any benefit though over like boiled white rice or simply baked lightly white rice, which would be less estrogenic potentially or irritating or acidic
I think grains for a lot of people supply selenium and aren't excessively high in protein and have carbs and depending aren't so acidic compared to potential other sources of nutrients, so its something that seems good and is a reliable 'buffer' thing so to speak, so again...its hard for me to say its bad remove it cause I know it might leave the person with a vacancy, though skillfully you could do better ultimately but I guess the person has to have the will and desire for that. Its hard to say it has any benefit though over like boiled white rice or simply baked lightly white rice, which would be less estrogenic potentially or irritating or acidic
Westside PUFAs
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No it's not. Oats and rye are gluten free and he's recommended oats in "Nutrition For Women" and has recently said this about starch.
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Rye is gluten free?
Westside PUFAs
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As opposed to gliadin and glutenin in wheat, rye storage proteins do not form gluten when mixed with water and kneaded. Rye flour contains lower levels of prolamins and glutelins (gliadin-containing proteins) than wheat flour.
Willam Koch liked rye for the silicon.
The Basic Chemistry Of Our Diet
IMPORTANCE OF SILICON
In connection with the utilization of calcium, silicon is important. It is my duty to emphasize the value of whole grain cereals, and especially whole rye, for this reason. Rye is generally grown in a soft sandy soil that does not support much else. This was easily tilled with the crude farming implements of the ancients. It naturally became the principle grain until the large plows or tractors could be put to work on the heavy clay soils. Then wheat became the grain of predominance. Commercial rather than nutritional considerations brought on this change. However, there are still some localities where rye is the principle product and food. Russia and the Balkans, in general, grow and eat much rye. Compare their health with that of the rest of the world. In the small country Belgium, I had the opportunity to look into this matter. The peasants ate rye bread. It was the whole grain well ground. The bread tasted delicious and one couldeat and eat this black bread and butter to one’s fill without wanting anything also on the menu. The peasants were a hardy example of physical health. Cancer and tuberculosis were rare among them. In the same country are the middle class of commercial and professional society and the upper social classes who ate white bread, wheat of course. They were the most unhealthy cancer laden people I have ever seen. The great variable between the peasant and the rest of the populace was the diet and chief of this was the rye bread. The long life of the ancients and of the Balkan races today is attributable, in my opinion, to the whole rye rather than the sour milk and garlic they are supposed to eat.
The factor in rye, one at least, which is of utmost importance in my mind is the fact that the roots take up pure silicon compounds from the soil, which are brought to the surface of the grain where the sun does its miracle and produces oxysilicon catalysts which are comparable to our carbonyl compounds and serve as oxidation chain initiators. You will recall from your chemistry, that carbon and silicon belong to the same group of elements in the Periodic System, and in some respects can be interchanged.
The hydrosilicons are well known as comparable to the hydrocarbons as lubricating oils. In the crude way then there is interchangeability. But in the more refined sense also we have the siloxin compounds, which are used to sensitize photographic plates to the red and longer rays of light. The carbon compound photosensitizers have competition here. In nutrition, however, carbon is far superior in so many ways as a builder of living objects that there can be no displacement except in certain particulars and the one outstanding case is that of the silicon compounds in the surface of the rye, altered by the sun’s rays to serve in oxidation catalysis. It is my opinion, that the locality for their service is within the intestinal tract in an important way for they may not be too well absorbed from the intestine, and here they can aid the oxidations in germs to keep them from being toxic and correct the pathogenic trend in viruses. However, silicon is essential to the tissues. Oxidation catalysts of this order should hold specific positions in the tissues too. At any rate the grand total of observations points to their importance in the body as a whole. In the face of the importance of whole rye products the struggle to obtain them is increasing with each year. Deceptive advertisements for denuded white flour does a large part in keeping people from healthful diet and their added vitamins is worse than a joke. When we wish to lower the resistance of rats to make infecting them easy, we just feed them white bread for a short time. The millers know that placing some whole wheat or rye about their factory will keep the rats from eating into the white flour sacks looking for food.
The Basic Chemistry Of Our Diet
IMPORTANCE OF SILICON
In connection with the utilization of calcium, silicon is important. It is my duty to emphasize the value of whole grain cereals, and especially whole rye, for this reason. Rye is generally grown in a soft sandy soil that does not support much else. This was easily tilled with the crude farming implements of the ancients. It naturally became the principle grain until the large plows or tractors could be put to work on the heavy clay soils. Then wheat became the grain of predominance. Commercial rather than nutritional considerations brought on this change. However, there are still some localities where rye is the principle product and food. Russia and the Balkans, in general, grow and eat much rye. Compare their health with that of the rest of the world. In the small country Belgium, I had the opportunity to look into this matter. The peasants ate rye bread. It was the whole grain well ground. The bread tasted delicious and one couldeat and eat this black bread and butter to one’s fill without wanting anything also on the menu. The peasants were a hardy example of physical health. Cancer and tuberculosis were rare among them. In the same country are the middle class of commercial and professional society and the upper social classes who ate white bread, wheat of course. They were the most unhealthy cancer laden people I have ever seen. The great variable between the peasant and the rest of the populace was the diet and chief of this was the rye bread. The long life of the ancients and of the Balkan races today is attributable, in my opinion, to the whole rye rather than the sour milk and garlic they are supposed to eat.
The factor in rye, one at least, which is of utmost importance in my mind is the fact that the roots take up pure silicon compounds from the soil, which are brought to the surface of the grain where the sun does its miracle and produces oxysilicon catalysts which are comparable to our carbonyl compounds and serve as oxidation chain initiators. You will recall from your chemistry, that carbon and silicon belong to the same group of elements in the Periodic System, and in some respects can be interchanged.
The hydrosilicons are well known as comparable to the hydrocarbons as lubricating oils. In the crude way then there is interchangeability. But in the more refined sense also we have the siloxin compounds, which are used to sensitize photographic plates to the red and longer rays of light. The carbon compound photosensitizers have competition here. In nutrition, however, carbon is far superior in so many ways as a builder of living objects that there can be no displacement except in certain particulars and the one outstanding case is that of the silicon compounds in the surface of the rye, altered by the sun’s rays to serve in oxidation catalysis. It is my opinion, that the locality for their service is within the intestinal tract in an important way for they may not be too well absorbed from the intestine, and here they can aid the oxidations in germs to keep them from being toxic and correct the pathogenic trend in viruses. However, silicon is essential to the tissues. Oxidation catalysts of this order should hold specific positions in the tissues too. At any rate the grand total of observations points to their importance in the body as a whole. In the face of the importance of whole rye products the struggle to obtain them is increasing with each year. Deceptive advertisements for denuded white flour does a large part in keeping people from healthful diet and their added vitamins is worse than a joke. When we wish to lower the resistance of rats to make infecting them easy, we just feed them white bread for a short time. The millers know that placing some whole wheat or rye about their factory will keep the rats from eating into the white flour sacks looking for food.
tankasnowgod
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Nope. It's one of the three gluten containing grains, wheat and barley being the other two. It's got significantly less gluten than wheat.
What are your thoughts on gluten or wheat?
tankasnowgod
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Personally? I don't think either is ideal, and probably should be limited, but so long as you don't have an obviously bad reaction, or are diagnosed celiac, I don't think they need to be strictly avoided, either. Personally, I'm of the belief now that most of the issues came from either whole grains (as the bran and indigestible fiber can cause GI issues), or from iron fortification. I think gluten can be an issue, but it's probably those other things that are generally causing it. Countries like France that eat refined wheat and don't fortify their flour with iron eat a lot more wheat, and don't seem to have issues like the US does.
In my own diet, I will use refined and unfortified pastas and pastries for variety, and will even order things like pizza or a hamburger when eating out (which is becoming a rarer and rarer occurrence).
Yeah , if I pay attention to reactions to gluten or wheat , in the short term there are much less obvious and negative than rice (constipation among other things) and potatoes (bloating etc.. little amounts may be ok). I find it hard to find real science on gluten rather than on celiac or just opinions and/or stupid trends , whole grains didn't do me good either (at all). Lots of pasta make me put on the usual belly and face water weight , baguette , brioche and some of the other options are pretty nice. Brioche is usually made with just a little butter , there are other white breads made without fats etc..
I'm curious about long term effects of wheat, I remember Ray said it's seen as an estrogen by the body (if memory works well enough) and triggers negative reactions , but he also said that processing it like in sourdough bread would quite dramatically change the quality of the proteins . In one of the kmud podcasts they mentioned gluten being present in much larger amounts in wheat compared to a century ago.
About fibers and indigestible fibers this is something I don't get yet, what is the difference between the raw carrot acting like an antibiotic and indigestible fibers or resistant starches being awful? Does it have to do with the geometry/length of the fibers? Do the other forms of resistant starches and indigestible fibers have things that rot and feed the bacteria ?
I'm curious about long term effects of wheat, I remember Ray said it's seen as an estrogen by the body (if memory works well enough) and triggers negative reactions , but he also said that processing it like in sourdough bread would quite dramatically change the quality of the proteins . In one of the kmud podcasts they mentioned gluten being present in much larger amounts in wheat compared to a century ago.
About fibers and indigestible fibers this is something I don't get yet, what is the difference between the raw carrot acting like an antibiotic and indigestible fibers or resistant starches being awful? Does it have to do with the geometry/length of the fibers? Do the other forms of resistant starches and indigestible fibers have things that rot and feed the bacteria ?
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